SoCal Hak Ip vs Sweetheart Lychees

[simon_grow]

I visited Leo Manuel today and he was kind enough to offer me a bunch of Brewster Lychees and also a few of his Hak Ip and Sweetheart Lychees. His Hak Ip and Sweetheart were much less fruitful than his Brewster which was completely loaded from the top to bottom with fruit.

His Lychees were planted in different parts of his yard and his Sweetheart is much larger than his Hak Ip so it's not really comparing Lychees to Lychees. The color of the leaves were slightly different but I feel it was due to being planted in different parts of the yard, age of tree, etc... I noticed that even on the same tree, the size, shape and color of the leaves can be drastically different from each other. Even the fruit from the same tree can be drastically different. Leo's Sweetheart Lychee had a few super small fruit that were about the size of a Groff but it was fully red and on the same tree, he had one fruit that weighed 49 grams and had a unique flattened heart shape very much like some of the pictures of Fei Zhi Siu from Australia.

I harvested two Hak Ip fruit and four Sweetheart fruit. The Hak Ip had an average weight of 38.1 grams and had an average Brix of 17.5%. The Sweetheart had an average weight of 36.4 grams, I only weighed 3 of 4 Sweethearts because one fruit was bad and I only used it for a Brix reading and to observe seed size. The sweethearts had an average Brix of 19.75%.

As far as taste, they both tasted the same to me even though they had different Brix levels. They both had a slight honey taste to them and I detected some Tannin taste in both varieties. Both had a medium level of Lychee/Rose flavor. I believe both varieties were harvested a bit past their prime. They both had relatively low production this year although the Hak Ip is much smaller than the Sweetheart.

In conclusion, I don't know for sure wether or not these two varieties are the same and probably the only way to find out is through sequencing their DNA. In my opinion, they are the same or at least they are so similar that I can't tell the difference.

When looking at these pictures, the color of the fruit is quite different but the differences in color can be attributed to the difference in growing conditions, age of tree, exposure to sunlight and everything else I touched upon above.

Simon

[simon_grow]

More pictures

[simon_grow]

One other thing is that both Hak Ip fruit had fully formed seeds and all the Sweethearts had Aborted or very small seeds. This can be due to the fact that the Sweetheart is planted away from other Lychees where as the Hak Ip is about 20-30 feet from a huge Brewster which can provide cross pollination. All this is just speculation.

Simon

[fyliu]

Thanks for the comparison and record keeping Simon.

This Hak Ip was what the nursery told me so I just went with it. The guy studied agriculture in China. Later I found out he tends to "have" whatever you want but you're not sure to get the real thing. Now his younger brother runs the nursery and he doesn't really know anything about growing fruits.

Anyway, Leo's Brewster was already really big when I was there 4 years ago. It seems to be a pretty good producer for him. His sweetheart was new and had a few fruits. The Hak Ip was planted around that time.

I'm glad it's starting to produce now. My Hak Ip had a decent crop this year but lost most of the fruits during one of the heat events. The fruits should have stabilized at that stage but still fell.

The heat dried out the skin as they were ripening, and the green beetles then attacked the fruits so the crop was maybe 50 underripe fruits. Hopefully the longan will do better.

[simon_grow]

You're welcome Fang. I'm glad you gave Leo the tree so that I can try the fruit of his labor, lol. Lychee trees are very sensitive. Once you get an older established fruit bearing tree like yours and Leo's, you may want to try giving your trees bi weekly soil drenches with Kelp emulsion. I don't know if you remember Phase001 from GardenWeb but he used seaweed to get his Sweetheart to fruit very well in most years. Bi weekly or monthly applications of organic fertilizers with small amounts of N-P-K may also help increase fruit size and give the fruit higher Brix. When the main crop is close to ripening, try reducing or completely stop watering for several days before you harvest the main crop and the fruit will taste much better. Here is a picture of Leo's Brewster taken today. The fruit were not fully sugared up yet but they were still delicious.
Simon

[simon_grow]

Hey Fang, I dont blame the nursery owner because it was probably sold to him as Hak Ip so he probably didn't know any better. Even the Pine Island Nursery viewer isn't showing the real Hak Ip. See this link for a picture of a real Hak Ip next to a Sweetheart which I believe actually may be Fei Zhi Siu http://tropicalfruitforum.com/index.php?topic=7096.msg93557;topicseen#msg93557

This fruit in the picture was actually labeled Hak Ip in Chinese and was purchased at 99 Ranch Market. I forget if it was from China or Taiwan. It has a smooth shell.

Simon

[bsbullie]

The Hak Ips grown here, which have a similarity the Sweetheart,  all have chicken tongue seeds like those of the Sweetheart.  I have not seen Hak Ips with fully developed seeds.  When comparing fully tipe specimens of both, they are both large, very sweet, little to no acidity,  distict rose water taste with the Hak Ips being slightly more floral.  If not fully ripe, both csn carry a slight level of acidity with the Hak Ips being slightly more foregiving.  The only time i see what could be described as rannic quality is when they are truly picked underripe.  Both these varieties,  at least here, benefit from being at their best when picked fully red.  Of course you have to have a good system to battle the birds.

I also know the issue that what is being coined the Hak Ip here, with a rough skin like that of the Sweetheart,  is not a true Hak Ip.

[simon_grow]

Here is a picture of a box label listing some varieties that may currently be growing in Mexico.

Simon

[fyliu]

Wow, that's like a mango box label, with more varieties than the mango label.

My relatives in China can't sell their lychee this year. It's so cheap it's not worth hiring a fruit picker. They just pick them themselves and dry them to sell later.

[HMHausman]

I visited Leo Manuel today and he was kind enough to offer me a bunch of Brewster Lychees and also a few of his Hak Ip and Sweetheart Lychees. His Hak Ip and Sweetheart were much less fruitful than his Brewster which was completely loaded from the top to bottom with fruit.

His Lychees were planted in different parts of his yard and his Sweetheart is much larger than his Hak Ip so it's not really comparing Lychees to Lychees. The color of the leaves were slightly different but I feel it was due to being planted in different parts of the yard, age of tree, etc... I noticed that even on the same tree, the size, shape and color of the leaves can be drastically different from each other. Even the fruit from the same tree can be drastically different. Leo's Sweetheart Lychee had a few super small fruit that were about the size of a Groff but it was fully red and on the same tree, he had one fruit that weighed 49 grams and had a unique flattened heart shape very much like some of the pictures of Fei Zhi Siu from Australia.

I harvested two Hak Ip fruit and four Sweetheart fruit. The Hak Ip had an average weight of 38.1 grams and had an average Brix of 17.5%. The Sweetheart had an average weight of 36.4 grams, I only weighed 3 of 4 Sweethearts because one fruit was bad and I only used it for a Brix reading and to observe seed size. The sweethearts had an average Brix of 19.75%.

As far as taste, they both tasted the same to me even though they had different Brix levels. They both had a slight honey taste to them and I detected some Tannin taste in both varieties. Both had a medium level of Lychee/Rose flavor. I believe both varieties were harvested a bit past their prime. They both had relatively low production this year although the Hak Ip is much smaller than the Sweetheart.

In conclusion, I don't know for sure wether or not these two varieties are the same and probably the only way to find out is through sequencing their DNA. In my opinion, they are the same or at least they are so similar that I can't tell the difference.

When looking at these pictures, the color of the fruit is quite different but the differences in color can be attributed to the difference in growing conditions, age of tree, exposure to sunlight and everything else I touched upon above.

Simon

Its very frustrating.  Thanks for the pictures but all they have done is further demonstrate that what we have here in Florida are confused and mis-identified. What I have seen here really don't match with either of the fruits you have shown us.   

[JF]

Great report Simon. I was eating Mauriius and Sweet Cliff this morning and read this thread. I took some pix so you can do the analysis. Both were sweet and juicy. Mauritius had a large seed but it appears to have the best flavor. Sweet Cliff  is a bit milder but had the smaller seed however they were both excellent...I detected some acidity. I have a Sweetheart I plan to add a sweet cliff for its superior production and small seed.







Both trees were feature in the thread bellow. They are reliable and loaded every year but Sweet Cliff holds ridiculous amounts of fruits

http://tropicalfruitforum.com/index.php?topic=16556.25

[simon_grow]

Very frustrating indeed. From the pictures I posted, you can see that fruit from the same tree can vary drastically in size, shape and color. Growing conditions can influence flavor of fruit so it is difficult to identify without DNA tests.

JF, I've only had a few sweet cliffs but the fruit with the smoother she'll does look like what I had. Kinda difficult to tell from the pictures. The Bosworth 3 AKA Kwai Mi Pink are also very sweet but they don't have much Lychee/Rose flavor.

Rob, I remember reading that many or most the Hak Ips in Flirida have small or aborted seeds and that made me wonder why the ones from Leo's place had fully formed seeds. There are reports that young trees tend to have higher proportion of fully formed seeds and the proportion of chicken tongue seeds can increase as the tree matures.

Thanks to Bradflorida for showing me this link that suggests that some Ohia may actually be Hak Ip. http://www.actahort.org/members/showpdf?booknrarnr=575_27 . The Ohia on Pine Island Nurserys viewer is not the real Hak Ip. The real Hak Ip is slightly more flattened and almost purplish red like a Brewster. The shoulders on the real Hak Ip is also more pronounced. The USDA has some pictures of a Hak Ip that is a bit small and somewhat a runt of a Hak Ip. The shell of the real Hak Ip is similar to Kaimana, the shape is similar as well.

Simon