SOLVED!!! Help strange disease on FL tomatoes

[Altrexy]

I know this isn’t exactly a tropical fruit but since most of us are in south FL I figured I might get some good help here. Every year I’ve tried to plant tomatoes (with the sole exception of Everglades) the plants get this strange disease and die shortly after. It always starts with the stems losing their “hairs” and going bald. They also completely lose their fragrance. They start to bronze a bit followed by leaf and branch death going from the bottom up. There is no visible bugs although a few years ago I microscoped what looked like russet mites. My next step is bombing with systemic to see if it is russet mites causing this. The plants usually outgrow the damage until they finally don’t and they perish.

[SanDiegoCherimoya]

First, the only way tomatoes look stringy like that is if you are growing them in too much shade.

Second, you're growing them in pots.

Try planting them in full direct sun in the soil and don't water any of the foliage.

[Galatians522]

I have seen tomatoes grown very successfully in pots here in Florida (where nematodes can be a limiting factor for in-ground plants). I have also grown cherry, grape, and Campari tomatoes in shade (in the ground). I don't see any signs of a leaf disease like septoria, or early/late blight. I would be looking at a soil borne disease like fusarium or verticulum. If the plant dies, cut into the stem and look for brown dead streaks in the stem. I would also think that one of those is more likely if you have been growing the plant in the same medium as a diseased plant from before. Fresh plants in fresh soil would likely help for next year (we've passed the time to plant here in Florida now).

[Daintree]

They aren't near or under a walnut tree, are they?
Other than walnut toxicity, I would lean towards a virus.
Throw all the soil out and move the pots to a new location - like SDC said, full sun.
As for pots, I grow tomatoes in pots all the time. They do have huge root systems and are very thirsty, so make sure the pots are big (16 inches at least) and well watered but not water-logged.

Cheers, Carolyn

[Altrexy]

First, the only way tomatoes look stringy like that is if you are growing them in too much shade.

Second, you're growing them in pots.

Try planting them in full direct sun in the soil and don't water any of the foliage.

I used to have a 99% shade cloth I have since gotten rid of. It’s under 30% shade cloth now and my Everglades has been producing like crazy and sprawled everywhere. The last time I tried full sun all my plants got fried as soon as it got hot. They’re in 5 gallon pots for now and have been doing super well. I have nowhere to put them in the ground unfortunately. I’m thinking either virus or tomato russet mite. The soil I used this year is completely fresh and new. Maybe I reused a pot..

[Galatians522]

Well, I definitely learned about a new pest. I'd never heard of that russet mite before. Although now that I see the pictures of the damage, I've probably had it and though it was a symptom of fungal infection. That could very well be what it is.

[SanDiegoCherimoya]

Did they burn because you sprayed the whole plant with water while then sun was out?

First, the only way tomatoes look stringy like that is if you are growing them in too much shade.

Second, you're growing them in pots.

Try planting them in full direct sun in the soil and don't water any of the foliage.

I used to have a 99% shade cloth I have since gotten rid of. It’s under 30% shade cloth now and my Everglades has been producing like crazy and sprawled everywhere. The last time I tried full sun all my plants got fried as soon as it got hot. They’re in 5 gallon pots for now and have been doing super well. I have nowhere to put them in the ground unfortunately. I’m thinking either virus or tomato russet mite. The soil I used this year is completely fresh and new. Maybe I reused a pot..

[Altrexy]

Well, I definitely learned about a new pest. I'd never heard of that russet mite before. Although now that I see the pictures of the damage, I've probably had it and though it was a symptom of fungal infection. That could very well be what it is.

Yeah I noticed there wasn’t much literature on it. Seems it’s not too common or since they’re microscopic people just chalk it up to a different disease. I actually bought a microscope and 100% confirmed I had russet mites a few years ago. I’m gonna try and find the pictures of the little guys. I microscoped a few leaves today and saw one single mite that didn’t really look like a russet mite. I might have gotten a bad sample though. My last time there was thousands of them per leaf. The first most noticeable symptom for me was the balding stems and loss of fragrance. One of my favorite things is running my hands on the plant and smelling that heavenly smell

[Altrexy]

Did they burn because you sprayed the whole plant with water while then sun was out?

First, the only way tomatoes look stringy like that is if you are growing them in too much shade.

Second, you're growing them in pots.

Try planting them in full direct sun in the soil and don't water any of the foliage.

I used to have a 99% shade cloth I have since gotten rid of. It’s under 30% shade cloth now and my Everglades has been producing like crazy and sprawled everywhere. The last time I tried full sun all my plants got fried as soon as it got hot. They’re in 5 gallon pots for now and have been doing super well. I have nowhere to put them in the ground unfortunately. I’m thinking either virus or tomato russet mite. The soil I used this year is completely fresh and new. Maybe I reused a pot..

That’s a common myth. If things worked that way then we’d be getting hotter instead of cooler when we sweat. Evaporation cools. Water isn’t a magnifying glass. Also once it goes over 100 in the summer humidity most everything that isn’t a cactus suffers. Instead of misting constantly or just plain giving up I put up a 30% shadecloth. There’s a reason tomatoes and strawberries are a winter crop in Florida, especially south Florida.

[SanDiegoCherimoya]

I've seen plenty of junk tomato plantings. The problem is that they don't want live where you're planting them. It's clear evidence you cannot argue.

Did they burn because you sprayed the whole plant with water while then sun was out?

First, the only way tomatoes look stringy like that is if you are growing them in too much shade.

Second, you're growing them in pots.

Try planting them in full direct sun in the soil and don't water any of the foliage.

I used to have a 99% shade cloth I have since gotten rid of. It’s under 30% shade cloth now and my Everglades has been producing like crazy and sprawled everywhere. The last time I tried full sun all my plants got fried as soon as it got hot. They’re in 5 gallon pots for now and have been doing super well. I have nowhere to put them in the ground unfortunately. I’m thinking either virus or tomato russet mite. The soil I used this year is completely fresh and new. Maybe I reused a pot..

That’s a common myth. If things worked that way then we’d be getting hotter instead of cooler when we sweat. Evaporation cools. Water isn’t a magnifying glass. Also once it goes over 100 in the summer humidity most everything that isn’t a cactus suffers. Instead of misting constantly or just plain giving up I put up a 30% shadecloth. There’s a reason tomatoes and strawberries are a winter crop in Florida, especially south Florida.

[Satya]

There’s a reason tomatoes and strawberries are a winter crop in Florida, especially south Florida.

the reason tomatoes are grown in winter in Florida is because most of them stop flowering when night temps get above 82F.

[Altrexy]

100% solved confirmed case closed. We have russet mites!! Again!! These guys are the worst pests I’ve ever dealt with. I wonder how many folks have tossed their tomatoes because of a “virus” which is really a mite they can’t see. It might be hard to distinguish in photos whether those are mites or random debris but it’s very obvious once you see them moving around

[Galatians522]

Sulfur kills mites, but its probably warm enough now that it might also burn your plants. You might try spraying at dusk so it dries before the heat comes. That is what they used to do in the groves.

[SanDiegoCherimoya]

 Nature solved your problem. You planted tomatoes where they didn't want to live. Bugs took them out.

100% solved confirmed case closed. We have russet mites!! Again!! These guys are the worst pests I’ve ever dealt with. I wonder how many folks have tossed their tomatoes because of a “virus” which is really a mite they can’t see. It might be hard to distinguish in photos whether those are mites or random debris but it’s very obvious once you see them moving around

[SanDiegoCherimoya]

What do you consider successful. I'd love to see these shade grown tomato plants. Personally, Ive never even seen tomatoes for sale in the grocery from Florida.

I have farmed both coastal and inland foothills here in San Diego. There's a reason no commercial tomato grows are along the foggy marine layered coast. If you're saying shade is no problem for tomato production, then show me the evidence.

Also, yes there are a lot of successful greenhouse tomato grows in pots. But, what's the growing medium and how large is the pot?

The most concerning part of this whole post is no one mentioned the variety of tomato being grown. So yes, case closed. Bugs killed a plant put in the wrong location.

I have seen tomatoes grown very successfully in pots here in Florida (where nematodes can be a limiting factor for in-ground plants). I have also grown cherry, grape, and Campari tomatoes in shade (in the ground). I don't see any signs of a leaf disease like septoria, or early/late blight. I would be looking at a soil borne disease like fusarium or verticulum. If the plant dies, cut into the stem and look for brown dead streaks in the stem. I would also think that one of those is more likely if you have been growing the plant in the same medium as a diseased plant from before. Fresh plants in fresh soil would likely help for next year (we've passed the time to plant here in Florida now).

[Galatians522]

Let's start a seperate topic for that discussion. I'm glad the OP figured out what the problem was and that I learned something from him along the way.

[Calusa]

There’s a reason tomatoes and strawberries are a winter crop in Florida, especially south Florida.

the reason tomatoes are grown in winter in Florida is because most of them stop flowering when night temps get above 82F.

👍Correct. Hot days and cool nights is what they like.

[Satya]

What do you consider successful. I'd love to see these shade grown tomato plants. Personally, Ive never even seen tomatoes for sale in the grocery from Florida.

I have farmed both coastal and inland foothills here in San Diego. There's a reason no commercial tomato grows are along the foggy marine layered coast. If you're saying shade is no problem for tomato production, then show me the evidence.

Also, yes there are a lot of successful greenhouse tomato grows in pots. But, what's the growing medium and how large is the pot?

The most concerning part of this whole post is no one mentioned the variety of tomato being grown. So yes, case closed. Bugs killed a plant put in the wrong location.

I have seen tomatoes grown very successfully in pots here in Florida (where nematodes can be a limiting factor for in-ground plants). I have also grown cherry, grape, and Campari tomatoes in shade (in the ground). I don't see any signs of a leaf disease like septoria, or early/late blight. I would be looking at a soil borne disease like fusarium or verticulum. If the plant dies, cut into the stem and look for brown dead streaks in the stem. I would also think that one of those is more likely if you have been growing the plant in the same medium as a diseased plant from before. Fresh plants in fresh soil would likely help for next year (we've passed the time to plant here in Florida now).

s/he said Everglades tomatoes. Please tone down, especially if you are unaware of local specifics but still want to participate in the discussion, maybe you will learn something new today... Everglades is a native tomato to FL. The size is small but they produce abundantly without care during FL winters.

[Satya]

Sulfur kills mites, but its probably warm enough now that it might also burn your plants. You might try spraying at dusk so it dries before the heat comes. That is what they used to do in the groves.

the biggest problem with mites is that they transfer virus. They don't do much damage to plants usually unless it's a huge infestation but the danger of mosaic and such is what makes you want to control mites. I tried predatory mites once for whiteflies, and they took care of mites in the shadehouse and on my brugmansias, too. The type that works in hot climates (they mention it specifially bc most predatory mites don't like heat) is called swirskii, i bought them from Arbico Organics.

[Galatians522]

Satya, that is interesting about the predatory mites. I have never heard of that.

For anyone who is interested, I started a new topic in the tropical vegetables section about Shade Grown Florida Tomatoes.

[NateTheGreat]

What do you consider successful. I'd love to see these shade grown tomato plants. Personally, Ive never even seen tomatoes for sale in the grocery from Florida.

I have farmed both coastal and inland foothills here in San Diego. There's a reason no commercial tomato grows are along the foggy marine layered coast. If you're saying shade is no problem for tomato production, then show me the evidence.

Also, yes there are a lot of successful greenhouse tomato grows in pots. But, what's the growing medium and how large is the pot?

The most concerning part of this whole post is no one mentioned the variety of tomato being grown. So yes, case closed. Bugs killed a plant put in the wrong location.

I have seen tomatoes grown very successfully in pots here in Florida (where nematodes can be a limiting factor for in-ground plants). I have also grown cherry, grape, and Campari tomatoes in shade (in the ground). I don't see any signs of a leaf disease like septoria, or early/late blight. I would be looking at a soil borne disease like fusarium or verticulum. If the plant dies, cut into the stem and look for brown dead streaks in the stem. I would also think that one of those is more likely if you have been growing the plant in the same medium as a diseased plant from before. Fresh plants in fresh soil would likely help for next year (we've passed the time to plant here in Florida now).

Idk if you're aware, but your posts come off as needlessly aggressive. You were wrong, his problem is mites not what you said, and you're perpetuating myths like water on tomato leaves causing sunburn... Now still trying to argue that you were right. Anyway, here's my local university's master gardener program saying to shade your tomatoes: https://ccmg.ucanr.edu/EdibleGardening/Protecting_Tomatoes_during_Hot_Summer_Days/

[Altrexy]

The varieties are green doctor, Everglades and I believe white currant. All affected to different degrees. Everglades being the most resistant to the mites and the other two being much more affected. I’m fairly sure the mites are the sole issue and not a mite associated virus. None of the common virus symptoms match up with what I have and the samples I showed on the microscope were still green and healthy. I’m sure the infestation is much much worse on the deflated crumbling leaves. As far as planting something where it doesn’t want to be I’m pretty sure that’s the whole point of gardening. I’ve also been dealing with this issue for years and have tried full sun and shade and it makes no difference to the mites. Spreading info on this underreported pest felt like the right thing to do. Not sure where the hostility could come from in a forum meant to help others.