Show Posts

This section allows you to view all posts made by this member. Note that you can only see posts made in areas you currently have access to.


Messages - Caesar

Pages: 1 ... 8 9 [10] 11 12 ... 19
226
Tropical Vegetables and Other Edibles / Re: Ensete ventricosum
« on: June 27, 2018, 07:40:15 PM »
Hey all. Since there's practically zero chance I'll be able to get clonal material from Ethiopia, and I'm pretty sure the species on the whole is edible (never mind varietal quality), I've decided to give this species a shot, growing it by seed. I'll probably buy a random variety from eBay (I'm already watching a couple of listings). I'll germinate them, grow them out, and once they have some decent size to them (maybe typical banana size), I'll harvest one for the corm. I'll leave most to harvest when they're older and bigger, to make note of any differences. If it seems like a halfway decent crop from seed (quality and production-wise), I'll probably add it to my stock permanently. If not... Well, you'll know. I plan on making my usual evaluation, so I hope to give every relevant detail when posting the results. I'm not keen on the idea of processing the pseudostem just yet, so I'll mainly be tasting and evaluating the corms. I'll use the pseudostems as compost, to help build the soil. If it's as promising a crop as I hope, I'll be making some attempts at clonal propagation as described in Lost Crops (core out the corm, fill with soil, wait for sprouts). Here's hoping I get good results from this! Starch roots are my favorites.  ;D

227
Bummer that they can't be grown from roots. I was hoping to find the Butterstick cultivar, but I can't find any cuttings online. I was hoping I might find roots at the market, but I guess they won't do me good for propagation.

229
While not currently in stock, I found a source for Ahipa (along with Mauka, Mashua, Oca, Ulluco, Yacón and a few other goodies). - https://www.cultivariable.com

That still leaves Goitenyo and Sphenostylis, so any leads would be appreciated.

230
Hi all. I'm on a root crop kick at the moment, and am now working my way through the leguminous ones. I'm not looking for every obscure species just yet, but there are a few hard-to-find ones that I'd like to get my hands on now. I'm currently growing Winged Bean (Psophocarpus tetragonolobus), and I have a source for American Groundnuts (Apios Americana). As for what I want...

I'm looking for seeds of the African Yam Bean (Sphenostylis stenocarpa). Similar to Pachyrhizus, it has crunchy tubers, but unlike its relatives, it allegedly has edible leaves and seeds. It's apparently a variable species, with different landraces having different traits in their roots and seeds; I'd like to obtain several, if possible. Link: https://www.nap.edu/read/11763/chapter/20#328

I have Jícama seeds (Pachyrhizus erosus) so I'm not looking for it, but I am looking for two relatives: Ahipa (P. ahipa) and Goitenyo (P. tuberosus). Ahipa appeals to me for its short non-vining growth, and the fact that it's adaptable. Like Jícama, it has toxic seeds and leaves (Rotenone). Goitenyo appeals even more to me, and is a higher priority (as well as seeming harder to find) because like Sphenostylis, it allegedly has edible leaves and seeds.

If anyone has any of these three, I'd like to buy them. And better yet, if they have direct experience with them and can confirm the edibility of seeds & foliage of Sphenostylis and Goitenyo, that would be appreciated.

231
The angular one! I think that's the same African type they grow in Las Cañadas. I noticed he mentioned "Hawaii" as a second cultivar. Does he have it and others, or just the angular "Africa"? I think my round type is "Sativa" since it comes from India, but I don't know if they have other cultivars in India, or if the Hawaiian one is different from mine.

Incidentally, did he happen to mention if he had D. esculenta?

I checked a few of David-the-good's videos and I think he has at least 3 different cultivars growing (2 round ones and maybe the angular one). Wouldn't mind getting in touch with him for a trade. If this keeps up, I may end up making a clonal repository for edible Dioscoreas.  ;D

232
Tropical Fruit Discussion / Re: Edible Conifers and other Gymnosperms
« on: June 02, 2018, 08:17:14 PM »
Wow! Excellent contribution. That's quite the list! A lot of species to review there for crop use. When using PFAF, I tend to bump up whatever rating they give a plant by at least half a point, as I've noticed them giving moderately low points to plants which I've seen considered as pretty good crops.

I had debated whether to include ferns and had originally decided not to, but the contribution is well appreciated. The idea of eating ferns deserves a lot of research; they're strong and hardy plants that can produce a fair crop and are perennials, but there's a lot of toxicity issues to hash out before considering them safe for long term consumption (though I doubt an occasional plate would do much harm). I guess it's similar to the whole "anonnacin" debate. I know plenty of ferns are habitually eaten and treated as delicacies, but has any particular species been conclusively proven to lack toxicity? I'm hoping there is, so I can add it to my own collection.

233
Excellent! Those trifidas should grow well for you. My original stock was from Walmart (Costa Rica as well, I think), and they had a slight sweetness to the taste that was absent from my own harvest (either way, it was a great yam).

Another bulbifera grower? Is he from the forum? Did he mention the type or origin of his stock? I'd like to buy or trade for some of his at his next harvest, if it's different (even better if they're several). The more edible types grown, the better. Las Cañadas in Mexico (link here) has an African type that I'd love to get my hands on (link to their catalog here). Only problem is they don't ship outside of Mexico. If I could get a forum member from there to buy and resell it to me, that'd be great, but I've no idea who to ask about that. With some of the projects I have going on right now, I plan to obtain quite a few more totes to grow some of the stuff I can't put in the ground right now.

That looks incredible! I'm pumped for the purple Ube, can't wait for your harvest. I'll trade you for all my roots. I've also been meaning to grow some white alatas (maybe "Florido"), but I haven't found a satisfactory variety lately, and didn't have the foresight to save the stem-piece from the last good one I ate. As soon as I get a good one, I'll be growing it for bulbils for sure.

234
Fascinating thread.  What plant produces the 'common' pine nuts?

Aside: some pines ooze ahead of pollination and the ooze is said to contain testosterone.

The source of the common Pine Nut is the Stone Pine (Pinus pinea) but other species of pine are commonly harvested as well.


Nice thread you started Caesar, i think nut crop's are are over looked by many people especially growing tree's that can bear a crop. But then again many of these tree's get very big and need room to grow! Interesting thanks for posting 8)

If it weren't for all the allergies that people have, I'd say nuts have the potential to be an important staple crop, especially the starchy ones. I can't imagine why they're not more commonly planted. And yes, a lot of room to grow indeed. I still have my Bunyas in pots for lack of an adequate locale, though I am very concerned that their tap root may have been permanently stunted by the pot (potentially making them more susceptible than usual to strong winds). ¿Can anyone chime in on this concern?


I have also been interested in the subject of food-producing conifers.  Here is a link to some work I did for a non-profit sustainability group  a few years back that mentions a number of conifer species incorporated in a food forest design:

https://www.onecommunityglobal.org/food-forest/

I don't think any conifer species would produce enough food per acre to be used as a crop per se, but can be worthwhile components of a more complex system.

Thank you for the link, it's got great info! As for productivity, the Araucarias probably produce more than enough to be worthwhile. The more common nut conifers, on the other hand, are probably of more modest production (perhaps that explains the high price of pine nuts and their use as a flavor accent).


We grow gnetum.  The nuts are pretty good prepared like they do in Indonesia.  Both the seeds and the soft, red shell are nice.
Interestingly, we have a male and female plant and the male got squashed by a tree that fell out of the forest.  The female has continued to produce.
Another thing is that it has been difficult to germinate the seeds in the nursery but we do get some volunteers under the tree.  It’s not been easy to airlayer either.
Peter

I failed miserably in my attempt to grow Gnetum, but it's high on my wish list as far as nuts go. I just wish there were an easier way to propagate them

Did the female produce pollen? It hadn't occurred to me that some conifers might be apomictic. Interesting...


Been trying to grow a few of these in pots before I was going to put them in the ground in Spring. I have had the hardest time getting them to survive. I have tried the Chilean Yew which made it about 2 months in a pot before going brown and A.  angustifolia that I got from a guy in Ocala FL, which all 12 arrived in good shape but when potted, 11 died almost immediately. The survivor has put on almost 6 inches since August but was potted no differently or treated any differently than the others. All had a fairly loose potting soil with perlite, ground pine bark, compost, dirt etc. Standard fare for potting soil. I don't think they were really in the soil long enough for that to matter anyway. I might try again in spring of 2019 and use them to replace whatever losses I have between now and then and just go straight into the ground with the seedlings.

I wonder what went wrong with them. I'm not aware of any conifer having particularly sensitive roots. Keep us updated on this, I'd like to see where it goes.

235
Hi all. I've been a bit busy, which is why I held off on posting in this particular thread, as I wanted some time for a proper and full reply. I have taken the advice you've all given to heart, and I'm here to say: the plan is back on. I came to realize that this project is too important to let go, and that there are solutions for the challenges we face here on the island, even hurricanes. So I will not be executing that modified plan I mentioned in my last post... I'm going for the original. So what has changed? Half of the solution was right in front of my eyes, and I hadn't even seen it. The other half was provided by the very purpose the project was founded on: Permaculture.

For one thing, not every tree in the countryside was ripped up. Indeed, most of the trees remain standing and have regrown beautifully from snapped or broken trunks. And even broken trees have their purpose. So in the spirit of permaculture, I have decided to integrate the storm's natural destructive power into the farm itself. Chainsaws, wood-chippers and any relevant resources and infrastructure will be included in the farm to turn the fallen trees into valuable biomass, from compost to biochar. I will figure out how to restore damaged trees to full productive health, and I will make due with what I have to make the project work as best it can.

Regarding the other solution... A large and protected nursery. I intend to keep a large collection of replacement trees for all the species in my project (with emphasis on the more important and the more vulnerable ones). With every loss on my farm there will be younger replacements at hand, which I will replace in turn in the nursery for the next big disaster.

Any further improvements on the plan will be evaluated and incorporated as I gain experience. In short, neither rain nor sleet nor gale-force winds will stop my project. It's one of the most important things I hope to achieve, and any further challenges will be welcomed as a learning experience for myself and for others who may wish to learn from my trials. That is the end of it.

As I mentioned in my last post, there is one aspect that remains changed. The job. So far, no answers to my applications, so while I look further, I'll be applying for a position in my local factory in a few weeks. Meanwhile, I'm broke. They haven't called me back regarding the plot of land I applied for either, so I'm not gonna count on that unless I actually get a call someday.

*

Good luck Caesar. You may consider papaya also as they are fast growing plants and the plantations are replaced at a periodical bases with or without hurricanes according to my readings concerning commercial papaya plantations. it helps you mitigate the damage if the trees are down by a hurricane.

Papayas are part of my plan. I'd like to trial Babaco too.  :)


Caesar, it's good that you had a chance to gain experience before you took a loss and know the risks. There really is no better teacher than experience. This is a forum about growing tropical fruit crops. Most of the tropics are subject to extreme weather threats including wind, water, and even heat, drought, and fire. All of these hazards need to be considered. The folks in California which were recently wiped out by fire are a good example.

So, what to do?
Design into your system resistance to those elements.
It really is folly to have 40 ft. Haden trees surrounding your flimsy trailer house as a hurricane approaches or to have dry mulched beds, cedar shingle roofs, vinyl siding, and gutters full of pine needles in a on a house in the fire prone areas of California. Looking back, what the hell were we thinking would happen?

This forum has plenty of folks with experience with hurricanes, accumulated decades and likely even centuries of lessons learned from across the world if you add us all up. There should be ways to mitigate and protect orchards against wind and water, at least to some extent. We probably need a dedicated thread on the subject, and I know it has been discussed some already.

You spoke about becoming a leader in your community and proving concepts. Well, there you go, this is a challenge to face in which you could help find solutions to this perennial problem. All of us can and should be doing these things.

I haven't kept myself up to date. How are people doing in California lately, in the aftermath of the fires? They're not still going on, are they? I hope everyone's doing better. I was just shocked by a recent study that says the death toll on PR is over 4,000. I suspected it was much higher than the local government numbers, but I never imagined it could've been that high.


Hi Caesar,

I think you are doing everything right, step by step. I got interested in permaculture and fruit breeding both out of curiosity and idealism, but I do have another education, job and passion which is my ‘first love’.
On the other hand I always fantasized about my ‘plant hobby’ to someday be able to generate some money or income, but after eight years of spending a lot of time and thoughts on it I realize that that is very hard to do ‘on the side’ . I am afraid there is not a lot of ‘passive income’ to generate from farm work and fruit breeding is by now an equally complex art, so adjusted to market demands it has become not only an enormous long shot, but in order to develop new varieties into a licensed or patented product that generates money ‘passively’ you have to work full time at it. So the ‘passive’ part is very relative.

Nonetheless some permaculture farms that are well planned and thought through have flourished and taken off also commercially. These are truly admirable enterprises and have given a better idea on how to make such a thing work. All of them take it as seriously hard work and research their context and market extensively, start small and scale things up later.
You might want to check out the videos of this guy:
https://youtu.be/p__7st7Q6ic

Good luck!

I've saved a few videos of his that seem particularly promising, but I gotta take time to see all of it. Good information, thanks for the link.


*


Thank you all for the advice and the encouragement. You've all been a greater help than you know, and despite the time elapsed, I hope this is not the end of this thread. Perhaps if I can get that job soon, I'll be that much closer to starting the farm. Slowly for sure, but I'll be posting my progress as it comes. Once again, thanks.  :)

236
A new update on my tropical root veggies:

The Potato Mints have started coming up from the seed tubers I planted, and I have spread them about between my grandmother's yard and my vegetable tubs. Many plants, plus a few extra growing strong from accidentally snapping some stems (which grew back from the roots anyway).

I'm concerned that I may have lost my D. polystachya. I have some suspects currently in pots, but they're similar to D. bulbifera when sprouting, so I can't yet be certain that I have any remaining. If I can positively identify any of the bulbils/vines, I will be growing them separately from the other yam vines from now on, in a 5 gallon plastic bucket (to hopefully keep the tubers compact).

From the original D. trifida plant, I now have 8 sprouted tubers, 2 of which have broken the soil surface. 2 of them are planted in one of the big plastic totes with a sprouted D. rotundata and 6 (¿or 7?) D. bulbiferas (some of them sprouted, with many feet of vine growth). The other 6 trifidas are in another tote with 3 Lerén plants and 4 potato mints. The Lerén are growing healthy and strong, and I hope to have some material to share this winter, along with the rest of my roots.

Regarding the D. bulbifera, I was concerned about bulbil viability... I am concerned no longer. Of the 19 roots, 6 (¿7?) are planted in their original tote, 4 in my grandmother's yard. The other 9 (¿8?) were eaten within days of harvesting. I'm unsure of some numbers there because not all have sprouted past soil level and I can't quite remember, but all were viable. Regarding the bulbils... Dear Lord! Of the 80+ bulbils I planted (ranging from medium to tiny), 66 were accounted for as having sprouted, 2 remain unsprouted-but-viable, and a few (uncounted, but I think less than 5) were explicitly found rotting. Any others remain unaccounted for (possibly tiny ones that rotted long ago). Of the 66, 10 were snapped when I tried to separate them from their communal pot, but they snapped off with strong roots, so I'm confident they'll survive. They were replanted alone in the sprouting pot to monitor their progress, and their tubers were planted elsewhere to see if they'd sprout new vines. Of the remaining 56, 10 vines were separated for a local friend, and 1 vine for another. The fate of the remaining 45 vinelets... Well, let's just say I'm repeating the sins of my past. First, a little context:

I'm not kidding when I say I have no available space at the moment. I tend to place new projects on hold, or otherwise execute them in containers, as you see here. Half of my trees are in temporary containers, waiting for their time. The back hillside of my home is prime planting space, but if it was totally inaccessible before (when it was merely covered by an impenetrable jungle of weeds), it's nearly impossible now with the fallen trees from the hurricane (that are themselves overgrown with the worst vining weeds). I'm just one guy, and tackling it by myself in the more manageable early days yielded very little progress (a tenth of the space or less cleared) for several months of effort. And that minor result was undone when I had to recuperate for a few months from minor surgery. Suffice it to say that I am unwilling to tackle it directly myself these days (it's an angry-button issue for me). So how would we handle it at home? Hire someone to clear it. It's pretty common practice over here. But we haven't been able to lately, and even if we could, it's a little harder to find someone with a chainsaw for the trees. So for now, I have no available space.

Back to the bulbils, and with the context of no available space, I planted all 44 remaining vinelets (and the 3 viable bulbils) in a single plastic tote. Extremely oversaturated with plants. I honestly do not expect this to yield good results, above or below ground. Nevertheless, consider it an experiment: Ultra-high Density Planting. If it goes as badly as I expect, you'll have direct evidence, the experimental poster-child of why you shouldn't have too many plants growing in a small space. If it actually goes well (or shows potential for slightly less saturated plantings), then you'll have incentive to try out high-density plantings yourselves. Regardless of the outcome, you can be sure of one thing... Half the folks in the forum are getting bulbils this next season.

*

Photo Gallery:

The Trifida/Lerén tote:


The 9-Yam tote (3 species, ignore the true potatoes I'm sprouting on the surface):


The Ultra-High Density D. bulbifera tote (many are below-soil while acclimating):


237
Tropical Vegetables and Other Edibles / Re: Ensete ventricosum
« on: May 29, 2018, 03:36:20 PM »
Thanks for the info, I've downloaded the videos. As for Mayagüez, I wouldn't count on much from them any time soon. Never mind the current issues with governments budgets and hurricane aftermath, they don't seem to have much in the way of plants available to the general public at the moment, especially not the more exotic ones. At least, that's what I remember from a few attempts to score some exotics that they were supposed to have. I think they currently deal more in conventional trials/experiments than in collecting exotic stock. If I need stock, I can usually count on the Ponce sub-station, but there's not much diversity of species there.

And that does seem like a very good use for them. I've considered raising pigs before, I'm not sure if I'll go through with it, but it's definitely something to think about. I have a lot of stored information to stew on in that regard, and the ECHO method looks like one of the best I've seen.

238
Temperate Fruit Discussion / Re: Chinese bayberry
« on: May 27, 2018, 06:05:04 PM »
You piqued my interest. Apparently, it's a dioecious nitrogen-fixing tree, but I don't know if the commercial cultivars require a male pollinator (¿pollenizer?) or not. Tradewinds Fruit states they are difficult and slow to sprout (http://tradewindsfruit.com/myrica-rubra-yumberry-seeds).

I tried looking for a retailer of named varieties, but there don't seem to be any stateside. I found one in China that ships worldwide... No idea if it's trustworthy, but I'm tempted to place an order. It'd be better if they put the prices in the actual page, though. They have 4 named varieties, with their qualities listed in-page, but there's no mention of a pollenizer. One of them is the Dong Kui you mentioned. Jason Nursery: this is their link (http://www.fruit-trees-nursery.com/myrica_rubra.htm#sthash.go2Trng7.xnU5AEk6.dpbs).

239
Have the cuttings properly taken root? Are they available yet?  ;D

240
Temperate Fruit Discussion / Re: The Official "Blueberry Tree" thread.
« on: April 11, 2018, 11:16:45 PM »
Boy, do I have some great news!




I see that there is a picture, but I don't actually see it. What is it? Have the cuttings taken root?  :D

Edit: I think the problem's on my end. I'm not seeing pics in any thread.

241
Caesar, I am surprised, I have been growing Dioscorea bulbifera for many years now, and I have only one vine growing from one bulbil and only one root tuber from each vine while you have many of both! Yr soil or climate must be very good for them!!

Perhaps the climate? I think it's pretty standard tropics over here, but not Ultra-tropical like at the equator. And I grew them where they'd receive direct sun, and kept up a heavy watering regimen during most of their growth. What's the climate and soil like at your place?

I used a seemingly high-quality store-bought soil to fill the tub where they were growing, and I did get to apply fertilizer once or twice. The actual soil on my property - outside the tubs - is a pretty heavy clay. I think it was landfill, to stabilize the area; I live in a hillside suburb. None were grown outside the tub.

The bulbils had already started sprouting when they arrived, so I buried them somewhat deep in their original pots, to let the stems acclimate to the local moisture without having to bag them. Once they burst through the soil, I let them grow a few more weeks before planting them all in the tub. There was only one bulbil per "hatching" pot, and each one had several vines, sometimes up to five. Since they were all doing it, I thought it must have been normal.

I think I forgot to post this initially, but this is the one pic I have of one of the bulbils sprouting through the soil for the first time. Three visible vines at this point.



What's the bulbil production like on your vines? Heavy or light? Have you noticed a difference between yearling vines and older vines? And what's their size range usually like?

Seeing as this is clonal material, I don't quite understand how mine turned out different, but it may very well be environmental, as you said. The multiple in-ground tubers were a surprise that I still haven't gotten over. I've never seen a yam do that, at least not in that way. The D. trifida was a solid cluster where you had to snap off each tuber from a solid top. With the bulbiferas, they were clustered in space, but they were loose. I didn't snap a single one off another when harvesting. The only clustering yam I've heard of that might be similar is D. esculenta, but I haven't acquired that one yet.

242
Tropical Vegetables and Other Edibles / Re: Ensete ventricosum
« on: April 01, 2018, 10:25:41 PM »
Lost Crops of Africa has some good info on enset.

Good call! I checked it out, and apparently there are several clones (not discussed in detail), some of which are particularly esteemed for their corms. I think I'd rather grow the corm types, as I'm fond of root vegetables and they don't require the processing effort nor the maturation time of stem types. So there's my answer: there are specialty types, and they're not commonly available (not the offered seeds online). I think I'd require a direct contact in Ethiopia in order to acquire it, and even then, Bananas are one of the few overtly illegal crops to import into the island (¿Unless one has the proper permits perhaps?), and I think that extends to Enset.


on the tangent, yes all banana hearts are edible, however you would have to stew them very long, and there is very little soft heart, the rest is very stringy and hard to chew.  Like coconut hearts, palm hearts, bamboo shoots, artichoke hearts, there is the 'softest' and best part which is at the very center, and then the quality degrades the further you go out.  I feed my pig whole banana trees, and the pig eats them as something to do with her day.  Here, some commercial pig farmers will chop up bananas and boil with feed.

Your average dwarf williams, or other large stalk dwarf banana only produces a heart about the size of a banana.  It is not commonly consumed.. like your post, it is a famine food. 

Thanks for your interesting post, never heard of that type, but here have Ensete glaucum, that does not have suckers.  The flowers have some herbal tradition.  I have over 20 types of unique bananas, but I stay away from anything with seed.

Well, given their tiny size, I think you're right in qualifying them as a famine food, not really worth it to grow the crop for that particular purpose. I'll stick to growing bananas for their fruit.

As for Enset, the Ethiopian type doesn't seem to sucker either. According to what I just read in Lost Crops ( https://www.nap.edu/read/11763/chapter/11#189 ), at harvest time they take some of the corms for propagation purposes, cut off part of the upper stem, core the whole thing to the center of the corm and stuff it with soil and manure; that induces bud production, sometimes over a hundred per corm.

Do you grow them for ornamental purposes? Ensete glaucum looks very nice, but I think it requires cooler highland conditions more than Enset.

243
I was thoroughly disappointed in myself on reading that I could have eaten that first bulbil. Oh well, lesson learned. I did get to try a bulbil in late december. And I tasted the roots in late February/early March. Both were boiled as one would boil other yams: until softened (no exceptionally long period for "toxins" or anything like that). But in waiting so long to write back, some minor nuances in flavor are lost to me, so my apologies in that regard. What I do remember is this: the bulbils and the roots are actually very similar to one another in taste; the bulbils were greenish even when ripe, and the roots were light yellow. There is a definite potato element in the flavor that is absent in other yams, and distinct from the potato flavor found in Plectranthus. Also, a very mild note (stronger in the bulbil) that reminded of bitterness, but nothing like the real bitterness one finds in nasty yams. The texture was firm when in chunks, and dense and pasty when mashed (not dry/floury like some of the better D. rotundata nor mushy like some D. alata). Some of my family members reported a slight slimy texture, which I didn't find (the closest I found was an oddly firm & slightly slippery texture in one tiny chunk, possibly near the stem end).

My personal verdict: agreeable flavor, but not top quality. Still, much better than the mediocre yams I've had, and even without the bulbil gimmick, I'd consider it worth growing on flavor alone. No strong bitterness, no rough fibers, no weird textures (at least, not that I could taste). I got to harvest and taste my D. trifida on the same day, and the D. rotundata a few days later; both of them turned out exceptional, so my palate was probably spoiled for them.  ;)

***

A gallery of the harvests (and some cooking pics):

The bulbils. I cooked one, and planted the rest. Notice the dark-ish color of the cooked flesh, and the even darker water it leaves behind. Not quite as dark as some of the bitter yams I've had (the "mediocre" ones I keep referencing: particularly poor specimens of D. alata and D. rotundata), and without their bitterness.




Some bulbifera roots (which should grow bigger with each passing year) and the normal-sized trifida roots (broken off from one cluster). Notice the paler color of the roots (though still yellow, in contrast with the white trifida roots).



And finally, a picture of my prize (though small) rotundata:



***

Finally, some extra experiences with the bulbiferas:

Snails and slugs continued to attack some of the remaining bulbils as the season went on, so I'd consider them the number one pest.

The overwhelming majority of the bulbils were very small, and I doubt they'd be worth much effort to prepare to cook. I'm not sure if picking some off (as one does with fruits) would increase the size of the remainder or if that's random. Seeing as production should increase over the years, I'm confident that I'll get a greater proportion of larger bulbils over the years (though I'm not sure if the plant should be covered by them, or anything like that). This was their first year (and crammed together in a single pot on a single trellis), and first year bulbil yams of any kind are supposedly poor producers.

Also... as I noted in the first post, I planted seven bulbils. When I dug up the roots, I found nineteen roots! I don't even know how that happens! While they were mostly clustered, none were connected (unlike the mass of trifida tubers). So not only are they productive in bulbils, they also seem very productive as roots (at least, when sown as a bulbil). I ate several roots with my family, and planted the rest, to hedge my bets in case something goes wrong. So far, none of the bulbils has sprouted, though none seems to have rotted either. Here's hoping I can get a mass of plants to spread around.

And that's it for the preceding season! I'll keep you all posted on any special developments this season.

244
Hi all, I'm writing up this thread to update y'all on the story so far with my non-solanaceous potatoes. First, the Potato Mint (P. rotundifolius):

The plant was vigorous almost from the start. It arrived early in the year as a tall and kinda weak-looking fully-rooted cutting from a Florida eBay vendor, and I planted it in one of those big plastic tubs with holes drilled in the bottom. I also planted a Guinea Yam (Dioscorea rotundata) in the same tub.

A week after planting and the potato mint already had plenty of strong growth. A month after planting, and it had already taken over the entire tub's surface area with foliage, and some branches were bending toward the soil and taking root. A few weeks later, and it was spilling out of the tub and onto the surrounding ground, so I decided to give it a drastic pruning, leaving behind a few stumps... In hindsight, that was probably a poor decision as the growth of new foliage would probably take vital energy and nutrients away from tuber growth. Lesson learned. I threw some tomato seeds onto the newly-exposed soil surface and forgot about them.

A few weeks afterwards, and the growth was carpeting the tub again, and the pruned stems I had thrown on the ground had taken root and started growing on their own (I left them there and they keep growing to this day). The surviving tomato plants grew tall between the potatoes, and soon both species started flowering simultaneously. A few weeks afterwards, with the tomatoes producing and the potatoes' flower spikes starting to fade (which means harvest time), I pulled up one of the potato plants and dug up the tubers.

Given the various less-than-ideal circumstances (container-growing, competing plants, partial shade, no fertilizer, impromptu heavy-pruning) the crop was small (and composed of mainly smaller tubers), but I'm confident it would've been a good crop under better circumstances. The biggest (normal-sized?) ones were about the size of a small potato, but many were smaller (like Lerén tubers), and a score of them were tiny (these I saved for re-planting). Even with a suspected smaller crop, I actually got enough potatoes out of that one mistreated plant to have a full plate of mashed potatoes. I pulled the remaining plants out the next week and had them fried.

The tubers were amazingly easy to process, so that even pinky-sized tubers were quickly dealt with and used. I put on a pair of gloves, and scratched the skin off under running water quickly during washing off the dirt. In fact, while the nails may have slightly sped up the process, it probably wasn't necessary, as the skin rubbed off with the soft part of the fingertips, it was that tender!

The tubers were white, but many had large areas of green under the skin, and a few had purple areas (all from the same plant). I was unconcerned with toxicity as I'm pretty sure the entire plant is technically edible and non-toxic. After boiling like normal potatoes, I tasted a few whole and mashed the rest. The taste was really very close to true potatoes, with a slight vegetal tone my family likened to Artocarpus camansi seeds (the very mild, immature ones, not the strongly-flavored ripe ones), but milder still. No purple remained after boiling and there was no bitterness or any discernible difference between the green and white areas. I should also point out that some sources mention a sweetness to the taste... I detected no such sweetness (nor any minty/peppery/spicy taste), it was just potatoey.

The second batch of tubers was prepared for frying. Some were left skin-on (I recommend it, though it requires delicate washing), many were sliced lengthwise, a few sliced into chip shape, and a few smaller ones were fried intact. Crispy outside, soft inside (even the chips were a bit flexible), and the flavor was like a combination of homemade french fries and fried eggplant (the good types; no bitterness). They were very good, and doubtless would've been excellent seasoned and roasted like wedge potatoes.

The verdict: unknown prospects as a commercial root crop (especially given how easily the skin rubs off), but excellent for the home vegetable plot. Vigorous and nearly care-free, probably productive (especially with good care and space, not like my neglect), easily propagated, easily processed, and of good taste. I highly recommend it for any warm-weather vegetable garden (no idea if it has a short enough growing season for cooler regions).

***

Now the Edible Air Potato (D. bulbifera):

I received 7 bulbils through the combined efforts of Chandramohan and Roy. They were quick to sprout through the dirt, the last of them a few weeks after planting. Each bulbil sprouted several vines, and would continue sprouting more throughout the growing season. Alas, my crime of neglect was worse with these, and I'm probably not witnessing full production (even though it still seems like a vigorous producer). For my current lack of space, I transplanted every single one of those plants (together with a Chinese Yam, D. polystachya) into a single tub that was probably only big enough (but not ideal) for just two plants; one trellis shared between them.

Despite the circumstances, they also grew vigorously (and twined together), and all seven plants are alive and well. Months passed without a single bulbil (it's not supposed to bear until close to the end of the growing season anyway). Then one day I saw a small bulbil, and it remained alone, increasing in size until almost reaching its maximum (small potato, but bigger than the P. Mint) long before any other bulbils showed up. When others showed up, it was an almost explosive profusion of bulbils, with a rough count of approximately 47 (which I'm fairly sure fell short of the true number even then; by now, many more still have showed up).

All was well and good, to a point, but there's an important thing to mention about this plant: it seems far more susceptible to animal pests than any other yam I've grown. Nothing of note has ever touched any of my other yam vines. Meanwhile, I've seen bulbifera leaves eaten by crickets, cockroaches and snails (and possibly a grasshopper and a katydid, but I didn't see them chewing). And the worst part: the snails ruin the bulbils themselves! I saw one with a gaping hole that looked like a bird pecked into it, thinking it was a fruit. For a while, that's exactly what I thought. But one night I decided to check on the plants at midnight and I started seeing the different pests in action. A week later, I saw the snail on the bulbil, and a second one on another one, rasping holes right through them. Suffice it to say that I've been hunting snails often since then, and crushing every one I find. But the damage was done: in a blind panic, I harvested the big one for fear that a snail would get to it first.

Strictly speaking, I'm not certain that you're not supposed to harvest them, but I was under the impression that you're meant to leave them on the plant until they drop off naturally. A friend (who has harvested alata bulbils) told me that if you pick them before their time, the flesh would be green, and they'd be inedible. Well wouldn't you know, when I went to cook the big one, it was green all the way through. Peeled so that I couldn't plant it, and seemingly too green to be edible, I had to throw it out. Crushing disappointment after all that waiting. Oh well, I've waited this long, I can wait longer for the other bulbils to ripen. I plucked a few small ones from a drying vine to propagate them, but the few big ones I've seen look like they have a few months to go before they drop. I'm hoping the little ones grow quickly, so I can get a half decent crop when it's time to taste them. I truly have high hopes for this plant, and will give my usual play-by-play analysis when I taste them (probably some time next year).

***

Photo Gallery:

The African Potato / Potato Mint:




Same, boiled, mashed and fried:




The Air Potato:




Snail damage:




The big one:


245
Tropical Vegetables and Other Edibles / Re: Ensete ventricosum
« on: December 04, 2017, 11:04:05 PM »
Bump.

Nothing? Anyone?

246
Tropical Fruit Discussion / Re: Edible Conifers and other Gymnosperms
« on: December 04, 2017, 10:50:58 PM »
Thanks for the info, I've incorporated it into the original post as an edit. As to which is the best/most-productive/most-reliable source of pollen, I cannot say, but I think it warrants a good long search when I get the chance.

247
Tropical Vegetables and Other Edibles / Re: Edible Flowers!
« on: December 04, 2017, 10:25:54 PM »
I keep this list in my files, to plan out flower strips between vegetable rows. It's mainly a list of ornamental-type flower plants that have edible parts (making them potentially productive companion plants); not all of them have the flower as the actual edible part (which is this thread's purpose), but most do, so I figured I'd just copy and paste it here.

Note: Some (like edible Lupines) have toxic parts, so please don't nibble flowers on this list until you're sure that the flower is the actual edible part.

Ornamental Flower Plants With Edible Parts:
Chrysanthemum coronarium
Reichardia picroides
Tagetes spp.
Calendula officinalis
Taraxacum officinale
Chicorium intybus
Microseris lanceolata
Centaurea cyanus
Acmella oleracea
Carthamus tinctorius
Helianthus annuus
H. tuberosus
Dahlia spp.
Dianthus caryophyllus
Pelargonium spp.
Papaver somniferum
Polianthes tuberosa
Camassia quamash
Triteleia laxa
Campanula rapunculus
Primula vulgaris
Tropaeolum majus
Tigridia pavonia
Hemerocallis fulva
Lupinus angustifolius

248
Hello everyone. I'm happy to report that I've been doing relatively well in the aftermath of hurricane Maria (diesel generator, accessible water - working pipes now -, and good food), and that my current collection is relatively intact, with only one exotic being strongly damaged (an Achachairu tree). Even the Dioscorea bulbifera is still there, growing on the trellis, unaffected by the storm. My collection survived due to the small size and young age of the trees (and the strategic placement of the ones still remaining in pots). The exotics turned out alright, but I lost all three of my mature avocado trees, large and in the midst of a good crop, completely uprooted. And the partial-to-full destruction seen in most of the trees in the countryside is surprising in its scale. For all my good fortune, I never imagined the entire island could sustain so much damage from a storm. The event shocked me to my core, and made me question my future at length.

I started this project as a thought experiment many years ago while I was still studying for my bachelors degree. It quickly grew into a labor of love, and while it never left the flexible stage of the theoretical into the practical, I had high hopes that I would someday accomplish much with it. I wanted to put theories to the test, bring true permaculture into the mainstream (at least in PR), focus on tree crops (which are mostly neglected in modern agriculture), expand the local palate with new choices, innovate in any way I could, and ultimately contribute to the food security of the island, both directly with my own farm, and indirectly through example. Dread and a sense of barren futility set in after the storm, and I thought I would never get that chance.

I thought about my options long and hard. While it's true that storms of this magnitude are rare on the island, the fact remains that the hurricane season is a yearly occurrence, and only chance or divine providence has kept such storms rare. There's nothing that would guarantee they would remain rare in the face of a changing climate. Some consider it foolhardy to plan one's life around unpredictable natural disasters, but that's exactly the point: hurricanes are not unpredictable. Their season is yearly and cyclic, like clockwork, and their presence is guaranteed in this general part of the world; the only unpredictable thing about them is whether they'll pass you by or hit you head on. Strong weather and geological events abound throughout the world, but they tend to be scattered and isolated events, truly unpredictable; few places have such a consistent cyclic risk of disaster (even if it rarely delivers on the threat). The threat is always there, in a way that random isolated events never are. I can live with the idea of having my efforts destroyed by a truly random event (something I never could've planned for), but to try the exact same plan in a place with a perpetual clockwork risk of disaster feels like I'm setting myself up for failure, painstakingly building something up that I know will be destroyed in a matter of time by a ticking time bomb. Such a prospect is completely unacceptable to me. So it was back to the drawing board, trying to salvage what I could from my plans (which, thankfully, are still theoretical; I still hadn't received a call for the paperwork I sent in, trying to acquire land).

I thought about doing it anyway, and I concluded that I couldn't. Even if I could handle the emotional impact of my work undone, the economic impact of a destroyed tree farm would probably bankrupt me. That means that (NFT's not withstanding), tree crops are out of the question for me as a dominant aspect of the farm (thus hurting that particular founding principle for me, here on the island). I thought about continuing the farm without the tree crops, but it feels like too much is missing, like the intended project was ultimately defeated. I thought about moving stateside, but even if the coasts were free from hurricane risk (which they're not), the warmest part of the mainland is still too cold during winter for some of the tropical trees I was hoping to trial; as for Hawaii, it's a little too far for my comfort, I don't know their weather patterns, and I've heard the cost of living is high there. I thought about moving to Nicaragua, Costa Rica, or even Brazil, where I could complete the project at a safe distance from such consistent yearly threats (provided those places don't have a hurricane season). But they share one trait in common with the US: they're not PR (so for all their completeness, any farms there would not contribute to the food security of my homeland). And besides, I've no family there, and I personally don't want to put much distance between me and them.

I was close to giving up entirely, but I've worked too hard for too long to give up on this. Some other job is necessary now, so at least that has changed: I wanted the project to stand by itself economically, as described earlier in the thread, but even before the storm I had come to accept the certainty that I need another job to acquire a firm economic foundation for myself. I was about to start the job search when the storm hit. In the aftermath, I noticed many staple crops were running low in the local markets, and I realized that with the yearly risk of storms, a strong food supply is necessary here, now more than ever. And that has kept me from giving up.

I still plan on getting a job as soon as I'm able (hopefully something in line with my Biology major), but I've also decided to combine some of the prior ideas and rebuild my fractured plans on them. I intend to start a farm here after I get a job. It will use some of the NFT alley crop methods as a basis, and I will focus on staples, vegetables and smaller fruiting plants. The Tree Crop section will be small compared to prior plans, and will consist mainly of Avocados (easily replaced if lost) and Breadfruit (quick to grow back from a broken trunk). That way I get to practice permaculture (even if the selection of tree crops is diminished) and contribute to the local food security, while being at minimal risk of strong economic loss (few and common trees to lose, and readily replaceable annual crops; hacked up NFT's should weather the storm nicely). Once I'm economically stable, I hope to acquire land in Central America later on, to grow the missing half of my farm: the exotic tree crops. I'd get to satisfy my desire for tropical fruit without living in yearly fear of hurricanes ripping them out of the ground. If I could ship the fruit into PR, I'd get the pleasure of expanding the local palate as well (even if they weren't grown there). Staple crops on the island, fruiting trees in Central America, and all my intended boxes checked. It's a little more complicated than I had hoped, but hopefully doable.

Any thoughts or advice in relation to this? And regarding acquiring land elsewhere?

249
Any update on the status of the seeds?

250
Tropical Fruit Discussion / Re: Jatropa
« on: August 23, 2017, 08:15:43 PM »
Here's what I could find on Edible Jatropha curcas:

Topic previously discussed here: http://tropicalfruitforum.com/index.php?topic=21320.0

Agribusiness Links:

* http://jatrosolutions.com/products/productlines/ediblenut.html

* http://www.hardmanagribusiness.com/chuta-a-totonacan-snack-food/

* http://www.hardmanagribusiness.com/tag/jatropha/

Academic Links:

* https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s00217-016-2814-x

* https://link.springer.com/article/10.1023%2FA%3A1008054010079


From what I can tell, the non-toxic "Chuta" type seems edible even when raw (though I'd roast them). My personal opinion (no idea if it's rooted in reality, just erring on the side of caution), I would obtain and/or propagate it exclusively from cuttings of confirmed fully-edible non-toxic types. The risk of cross-pollination with toxic types seems like too much... Even if you got seeds from the right plant, if it was pollinated by a toxic type, the seedling could bear toxic nuts. And even if it wasn't pollinated by a toxic type, what do we know of its genetic inheritance? There may be some combination of recessive and dominant traits that could lead to a reversion in subsequent generations, leading to toxic nuts from non-toxic stock. This is all speculation on my part, but I personally would rather not risk it. I like the sound of this crop, and I personally intend to acquire it. But I'm only willing to get it as a cutting, from a tree whose owner eats the nuts on a regular basis. What better confirmation of it's lack of toxicity than a healthy consumer? Those are my two cents.

Pages: 1 ... 8 9 [10] 11 12 ... 19
SMF spam blocked by CleanTalk