uvaia with old red leaves?

[huertasurbanas]

Hi, yesterday I bought many native fruit trees, some of them (24) are uvaias. 2 or 3 bushes seem to be not eugenia pyriformis, but eugenia lutescens. Today I noticed something rare to me: 1 uvaia looked like an eugenia uniflora on spring or winter, with pretty old red leaves.











I never saw an uvaia with old red leaves (and the biggest one, planted on the garden 3 years ago, never never turned red), all the others are just green (but the supposed lutescens produces new red leaves). Could this be a rare variation that will produce a different fruit?

Does your uvaias turn red on winter? I could not find a single image on the net about a red leafed uvaia.

[Don]

That is interesting, the only Eugenia of mine that went like that in winter was Eugenia patrissii.  What other types of eugenias did you buy?

[Solko]

That is a cool discovery! If any of your 24 new Uvaia's produce fruit this year, I'll be asking you for seeds! I love the genetic variation that this species displays.

According to the studies I have seen Uvaia is genetically very close to Ubajay, Eugenia Beaurepairiana and Eugenia Lutescens. But that entire 'Uvaia' branch of the evolutionary Eugenia tree sits between Eugenia Involucrata and Eugenia Uniflora. So it's close enough to Pitanga to share some of the genes that would make the leaves turn red. My Pitanga's do that on new growth and when it gets cold. On this tree it looks like a reaction to the cold, since all leaves have turned red.

Beaurepairiana has an orange fruit, so maybe that one produces more red pigment? Maybe it has some of those genes. It would be cool if this one would give an orange fruit.

By the way - if you want to try some crosses, I would try to cross Uvaia with these species - they are evolutionary the closest to Uvaia. Repanda, Guabiju and Florida are also on the same branch, but further away than Involucrata and Uniflora.

[huertasurbanas]

Hi Don: this seller had only 1 eugenia repanda that bears red fruit (all mines from other source does it in black), e. uniflora (he said they are allways black...) and these uvaias. The other eugenias I have (that dint fruited yet) are: reindwardtiana, brasilensis, candolleana, involucrata, selloi, luchnatiana, itaguahiensis and a supposed moraviana.

Solko: very interesting, do you have links to those articles? I will send you seeds: the biggest one, planted at the garden, should produce flowers soon (it is chloritic due to bad water and too much sun, but it seems to recover with iron and only rain water). Uvaia close to ubajay, what a crazy idea. I would love to cross any eugenia just for fun, the problem is they should flower at the same time. For instance, now the only one that flowers is uniflora.

This red leafed uvaia, maybe, would bear darker orange fruits? I dont know...

[FlyingFoxFruits]

In my experience it is not unusual to see pyriformis leaves that turn red during winter.

Many Eugenias do this.

[Solko]

This is the article I got the information from:

http://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s12225-014-9497-x

And somewhere else on the web I found this image from the article:



It looks like E Stipitata also is closely related to Uvaia

[huertasurbanas]

Nice image, Solko, and what does it means this:

". A total of 70 samples were analysed and the resulting topology confirms the inclusion of Neotropical genera Calycorectes, Hexachlamys, Phyllocalyx and Stenocalyx in Eugenia to preserve the monophyly of Eugenia. "

so ubajay now should be an eugenia and not hexachlamys? so we can try to cross uvaia and ubajay? weird... but the people from the north of Argentina use to call ubajay to uvaia or "ubajay de monte", and even there is an eugenia pyriflora that is called ubajay too...

Also, I have that 2 myrcianthes from that list (pungens, fragans), and cisplatensis, but it seems that the only good fruit is from pungens (guavijú) and it would not make sense to cross them or use as rootstock.

[huertasurbanas]

In my experience it is not unusual to see pyriformis leaves that turn red during winter.

Many Eugenias do this.

I know, many of my eugenias use to do it, but I never saw a pyriformis doing it. So yours must be from a different source than most of mines, for sure.

I cant find a single photo on the net about a red leafed uvaia

[FlyingFoxFruits]

chilly weather turns the leaves red, it's nothing unusual, i have lots of eugenias that do this of all sorts...

did you notice the leaves were red, after the plant was exposed to temps of 50F or less?

In my experience it is not unusual to see pyriformis leaves that turn red during winter.

Many Eugenias do this.

I know, many of my eugenias use to do it, but I never saw a pyriformis doing it. So yours must be from a different source than most of mines, for sure.

I cant find a single photo on the net about a red leafed uvaia

[huertasurbanas]

chilly weather turns the leaves red, it's nothing unusual, i have lots of eugenias that do this of all sorts...

did you notice the leaves were red, after the plant was exposed to temps of 50F or less?

In my experience it is not unusual to see pyriformis leaves that turn red during winter.

Many Eugenias do this.

I know, many of my eugenias use to do it, but I never saw a pyriformis doing it. So yours must be from a different source than most of mines, for sure.

I cant find a single photo on the net about a red leafed uvaia

I know, but the other 23 uvaia plants in the same place didnt got red, and the one planted at the garden 3 years ago got -3º C and not a single red leaf. A mistery!

[Guanabanus]

Maybe there is another possibility, such as deficiency of Phosphorous.

[huertasurbanas]

Maybe there is another possibility, such as deficiency of Phosphorous.

OK, I named it "red leafed uvaia" and will be watching it to see if it behaves the same way every year, and will add some fertilizer with phosphorous.

" Photosynthesis, the main function of plant cells that produces energy from sunlight and water, usually remains at a normal rate under a phosphorus-deficient state. However phosphorus usage in functions within the cell usually slow. This imbalance of rates in phosphorus deficient plants leads to the buildup of excess carbohydrate within the plant. This carbohydrate buildup often can be observed by the darkening of leaves. In some plants the leaf pigment change as a result of this process can turn leaves a dark purplish color." https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phosphorus_deficiency

[huertasurbanas]

I mailed Helton with many photos of this uvaia and he seems to believe it's very rare and maybe another species... I dont know, just wait till it fruits...

[Solko]

Hi Marcos,


I finally found a video that shows the Pyriformis next to the Lutescens:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HY5EyM0SgO0

But on this video the Pyriformis has long red leaves (as new growth) and the Lutescens has rounder, glossy leaves. It seems we will remain confused until we have tasted a fruit from every tree 

Nice image, Solko, and what does it means this:

". A total of 70 samples were analysed and the resulting topology confirms the inclusion of Neotropical genera Calycorectes, Hexachlamys, Phyllocalyx and Stenocalyx in Eugenia to preserve the monophyly of Eugenia. "

so ubajay now should be an eugenia and not hexachlamys? so we can try to cross uvaia and ubajay? weird... but the people from the north of Argentina use to call ubajay to uvaia or "ubajay de monte", and even there is an eugenia pyriflora that is called ubajay too...

As I understand it, this image just maps genetic proximity. All species keep their names, so Hexachlamys remains Hexachlamys. The names point to observable botanical differences. The image to genetic similarity. Because two species might share some genes and ancestry. And this is what this research tried to map. They do it with specific markers, though, and if you use different markers you can get a slightly different map, because species that share a lot of markers that were used in this research may not share the other markers.

It points out that Ubajai and Uvaia are two different species, but that they evolved from a common ancestor in the recent past. And that ancestor again had a common ancestor with Pitanga and Grumixma in a bit more distant past...

[greenman62]

i have a couple of guava that turn beet red when it gets cold.
i read somewhere it has to do with phosphorus
but, really PH is the culprit too.
The cold weather changes the ability to uptake
(maybe cold-wet changes the PH ?)

anyway, i would check moisture and soil PH.
maybe add some phos. maybe lime also if needed

[huertasurbanas]

The first fruits of this species are ripening now:



new leaves are red, and we are in summer:

[Garcinia]

Interesting. Hopefully you have some seeds available later in the year.

[huertasurbanas]

That fruit from jan 10 fell of the tree being green (then it ripened outside the tree but had very little flesh), but now it has many more and one of them is turning orange. They seem to be really different to my other uvaias: Have a rough skin.

[huertasurbanas]

A video with the differences I see now:

https://youtu.be/zhZOU9A4eSQ