'Isan Indigo' Chewy Purple Sugar apple update.

[palmtreeluke]

For the backstory please visit the original thread here: http://tropicalfruitforum.com/index.php?topic=25267.0


2020 Update:

1. After experiencing freezing temperatures in January.  We ran sprinklers to ice over the small isan indigo seedlings for a few hours. I'm happy to report no cold damage or tip die back occured on small 1 gallon plants.

2. As the 2017 release of seedlings begin to fruit and mature... some folks (forum user: achetadomestica) are trying to sell scions of their seedlings as "isan indigo'... not only is this unethical, it's disrepectful and negligent. Please be aware no budwood or scions has been distributed of 'Isan Indigo'.   We will try to make grafted trees availble in the future and an update will be posted here when availble.

3.Now for the exciting news:  We have just re-release chewy purple sugar apple seeds on a website called www.BidNgrow.com  direct link here: https://www.bidngrow.com/Listing/Details/7095885/RARE-Isan-Indigo-Chewy-Purple-Sugar-apple-seeds-Annna-Squamosa

[j-grow]

amazing how things happen ...... I was going through the catchall drawer in the kitchen yesterday and found the seeds i bought from you back then.  Wanted to plant them and could never figure out where I put them.

[Jani]

Please put me down for a grafted tree whenever they're ready.

[Bush2Beach]

Unless I am missing something It seem’s like neither of you can offer the Isan Indigo as you grew it from seed and as you stated seed’s are not true to parent. Which is fine if you make clear what your selling is not a clone of the parent, but it appears your getting upset that someone else is doing the same thing you are .
You could call your Isan Indigo seedling line something luke and get on with it and have a name to memorialize this amazing find, er gift, forever.

[palmtreeluke]

Unless I am missing something It seem’s like neither of you can offer the Isan Indigo as you grew it from seed and as you stated seed’s are not true to parent. Which is fine if you make clear what your selling is not a clone of the parent, but it appears your getting upset that someone else is doing the same thing you are .
You could call your Isan Indigo seedling line something luke and get on with it and have a name to memorialize this amazing find, er gift, forever.

Heres how it works...Im the breeder of the 'isan indigo'.... I gave it that name.  Its one special tree that I selected from growing out multiple trees from one fruit. I selected it from an unnamed fruit from Thailand... planted seeds and ive grown them and observed them for 6 years now. There was one outstanding tree.... Its the one I called 'Isan Indigo'.  Its siblings are inconsisent in production and much lower too.  One sibling chewy purple tree 20 ft away only made one fruit last year and its 8 foot tall and already leafed out.  The 'Isan Indigo' is just now breaking dormancy and made around 75 fruits at 8-9 ft tall.

For the record: The original fruit I ate was not chewy like the offspring. The original isan indigo I planted here IN southwest FL has great productivity compared to its siblings.  When someone sells scions of a seedling they cannot claim they have an exact clone of the parent...  The seedlings will likely be inferior, thats why we graft things.... but if you grow out 100s or 1000s you can possbly find somthing better than the original.  This is how plant breeding works.  I chose not to patent this variety for multiple reasons and want the plant community to have access to this wonderful fruit, but please respect the name...

[sunny]

I have the original tree of this fruit, a grafted one here in thailand. They are soft and taste as normal noina's, small fruit with purple skin. It blooms non-stop.

[shot]

I have the original tree of this fruit, a grafted one here in Thailand. They are soft and taste as normal noina's, small fruit with purple skin. It blooms non-stop.

Then this fruit is a big improvement over the soft fleshed fruit in Thailand.Good going luke keep up the improvements.

[JoeP450]

Luke,

I have a nit pick with calling yourself a “breeder” as you didn’t select the parents, ie breed anything. What happened was you planted out a few seeds and happened upon a chance seedling that has outperformed the others in the bunch. This same logic applies as when you say as if planting hundreds or thousands of seeds ect. Achetadomestica likewise planted out a handful of seeds and likewise could also be “lucky” to have an improved version of isan indigo.

-Joe

[pineislander]

Heres how it works...Im the breeder of the 'isan indigo'.... I gave it that name.  Its one special tree that I selected from growing out multiple trees from one fruit. I selected it from an unnamed fruit from Thailand... planted seeds and ive grown them and observed them for 6 years now. There was one outstanding tree.... Its the one I called 'Isan Indigo'.  Its siblings are inconsisent in production and much lower too.  One sibling chewy purple tree 20 ft away only made one fruit last year and its 8 foot tall and already leafed out.  The 'Isan Indigo' is just now breaking dormancy and made around 75 fruits at 8-9 ft tall.

But can you really compare one seedling tree to it's siblings? Sure it could be "the one" but replication is the hallmark of the scientific method. I wish you well with this one and most likely once you have a dozen grafted trees in production you will find they all behave exactly alike but who knows until you have replicated it in a grafted form? Maybe you already have the test going, let us know how it goes.

[palmtreeluke]

I have the original tree of this fruit, a grafted one here in Thailand. They are soft and taste as normal noina's, small fruit with purple skin. It blooms non-stop.

Then this fruit is a big improvement over the soft fleshed fruit in Thailand.Good going luke keep up the improvements.

Thank you!

[palmtreeluke]

Heres how it works...Im the breeder of the 'isan indigo'.... I gave it that name.  Its one special tree that I selected from growing out multiple trees from one fruit. I selected it from an unnamed fruit from Thailand... planted seeds and ive grown them and observed them for 6 years now. There was one outstanding tree.... Its the one I called 'Isan Indigo'.  Its siblings are inconsisent in production and much lower too.  One sibling chewy purple tree 20 ft away only made one fruit last year and its 8 foot tall and already leafed out.  The 'Isan Indigo' is just now breaking dormancy and made around 75 fruits at 8-9 ft tall.

But can you really compare one seedling tree to it's siblings? Sure it could be "the one" but replication is the hallmark of the scientific method. I wish you well with this one and most likely once you have a dozen grafted trees in production you will find they all behave exactly alike but who knows until you have replicated it in a grafted form? Maybe you already have the test going, let us know how it goes.

Yes you can compare trees to its siblings, that the best way to find an improvement in one generation... keep the best replant and cull the bad stuff so the pollen cant ruin your project....this is called 'selective breeding'  thats why im calling myself a breeder but use the term loosely. define it how you will, I do this with many plants, wheter it be perennial or annuals vegetables, and fruit.  our entire farm is an experimental breeding center if you want to think of it that way.

Many people think sugar apple are 'true to seed' ... when in fact they are more likely to be 'similar to parent' just like many seeds. 

basically find a desriable fruit to start with, plant out seeds, compare them as they grow for many years, taste them, let them flood, go through hurricanes, experience freezing weather, whatever... etc.  You then grow seed from the best one, keep doing this.  Depending on what your breeding for you select based on those characteristics you want to breed. Many things to breed for including shelf life, color, texture, disease resistant, cold hardiness, the list goes on.... breeding plants can take generations and its many peoples life work.

happy growing!

[Alejandro45]

Luke,

I have a nit pick with calling yourself a “breeder” as you didn’t select the parents, ie breed anything. What happened was you planted out a few seeds and happened upon a chance seedling that has outperformed the others in the bunch. This same logic applies as when you say as if planting hundreds or thousands of seeds ect. Achetadomestica likewise planted out a handful of seeds and likewise could also be “lucky” to have an improved version of isan indigo.

-Joe

I agree completely Joe. To say one is a “breeder” in this case does not appear justified more like Luke selected the best seedling he got from a tree that was already grafted in another country, which to me implies someone else had already been either working on the variety or noticed the fruit enough to graft it. For instance if I purchase a littler of puppies and out of that group I select the pick of the litter “superior in every way” but did not raise the parents or put time in other then feeding and caring for the pups to maturity then I am not the breeder. I am simply a flipper and selling off the superior pup as my own creation.

But that’s neither here nor there really, as these plants don’t care what they are called.  These names only help us organize and develop varieties that could be improved upon.