citrus and temperature

[Zafra]

This might ramble a bit so excuse me in advance - maybe if I get some responses they will help me clarify my questions! I'm trying to understand citrus and its temperature needs. I live in a tropical environment, temps never lower than the high 50s and more often only to the low 60s at night. My navel oranges from a very young tree are already scrumptious, as good as any I ever bought when I lived in California. So they don't seem to be lacking for cold weather. But the grapefruits I've had here have been inedibly sour, and I've read that some citrus needs cold weather to "sweeten up". On the other hand, I've read comments here that people's grapefruits didn't sweeten up because they didn't get the necessary heat. Now I'm confused.
Most info I read is speaking to people in temperate zones where the concern is cold tolerance. But what about lack of cold tolerance?
What are the "rules" about citrus and temperatures? Which varieties will produce good fruit with no chill to speak of?

[countryboy1981]

California citrus does not taste very good when purchased here.  Everytime I do, I am severely dissapointed amd remember why I dont.  It may have somethung to do with shipping across the states.  To me l, citrus tastes best when you have the high heat in the summer and cold when it is hetting ready to ripen.

[Mike T]

I have mentioned my experience with citrus varieties at 16 latitude in a wet tropical climate before a few times. Citrus are grown continuously for over 2000 miles and more than 20 degrees of latitude  along the east coast of Australia so it is easy to see the effects of climate. Honey murcott that I grow are pretty different from those grown say 1500 miles south of me.Mine are equally sweet but more like an orange in form and do colour properly.Only some mandarins grow ok in my climate and they are thinner skinned,have a little less acid and are more yellow than orange as compared to the same variety grown in a colder climate.They are still good quality.You probably don't have hickson,ellendale and emperors there.Navels are terrible in my climate never colouring,getting huge and being bland but valencias taste great get very large and again are more yellow than orange.Grapefruit in my climate are less acid,larger and thinner skinned than those grown in a cooler climate.It all depends on the specific type of citrus as to how good the quality is in a tropical place but less acidity and colour as well as larger fruit are general rules.Fewer oranges and mandarins are ok in the tropics than sun tropics or warm temperate areas.

[Tom]

Thanks for the report Mike T. That is very interesting. I guess it would be boring if everybody and everything were the same ! Good Day ! Tom

[BajaJohn]

Hi Zafra - I share a similar "cold" problem at 23 latitude in Baja California with summer highs in the 90s and winter lows generally mid- 50s. Humidity generally ranges from 25 (winter) to 65 (summer). This is a new climate to me, so I'm keen to find others to share experiences.
The citrus I have and my interest in growing them was all inherited when I bought the house 4 years ago so I'm no expert. I don't even know what varieties I have. There are Valencia and Mandarin oranges, lemons, Mexican limes and yellow grapefruit which all seem to thrive here and produce tasty, juicy fruit (again, I'm no expert on quality).
The grapefruit tree produces the only grapefruit that I've ever enjoyed eating. My wife is a grapefruit fan and says they are the best she has ever tasted. They are less sour than other grapefruit and are so sweet that they never need sugar. They are also very juicy. Maybe it is the variety but I haven't identified it. I'll add images if it can help identify it and can add more specific photographs on request to help identify it.
My wife also pointed out that pink grapefruit are usually the sweetest, so you could try growing those.
Not sure if it has anything to do with fruit quality but the tree was severely traumatised in the past. It was in very poor shape with loads of dead branches when I inherited it 4 years ago. The garden had been neglected for about 10 years and the grapefruit was overgrown by another tree which almost enveloped it.

Close-up of leaves and fruit (about 5" diameter)


The tree on Feb 16. We have been picking fruit for a couple months so it is looking a bit depleted.

[Millet]

BajaJohn your grapefruit could be one of  many, however looking at it, it looks like a variety called  Marsh.   Zafra, a long time ago Dr. Malcolm Manners who is the chair of the citrus department at Florida Southern University, told me no grapefruit should be picked before March (for trees growing in the northern hemisphere).   When left hanging on the tree until then grapefruits sweeten up and the acid content reduces. 

[Zafra]

Wow I missed all these responses because the post had been pinned! Oops.
So in theory grapefruit should be good here, and the couple I've tried were picked way too early? That's great, because I love grapefruit and wanted to grow one, but not if it was going to turn out inedible. I've heard rumors that you can find grafted Marsh here - the search begins...
Interesting about the navel oranges in your area Mike T. Like I said the one fruit we got from our recently planted navel tree was scrumptious and way better than the navels we've bought here in the past (I stopped buying them because they were just like you describe, large and bland, sometimes dry) - come to think of it we let it hang on the tree for ages, so maybe that was part of it. We haven't gotten fruit from our Valencia yet, but the ones we buy are way better than the navels.
Which citruses are better for no chill areas in general? Is there a list?
Couldn't BajaJohn's grapefruit be the hybrid Oroblanco? It's often described as so sweet it doesn't need sugar.

[BajaJohn]

Here are more pictures of my grapefruit to help figure out what it is. If March is so common, I'm sure I must have bought them in stores but I've never encountered anything as sweet and lacking in bitterness as the one I have although that doesn't sound like an issue for Zafra. It doesn't look much like the Oroblanco described on the internet. The skin seems about normal for grapefruit, it has seeds and the white fleshy parts are no more bitter than normal grapefruit.

The fruit quality is probably mostly an issue of variety compatible with your climate. I've experienced it with many vegetables where success even varies with time of year that seeds are sown. I also bought a pomegranate here that has thrived but the fruit is so acid that it is inedible. Other pomegranates around here are fine. I don't have the experience to make recommendations on varieties for you - sorry.

The climate probably influences picking time too. Although I'm only 2 degrees (140 miles) South of Lakeland (home Dr Manner's FSC) in latitude, I've been picking grapefruit since mid-January and they have been as good as they ever get. Temperature ranges seem about the same, humidity is about 15% lower and rain here is rare.





I hand-squeezed the 2 grapefruit I cut and got about 5 fl oz of juice from each, along with 4 seeds from one and 6 seeds from the other.

[Zafra]

Yeah that doesn't look at all like an Oroblanco. It's pretty dark yellow for a Marsh too, isn't it? But that could all be climate related. Regardless of its name, you've got yourself a fantastic fruit there - lucky you!

[BajaJohn]

Thanks Zafra. Maybe I have a gem here and need to learn how to propagate and share my good fortune. From what I've read the Marsh is a good choice for a hot climate so may be one for you.
Good luck!