Mangos from cuttings?

[Pancrazio]

Hi everyone.
Another silly question.
I have read a bit around about mango cuttings. They have several disadvantages over grafting: poor rooting, weak root system once established etc.
Anyway i find them interesting, since it is a way to propagate mango without the need of a rootstock (the closest nursery selling mangos being 650 miles south of my house, and my summer being too short to let seed grow to an appreciable size before 2-3 years - this means that is hard to grow my own rootstock).
Apparently, as i have read, making the cutting roots isn't easy at all. Hormones and hot beds seems to be involved.
But i wonder if some of you have some direct experience with cuttings, and some suggestion for me if i wanted to try that way.
Thank you for your help! 

[phantomcrab]

This is a round about way to do it. Grow some rootstocks from seed and root some cuttings from cultivars you like. Once all the plants are growing well, graft the cuttings onto your established rootstocks. This circumvents the weak root problem and results in a grafted tree like you would buy from a nursery. I don't know how to root mango cuttings though. Does air layering work with mangos?

[murahilin]

Hi everyone.
Another silly question.
I have read a bit around about mango cuttings. They have several disadvantages over grafting: poor rooting, weak root system once established etc.
Anyway i find them interesting, since it is a way to propagate mango without the need of a rootstock (the closest nursery selling mangos being 650 miles south of my house, and my summer being too short to let seed grow to an appreciable size before 2-3 years - this means that is hard to grow my own rootstock).
Apparently, as i have read, making the cutting roots isn't easy at all. Hormones and hot beds seems to be involved.
But i wonder if some of you have some direct experience with cuttings, and some suggestion for me if i wanted to try that way.
Thank you for your help!

I am a bit confused by that statement about waiting 2-3 years for a seed to grow into a rootstock. Are you saying that you would have to wait 2-3 years to graft onto a seedling? If so, you can graft onto your seedling within a few weeks to a few months.

[bsbullie]

This is a round about way to do it. Grow some rootstocks from seed and root some cuttings from cultivars you like. Once all the plants are growing well, graft the cuttings onto your established rootstocks. This circumvents the weak root problem and results in a grafted tree like you would buy from a nursery. I don't know how to root mango cuttings though. Does air layering work with mangos?

What would be the point of this ?  Why would you try to root a cutting only to use it a budwood for grafting ?  It would make much more sense to grow the rootstock (from seed) and use budwood directly from the tree to graft.

Now, with that being said, from what I gather, the whole issue with this post is that he has a short summer season to germinate the seed.  This leads me to murahilin's post above, why would you need to wait 2-3 years for a seedling to grow to graft ?

[Pancrazio]

Thank everyone for yor answers.
Yes, apparently i need about 2-3 years to grow a rootstock big enough to attempt a graft from seed. At least, the kind of graft i know and i always hear about here (cleft and side-veneer graft). If it is true that i need at least a plant with a steam of the size of a pencil, well, 2-3 years are the quickest i can imagine here (i planted 2 seeds in july 2010 - they were tommies - and they aren't ready yet for grafting).
I didn't knew that i could use a rootstock so young. Is there a video or something?

Anyway, apparently nobody roots mango cuttings.

[murahilin]

Thank everyone for yor answers.
Yes, apparently i need about 2-3 years to grow a rootstock big enough to attempt a graft from seed. At least, the kind of graft i know and i always hear about here (cleft and side-veneer graft). If it is true that i need at least a plant with a steam of the size of a pencil, well, 2-3 years are the quickest i can imagine here (i planted 2 seeds in july 2010 - they were tommies - and they aren't ready yet for grafting).
I didn't knew that i could use a rootstock so young. Is there a video or something?

Anyway, apparently nobody roots mango cuttings.

Rooting mango cuttings is difficult. Here is a link that describes a few different mango propagation methods including by cutting. http://www.ikisan.com/Crop%20Specific/Eng/links/ap_mangoPropagation.shtml

You can do a cleft graft on a very young mango. You can also do different types of budding on the young seedlings. I don't have any videos but you can just do a cleft graft the same as you would on an older tree. Get a piece of budwood that matches the size of your young seedling and graft.

[Pancrazio]

Well, then i'll try something next summer. I don't think i'll be able to try side veneer, but some clefts are definitively possible.

As for rooting cuttings, seems way too hard...

[Herman]

Try stone grafting.  You can graft onto a 19 day old seedling. 75-80% success rate.

[Herman]

Make that 14 days even.

[MangoFang]

Herman - what's a stone graft?

... and what about doing an air-layering of a branch or two, Pancrazio?  Not that I've done it,
but does anyone know how thick/old does a branch have to be to try that method??



MF

[nullzero]

Herman - what's a stone graft?

... and what about doing an air-layering of a branch or two, Pancrazio?  Not that I've done it,
but does anyone know how thick/old does a branch have to be to try that method??



MF

Found this link may be regarding it; http://www.development4you.org/2011/05/epicotyle-mango-grafting.html

[Herman]

Steps to stone graft a mango:

1.  Plant rootstock mango seed.
2.  When mango seed sprouts, mark as day 1.
3.  After day 7, select good branch on mother tree, but do not cut it.  What you want to look for is red or purple leaves at the end of the branch, where it is starting to form new leaves.  Trim all of the leaves, except for the purple/red leaves at the end, down to 6 inches.
4.  Wait 7 days.
5.  Cut the scion from the mother tree, that is the part prepared in step 3, which includes the red/purple leaves along with the 6 inch defoliated branch.  Immediately place branch in distilled water so the red/purple leaves do not dry out.  Cut each red/purple leaves in half.
6.  Prepare the rootstock by cutting off the top, leaving 3-4 inches at the base.  Make a 1 inch cut down the center of the rootstock.
7.  Trim both sides of the end of the scion (opposite side of the red/purple leaves) to make a point.  The point should be about 1 inch long.
8.  Insert point of scion into slit of rootstock.  It should fit nicely.  Bind with grafting tape. 

The grafted seedling will require lots of water and moisture.  Cover with a plastic bag and make sure it is always moist.

[Pancrazio]

Well, it's interesting and i'm going to try it if i'll have enough scions this summer. Making enough rootstock seems simple enough.
I have found this, for future reference:

http://www.permaculture.org.au/resources_files/farmers_handbook/volume_3/14_stone_grafting.pdf

[jcaldeira]

Stone grafting appeals to me, but the stems on my  mango at 2 weeks or even one month of age are too small to graft.  They are far less than pencil thickness.  I've been waiting until the seedlings become the same diameter as the scion wood so both sides of the cleft graft match.

I assume the thin stems on my mango seedlings are due to the polyembryonic variety, but that's all that's available here in Fiji.  Anyone else in this situation?

John

[Herman]

Usually the largest stone varieties are used, but it is still possible in your case.  I've heard that it is even possible to graft directly to the stone (seed).  You want the stone to still be available to the scion after the graft.

[jcaldeira]

But Herman, how do you graft a pencil-thick mango scion (those are the thinnest branch tips, normally) to a tender seedling only half that diameter? 

I certainly would like to do that if possible.

John

[Mr. Clean]

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[DaveinNoVA]

I was able to root a mango cutting this last summer. BUT, it was only an experiment and I used a cutting of a seedling mango that was only about 2 year old. It could be that juvenile growth is easier to root than mature, bearing-age growth. I don't know. I'll try to add pics. If they show up, the first pic is two to three weeks after sticking in the prop box. The second pic is about 8 or 9 weeks as it is getting its first flush.  This was an Ataulfo seedling plant.

 

[Orkine]

Well, it's interesting and i'm going to try it if i'll have enough scions this summer. Making enough rootstock seems simple enough.
I have found this, for future reference:

http://www.permaculture.org.au/resources_files/farmers_handbook/volume_3/14_stone_grafting.pdf

Watch this video.  It will help your confidence.