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Messages - FloridaFruitGeek

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1
Tropical Fruit Discussion / Re: Nitrogen Fixers
« on: August 18, 2019, 09:22:27 AM »
Here in North Florida, the best nitrogen fixing tree I've found for interplanting among fruit trees is Enterolobium contortisiliquum. Seedlings are already nodulating at six weeks old. Planted out in our sandy soil, they grow extremely rapidly, with a spreading form. If allowed to grow untrimmed, in ten years the trunk is often so big I can't reach my arms around it.
Their tissues are so full of nitrogen that sometimes when you break open a fallen stick from them, the inside of the stick reeks of ammonia.
In their first few years, these Enterolobium trees cast a light shade which can be helpful for getting some kinds of young fruit trees established (as these N-fixers get bigger they cast denser shade). They're easy to coppice or pollard - if at any point you decide they're getting too big or casting too much shade, just cut them back with a chainsaw.  They'll throw out sprouts from the cut point, and you can then cut those sprouts back annually to maintain them fixing nitrogen without excessively shading your fruit trees.
They make lots of pods here, but I only rarely see seedlings pop up on their own. Scarifying seeds is helpful for germinating them, and the rarity of spontaneous seedlings maybe results from the absence of large animals here eating the pods & scarifying the seeds.

During colder winters here, they freeze back partially, then in spring they sprout out from wherever they froze back to. I've seen trees take 15F(-9C), which killed them back to major limbs, but not all the way to the ground. In areas with colder winters, presumably they would freeze to the ground every winter as a dieback perennial.

2
I love the flavor and aroma of 'Ruby Supreme' guava. But when I tried growing it in the ground in my greenhouse, I found that this variety is very sensitive to nematodes. Josh Jamison in Lake Wales, FL says he's been getting good results grafting nematode-sensitive guava varieties onto cas guava, Psidium friedrichsthalianum, which he says is nematode-resistant. I just recently got a cas guava from Josh, and I plan on experimenting with this technique - guava is a "must-have" fruit for me!

3
Reportedly that works - Ficus glomerata aka racemosa can successfully work as a nematode-resistant rootstock for Ficus carica. I recently got a plant of what is supposed to be Ficus glomerata, and I am actively multiplying it by cuttings so I can try grafting on good varieties of edible figs.

Other Ficus species I'm currently testing as hopefully nematode-resistant fig rootstocks are Ficus palmata, Ficus pumila, and the one from ECHO in Fort Myers, which Crafton Cliff says is Ficus sycomorus.

Species I've heard can work as fig rootstocks which I havn''t acquired yet are Ficus opposita, Ficus septica, Ficus ulmifolia, and Ficus pseudopalma.

4
That's been most people's experience growing 'Brazos Belle'/'Wilma' in Florida. Apparently it does better in its home region of Texas, but here in Florida the humidity seems to make virtually all the fruit drop off prematurely, so they don't do anything like a proper ripening. I have occasionally gotten a few fruits of this variety to stay on the tree long enough to what seems close to a full maturity in September, and the flavor was ok, but not nearly as good as the other Mexican varieties.

It is for this reason that Hopkins Nursery, the wholesale source of most of the Mexican variety avos in Florida, has stopped propagating 'Brazos Belle'.

In the Gainesville/Ocala area, we've had much better results with Mexican avocado varieties 'Opal'/'Lila', 'Del Rio'/'Pryor', and 'May', which is probably the same variety as ''Joey'.

5
Miamifruit.org

They have a fruit stand at a farmers market every Saturday. It may be listed on their website or just email them.

I'll look into where the Miami Fruit folks do their Saturday farmers market sales, thanks!

6
I'm going to be making a whirlwind tour of Homestead shortly. Definitely going to spend a good chunk of time at Fruit 'n Spice Park.

While in the area, I want to buy some tropical fruits, especially jackfruit. Basically, I want to get some of whatever kinds of fruit are currently in season.

In the early 2000s, there were lots of fruit stands on Krome Ave selling all kinds of tropical fruit for very reasonable prices. Last time I was there a few years ago, the fruit stands on Krome seemed to have mostly disappeared.

I know about Robert Is Here, but they cater to the tourist market, with very high prices.

Any good places in the area that sell a range of locally-grown tropical fruits for reasonable prices?

7
Musa velutina is the "pink" banana? Does it do well in frost climate? Is it similar to Helen's Hybrid? do you have experiences (also indirect) with this last Musa?
Thanks

Yes, Musa velutina is the small red/pink banana. The one's I've had, I'd rate as only barely edible. Once peeled, the fruit is maybe the dimensions of my thumb, and probably 80% of the volume is seeds. And what flesh is there, is just mediocre in flavor. So you pop one in your mouth, suck a bit of vaguely sweet flesh off the mass of seeds, then spit out  that bunch of pebbles. I don't know if there are better forms in existence, but the ones I've tried would take a LOT of breeding work to become evenly remotely desirable as a fruiting plant. 

8
Temperate Fruit Discussion / Re: Moving to zone 8b
« on: June 05, 2016, 04:34:33 PM »
I'm a little south of Gainesville, and I've been trialling cold-hardy avocados. The most cold-tolerant is 'Del Rio', which can handle temps in the mid to upper teens without much problem. Sometimes if warm weather has preceded that kind of extreme cold, it might have flower buds emerging that you'll lose, but it often pushes out more after losing the first batch. Fruit is small, with about a third to half the flesh volume of a Hass, but it's got absolutely outstanding flavor, with a high oil content. Plus, you can eat the skin like an apple. I think it's my favorite flavored avo. That one should grow fine for you up in the panhandle. Other cold hardy types I've tried are Wilma, May, and Opal, and they're almost as cold hardy as Del Rio, so they're good candidates also for that area.
One thing about the cold-hardy avos: they need shade when young. Planted in full sun, they often sulk. With shade from mid-day sun the first few years, they make steady progress, rapidly getting larger each year, and once they get about 10-15 feet tall, they can handle full sun.

9
Tropical Fruit Discussion / Re: Protecting seeds from cold during shipping
« on: December 28, 2015, 10:11:04 AM »
Call up some businesses that sell aquarium plants and animals by mail. They use hot packs in winter and cool packs in summer to keep their product alive, often in small packages. They could tell you what they've found most successful.

10
NATGRAFT FIGS

NATGRAFT FIGS...Following many years of fig growing and research we are pleased to release the NATGRAFT FIGS to which we have added a root system that will tolerate both wet and dry tropical conditions. We believe this to have world significance, with figs now able to be grown outside their traditional areas and for an extended season.                                   Other points of interest -                         
 This is a tree not a bush
It requires less water than other similar trees
  It requires less fertiliser
    Excellent quality sweet fruit
The top remains ‘Mediterranean’ and will require several fungicide sprays during the wet season.  Due to the prolific root system it should not be planted near pipes or structures.

This is from tropiculture in darwin australia. I have spoken to them. They dont tell you much about the rootstock but it is a native selection and tested for long term compatability and durability. Couldnt work out how to post the pdf sorry.

             


Nice bit of info, Druss, thanks! Well, this definitely confirms it: there are one or more Ficus species native to North Queensland that can make an excellent rootstock for figs. (apparently the majority of Ficus species have varying degrees of graft incompatibility with Ficus carica.) Kind of a pity the folks at Tropiculture are being so tight-lipped about just what species they're using. I wonder if they can ship bare-root plants internationally? I'd be tempted to buy a fig tree from them, just to slice off the scion and let the rootstock grow, so I can propagate it into many plants, and graft figs onto them! Hmmm...

11
Sounds like Ficus racemosa but this species seems far removed from the domestic F.carica.One of the sandpaper figs like F.fraseri or F.opposita would make more sense.It won't be a banyan or stranger, buttressed rainforest giant,swamp F.septica or epiphyte.

Thanks Mike, that's some helpful progress towards figuring this out. I looked up the species you mentioned, and Ficus opposita sounds like it possibly, possibly, maybe could be the one. The 1925 report describes the fruit as being pretty good to eat, having a "fine delicate sweet flavor, and size of a black Smyrna fig, only more rounded, and dark crimson when ripe." I don't imagine there are too many wild fig species there with fruit that big or of such good flavor, are there?

12
not sure if it's the same variety, but I was given a fig cutting years ago that was of a special variety (or species), being selected and tested for resistance to nematodes.

my rooted cutting died due to neglect, but if you want, I can try to track them down again, my good friend has the details...this would be a good excuse to call him and bother him about plants...maybe I can learn something new in the process.

Adam: Yes, yes, yes!! Please contact your friend and see if it's possible to get any more of that fig rootstock. Also, see if you can milk him for any details about  who's been testing that variety as a fig rootstock, and what their findings have been.

I'm getting a little obsessed with this,  figuring out what type(s) of Ficus will make a good, nematode-resistant rootstock for figs in Florida. And since root-knot nematodes are a widespread problem in the tropics and subtropics, a solution to this might be widely useful in many areas.

I'm trying to compile any info I can find on the subject, and there's not a lot of reports out there of people with actual experience trying this. Most of what I find is people quoting and re-quoting the findings of  a study that was published in 1970. I would have hoped we would have made some progress on this in the last 45 years!

I recently wrote up the state of what I've been able to find out, and my own limited experiments so far on this subject: http://www.floridafruitgeek.com/uncategorized/in-search-of-nematode-resistant-fig-rootstocks-progress-report-1/
I intend to figure this out, so we can have a decent rootstock for figs in Florida in a few years.

-Craig

13
I'm trying to track down a species of Ficus from Australia that reportedly makes an excellent nematode-resistant rootstock for figs. 

I found it described in an article from the Florida State Horticultural Society from 1925. They tested 18 Ficus species as potential nematode-resistant rootstocks for figs, and found that the most promising was an unidentified Ficus species from North Queensland, Australia, introduced by the Office of Seed and Plant Introduction in 1921 under the name SPI 52406. Growing in its native habitat, this species was described as, "A large clean tree with fruit of fine delicate sweet flavor and size of a black Smyrna fig, only more rounded and dark crimson when ripe." They report that the species is evergreen, and in Florida it suffered foliage burn at 29 degrees F, and die-back at 25 degrees F.

They report that fig scions made graft unions more reliably and with better subsequent growth on this species than grafted onto Ficus glomerata, their second-best choice. They report that they planted out one fig grafted onto Ficus 52406 in spring in nematode-infested soil, and as a control also planted a self-rooted fig 17 feet away. By fall, the grafted plant had ripened almost a hundred figs, growing to 4.5 feet with a 2.5 inch diameter trunk just above the bud union. The self-rooted fig nearby suffered heavy nematode damage to its roots, grew to just 2.5 feet, and ripened only a single fig the same year.

I can't find any subsequent information on this species.

I know this is not a lot of information to go on in terms of the description of the mystery Ficus 52406 from North Queensland. I've read that there are 45 Ficus species native to Australia. But I thought it was worth a shot posting this, to see if anyone might recognize what species Ficus 52406 might be, particularly some of the Australian readers of the forum. Any ideas?

-Craig

(original 1925 report: http://fshs.org/proceedings-o/1925-vol-38/92-97_Mowry.pdf)

14
Tropical Fruit Discussion / Re: Patience
« on: December 13, 2015, 04:28:10 PM »
Some seeds which in the wild normally pass through the digestive system of an animal can be very slow to germinate without this passage, or a simulation of it. I saw a report on how Enterolobium seeds extracted from horse manure germinate within days, while the same seeds planted straight from the seed pod took over a year to germinate, I think. For especially slow seeds, might be worth trying to figure if some animal normally eats those seeds in the wild, and if there is a way to simulate passage through that kind of animal.

15
Tropical Fruit Discussion / Re: My Tropical Fruit Trees in PA
« on: December 13, 2015, 02:28:58 PM »
Nice work!

Nice photos!

Welcome!

(Ps, the way you uploaded the pics might be the best way, it helps avoid those pop up ads!!)



Adam, this statement caught my eye because I'm new to the forum -- what ways(s) of posting pix are prone to pop up ads, and which way(s) of posting pix don't have that problem?

-Craig



16
Tropical Fruit Discussion / Re: My Tropical Fruit Trees in PA
« on: December 13, 2015, 12:47:20 PM »
Very impressive plantings, Kristy! You probably already know this, but carambola is another one that people have gotten to fruit pretty well in pots up north.

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Tropical Fruit Discussion / Re: Most Outrageously Delicious Canistel Ever
« on: December 13, 2015, 12:30:08 PM »

And then there's flavor. Reading this thread, I wish I could sit next to Oscar of Fruitlovers, sampling the same canistels, to see if the "strong musky taste or annoying cloying sweetness" he detects in many varieties are qualities I would also find objectionable, or maybe the flavors he dislikes are exactly the flavors I love about this fruit. \

Yes, I suspect that the qualities he finds objectionable are either unnoticed or pleasant to you-and me.

I'm another canistel fan, with limited experience eating different varieties.  Ross is the only one I'm currently growing

I'd like to try Oscar's find.

It's not just me. Most people are not so crazy about canistel for the very same reasons. If you try to sell this fruit you will see what i mean. The good news is that there are selected types that i think would be a whole lot more popular with most folks.


Part of what's so confusing about this discussion is that we don't have enough widely distributed clonal varieties of canistel to use as reference points, for people who are widely scattered geographically. What seems to be the most widely distributed variety of canistel (or relative of canistel, depending on who you ask) is Ross Sapote, and unfortunately there appear to be numerous seedling varieties being distributed under that name. So your Ross Sapote could potentially  have a very different flavor and texture than mine.

Not to mention differences in climate, soil, rootstock, stage at which fruit was picked, ripeness at time of eating, etc, etc.

We just need to have a bunch more canistel-eating parties, with named varieties, and everyone can fill out a form rating each variety!



18
Tropical Fruit Discussion / Re: Most Outrageously Delicious Canistel Ever
« on: December 09, 2015, 12:14:36 PM »
This whole discussion has got me wondering about how different people react to the flavor and texture of particular canistel fruits. I haven't had the opportunity to try many named varieties -- the majority of my canistel eating experiences have been in the Sapotaceae grove at Fruit & Spice Park, where most of the trees are unlabled as to variety.

I absolutely LOVED the vast majority of canistels I ate there, as well as most I've eaten elsewhere. It's really my favorite fruit (yes, I like them more than mangoes!). But I was always puzzled about how the employees at FSP never seemed very excited about all those golden treasures dropping from the canistel trees. Whenever I asked them how they liked canistels, they'd typically shrug their shoulders and make some indifferent comment, sometimes saying it's too dry for them. Same comment I frequently see online, people saying they want a moister-fleshed canistel.

That gets me wondering. The dryness that other people complain about -- is it  exactly the texture I like in this fruit? Or are they just eating it at an earlier, drier stage than I'm eating them? Perhaps the varieties I've eaten just have particularly moist flesh?

And then there's flavor. Reading this thread, I wish I could sit next to Oscar of Fruitlovers, sampling the same canistels, to see if the "strong musky taste or annoying cloying sweetness" he detects in many varieties are qualities I would also find objectionable, or maybe the flavors he dislikes are exactly the flavors I love about this fruit. Oscar does say he's not a huge fan of canistels.

I've also heard people online complaining about canistels having a fart-like aroma. I've never detected any such smell in any canistels I've ever sniffed. Again, makes me wonder if we're dealing with different types of canistels, different stages of ripeness, or if we just have different noses.

Guess I need to meet up with some of the other people on this board during canistel season, and have a canistel taste-off. Have others noticed a wide range among people in which canistel varieties they prefer (flavor, texture, & aroma), or do you find that different people tend to rate canistel varieties similarly?

-Craig

19
Not sure on the answer to your question but I thought 9a/b was too cold for macadamia. Be interested to see how they do, that's a tree I have wanted for awhile and if the light shade thing is true I even have an area for that too.

Tropheus76, have you seen the macadamia trees that Larry Shatzer of Our Kids Tropicals has in Winter Garden, on the west side of Orlando? I haven't seen them in a while, but a few years ago he had several macadamia trees, 25-30 feet tall, that regularly made nuts. His property is in a slightly warm micro-climate, but it definitely gets into the upper 20s many winters. So it's possible to have macadamia trees in the Orlando area.

20
Tropical Fruit Discussion / Re: Introduce Yourself
« on: December 03, 2015, 09:53:05 AM »
Hello everyone, I've been reading the forum for a while, finally decided to register, for the opportunity to connect with so many knowledgable people.

I live in Marion County, FL, Zone 9a, roughly a hundred miles north of the outer fringes of where you can start to grow tropicals outdoors in Florida. Outside the greenhouse, I've got misc. citrus, figs, Tex-Mex avos, mulberry, Asian & American persimmons, and nitrogen-fixing trees (Enterolobium).  Inside the greenhouse, canistel (my true love!), miracle fruit, jackfruit, jaboticaba, Cattley guava, banana, Eugenia reinwardtiana, playing around a bit with black sapote but not sure if I can fruit it in a greenhouse.

I look forward to learning much from all you folks!

-Craig

Craig welcome to the forum

I have faith, you can fruit a black sapote in a greenhouse (or in pot).

you might be interested in some of the garcinias and eugenias (myrciarias/plinias) from Brazil.

I too enjoy canistel.  What variety is your favorite?

Jeff- I would love to be able to try named varieties and be able to have an answer to that question. But when I lived in Homestead, I used to go to the Fruit 'n Spice Park several times a week during canistel season, and gorge myself on fallen canistels till I couldn't eat another bite! It was heaven.

21
Also, I've seen cattley guavas fruiting well in shade, both red and yellow forms. Be careful, though - apparently in some parts of South Florida they can be invasive.

22
Tropical Fruit Discussion / Re: Eugenia reinwardtiana setting fruit well
« on: December 01, 2015, 07:18:51 PM »
I planted a Eugenia reinwardtiana in the ground this past spring, and it's just started ripening fruit in the last few weeks. I like them -- kind of a big seed, but the flesh has a great flavor. The fellow I got the plant from has one in a 7 or 15 gallon pot, and he says his is nearly everbearing. I look forward to having these available for snacking on for most of the year!

23
Tropical Fruit Discussion / Re: Introduce Yourself
« on: December 01, 2015, 07:05:48 PM »
Hello everyone, I've been reading the forum for a while, finally decided to register, for the opportunity to connect with so many knowledgeable people.

I live in Marion County, FL, Zone 9a, roughly a hundred miles north of the outer fringes of where you can start to grow tropicals outdoors in Florida. Outside the greenhouse, I've got misc. citrus, figs, Tex-Mex avos, mulberry, Asian & American persimmons, and nitrogen-fixing trees (Enterolobium).  Inside the greenhouse, canistel (my true love!), miracle fruit, jackfruit, jaboticaba, Cattley guava, banana, Eugenia reinwardtiana, playing around a bit with black sapote but not sure if I can fruit it in a greenhouse.

I look forward to learning much from all you folks!

-Craig

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