Author Topic: "Tim" atemoya, need help from Aussies with a proper ID  (Read 4006 times)

TheDom

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 503
    • Fort Myers, FL
    • View Profile
"Tim" atemoya, need help from Aussies with a proper ID
« on: August 08, 2017, 11:13:03 PM »
This is the first picture I've been able to get of a "Tim" atemoya. It is rumored to have been from budwood brought over from Australia years ago, but nobody is sure what name it originally had over there. Besides the picture all I've heard about it is that it sets about as well as Gefner without hand pollination and the guy who first started growing it loved the flavor so much he replaced all of his Gefner with Tim. I'll do my best to get more pics through season, and hope to have fruits of my own either late this season or next year.

Dom

FruitFreak

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 869
    • USA, FL, Naples, 10a
    • View Profile
Re: "Tim" atemoya, need help from Aussies with a proper ID
« Reply #1 on: August 09, 2017, 12:21:22 AM »
This is the first picture I've been able to get of a "Tim" atemoya. It is rumored to have been from budwood brought over from Australia years ago, but nobody is sure what name it originally had over there. Besides the picture all I've heard about it is that it sets about as well as Gefner without hand pollination and the guy who first started growing it loved the flavor so much he replaced all of his Gefner with Tim. I'll do my best to get more pics through season, and hope to have fruits of my own either late this season or next year.


Nice fruit Dom.  Hopefully there is some input on this as I'm very curious myself
- Marley

Mike T

  • Zone 12a
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 9014
  • Cairns,Nth Qld, Australia
    • Zone 12a
    • View Profile
Re: "Tim" atemoya, need help from Aussies with a proper ID
« Reply #2 on: August 09, 2017, 03:57:48 PM »
If someone wanted to get atemoya scion from Australia Paxton prolific aka AJ Pinks, Hillary white, real Pinks Mammoth and maybe tropic sun would be on the hit list for acquisition.They wouldn't bother with relatively low quality widespread varieties like gefner or African pride.It doesn't really look like any of these but they are variable and climate and nutrition can influence phenotypic expression. Any info on the source at either end or location in Australia or US?

TheDom

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 503
    • Fort Myers, FL
    • View Profile
Re: "Tim" atemoya, need help from Aussies with a proper ID
« Reply #3 on: August 09, 2017, 05:11:51 PM »
If someone wanted to get atemoya scion from Australia Paxton prolific aka AJ Pinks, Hillary white, real Pinks Mammoth and maybe tropic sun would be on the hit list for acquisition.They wouldn't bother with relatively low quality widespread varieties like gefner or African pride.It doesn't really look like any of these but they are variable and climate and nutrition can influence phenotypic expression. Any info on the source at either end or location in Australia or US?

I don't have much info on either side of it unfortunately.

Side note: you said real Pink's Mammoth. Is there known to be an impostor Pink's Mammoth here in the states?
Dom

Mike T

  • Zone 12a
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 9014
  • Cairns,Nth Qld, Australia
    • Zone 12a
    • View Profile
Re: "Tim" atemoya, need help from Aussies with a proper ID
« Reply #4 on: August 10, 2017, 05:15:30 AM »
Pinks Mammoth was adopted by Australia a little over 120 years ago and from all accounts had a long a colourful history in French Guiana its original home. It is probably the original atemoya. They were seed grown until quite recently and there are a few forms of them.The real deal is asymmetrical and bumpy reaching 4kg or even larger but most are much smaller.I don't know if the mammoth in the states is the same as the classic one here but the KP mangoes sure look different.The fruit in the pic could be a mammoth or derivative.

DocFruitFly

  • Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 31
    • Palmetto, FL
    • View Profile
Re: "Tim" atemoya, need help from Aussies with a proper ID
« Reply #5 on: August 10, 2017, 08:38:55 AM »
I've got a Tim in the ground, but it hasn't fruited yet. All I heard was that it was of excellent flavor, but I didn't get any other specifics.


Vernmented

  • Starry Nursery/Plant Hoarder/Zone Pusher/Biochar Enthusiast
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1331
    • USA, Florida, Sarasota, 9B/10A
    • View Profile
    • Starry Nursery Instagram
Re: "Tim" atemoya, need help from Aussies with a proper ID
« Reply #6 on: August 11, 2017, 07:07:27 PM »
Pinks Mammoth was adopted by Australia a little over 120 years ago and from all accounts had a long a colourful history in French Guiana its original home. It is probably the original atemoya. They were seed grown until quite recently and there are a few forms of them.The real deal is asymmetrical and bumpy reaching 4kg or even larger but most are much smaller.I don't know if the mammoth in the states is the same as the classic one here but the KP mangoes sure look different.The fruit in the pic could be a mammoth or derivative.

This is what I am working for Pink's Mammoth right here. First time fruiting it. Hopefully I will have some pollen for my Tim and Australia from Steve. They are both flowering and big enough to hold at least one or two. That way we can at least see if they are the same thing.





-Josh

Mikey

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 397
    • San Diego, ca
    • View Profile
Re: "Tim" atemoya, need help from Aussies with a proper ID
« Reply #7 on: August 11, 2017, 09:22:31 PM »
Pinks Mammoth was adopted by Australia a little over 120 years ago and from all accounts had a long a colourful history in French Guiana its original home. It is probably the original atemoya. They were seed grown until quite recently and there are a few forms of them.The real deal is asymmetrical and bumpy reaching 4kg or even larger but most are much smaller.I don't know if the mammoth in the states is the same as the classic one here but the KP mangoes sure look different.The fruit in the pic could be a mammoth or derivative.

This is what I am working for Pink's Mammoth right here. First time fruiting it. Hopefully I will have some pollen for my Tim and Australia from Steve. They are both flowering and big enough to hold at least one or two. That way we can at least see if they are the same thing.







I thought the pink mammoth was bitter?  Is it a better fruit than African pride?

Galatians522

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1824
    • Florida 9b
    • View Profile
Re: "Tim" atemoya, need help from Aussies with a proper ID
« Reply #8 on: September 20, 2021, 10:50:57 PM »
Ok, I want to bring back this discussion about Tim's identity. I have grown the tree for 3-4 years now and gotten to eat a number of fruits. Based on my observations I think it is in the Pinks Mamoth family and possibly Maroochy Gold or Hillary White (Hillary White was a budsport of Pinks Mamoth that was more productive without hand pollination and Maroochy Gold is a hybrid of Hillary White with a red sugar apple). The link below includes a couple pics of Maroochy Gold. Disregard the picture of the huge fruit with the baby--they apparently uae that on several of their atemoya descriptions.

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=https://www.daleysfruit.com.au/Custard-Apple--Maroochydore-Gold-Annona-atemoya.htm&ved=2ahUKEwiehaGo9I7zAhXUTTABHX2MDhQQFnoECAMQAQ&usg=AOvVaw17WiKDdcs2JeyLRiy-haNH

Based on the 4 atemoyas that I have grown (Tim, Lisa, Gefner, and Dream) Tim has the largest leaves, fruit, and seeds. It ialso has richest/sweetest flavor and an excellent flesh to seed ratio. It also has the thickest peel and some grittiness near the peel (similar to the mamoth types). The exterior of the fruit is knobby (as opposed to pointy, smooth, or impressa type fruits) and many fruits exibit creaming between the segments at maturity--something I have not seen in Gefner or in pics of African Pride (which according to the book I have from Australia is actually be the Israeli variety Kaller which made its way to Australia by way of South Africa). What do those of you who have grown this fruit think? Are my descriptions accurate and does the atemoya in the picture resemble the Tims you have grown?
« Last Edit: September 22, 2021, 09:45:50 PM by Galatians522 »

Gone tropo

  • Durian obsessed
  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 385
    • Nth Qld Australia, zone 13a
    • View Profile
Re: "Tim" atemoya, need help from Aussies with a proper ID
« Reply #9 on: September 20, 2021, 11:39:25 PM »
Man those are some incredible looking fruits, atemoya are incredible I dont live in the ideal climate but because they are so nice im growing out a bunch of seedlings from great fruit anyway trying to hope for the best.

Mike T

  • Zone 12a
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 9014
  • Cairns,Nth Qld, Australia
    • Zone 12a
    • View Profile
Re: "Tim" atemoya, need help from Aussies with a proper ID
« Reply #10 on: September 21, 2021, 01:18:59 AM »
The pics are not mammoths, HW, MG or PP but you describe what mammoth is like inside. Mammoth x AP i see in the markets at times and thankfully they are more like mammoth inside. They look pretty similar and I posted pics of Rusty's fruit with them a few years ago. To around 5 lbs but not like the biggest mammoths.

palmtreeluke

  • Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 157
    • SW Florida
    • View Profile
    • Green Planet Farm
Re: "Tim" atemoya, need help from Aussies with a proper ID
« Reply #11 on: September 21, 2021, 01:49:23 PM »
Steve from fruitscapes said they determined 'TIM' was identified as African Pride. 
not sure how this conclusion was made... I dont have african apride to compare my Tim to.



Home of the Chewy Purple Sugar Apple Annona squamosa 'Isan Indigo'
www.greenplanetfarm.com

skhan

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2274
    • United States, Florida, Coral Springs, 10b
    • View Profile
    • Videos of Garden
Re: "Tim" atemoya, need help from Aussies with a proper ID
« Reply #12 on: September 21, 2021, 02:13:21 PM »
Steve from fruitscapes said they determined 'TIM' was identified as African Pride. 
not sure how this conclusion was made... I dont have african apride to compare my Tim to.

Thanks for the info.

Galatians522

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1824
    • Florida 9b
    • View Profile
Re: "Tim" atemoya, need help from Aussies with a proper ID
« Reply #13 on: September 21, 2021, 07:20:59 PM »
Steve from fruitscapes said they determined 'TIM' was identified as African Pride. 
not sure how this conclusion was made... I dont have african apride to compare my Tim to.

At one point, Fruitscapes was selling Australian and Tim that were both suposed to be from the same source in California. The following thread has a picture of the "Australian" atemoya fruit. It does look like it could be African Pride.

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=http://tropicalfruitforum.com/index.php%3Ftopic%3D26117.0&ved=2ahUKEwiB8NyFmJHzAhUvQzABHcPQCvAQFnoECB4QAQ&usg=AOvVaw0Wbb-5DOiSfPwvx0NLbp5F

Here is a picture of what we have been growing as Tim from Fruitscapes. It does not look like any of the pictures of African Pride that I have seen. Notice the creaming between segments.