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Author Topic: Interesting Story about these two cold hardy avocados.  (Read 595 times)

OCchris1

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Re: Interesting Story about these two cold hardy avocados.
« Reply #25 on: May 24, 2019, 01:57:33 AM »
I admire your dedication Joe! Your ability to process the literature and come up with your own ideas that could work in your environment is commendable. Well done.
-Chris

Mark in Texas

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Re: Interesting Story about these two cold hardy avocados.
« Reply #26 on: May 24, 2019, 09:15:57 AM »
  I've heard nothing but good things about the Mexicola.

Im here to say bad things about mexicola. My mexicola has a date with my chainsaw coming up.  :)

You're spoiled and with what perfect conditions you have I don't blame you a bit for being damn choosy.  It's been reported that an old Mexicola in one of the southern states took 5F and survived.

I guess everyone has their preferences for rootstocks.  I found the typical Florida Slimcados, the W. Indies X Guatemalan hybrids like Monroe, to be extremely vigorous and accepting of scions.  My original trees done back in 2012 are on those stocks.

Mark in Texas

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Re: Interesting Story about these two cold hardy avocados.
« Reply #27 on: May 24, 2019, 09:37:25 AM »
First I did research on where the cold hardiest oldest trees are found and when they bear fruits. So during the fruiting season, I looked at the forecast if it is windy. If that afternoon to evening is windy, I schedule a very early morning trip to those trees and then pick up their fruits from the ground. Most of these trees are in public parks and if on private properties, some of their branches extends to the roads and so I pick up the fruits, and I ripen them, got to taste them too, and then use their seeds as rootstocks.

Now I have many cold hardy avocados grafted on to those seedling rootstocks and as they bear fruits, I use the seeds to experiment if they make excellent rootstocks. I usually started them by germinating them during the winter on potting media, and left outside. I have produced many cold hardy seedlings this way. I will have plenty to experiment from my first generation fruits.

Damn, that's what I call passion.  Good on ya!   If I wasn't getting too old for this chit I'd reinvent the wheel with Nuevo Leon and Oxaca Mexican Criolo avocados, growing and selections. I have a connection thru a friend who knows a Mexican avocado grower who grows and sells varieties of the old landrace Mexican cold hardy Criolo avocado trees.  He's offered my friend scions.  i backed out of her request to graft different named varieties due to the risk of customs and other issues such as disease/insect contamination, which I guess you could get around with a quarantine drill.  She would basically have to smuggle them across is what she's telling me.  Here's one such avocado hanging from one of his trees.  These Mexican and Guatemalan avocados come in all shapes in sizes from ping pong ball size to 2 pounders.



Here's a partially censored variety script he sells beginning with the words "Tengo...." aka "I have....."



I wonder what his "egg of the bull" variety tastes like.   ;D
« Last Edit: May 24, 2019, 09:41:05 AM by Mark in Texas »

JoeReal

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Re: Interesting Story about these two cold hardy avocados.
« Reply #28 on: May 24, 2019, 11:41:03 AM »
First I did research on where the cold hardiest oldest trees are found and when they bear fruits. So during the fruiting season, I looked at the forecast if it is windy. If that afternoon to evening is windy, I schedule a very early morning trip to those trees and then pick up their fruits from the ground. Most of these trees are in public parks and if on private properties, some of their branches extends to the roads and so I pick up the fruits, and I ripen them, got to taste them too, and then use their seeds as rootstocks.

Now I have many cold hardy avocados grafted on to those seedling rootstocks and as they bear fruits, I use the seeds to experiment if they make excellent rootstocks. I usually started them by germinating them during the winter on potting media, and left outside. I have produced many cold hardy seedlings this way. I will have plenty to experiment from my first generation fruits.

Damn, that's what I call passion.  Good on ya!   If I wasn't getting too old for this chit I'd reinvent the wheel with Nuevo Leon and Oxaca Mexican Criolo avocados, growing and selections. I have a connection thru a friend who knows a Mexican avocado grower who grows and sells varieties of the old landrace Mexican cold hardy Criolo avocado trees.  He's offered my friend scions.  i backed out of her request to graft different named varieties due to the risk of customs and other issues such as disease/insect contamination, which I guess you could get around with a quarantine drill.  She would basically have to smuggle them across is what she's telling me.  Here's one such avocado hanging from one of his trees.  These Mexican and Guatemalan avocados come in all shapes in sizes from ping pong ball size to 2 pounders.



Here's a partially censored variety script he sells beginning with the words "Tengo...." aka "I have....."



I wonder what his "egg of the bull" variety tastes like.   ;D

The egg of the bull might just be the shape and size. After all, the original word for avocado is 'testicle'.  Nahuatl name for the indigenous avocado fruit is āhuacatl, that also means “testicle.”

That would be interesting... All those cultivars.  All of the avocados that the US have were originally smuggled in from other countries, mostly from South America and Mexico. The endemic ones were from seedlings of the smuggled ones of ancient days. When US was not yet formed, people from Americas moved about and brought with them plants and animals. Of course those that have established avocado orchards wanted protection.

I don't know of any existing quarantines on avocados, since they're not a major agricultural crop of the US.

 

Mark in Texas

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Re: Interesting Story about these two cold hardy avocados.
« Reply #29 on: May 25, 2019, 08:19:33 AM »
The egg of the bull might just be the shape and size. After all, the original word for avocado is 'testicle'.  Nahuatl name for the indigenous avocado fruit is āhuacatl, that also means “testicle.”

That would be interesting... All those cultivars.  All of the avocados that the US have were originally smuggled in from other countries, mostly from South America and Mexico. The endemic ones were from seedlings of the smuggled ones of ancient days. When US was not yet formed, people from Americas moved about and brought with them plants and animals. Of course those that have established avocado orchards wanted protection.

I don't know of any existing quarantines on avocados, since they're not a major agricultural crop of the US.

You know your testicles well. ;)  Mexico is a bit weird regarding bringing avocados back across the border.  You can do it but for some strange reason the vendor must remove the seed upon the sale.

Here's one Mexican avocado grower in case you do Facebook. https://www.facebook.com/jaime.gonzalez.900388?__tn__=%2CdlC-R-R&eid=ARBq9MEg4CRtHJaQJV-ERVkTV_slqF8oh7bRQ2MRH5L4FJoDe_suzTDFllJ2JlJpx6r-kqTnTWzh7Opg&hc_ref=ARSm137MJLu4gTrAkjARILAiA71ufnyzZqxSxexNBpL13CJTcMxN28eFYVBo1NWflZw

This Texan lives near San Antonio and has quite a few videos including taste tests of varieties he grows.  Does very well with the Tex-Mex avocados some growing as big as 30'.  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TvpI9x9wG_Y&feature=youtu.be

ricshaw

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ricshaw

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Re: Interesting Story about these two cold hardy avocados.
« Reply #31 on: May 25, 2019, 12:11:52 PM »
Genetic Diversity of Mexican Avocado in Nuevo Leon, Mexico

https://www.intechopen.com/books/molecular-approaches-to-genetic-diversity/genetic-diversity-of-mexican-avocado-in-nuevo-leon-mexico

I learned something new: 
"Persea americana var. drymifolia trees are characterized by their resistance to cold and
high oil content, a very distinctive characteristic is its strongly aromatic leaves (anise scented)
in almost all individuals; usually, they grow at altitudes greater than 2,000 m. The leaves are
dark green with light green or reddish young shoots; the fruit has a thin, smooth and soft skin,
the seed can be adhered or loose, the cotyledons are smooth or slightly rough, and it is common
to find fibre in the flesh, although this is not found in most cultivated species.
Given that the avocado is an open-pollinated species, it contains great genetic variability with
almost unlimited possibilities for utilization; a wide diversity of germplasm allows the
advancement of botanical and agronomic knowledge and the development of new cultivars."

Mark in Texas

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Re: Interesting Story about these two cold hardy avocados.
« Reply #32 on: Today at 08:03:01 AM »
Genetic Diversity of Mexican Avocado in Nuevo Leon, Mexico

https://www.intechopen.com/books/molecular-approaches-to-genetic-diversity/genetic-diversity-of-mexican-avocado-in-nuevo-leon-mexico

That's where my friend's friend lives - state of Nuevo Leon.  I noticed some of the improved creoles is what he's growing. 

I would think that if they grew, shipped, and warehoused well, had a good meat to seed ratio, they would be grown in place of Hass. 

ricshaw

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Re: Interesting Story about these two cold hardy avocados.
« Reply #33 on: Today at 11:50:14 AM »

I would think that if they grew, shipped, and warehoused well, had a good meat to seed ratio, they would be grown in place of Hass.


Thin skin and different appearance... probably not going to replace Hass.

z_willus_d

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Re: Interesting Story about these two cold hardy avocados.
« Reply #34 on: Today at 01:10:40 PM »
Nice to see some success in my area. I'm actually pretty close to some GIANT duke's in oroville.
Did you plant in a mound or directly at ground level? I know standing water is a huge issue out here.
Joe, excellent and extremely interesting (and to me) important work that you've presented.  I've been on a similar, if less sophisticated and successful, quest to successfully grow avocados here in Sacramento (Roseville suburb), where we often see the wild temp drops, particularly with these artic inversions we've been getting of late.  I came upon the Duke story (and even held dialogue with it its progenitor and others related to it).  I've made several trips to Oroville to take cuttings and search for seeds.  I've only found one half-eaten avocado from in my visits.  The 2nd set of cuttings I took were grafted onto 2 or 3 box store 5G trees I purchased.  The trees were not healthy due to the winter they withstood, and wild several of the grafts took, the trees ultimately died.  I'm now banking on my Fuerte, Mexicola, and Bacon to survive the transplant I just subjected them to in my front yard.  These trees just produced their first fruit (the Mexicola was excellent) last year.  I had them in large ~50-gal containers for 5+ years.

At any rate, I'll be following your work very closely.

Thanks for sharing.
-naysen











Luisport

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Re: Interesting Story about these two cold hardy avocados.
« Reply #35 on: Today at 01:26:31 PM »
I just found ettinger avocados on the market. I buy some to plant the seeds... untill now i have stewart, ettinger and sir prize seeds growing. Hope to have more cold hardy varieties soon!

 

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