New Persimmon - "South Florida"

[gunnar429]

Adiel, have you tasted Hudson persimmons or know anyone who has?

Yes, I have and from a 1 to a 10, I would rate it a 10, very sweet when soft and ready.  I liked it better than the winterset.  The Hudson Persimmon is very good and very similar in taste and in looks to a fuyu.

Adiel, you rated hudson/s. FL as a 10.  Where would you rate the winterset on scale of 1 to 10?

Thanks

[LEOOEL]

This is a good, informative Thread, which I'm glad it's been brought back. It basically consists of infomation about the 2-3 best persimmons for the South Florida area.

After, re-reading this/other Thread(s), again, this is what I come away with:

'South Florida' persimmon is the same thing as 'Hudson' persimmon. It begs the question: is 'Hudson' better overall quality (production, flavor, fruit size ...) than 'Triumph' and 'Winterset?' From what I've read, 'Hudson' requires no chill hours. Is 'Hudson' ('S. Florida') thus indeed a better variety than 'Triumph' and 'Winterset?' This variety is reported to be similar in size to the 'Triumph' persimmon and in harvest season, August to December (according to Pete's Plants). It is also mentioned in Pepe's Plants website that it is "very similar to Triumph but is said to have even less chill requirements and more productive."

'Triumph,' ranks in at second best place. The renowned 'Triumph' is reported to be a small to medium sized fruit, similar in size to the 'Hudson' ('S.Florida') persimmon.

The Triumph does phenomenally well here in South Florida - producing so much fruit that broken branches are not uncommon. I get dozens of fruit each year from a 5 year old, 5 foot tall tree. It's a great persimmon, but not quite as good tasting as the winterset.

'Winterset' ranks in at third best place. It is reported by Jeff (Cookie Monster) to be smaller than 'Triumph' but with an even better taste. The harvest season is reported to be November-December by TT.

Steve Cucura usually recommends the winterset. It's comparable to the saijo in quality (ie, excellent) but bears much more heavily. The fruit are smallish and very sweet (22 degrees brix if I remember correctly). I've seen the winterset fruit in a 3 gallon pot.

As always, different locations/conditions can have an effect on overall fruit quality.

[Guanabanus]

Gary USUALLY doesn't re-name varieties, but he did re-name the Po Pyu Kalay as "Lemon Meringue," because it would sell more that way.  Obviously 'South Florida' will sell better than a variety that appears to be named after a river in New York.

[mangokothiyan]

I have Winterset and two South Florida Persimmon trees. All of them have woken up now. The Winterset had four fruits last year and I was able to taste one. Top notch; really sweet and delicious. Excited to read that SF is even better.

[LEOOEL]

Yesterday, I got (from PI), and planted, the 'South Florida' persimmon variety.

This is a great fruit. And, in order to develop a larger fruit that is suited for the S. Florida, USA, area, it deserves the same treatment as some 'Dragon Fruit' plantations that they have going on here, Texas and other locations.

[Mr. Clean]

I have three South Florida Persimmons in ground.  I learned the meaning of astringent by trying a fruit too early.  The ripe ones I had were small, deep orange and intensely sweet.

[LEOOEL]

Perhaps if the fruit is culled, like with Loquat fruit, there will then be an improvement in fruit size/quality.

[crazyforcherimoya]

Bught a healthy nice looking triumph from Pepe but it didn't last 2 years here in miami beach. Now have a south florida that appears to be frozen in time since I bought it 1 year ago...limbs are flexible and tree is alive. Similar behavior as the triumph.... I wonder whether the issue could be proximity to ocean /high saline environment. Anybody growing it successfully close to the beach?

[johnb51]

Bught a healthy nice looking triumph from Pepe but it didn't last 2 years here in miami beach. Now have a south florida that appears to be frozen in time since I bought it 1 year ago...limbs are flexible and tree is alive. Similar behavior as the triumph.... I wonder whether the issue could be proximity to ocean /high saline environment. Anybody growing it successfully close to the beach?

I'm less than one mile from the beach, and my Triumph is doing fine, appears to be setting fruit after 2 years in the ground.  I purchased a "South Florida" recently, which I haven't planted yet.

[crazyforcherimoya]

Thanks John - I am thinking salt should not be to much of a problem although I am near the beach - I can grow papayas and sugar apples which are typically very salt intolerant....

I water my persimmon weekly unless it rains and never fertilized it (waiting for it to wake up first....). Maybe nematodes eating the roots?

[crazyforcherimoya]

My south Florida persimmon has finally waken up for the first time here is Miami Beach after I purchased it almost 1 year back. I think it is trying to flower although it is still a small tree. I have no hope for it to carry any fruit to maturity but I thought if it flowers it means it likes it over here.

The tree has developed some long thin branches that I am going to prune at a certain point to promote branching and sturdy scaffolding. But I will likely wait till the end of the season to avoid shocking the plant while it is flushing.

I hope this one settles down without any major issue in my backyard unlike the Triumph which lasted only 1 season... will keep my fingers crossed

[gnappi]

I went to Excalibur last week to get another persimmon. Based on comments here I narrowed my list to South Florida and Triumph which Excalibur had several of the So Fla.

I also got to look at a few Winterset and Jeff is correct that the one I bought a few years ago looks nothing like the winterset I saw. The unknown (UNK) cultivar is nearly 10' tall and for the first year it now has bloomed and set several fruit.

After looking at all of them, I settled on a little (~4') South Florida which is nicely full and has three fruits on it. The fruit are twice the size of the UNK.

I can't wait to taste them.

[FlyingFoxFruits]

I was thinking the same thing. Will be interesting to get more data on this one. Persimmon is a top notch fruit, one of my favorites for the late fall / early winter; definitely interested in new cultivars that produce well down here.

That doesn't make a lotnof sense.  If the tree has an actual varietal name, why would anyone , especially the likes of Gary Zill who is no stranger to Richard Campbell, call it "South Florida"?  Also, why would it be coined (as if it has an already established name i don't feel right calling it something else) South Florida if it came feom North Florida?

agree,I was told it was a very good producer,I planted one myself,I sure would like to get more info on it just so I can relay it to customers.

*** mod edit:  fixed quote ***

any update on this persimmon?  I got some today, beautiful 3 gal plants....

I'm curious to know how it's performed.

also, is it the same as "Hudson"? and it's astringent?

[johnb51]

"South Florida" seems to be one hardy persimmon tree.  Mine is still in the pot but has already set fruit.  Also, when I re-potted it, I was less than kind to the roots, but it survived and has grown a lot since.

[mangomandan]

I have three South Florida Persimmons in ground.  I learned the meaning of astringent by trying a fruit too early.  The ripe ones I had were small, deep orange and intensely sweet.

Exactly what I was wondering.  I have one fruit from SF, just picked.  Do I wait until it is quite/very soft to eat?

[cbss_daviefl]

Yes, very soft.   It should have give with a light touch. 

I have three South Florida Persimmons in ground.  I learned the meaning of astringent by trying a fruit too early.  The ripe ones I had were small, deep orange and intensely sweet.

Exactly what I was wondering.  I have one fruit from SF, just picked.  Do I wait until it is quite/very soft to eat?

[Mr. Clean]

I have three South Florida Persimmons in ground.  I learned the meaning of astringent by trying a fruit too early.  The ripe ones I had were small, deep orange and intensely sweet.

Exactly what I was wondering.  I have one fruit from SF, just picked.  Do I wait until it is quite/very soft to eat?

Wait until it is orange and soft; or you will regret it.

[johnb51]

It seems awfully early for persimmons to be ripening.  I have 5 or 6 green Triumph persimmons on my tree.

[gnappi]

It seems awfully early for persimmons to be ripening.  I have 5 or 6 green Triumph persimmons on my tree.

Yeah it is, especially May 8th?

My "Unknown" (previously thought to be a winterset) has very green hard fruits, and the "South Florida" has a few that are blushing a light yellow but won't be ready for at least a couple of months.

[crazyforcherimoya]

My South Florida P is getting ready for the winter or so it looks. This is its first year in the ground (bought it as a 5 gallon last winter). It bloomed, set 3 fruits but aborted them quite early. Still not to bad.

Now that the end of the summer is approaching the leaves look fairly beaten up and are turning rubbery and blackish. Is this what other folks close to the ocean are experiencing as well? How is the foliage of your tree at this point?

Thanks for any input

[gunnar429]

FYI, there is a persimmon tree var. Hudson aka South FL at Fairchild Gardens, just outside the Whitman pavilion to the right (next to the cheena and black gold jakfruit

[gnappi]

My South Florida P is getting ready for the winter or so it looks. This is its first year in the ground (bought it as a 5 gallon last winter). It bloomed, set 3 fruits but aborted them quite early. Still not to bad.

Now that the end of the summer is approaching the leaves look fairly beaten up and are turning rubbery and blackish. Is this what other folks close to the ocean are experiencing as well? How is the foliage of your tree at this point?

Thanks for any input

It's not a coastal thing, I'm a pretty long way from the ocean and the leaves on both of my persimmon are doing the same thing. They "may" keep a few raggedly looking leaves through the winter then burst out with new growth in the spring. I think my south Florida's fruits won't be ready for a while yet though they are getting a nice orange color, and my other thought to be a winterset is a good month away from that.

[johnb51]

The fruit on my Triumph persimmon has started to change color--it should be ripe soon?  As far as the leaves go, they do look like what crazyforcherimoya describes.  Also, South Florida persimmon leaves are starting to look the same.

[FlyingFoxFruits]

harvesting south FL's now, and they nice tho.

other types too tho...

video here...
https://youtu.be/q1sqE8poOYY