Grape for Florida Tari's Burgundy

[FruitFreak]

@Mark in Texas
Thanks for the further information. I have to read it a few times to understand it. I get the part about Muscadines being wild so needing double the cordon length to run

I was also wondering if a downward VSP for muscadine verities would be better suited to accommodate their inherent "drooping" growth habit?  Some articles point out the trellis system should be designed around the growth characteristics of the grape to be grown. 

[WGphil]

I have two muscadine and a Southern Home grape.  The first two are about thirty years old.   They have never had a problem.  The Southern Home had its first crop last season.     

I just use the hedge trimmers on the muscadines  to get them out of the mango tree and back closer to the wire.     I wait until a  colder day to cut the vines.   They bleed pretty bad if you do it when it has been warm for awhile.  So I do that during the coldest month. 

The Southern Home is very tasty.  My first reaction was wow.   It is very good and has that bunch grape taste that is hard to grow here.   

[Mark in Texas]

I was also wondering if a downward VSP for muscadine verities would be better suited to accommodate their inherent "drooping" growth habit?  Some articles point out the trellis system should be designed around the growth characteristics of the grape to be grown.

#1. Try it and see.  You can always change the training method.  #2. I agree.

The vine really doesn't care, it's your call.

[Mark in Texas]

Dog and pony show time.  As posted on the Texas Rare Fruit Growers Facebook page a couple of days ago.  Vines are 6-7' tall full of small clusters. Should get 2 tons on the four rows.

[zands]

@Mark..... More grape photos the merrier. I am learning a lot! Your vines look great! Like lots of grape trees in a row. You are espaliering grape trees!

[Mark in Texas]

Thanks!  It was shredded by 3 series of hailstorms in one afternoon about 3 weeks ago. 

The idea is to have a continuous line of vines with no breaks.  I just planted 4 Rousanne in the holes, voids left by dead vines.  Cotton root rot is a problem here.

Good luck

[FruitFreak]

Dog and pony show time.  As posted on the Texas Rare Fruit Growers Facebook page a couple of days ago.  Vines are 6-7' tall full of small clusters. Should get 2 tons on the four rows.

Wow! those rows are beautiful!

[Mark in Texas]

Thanks!  I'm all about cheap labor. 

[zands]

Thanks!  It was shredded by 3 series of hailstorms in one afternoon about 3 weeks ago. 

The idea is to have a continuous line of vines with no breaks.  I just planted 4 Rousanne in the holes, voids left by dead vines.  Cotton root rot is a problem here.

Good luck

By shredded this means you had a mess on your hands but they will grow back and give you grapes this year? The cordons are still intact

[Mark in Texas]

Thanks!  It was shredded by 3 series of hailstorms in one afternoon about 3 weeks ago. 

The idea is to have a continuous line of vines with no breaks.  I just planted 4 Rousanne in the holes, voids left by dead vines.  Cotton root rot is a problem here.

Good luck

By shredded this means you had a mess on your hands but they will grow back and give you grapes this year? The cordons are still intact

I lost leaves and few branches on every vine but these guys are on steroids.  I'm expect a heavy crop.

[zands]

I lost leaves and few branches on every vine but these guys are on steroids.  I'm expect a heavy crop.

Good to hear this! Make lots of money! I just came in from straightening up my Southern Home muscadine vines

[zands]

The Southern Home is very tasty.  My first reaction was wow.   It is very good and has that bunch grape taste that is hard to grow here.

Thanks for your take on them. I have two small vines of this variety. Now I am going to be sure to give them more attention. I have other muscadine grapes but the Southern Home grapes are the largest...most developed

________

http://www.caes.uga.edu/commodities/fruits/muscadines/cultivars/southern_home/southern_home.html
History

Southern Home' was introduced in 1994 by J. Mortenson, J. Harris, D. Hopkins, and P. Anderson of the University of Florida. 'Southern Home' was selected from the cross 'Summit' x P9-15. 'Southern Home' is special among muscadine cultivars because the P9-15 parent is a complex hybrid between V. rotundifolia, V. popenoei, V. munsoniana, and V. vinifera. The first three species are all from the muscadinia subgenus, and V. vinifera is the standard wine bunch grape species. You can tell the hybrid nature of this cultivar by the cut leaf pattern of the leaves.

We have only evaluated 'Southern Home' in an informal way. The berry size is likely too small for use in the commercial market. However, berry flavor and overall quality are good, and the flesh has a nice crisp texture. This vine is highly recommended for home plantings because it is self-fertile, has good flavor, and the cut leaf pattern is very ornamental.

[Mark in Texas]

Nice. I'd like to know how the brix and pH play once ripe.

[gunnar429]

I know it doesn't count without pictures but I harvested the last of my tari grapes today.  Filled a 2 gallon bucket.  I like them.  Sure, it takes some getting used to eating seeded grapes if all you've had is seedless, but these were a little tart and a little sweet, made a good red/purple grape, and the skin was definitely more palatable than muscadines...just like red grapes from the store, albeit a little smaller...now I am no grape expert by any means....never even been to wine country.

But, these vines are 2 years old, productive (you hear that mr c ), and they pop out grapes even before leaves.  I also like that they are early season (makes a good tart balance to eating so much mango)--especially since other muscadines are just starting to fruit (tiny fruit atm)...this is great for multiple harvest seasons here in south florida.

Hoping dunstan's dream is just as good.  Btw, I have a double cordon setup, about 25 ft long, against a fence (on 2 wires)

[WGphil]

If you are in Central Florida, you can visit Lakeridge winery and see how they trellis for this climate.   You get to taste the wines from the different grapes they grow there. 

In the same area closer to Clermont, Tommy Free owns a Upick grape operation.   Good to try several types to find the one you like before planting

If you bend a lower vine to the ground and cover it with dirt, it will root.   

[Sugartopfarms]

I first was very intrigued by the success you guys were having with Tari Burgundy that I started doing some research. I ended up with two nice Tari Burgundy's from Pine Island via a very nice fellow TFF member (Val).
Upon, further research I found myself getting more and more confused on how some people call them "bunch grapes" but most refer to them as a muscadine hyrbid. In fact, pine island puts both labels on the plant, adding to the confusion. I made my trellis as a bilateral cordon training system from UFs literature on muscadines. I am hoping to get them like some of the pics shared by Mark.

WGphil, I live right by Lakeridge, I didnt know they would have Tari Burgundy. DO you know if they do?
Also, I couldnt find anything on Tommy Frees U Pick? Any additional information. THanks!

[Zeeth]

Do any of the Florida grapes have a concord-like taste?

[Central Floridave]

My Tari Burgundy has about ten pounds of fruit on it now. They are just about ready to pick. I have them covered in bird netting currently. I'll post photos later tonight.  They taste great.   Is there any problem with eating the seeds?   I've just chew on them and swallow some of the seed if i'm inside and no spitting allowed.   

[gunnar429]

My Tari Burgundy has about ten pounds of fruit on it now. They are just about ready to pick. I have them covered in bird netting currently. I'll post photos later tonight.  They taste great.   Is there any problem with eating the seeds?   I've just chew on them and swallow some of the seed if i'm inside and no spitting allowed.

I have just been swallowing them...I don't like the taste of the seeds, so I have been working on eating them gently and swallowing the seed.  When I harvested, I had a few raisins on the tree, dried by the sun, but since the seeds were inside them, they didn't taste too good (probably could've tried harder (read: at all) to remove them.

[zands]

My Tari Burgundy has about ten pounds of fruit on it now. They are just about ready to pick. I have them covered in bird netting currently. I'll post photos later tonight.  They taste great.   Is there any problem with eating the seeds?   I've just chew on them and swallow some of the seed if i'm inside and no spitting allowed.

I look for bunches that have turned medium to dark purple.Then I look for the darkest of the dark grapes of the bunch,  I remove and eat those, and I get the most sweetness this way. I leave the bunch on the vine to ripen more and just pick off the darkest sweetest individual grapes

~~~~~~~~  TARI ~~~~~~~~~

[gunnar429]

I first was very intrigued by the success you guys were having with Tari Burgundy that I started doing some research. I ended up with two nice Tari Burgundy's from Pine Island via a very nice fellow TFF member (Val).
Upon, further research I found myself getting more and more confused on how some people call them "bunch grapes" but most refer to them as a muscadine hyrbid. In fact, pine island puts both labels on the plant, adding to the confusion. I made my trellis as a bilateral cordon training system from UFs literature on muscadines. I am hoping to get them like some of the pics shared by Mark.

WGphil, I live right by Lakeridge, I didnt know they would have Tari Burgundy. DO you know if they do?
Also, I couldnt find anything on Tommy Frees U Pick? Any additional information. THanks!

Okay, so they are a hybrid (cross) between bunch grapes and muscadine grapes, but in my ignorant opinion, they take mostly after the bunch grape side of the family.  Mine have already fruited and my muscadines have just started flowering/baby fruitlets.  I eat red grapes from the store, and I find these to be at least as good as those (which for S FL is awesome...not napa valley, y'know)...only difference is they can be slightly smaller and of course, they have seeds.

I just put two wires along my fence at about 3 ft and 6 ft from the ground, and tied the new growth to the wires for the past year and a half...then this year, I just had loads of bunches of grapes, and then the leaves pushed out and covered the fruit some....pretty easy.  I am a big fan, at least in fruiting year 1!

[gunnar429]

My Tari Burgundy has about ten pounds of fruit on it now. They are just about ready to pick. I have them covered in bird netting currently. I'll post photos later tonight.  They taste great.   Is there any problem with eating the seeds?   I've just chew on them and swallow some of the seed if i'm inside and no spitting allowed.

I look for bunches that have turned medium to dark purple.Then I look for the darkest of the dark grapes of the bunch,  I remove and eat those, and I get the most sweetness this way. I leave the bunch on the vine to ripen more and just pick off the darkest sweetest individual grapes

~~~~~~~~  TARI ~~~~~~~~~

I like 'em red, dark red, and purple, but purple requires more vigilance before they get overripe (daily walk through the orchard at least)...

[zands]

I like 'em red, dark red, and purple, but purple requires more vigilance before they get overripe (daily walk through the orchard at least)...

It a pain but I will make the extra effort to get them (Tari) sweet as possible. I was suspicious that Tari was going to be on the tart side due to its light to medium darkish purple hue. Nowhere near as dark as Ison and other dark purple muscadines

Plant your Dunston dream (dark muscadine) from Pine Island in a really good place. This dark one should be sweeter overall than Tari
I am going to up-pot my Dunston and plant next year

[Central Floridave]

[Sugartopfarms]

Okay, so they are a hybrid (cross) between bunch grapes and muscadine grapes, but in my ignorant opinion, they take mostly after the bunch grape side of the family.  Mine have already fruited and my muscadines have just started flowering/baby fruitlets.  I eat red grapes from the store, and I find these to be at least as good as those (which for S FL is awesome...not napa valley, y'know)...only difference is they can be slightly smaller and of course, they have seeds.

I just put two wires along my fence at about 3 ft and 6 ft from the ground, and tied the new growth to the wires for the past year and a half...then this year, I just had loads of bunches of grapes, and then the leaves pushed out and covered the fruit some....pretty easy.  I am a big fan, at least in fruiting year 1!
[/quote]

Thanks for the information. Based on everyones pick I was thinking the same thing on how they seemed more like a bunch.