Author Topic: Producing Seeds with Self-Sterile plants & distant hybridising - How to do it  (Read 3538 times)

Tao2

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 I came across this method on another forum (dedicated to cactus breeding my thanks to "Evil Genius")  I have spoken with one person who claimed its success & I'm presently using it myself, though it will be a few weeks before I will know if the fruit has set.

Would appreciate any feed back.................

Many garden plants have duplicated their chromosome count (2n, 3n, 4n ).......it may be a natural thing and it is also due to gardeners over 1000'S of years hybridising, breeding plants.......bigger fruit and flowers etc .........this often makes the plant self sterile (needs another plant that isn't its clone to breed successfully, set seed)...... feel free to correct me if I'm in error.................

 "just want to share tech that can be used to fertilize the flower of a plant that usually needs pollen from another one to develop seed:

1. Get yourself some Cement from the DIY Store. Very fine pulver. The finer the better. But the typical Commercial grade works fine as well.

2. Get yourself a small brush and apply some of the cement dust on the Stigma of the flower on the plant that you want to produce seeds with. (Also try to blow a little bit of the dust inside the flower....don't breath in)

3. Cement works as some kind of irritator what makes the flower create some Anti-Bodies that enable her to accept her own pollen.

4. Then wait for half an hour and brush some of the own pollen on the flower and repeat this numerous times.


Now heres some additional info: Usually, there is only very few seed to be harvested but it works and the seeds are usually viable. The reason why this works is that cement consists of highly basic calciumsillicates that tremendeously raise the ph of the flower. Because there also are aminoclusters on a pollencorn that are also responsible for raising the ph, the cement has the very same effect. Because of his highly basic potential, cement is even way more effective. Basic niveau reduces the ability of the flower to abort the pollen so it accepts it.

IT ALSO ENABLES YOU TO CROSS plants THAT ARE INCOMPATIBLE WITH EACH OTHER! ie very distantly related. Its not guaranteed that it works all the time and you have to experiment a lot but i know that it worked in some cases.
Another Advantage is that genetecially, defects will be passed down to the offspring.

But in some cases, plants can be weak or not healthy and may need additional generations of breeding in other plants. The produced Offspring thats created with this tech is not to be seen as clones as there is a recombination of DNA going on, what enables them to cross them in with the motherplant as well."

an opportunity to make some very interesting hybrids......or self fertilise a self sterile plant...enjoy....

nullzero

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Tao2,

Very interesting info, have you done this method with success yourself?
Grow mainly fruits, vegetables, and herbs.

plantlover13

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Hmm, maybe some garcinia hybrids, get some mangoostan flavor in a more manegeable tree...  ;D

Sanddollarmoon

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Hmm, maybe some garcinia hybrids, get some mangoostan flavor in a more manegeable tree...  ;D

I was also thinking about hybridizing common malvales with durian, but honestly I am not going to try crossing into order territory yet, until I try some of the same family, such as, say, a angel's trumpet X garden tomato. You also have to be able to obtain viable pollen of one of the plants you want to breed, and already have a plant of the other, and they need to be flowering at the same time of year, and the recieving ovary cannot be too small or too large to hold/decect pollen. Say you wanted to creat a pumpkin forget-me-not hybrid, the pumpkin pollen would be too large for the tiny forget-me-not ovary.

plantlover13

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Hmm, maybe some garcinia hybrids, get some mangoostan flavor in a more manegeable tree...  ;D

I was also thinking about hybridizing common malvales with durian, but honestly I am not going to try crossing into order territory yet, until I try some of the same family, such as, say, a angel's trumpet X garden tomato. You also have to be able to obtain viable pollen of one of the plants you want to breed, and already have a plant of the other, and they need to be flowering at the same time of year, and the recieving ovary cannot be too small or too large to hold/decect pollen. Say you wanted to creat a pumpkin forget-me-not hybrid, the pumpkin pollen would be too large for the tiny forget-me-not ovary.

I was thinking mangoostan x lemon drop mangostan.

Maybe give the plants ahormone shot to encourage blooming?

Sanddollarmoon

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« Last Edit: December 01, 2013, 02:28:37 PM by Sanddollarmoon »

Guanabanus

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I hybridized Annonas for 16 years, but had never heard of something like this!  I shall have to try it!
Har

Tao2

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Very interesting info, have you done this method with success yourself?
[/quote]


I am presently attempting a self pollination with a self sterile cleistocactus strausii...........(I'm only guessing its self sterile...(search's have supported that notion).....so not a true test)and and cross between an Epiphyllum hybrid cactus and  cleistocactus strausii............they have both just started flowering.................the next flowers that open I will remove the pollen anthers to ensure no self contamination.................So its all new to me.................a nursery women indicated she had used it on a rare endangered plant to build up non cloned stock.................but until I see the fruit set.....I just don't know....................I tend to do the same flower over days many times...............until the flower folds.............its a bit of a concern I might over do the cement and burn the stigma....................but it does open up a world of possibilities to the home breeder...................

nullzero

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Link to the original "Evil Genius" thread

http://www.shaman-australis.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=30961

Quote
POSTER: so i'm assuming you could use lime or any other carbonate or highly basic powder

EV: Exactly. Everything that has the ability to influence the ph should also be able to influence the pollen acceptance as well. Some may work better than others so please dont hesitate to publish your results. Success Rates may be shockingly low or high. Its all about the ph, the moisture and some luck. Crossing difficult cacti is a numbers game.
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Pancrazio

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A think to take in account is the somatoplastic sterility, when fertilization of pollen occurs, the embryo is viable, but the seeds is unable to develop because the secondary endosperm (which is triploid) is unable to develop because the chromosome count doesn't match. You have to take in account even this.
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Tao2

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Re: Producing Seeds with Self-Sterile plants & distant hybridising - How to do it
« Reply #10 on: September 25, 2013, 09:03:26 AM »
Thanks Pancrazio
In seaching 'somatoplastic. I came across this...................I guess in extreme cases where the seed doesn't reach maturity for any of the following reasons..................embryo rescure can be acheived by tissue culture................


 Author:    Johnston, Dorothy M.
Abstract:    Post-fertilization breakdown in the reproductive processes is frequently the cause of incompatibility in interspecific and intergeneric crosses in plants. Cooper and Brink (1940) report that sterility in the crosses Nicotiana rustica X N. glutinosa, N. rustica X Petunia violacea and N. rustica X Lycopersicon esculentum is due to a type of seed failure which they call somatoplastic sterility. Fertilization, although delayed, takes place, and the hybrid embryos grow normally until the collapse of the young seeds. The endosperm however is retarded in development; it loses ascendancy over the maternal tissues of the ovule, which proliferate and finally occlude the endosperm. Associated with these events is the non-differentiation of the vascular bundle to the ovule. Starvation of the endosperm results. Final seed collapse is initiated by the breakdown of the endosperm, which begins in the chalazal region and progresses towards the embryo. Ledingham (1940) has investigated the development of the embryo and endosperm in the cross Medicago falcata X M. sativa and the reciprocal. He finds that there is some evidence that if the development of the endosperm and embryo is too slow some part of the ovule or ovary develops at their expense until abortion occurs. Autogenous endosperm breakdown is reported by several investigators. Kihara and Nishiyama (1932) found that in the cross Avena strigosa X A. fatua the endosperm grows very rapidly but abnormally. Mitotic divisions are disturbed, so that giant masses of chromatin are formed. Large irregular nuclei, unhealthy cytoplasm, and weak cell wall formation are also found. Seeds are formed but they do not germinate. In the reciprocal cross, A. fatua X A. Strigosa endosperm development is very slow and soon ceases. In some ovules it is regenerated later from a group of cells in the antipodal region, and these ovules may form fertile seeds. Boyes and Thompson (1937) describe endosperm and embryo development in reciprocal crosses in Triticum and Secale. The embryos develop normally. In the endosperm all conditions are found from a slight retardation in growth to extreme abnormalities and early abortion, depending on the width of the cross and the direction in which it is made. Kostoff (1930) suggests that abortion of endosperm and embryo in Nicotiana hybrids may be due to an immunity reaction. Antibodies are produced in the maternal tissues which attack the hybrid embryo and endosperm. Laibach’s theory (1929) which explains the non­germination of hybrid embryos in Linum by unfavorable influences of the mother plant, is similar. When the embryos are dissected out it is found possible to raise them to maturity. Preliminary work (Thompson, 1939) indicates that fertilization takes place in the cross Hordeum vulgare x Secale cereale, and that seed failure is due to a characteristic type of endosperm abortion. The development of the hybrid embryo and endosperm is traced in the present study.