The Tropical Fruit Forum

Yellow Sapote (Casimiroa tetrameria) is thought to be part of the genetics of Suebelle (fuzzy underside of leaves) and Suebell is as a result smaller than the typical White Sapote (Casimiroa edulis).  My Pike is a giant and I can't reach around the trunk with both arms.  Unbelieveable amount of fruit is produced.  The Yellow sapote on their own roots are sized much smaller.  These trees are well over 20 years of age.  Interestingly, grafting a white sapote (like my giant Pike) on a yellow sapote rootstock causes extreme dwarfing and a tree about six ft tall, producing normal sized fruit.  No delayed incompatibility so far in over 20 years.  I have 4 dwarfed white sapotes on yellow rootstock, some 4 ft tall, some 7ft tall after more than 20 years. .  A much younger person needs to experiment with a varied interstock of yellow sapote on white sapote to regulate ultimate size of the tree.  As an aside, a friend dried some white sapote fruit (sliced) and it was exellent, described as the flavor of "gummy worms".

Jack, that's just too much useful info in one post.  This is the first time I hear about dwarfing white sapotes. 
What a great way to grow white sapote on yellow sapote rootstock to dwarf it.  Less space, less trimming, less climbing, less mess and flies from falling fruit.
I cut down two of my four WS trees because they just grow too fast and get too huge.  Especially the Redlands.  Malibu#3 is also super vigorous.
Suebelle dies easier than other WS in Phoenix, so maybe yellow sapote rootstock would be difficult to use in the desert.
I top worked my Vernon to Malibu#3 and Walton because Vernon has bitter skin and a weird flavor here.  Malibu#3 and Walton taste better.
My kids love gummy anything.  I will try to dehydrate some WS this year!  Too many WS to eat anyway.

I top worked my Chironja to an orange because it's not good.  It was the CRC 4045 from UC Riverside.
It's productive and cold hardy, but is seedy and has dry granulation problems two years straight.
It's also on the sour side and lack a nice flavor.  There's probably a much better Chironja in Puerto Rico.

Might still be worth an experiment with the localized quince variety given its tolerance for everything else that Arizona can throw at it (crap soil, high ph, salt, heat, cold).

True, you never know.

Interesting because dwarfing should be bad for heat tolerance, since vigor helps overcome heat stress.
For example rootstocks for peach and citrus that do well in Phoenix must have two main traits:
1. tolerance of high soil pH & salts,
2. is vigorous and produce a standard size tree.

Peaches on dwarfing rootstocks like Citation and citrus on Flying Dragon suck here.
Peaches on Lovell or Nemaguard and citrus on C35 suck less.
Viking and Hansen are best for peaches in AZ.
Sour Orange and C22 are great for citrus.

Phoenix is probably hotter than the Mediterranean areas where they grow loquats.

Avocados are much harder to grow than loquats in Phoenix.

Julys in Phoenix are usually between 105F to 120F so 40C to 49C. 
Humidity lows between 5% to 20% unless we get the monsoons.
I guess that would be January in Australia.

Whenever I used to google for a rare tropical fruit tree in the US, Daley's Nursery always shows up.
Drives me crazy! 

Kaz is a MVP!

Some other stuff that doesn't give a crap about reflected heat against a west-facing block wall:

-bouganvillea (grab some of the upright varieties like Alexandra rather than Barbara Karst to cut down on trimming time)
-Pride of Barbados (can get toasty first year against the brick)
-Mexican bird of paradise (the yellow one, also a nitrogen fixer with okay shade after a couple of years)
-Pomegranate (Wonderful cultivar, some of the other cultivars like sweet and eversweet don't like the brick as much)
-Sugarcane with a little bit of afternoon shade when getting established
-Dwarf chinese bamboo (at least for me, other people have struggled with this one but I manged to get a patch going against the west wall with a little shade during June-Autumn after planting. Other varieties are not a fan ime.
-Vernonia amygdalina (growth similar to bamboo out here if trimmed regularly, indestructible once established, supposedly edible but bitter as bitter melon).
-Cape honeysuckle, but gets a little toasty first year.
-Hop bush but they get stupid huge

This is all stuff that I've gotten to survive a year. The trick with all of those is to water the crap out of them while they get established during hot months, moreso than you think they need.

I'm testing out curry leaf a couple of feet from the wall this year. And honestly I'd probably just use pomegranates except my neighbor and I don't like looking at each other, including in fall and winter 

Also, plants near other plants do better in the winter for me. I'm currently going for the "high density chaos forest" approach and that is the stuff that thrives in both seasons as opposed to orderly well-spaced planting. Others' mileage may vary.

Right, walls kill heat sensitive trees in the summer, but they protect tropical trees in the winter.  Just consider that walls damage plants with heat and reflected light in the summer day so works at a further distance than wall heat protection in the winter night.

The deciduous fruit trees I found that don't give a damn about reflected wall heat are(in decreasing order):
Pomegranate
Jujube
Mulberry
Mulberry nigra
Peach - depending on rootstock

The tropical fruit trees that don't give a damn about summer wall heat and also benefit from the wall heat in the winter are:(in heat tolerance decreasing order):
Guamuchil
Kei Apple
Natal Plum
Indian Jujube
Bael
Marula
Phalsa
Jamaican Cherry
Barbados Cherry
Lemon
Lime
Imbe
Common Guava - most
Jambolan
Ice Cream Bean
Papaya - Mexican, not Hawaiian

40% is a pretty good gamble.

Not investment advice.

CeeJey & Snowjunky, I think your best chance for a loquat to do well is to start by growing a lot of seedlings and let the strongest one (still alive) survive the heat as they grow to be 1 year old seedlings. I did this with my loquat seeds, planted a tub full of 100+ seeds, then let them all grow out, had about 60-80 seedlings. The seedlings were in the community tub until the most vigorous seedling survive. I will now take the remaining 2 seedlings and put each in a nice large pot to grow until they fruit. I don't have the heat you have in AZ, but with this method it will allow only the strong to survive.

Here's the results:
1. Setup, Home Depot plastic container, 12x19.
2. Seeds- started with over 100 seeds (May 2021)
3. Germinated 80% seedlings
4. Continued in same tub until two survived
5. Seedling #1 - 27" tall today
6. Seedling #2 - 40" tall today

Yes, seedlings would be the stronger than most grafted loquats.  If the seedling fruit is not good then graft good varieties on the east or NE side of the tree.

You have to be creative to keep certain trees alive in Phoenix. 
I don't use shade structures for trees.  I plant a moringa or Emerald okra on the west side of the tree for afternoon shade. 
Any plant that's fast growing and heat resistant will do for shade and a plant also increases the humidity and cools the temperature for your tree. 
Shade structures can't do that.  Just remove the plant when your tree is strong enough to take the heat.

I've tried sunflowers too because they grow fast and tall, but they die before summer's over and are allelopathic.

Hi all, I grow loquats in Phoenix.  I've had many loquat trees die in the summer. 
Selecting the right varieties is most important.  Some varieties are much more heat tolerant than others. 
Generally speaking orange flesh varieties are hardier than yellow flesh and white flesh is the weakest. 
But flesh color does not guarantee heat tolerance. 
Big Jim, McBeth, Argelino, Kanko can take full sun in a cool spot in my yard after one year in ground. 
Novak, Bradenton, Tanaka need afternoon shade. 
Christmas, Champagne, Ed's Delight need shade from late morning. 
Vista White needs shade all day long.
Loquats need water everyday in the summer until established, then every two or three days and water deeply.
Finally, loquats from cuttings are weaker than grafted trees with a tap root.

What other varieties and tips would you recommend?

I'll have to be happy with just longan.  Phoenix 8.x pH soil, water and heat is just too much for any lychee variety.