Author Topic: Jatropa  (Read 5212 times)

luc

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Jatropa
« on: August 21, 2017, 12:33:43 PM »
Is there a way to distinguish the edible variety from the toxic one ?
Luc Vleeracker
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Mexico , Pacific coast.
20 degrees north

Aaron

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Re: Jatropa
« Reply #1 on: August 21, 2017, 12:51:24 PM »
I have a edible one (Though i havent tested it yet) and would like to know also.

achetadomestica

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Re: Jatropa
« Reply #2 on: August 21, 2017, 03:30:43 PM »
I have a edible one (Though i havent tested it yet) and would like to know also.
How do you know it's edible?
I got one from a guy who got it from someone who called it a Florida pistachio.
Both of these people ate them in fact the original guy has been eating them for years
and his tree is huge  I got a tree and did a little research and found out
it is toxic? My tree hasn't produced allot but I did plant a seed and have a second one
growing. I guess they are perfect to give to the neighbor for now?

roblack

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Re: Jatropa
« Reply #3 on: August 21, 2017, 03:36:02 PM »
Is there a way to distinguish the edible variety from the toxic one ?

I can think of a way, but do not recommend it.

As far as I know, they all are toxic. Do not advise ingesting them.

Good for bringing the bees and butterflies in.

tropicbreeze

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Re: Jatropa
« Reply #4 on: August 22, 2017, 05:04:20 AM »
It's called "Bellyache Bush" here and is considered toxic. Also a declared noxious weed. I've never heard of anyone eating any here but if it gets into where cattle are run there's problems. The cattle would try to eat the leaves and maybe that's the toxic part. I don't like it because I've spent a lot of time and effort trying to eradicate it.

huertasurbanas

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Re: Jatropa
« Reply #5 on: August 22, 2017, 07:11:52 AM »
I dont know, but it is true that non toxic exists:

" Francis, G., Oliver, J., Sujatha, M. 2013. Non-toxic jatropha plants as a potential multipurpose multi-use oilseed crop. Industrial Crops and Products 42: 397-401.
Jump up ^ Martínez-Herrera, J., Martínez Ayala, A., Makkar, H.P.S., Francis, G., Becker, K. 2010. Agroclimatic conditions, chemical and nutritional characterization of different provenances of Jatropha curcas L. from Mexico. Journal of Food Quality 35:152-158."

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jatropha_curcas#cite_note-14

shot

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Re: Jatropa
« Reply #6 on: August 22, 2017, 09:04:33 AM »
Reply #4 Jatropha gossypiifolia is Bellyache Bush.Jatropha curcas is bio diesel tree.

luc

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Re: Jatropa
« Reply #7 on: August 22, 2017, 03:23:24 PM »
Starting to flower now , if I like the flowers it can stay .
Luc Vleeracker
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achetadomestica

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Re: Jatropa
« Reply #8 on: August 22, 2017, 10:07:18 PM »
I ate one of mine last year and it was very good. I have always wanted to grow
nut trees and Florida is very limited. Another great thing about this tree is I planted it and have
never watered it. I put a ring of mulch around it and that's it.  It has a few nuts on it right now

https://www.hort.purdue.edu/newcrop/duke_energy/Jatropha_curcas.html#Toxicity

According to this roasting them makes them innocuous


huertasurbanas

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Re: Jatropa
« Reply #9 on: August 23, 2017, 05:38:07 PM »
"Toxicity

The poisoning is irritant, with acute abdominal pain and nausea about 1/2 hour following ingestion. Diarrhea and nausea continue but are not usually serious. Depression and collapse may occur, especially in children. Two seeds are strong purgative. Four to five seed are said to have caused death, but the roasted seed is said to be nearly innocuous. Bark, fruit, leaf, root, and wood are all reported to contain HCN (Watt and Breyer-Brandwijk, 1962). Seeds contain the dangerous toxalbumin curcin, rendering them potentially fatally toxic."

Caesar

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Re: Jatropa
« Reply #10 on: August 23, 2017, 08:15:43 PM »
Here's what I could find on Edible Jatropha curcas:

Topic previously discussed here: http://tropicalfruitforum.com/index.php?topic=21320.0

Agribusiness Links:

* http://jatrosolutions.com/products/productlines/ediblenut.html

* http://www.hardmanagribusiness.com/chuta-a-totonacan-snack-food/

* http://www.hardmanagribusiness.com/tag/jatropha/

Academic Links:

* https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s00217-016-2814-x

* https://link.springer.com/article/10.1023%2FA%3A1008054010079


From what I can tell, the non-toxic "Chuta" type seems edible even when raw (though I'd roast them). My personal opinion (no idea if it's rooted in reality, just erring on the side of caution), I would obtain and/or propagate it exclusively from cuttings of confirmed fully-edible non-toxic types. The risk of cross-pollination with toxic types seems like too much... Even if you got seeds from the right plant, if it was pollinated by a toxic type, the seedling could bear toxic nuts. And even if it wasn't pollinated by a toxic type, what do we know of its genetic inheritance? There may be some combination of recessive and dominant traits that could lead to a reversion in subsequent generations, leading to toxic nuts from non-toxic stock. This is all speculation on my part, but I personally would rather not risk it. I like the sound of this crop, and I personally intend to acquire it. But I'm only willing to get it as a cutting, from a tree whose owner eats the nuts on a regular basis. What better confirmation of it's lack of toxicity than a healthy consumer? Those are my two cents.

Aaron

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Re: Jatropa
« Reply #11 on: August 24, 2017, 03:41:13 PM »
I have a edible one (Though i havent tested it yet) and would like to know also.
How do you know it's edible?
I got one from a guy who got it from someone who called it a Florida pistachio.
Both of these people ate them in fact the original guy has been eating them for years
and his tree is huge  I got a tree and did a little research and found out
it is toxic? My tree hasn't produced allot but I did plant a seed and have a second one
growing. I guess they are perfect to give to the neighbor for now?

I got mine for H.e.a.r.t. apparently they have eaten them.  I would only grow them from cuttings to be on the safe side.

greenman62

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Re: Jatropa
« Reply #12 on: August 27, 2017, 08:54:01 AM »

 I would obtain and/or propagate it exclusively from cuttings of confirmed fully-edible non-toxic types. The risk of cross-pollination with toxic types seems like too much... Even if you got seeds from the right plant, if it was pollinated by a toxic type, the seedling could bear toxic nuts. And even if it wasn't pollinated by a toxic type, what do we know of its genetic inheritance? There may be some combination of recessive and dominant traits that could lead to a reversion in subsequent generations, leading to toxic nuts from non-toxic stock. This is all speculation on my part, but I personally would rather not risk it. I like the sound of this crop, and I personally intend to acquire it. But I'm only willing to get it as a cutting, from a tree whose owner eats the nuts on a regular basis. What better confirmation of it's lack of toxicity than a healthy consumer? Those are my two cents.

my thoughts exactly.
i would ONLY trust it from cuttings. (or air-layer etc...)

here is the video i had originally found on this...
i cut the video to start at the Jatropha
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pbbcqBVldX4#t=10m37s

The guy in the video is Josh Jamison he is the head of agricultural operations at H.E.A.R.T. in Lake whales.

Office: 863.638-1188
info@heartvillage.org

He mentions there is a variety of Jatropha that is edible
"selected form brought back from Mexico by Julia Morton"
https://www.wikiwand.com/en/Julia_Morton

Julia Morton is well known for her work with poison plants, as well as fruits for  S Fla.
(and other stuff... an amazing woman)
i use this website all the time to find out about growing conditions of certain plants...

Fruits of Warm Climates (1987)
https://hort.purdue.edu/newcrop/morton/index.html

SHe writes...
The poisoning is irritant, with acute abdominal pain and nausea about 1/2 hour following ingestion. Diarrhea and nausea continue but are not usually serious. Depression and collapse may occur, especially in children. Two seeds are strong purgative. Four to five seed are said to have caused death, but the roasted seed is said to be nearly innocuous. Bark, fruit, leaf, root, and wood are all reported to contain HCN (Watt and Breyer-Brandwijk, 1962). Seeds contain the dangerous toxalbumin curcin, rendering them potentially fatally toxic.
https://www.hort.purdue.edu/newcrop/duke_energy/Jatropha_curcas.html

Caesar

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Re: Jatropha
« Reply #13 on: September 18, 2018, 06:32:17 PM »
Well, 3 of the 4 cuttings sent to me by achetadomestica struck, and all 5 seeds sprouted as well, growing nice and strong.

The cuttings:




The seedlings:




As for the seedlings, I’m at a bit of a loss as to how to manage them (crop-wise). I know they come from a line of seed-grown Jatropha that have all turned out edible, but I’m still a little wary of eating their nuts when they start bearing. Logic tells me to just taste ‘em and stop eating if I get gastric trouble, but that only accounts for the phorbol esters. Curcin is the more dangerous toxin by far, but I couldn’t find much information on it out there. What are the symptoms of curcin poisoning? And what is the treatment? Can I just do the whole “eat 1 the first day, 2 the second, etc.” that I would usually do, or is that still capable of poisoning me if the nuts have curcin? Should I just trust that the seedling nuts will be okay and go hogwild eating them?

The edible ones should be edible in their raw state (and I think the parent tree is such), but some toxic types can be eaten roasted... does that take care of the curcin or just the phorbol esters?

I already have the cuttings of the confirmed-edible parent, and I can easily get more cuttings once those trees mature (so... perhaps I don’t need the seedlings?), but I kinda still wanna take care of the seedlings and use them as crops.

Anyone here got any advice?

Aaron

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Re: Jatropha
« Reply #14 on: September 19, 2018, 05:13:45 PM »
Well, 3 of the 4 cuttings sent to me by achetadomestica struck, and all 5 seeds sprouted as well, growing nice and strong.

The cuttings:




The seedlings:




As for the seedlings, I’m at a bit of a loss as to how to manage them (crop-wise). I know they come from a line of seed-grown Jatropha that have all turned out edible, but I’m still a little wary of eating their nuts when they start bearing. Logic tells me to just taste ‘em and stop eating if I get gastric trouble, but that only accounts for the phorbol esters. Curcin is the more dangerous toxin by far, but I couldn’t find much information on it out there. What are the symptoms of curcin poisoning? And what is the treatment? Can I just do the whole “eat 1 the first day, 2 the second, etc.” that I would usually do, or is that still capable of poisoning me if the nuts have curcin? Should I just trust that the seedling nuts will be okay and go hogwild eating them?

The edible ones should be edible in their raw state (and I think the parent tree is such), but some toxic types can be eaten roasted... does that take care of the curcin or just the phorbol esters?

I already have the cuttings of the confirmed-edible parent, and I can easily get more cuttings once those trees mature (so... perhaps I don’t need the seedlings?), but I kinda still wanna take care of the seedlings and use them as crops.

Anyone here got any advice?

I would only deal with cuttings.

achetadomestica

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Re: Jatropa
« Reply #15 on: September 19, 2018, 05:43:10 PM »
Originally the seeds came from a tree an old guy has. He has eaten the nuts for years.
My friend planted a seed and I got a tree from his seeds. My friend also ate the nuts.
My tree produced nuts and I ate the seeds and also planted one. Now I have a small tree
from the larger tree. That's 4 generations and no sign of toxicity? My small tree produced in
one year so it won't take long to figure it out. Also my friend's tree was constantly raided by
squirrels and they didn't disappear. I don't have squirrels in my yard someone shot them.


luc

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Re: Jatropa
« Reply #16 on: September 19, 2018, 06:07:51 PM »
Mike and all , my tree came from the Morelos area in Mexico , that is where they cultivate the edible variety and my Mexican wife has family there ...I never put it in the ground , is still in a 20 liter paint-bucket ...zero attention and this thing is still alive...it did flower but I never followed up so I have no idea if a single plant produces ?
Luc Vleeracker
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luc

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Re: Jatropa
« Reply #17 on: September 19, 2018, 06:10:23 PM »
As a matter of fact I never even ate one of my Akee....
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achetadomestica

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Re: Jatropa
« Reply #18 on: September 19, 2018, 08:34:36 PM »
The old guy and my friend both had single trees and they produced.
I have never watered mine or fertilized them and they do fine. My friend
watered his tree and it was getting very large but he moved.


When I ate the seeds it reminds me of a large sunflower seed. Very tasty!

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Re: Jatropa
« Reply #19 on: September 23, 2018, 04:10:26 PM »
I’ll err on the side of caution then, and stick to the cuttings. I’ll still keep the seedlings in pots though... maybe if I can find an able laboratory, I can test their seeds later.

I planted the most vigorous cutting, and kept the other two in pots, to be planted later. Here’s the planted one:



Caesar

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Re: Jatropa
« Reply #20 on: October 17, 2018, 06:43:57 PM »
The cutting in the ground is growing in nicely. I planted some Dianella congesta around it.



achetadomestica

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Re: Jatropa
« Reply #21 on: October 17, 2018, 07:44:29 PM »
In Florida my trees lose their leaves when the daylight gets short.
They seem to emerge from their dormancy late in the Spring.

pineislander

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Re: Jatropa
« Reply #22 on: October 17, 2018, 08:32:49 PM »
As a matter of fact I never even ate one of my Akee....
That brings to mind something I noticed recently. My neighbor has a big old Akee tree and I keep watching for ripe fruit, it doesn't bear heavily but there are often a few on the tree. I do find that squirrels are carrying the red but unripe fruit to a lower crotch in the tree and are opening them and eating the arils but not any of the seeds. I understand that eating akee that way is very bad for humans. So, don't necessarily use edibility by squirrels as a sign of human edibility.

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Re: Jatropa
« Reply #23 on: October 19, 2018, 11:08:50 AM »
achetadomestica
if you have any extra seeds let me know
(i can purchase)

if i ever do grow a tree, i would probably send seeds in for testing first.
this way also, i can propagate cuttings to trade etc.
it would be nice if rare-fruiters had more than 1 source.

or, if anyone has cuttings i would be interested.


achetadomestica

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Re: Jatropa
« Reply #24 on: October 19, 2018, 04:37:54 PM »
achetadomestica
if you have any extra seeds let me know
(i can purchase)

if i ever do grow a tree, i would probably send seeds in for testing first.
this way also, i can propagate cuttings to trade etc.
it would be nice if rare-fruiters had more than 1 source.

or, if anyone has cuttings i would be interested.

I checked for someone else yesterday and the seeds are done for the year.
I had noticed a couple late clusters of nuts and when I checked I found the
seeds at the bottom and they looked dry. I ate the last 5 seeds and it's kind of weird the
way your mind plays tricks on you, but I had no ill effects. The seeds are done till next
July but if you want a couple cuttings Pm me maybe trade for a couple mulberry cuttings?