The Tropical Fruit Forum
Citrus => Citrus General Discussion => Topic started by: brian on January 18, 2017, 01:20:13 PM
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I've accumulated pretty much every kumquat and hybrid that I can find. Here's my impressions so far...
Nagami (Nordmann Seedless) - excellent taste. Sometimes a slight soapy taste if not 100% ripe, somewhat astringent also
Nagami - excellent taste but has seeds. More sour than nordmann because its fatter and so has more juice. Sometimes a slight soapy taste if not 100% ripe, somewhat astringent also
Marumi - excellent taste, some seeds
Meiwa - excellent taste, some seeds. Less sour than other kumquats because it has more flesh than juice
Fukushu/Changshau - my personal favorite. Initially mine were about the same size as marumi/meiwa and nearly seedless. More recent crops have been much larger, about the size of a golf ball, and with significantly more seeds. The smaller ones were better in my opinion. I'm hoping that limiting pollination or using giberellic acid would help reduce seed count and also fruit size.
Hong Kong - not really edible because of tiny fruit size, no juice, all seeds. I did eat a bit of the flesh on one and it is somewhat sweet but this is a pure oranamental & breeding parent
Indio Mandarinquat - poor taste for two years in a row. Skin is thin and dry, not enough sweetness to offset sour juice. Off taste similar to Rangpur but less spicy.
Centennial Variegated - poor taste for me on my first crop. Similar to Indio Mandarinquat. Thin is skin and dry, not enough sweetness to offset sour juice. Off taste similar to Rangpur but less spicy. This variety supposedly has a reputation for good taste so I'm hoping it will improve next year but I don't expect the character to change.
Nippon Orangequat - decent but somewhat bland taste. Skin is thick and bland, whole fruit is a bit sloppy as the flesh is soft and juicy. Not worthwhile in my opinion because skin is not sweet like more common kumquats, size is as large as a navel orange, taste inferior to navel orange, and has seeds. You'd be better off with another kumquat or a sweet orange.
"Excalibur" Red Lime - UCR mentions likely Kumquat/Rangpur hybrid. This one was a surprise to me. I couldn't locate one forever and ended up trading with Lorewren on this forum who lives nearby to me. I've been eating the first crop over the past four months and they keep getting better the longer they hang on the tree. They are now dark orange and about the size of a Clementine. They taste quite good, like what I was expecting from Nippon Orangequat. The skin is sweet and relatively thick. When first turning orange 3mo ago they were sour but now they are sweeter and I eat them out of hand. There is a bit of the Rangpur taste but not strong. Seedy, though.
Lakeland Limequat - typical lime flavor. Thin rind that was rather dry and not at all sweet. Few seeds. I wouldn't recommend over a Bearss lime unless you need the cold hardiness.
Sunquat - bright yellow like a meyer lemon, and tasted similar. Thin skin, not sweet but not too dry. Much sweeter than a true lemon. Again, if you need a lemon I'd stick with a real one, but the Sunquat fruit is very attractive looking as it's perfectly round and bright yellow. I'm thinking I will keep this as an ornamental. (RyanL - you called it)
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Limequat amd lemonquats are also very good in my opinion. Last year I left the centennial kumquat fruit on the tree to early February and they were very good. This year I had to harvest them early January due to a 20 degree night and they are still sour.
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I have 2 nagamis planted in the ground and one on the balcony. All of them have one thing in common: they are slow growing citrus.
I love them anyway.
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Thanks for the recap. I have the Nagami and always wondered if there were better variety. I like Nagami. Mostly grow it as an ornamental and novelty fruit.
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My centennials still have a slight striping and are not as dark orange as my other ripe kumquats, yet they come off the tree with only the slightest effort and sometimes drop on their own. Maybe the tree is struggling and trying to shed fruit rather that mature it fully
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here is one in local bar loaded with fruits.
(https://s26.postimg.cc/urr9q6suh/IMG_20161201_160310_1.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/image/bzfemlwg5/)image hosting no sign up (https://postimage.org/)
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Brian, Very accurate description. I share your opinion of nippon, Indio and nagami. However I dont find fukushu to be very good, the only one I still have is meiwa, the best kumquat, in my opinion. I did have a sunquat, I think you will find them in the same arena as indio and nippon, more of an ornamental. One application though is for cooking and candying.
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I feel that meiwa, marumi, nagami, and fukushu are all a cut above the rest and personal preference makes the final call.
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Wow, that Crotia tree is loaded! What is that yellow piece of paper in the tree with holes?
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It is a glue trap for insects. The black spots are insects, not holes.
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Interesting. Looks like it works! But, why? fruit fly?
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Yes, all kinds of insects. Fruit flays, CLM...
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Centennial Kumquat when is ripe looks like in the picture below and the taste is excellent. Meiwa is one of my favorite too. The Red lime is a disappointment for me.
(http://i.imgur.com/XKh7SFW.jpg?1)
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The centennial in the picture looks nicer than the ones on my current crop. Hoping it improves next year. My first crop of Meiwa was very poor, but subsequent ones have been great.
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I had some ripe Lakeland Limequats and a Sunquat today for the first time.
The lakeland had typical lime flavor. Thin rind that was rather dry and not at all sweet. Few seeds. I wouldn't recommend over a Bearss lime unless you need the cold hardiness.
Sunquat was bright yellow like a meyer lemon, and tasted similar. Much sweeter than a true lemon. Again, if you need a lemon I'd stick with a real one, but the Sunquat fruit is very attractive looking as it's perfectly round and bright yellow. I'm thinking I will keep this as an ornamental. (RyanL - you called it)
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I dont know if there is a difference between a sunquat and a lemonquat, but I am a big fan of the lemonquat. It is my favorite lemon by far, even over a store bought lemonade lemon.
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Its kumquat season again for me. Not much has changed. I still think the Indio Mardarinquats and Centennial variegated are far inferior to the nagami/marumi/meiwa types. The nordman nagamis and fukushu are still great. I didn't get much marumi or meiwa as the trees have been unhealthy. Hopefully they'll bounce back soon.
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I've been picking a lot of Fukushu kumquats. Great tasting as a snack food. I originally purchased the cultivar due to a suggestion from Brian.
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As my changshou/fukushu has matured (it is now 4 years in the ground) it has gotten better and better. I have a very fecund meiwa that is 20+ years old I almost ignore due to the fukushu. And meiwa is pretty darn good, let me tell you. The meiwa is most excellent in salads. I didn't do marmalade this year so jury is still out for which variety makes the best jam.
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Does Ichangquat count as a kumquat variety?
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I've never heard of a Ichangquat, and I'd be interested in sampling one, but my experience so far with kumquats is that only fukushu, nagami, meiwa, and marumi are worthwhile unless you are specifically looking for extra cold-hardiness and are willing to compromise on taste/seedlessness.
I believe a seedless fukushu would be the best fruit around. Nordmann is great but nagamis have a very slight off taste that doesn't appear in fukushu, meiwa, marumi.
Btw, cut up kumquats in vanilla ice cream is amazing.
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I had my first fruit from my lakeland limequat tree (record buck cutting) and I have to say it is better than any store bought key lime that I have had. My eustis limequat makes huge fruit (for what it is) about the size of a bearss lime but the peel is thicker and the peel has a kumquat-ish smell--the taste of the fruit is lime-ish. The eustis is on volkemer lemon rootstock which would explain the larger fruit. The lakeland limequat is slightly smaller than a golf ball and has a thin peel which does not have any kumquat smell to it more of a tropical lime. It was starting to turn slightly yellow. I cannot compare it to any homegrown key lime but if you have a choice between a homegrown lakeland limequat or a store bought key lime, the lakeland limequat wins hands down. I was not expecting it to be this good due to having a few years worth of eustis limequat harvests; the eustis is not a bad fruit but is substantially inferior to the lakeland limequat.
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Thanks for the reminder, I think my lakeland has some fruit that may be ripe by now. I have to find it in the greenhouse jungle.
I have a huge crop of nordmann nagamis I have been eating for weeks, calomondins, “excalibur” hybrids, and a bunch of Fukushu and centennial ripening
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Most of mine are still green. The best centennial i had was in February after it had some time to sweeten up on the tree.
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I have a grafted changshou/fukushu about 2ft tall. I hope to get some fruit soon. How hardy are kumquats?
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In-ground kumquats are supposed to be hardy to the teens. Container tres and young plants are supposed to be far less hardy, maybe damaged in 20s?
I have never tested mine, they are greenhoused when it goes below 40F.
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If I did not bank my citrus I would have lost nearly all if my kumquats other than the meiwa when we had several nights near 16 degrees. My centennial, eustis, and lemonquat were decapitated above the soil bank.
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I got over a gallon of fruit this year from a single kumquat tree that is under 3ft tall (4-5ft including roots & pot). Keeping them in containers and moving inside for winter should be a good solution for them.
This is after I had already picked some of the fruit:
(https://i.imgur.com/DHsyWvz.jpg)
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brian, your the kumquat king on this board. You have just about all varieties of kumquat. The tree in the above photo is a nice cared for tree.
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Countryboy, thank you for your very exciting taste report. Did you eat the fruit fresh out of hand or did you juice it?
My limequat Lakeland bears the first time. I am not sure, when to harvest and how to use it.
(https://i.postimg.cc/LhyNt32s/lakeland.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/LhyNt32s)
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I have been cutting them into wedges and using them in water, tea, and beer. The ones I have picked thus far have been getting spots of yellow on them, not near fully ripe. My favorite lime other than red lime which doesnt have real lime flavor.
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I have another crop of centennial variegated kumquats becoming ripe. Again, they are pretty terrible - thin dry skin, very sour, rangpur-like bitterness. These taste identical to the indio mandarinquats (that I dislike the same)... same taste and texture simply striped with a rounder shape than indio.
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Also Fukushus are ripening. The largest ones are golf ball sized. I prefer them smaller, easier to eat whole. This one only had three seeds, not bad, I've seen from zero to 6+.
Taste is very good, not quite as flavorful as last two years' crops. This one is somewhat yellow still, I'll let them ripen longer.
EDIT - this is actually Marumi kumquat, not Fukushu, they are so similar I didn't notice it was the wrong tree
(https://i.imgur.com/WeYzWV2.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/OUonYGQ.jpg)
"excalibur" "red limes" have been orange for some time, but they get darker orange and sweeter the longer they hang on the tree. Once dark orange like this they are edible out of hand. Not as good as fukushu/meiwa/marumi, but much better than indio/centennial. They are about halfway in between.
(https://i.imgur.com/okiPkPk.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/AUbG5Ys.jpg)
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I enjoyed the Centennial my wife and I planted, so can't wait to try these other varieties! That red lime is beautiful!! Edible peel?
Do you eat your lakeland limequat peel and all? Same question regarding Calomondin?
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Yes red lime peel is edible, with good texture. Slightly sweet but not as much as "true" kumquats.
Lakeland peel is noticeably sweet and edible, you can eat them whole if you take the seeds out, but the inside is still very sour it overwhelms the sweet peel.
Calomondins I always eat the peel. The peel has no flavor but is very soft unlike the dry skin ones of centennial, indio, and some others. Calomondin is easily peelable and segments separatable exactly like a miniature mandarin. If it wasn't extremely sour and seedy I could see it being very popular with children. When they become very ripe they are decent to eat out of hand but still very sour. I keep them around because my 2yo daughter loves picking them.
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Yes red lime peel is edible, with good texture. Slightly sweet but not as much as "true" kumquats.
Lakeland peel is noticeably sweet and edible, you can eat them whole if you take the seeds out, but the inside is still very sour it overwhelms the sweet peel.
Calomondins I always eat the peel. The peel has no flavor but is very soft unlike the dry skin ones of centennial, indio, and some others. Calomondin is easily peelable and segments separatable exactly like a miniature mandarin. If it wasn't extremely sour and seedy I could see it being very popular with children. When they become very ripe they are decent to eat out of hand but still very sour. I keep them around because my 2yo daughter loves picking them.
Great to know, I can't wait to get my hands on one of those red limes, have a rangpur but definitely need that. I'll have to check excalibur next time I make it there.
Love how the calomondin segements like a mandarin! Wish there was more sweetness there but I'm going to try making a juice, don't mind super sour when I'm not having to chew it up for a minute. I eat lemons and limes out of hand all the time haha.
I'll have to see if I notice some sweetness on my limequat peels I just picked.
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Just hand squeezed a lemonquat and it tastes similar to lemonade.
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Here's some of the centennials. After leaving them on the tree a while longer the red stripes become more prominent and the flesh/juice taste is a little better, but the skin still tastes poor
(https://i.imgur.com/HPaZLVw.jpg?1)
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My centenniala are about 1.5 times that size. They dont seem to really sweeten up until late December.
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Its the combination of flavors of the flesh and peel that makes kumquats so good to eat. Seems like juicing them would be a waste of the fruit.
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I think some kumquat hybrids are intended for marginal areas where their extra cold hardiness makes them viable where true lemons or limes cannot survive outdoors. For limequats, there is the added benefit of year round fruiting.
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I ate a fee more centennials from my tree today. After ripening far longer than I thought they would hold on the tree they are actually decent to eat. The bitterness is gone, though the skin is still papery
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Brian,
Thank you for updating. I think I am personally most interested in kumquats myself of all citrus. My sunquat, you helped me with on my other post, is finally arriving from harris citrus this thursday. I now have 4 different varieties; Hong Kong, a very young grafted Nagami (I was impatient to let my rootstock grow), soon to be sunquat, and this spring on backorder is a meiwa (I may cancel and wait on harris updating their shop for one). Meiwa is the only one I have tried so far, and WOW, I LOVE the sweet flavor and crunch it has. Like crisp salad only, you know, has flavor.
I'm interested in mandarins, but I am container only and I want things that flower profusely. Do mandarinquats carry this from kumquats? I also am having a hard time finding any online to purchase. Would you ever in the spring (or whenever you prune) consider selling any budwood of your varieties to Wisconsin? (unless in quarantine of course) I have very recently finally taught myself how to graft.
Also, the red lime seems very interesting! That is a kumquat variety? You eat the entire fruit whole, minus seeds?
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Frank I highly reccomend you try fukushu/changshou or marumi (they are very similar), and nordmann seedless nagami as it is otherwise identical to nagami but seedless. These are my favorite types. Meiwa can be quite good also but I have only had a few of the fruit.
The mandarinquat and orangequat are pretty bad in comparison. The thing is, the “regular” kumquats nagami, meiwa, marumi, fukushu are already flavored like orange/mandarin, these hybrids don’t add anything in my opinion, and I think they are worse in every way. Orangequat is like a full size bland seedy orange, and mandarinquat tastes like rangpur lime - sour/orange with a bitter taste. Ill send you some fruit next crop i get if you want to try them, and/or budwood.
If you want something that is truly half mandarin half kumquat try a calomondin! They look exactly like mini mandarins, are easily peeled and segmented like mandarins, and have edible thin skin. They are simply too sour for most people. I eat them sometimes.
Red lime is neat because it is extremely vivid dark-orange to almost magenta colored, and is decent to eat.
Every kumquat and hybrid are prolific at flowering and fruiting. If you have grafted trees you will almost certainly get fruit in the first year or two
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Brian, good post, very descriptive.
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I would love to try some whenever possible! The reason I had never tried to obtain fukushu or marumi is that I was told they were very sour. Again the only kumquats that I have tried are meiwa, which are AMAZING, I honestly prefer them over any orange. I had forgotten that calomondin was a kumquat cross! I have several of those, currently rooting cuttings. I personally am not a fan of calomondin straight up, it is way too sour for me haha. I love the juice with sugar though. I am a fan of sweet fruit.
Also, I will probably stay away from the Mandarinquat then.. I am all for ornamental value of the crop but since I've tasted meiwa, my interests have slightly changed haha.
Red lime sounds really cool, I've never heard of that type of red lime! Those are kumquat hybrids?
Prolific blooming is a very exciting feature for me, so my hope is I will eventually collect them all!
My grafted nagami is only 3" tall, so It will be a while before I try fruit from that guy. I am very excited for my trees to arrive, although it may be awhile still before fruit, I am excited for the opportunity.
Let me know if you will be trimming soon or whatever crop is available! I will be more than happy to compensate for your time and being so generous! Thank you for your knowledge, it truly does aid me in what varieties I want to look at next as there isn't much online elsewhere about many of these plants.
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PM me your address Ill mail you some fruits. I have fukushu, marumi, centennial, red lime, sunquat, and limequats ripe now. More than I can eat
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Oh wow, awesome! Thank you! I pm’d. I was about to purchase a limequat but figured it would be too sour for my liking. I really appreciate that, it will depict which varieties I shall get next.
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I *still* have a ton of centennial kumquats hanging on the tree from the crop months ago, and they haven't deteriorated at all. I eat them every once in a while. The bitter flavor is gone now, their are decent enough for being the only tree with edible fruit right now.
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My Meiwa kumquat has so many fruits there is no way I can ever eat all of them. I do notice that the Meiwa's peel is loosing some of its sweetness the longer the fruit hangs.
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Yes, I have noticed the same with marumi and fukushu. If they hang for too long the peel becomes bland and soft/wrinkled. So far I have been able to eat nearly all of them, though. Next year there will be too many.