Mulch problem - need your help

[minh]

Hello fellow fruit growers,  I'm a long time lurker on this forum.  I need your help with my mulch problem.  Here is a short summary.

We live in Cerritos, CA where the city operates like one huge HOA.  What makes the situation worse is we have two neighbors that keep on complaining about our property to the city for having too much mulch.  Today, the city enforcement inspector came to my house and posted up a "Notice Of Public Hearing" on my yard.  Basically, the hearing is being convened because I failed to remedy the mulch and/or weeds and debris from my yard.

I have attached a few photos of my yard.  I mainly grow fruit trees and have about 20+ trees in my yard (longan, lychee, jaboticaba, cherimoyas, atemoya, avocado, wax jambu, guava, dragonfruit, starfruit, caimito, ...etc).

About every 6-12 months, i would get a truck load of mulch from the local arborists and spread it through out my yard.

Does anyone have any experience with public hearings or what to expect?  The enforcement officer said my mulch has not been approved.  What's the best way to convince them otherwise or is this a lost cause?

I would appreciate any feedback. 

Thansk,
Minh

[behlgarden]

from my understanding City can only dictate mulch type for the parkway area only, the strip between curb and your sidewalk. All other areas do not require any approvals in any city as its your property. If you have HOA, you better read their requirements as those HOA folks are sneaky bastards.

In Public hearing, you will hear complaints from your neighbors, and City will talk about notices issued and why you have not taken any action.

You need to go prepared to:
1. Fight, in this case you need to cite city requirements on mulch, what is specified if that, where is requirement coming from, and if HOA has any limits. It would help if you can have an expert weigh in on benefits vs. complaints sheet comparison.
2. You surrender and remove. this would be devastating.

The one problem I see is that you have been putting so much mulch piling on that its making a mess on sidewalks and road and creating unsightly conditions, If my neighbor did what you did, I would be pissed too.

Do your homework. Go to the City that handles parks and recreation or public works. Ask them for city requirements on Mulch and where that requirements apply. Then you see if your mulch is within the guideline. Mulch is a mulch, but too thick layer that blows off with wind and makes a mess is your problem I believe.

[Cookie Monster]

What section of municipal code are they citing? https://www.codepublishing.com/CA/Cerritos/

This is the reason why I've chosen to live in a blue-collar neighborhood.. even though I've paid off the mortgage and could easily "upgrade." It seems that there is a positive correlation between picky / finicky neighbors and median household income (or alternately median household wealth).

I asked my HOA if it would be OK to mulch over the entire back yard. The response I got was "we need to consult our attorney." I just went ahead and did it anyway. That was 12 years ago.

At any rate, cities only tend to be concerned with mulching the front yard. Backyard shouldn't be an issue. What's odd is that a Leftist California city would prefer grass over mulch -- in an area known for its water shortages and where environmental issues as mundane as cow flatulation are regulated by state law.

[minh]

@ behlgarden : When I took the pictures, it was after I pulled some of the debris from the parkway onto the street.  Since then, I have removed the mess.  My parkway/sidewalk is always clean since my gardener comes every week to do the mowing and cleaning.  I will need to do some research on what is the expected mulch that they require.  The enforcement officer said the mulch could be 24" high but I'm nowhere near that limit.  He did mention that the mulch was the wrong type and covers too much of my backyard area.

@ Cookie Monster : The letter said my property was found to constitute a property nuisance as defined in Chapter 6.20 PROPERTY MAINTENANCE of the Cerritos Municipal Code.  I used to have grass on the parkway but changed to drough tolerate plants to save water.  It's unfortunate that my property is at the end of a cul-de-sac where my backyard is actually my sideyard, exposed to street view.

Maybe in 20 years, I can retire to somewhere peaceful.

Thanks for the advice.  It looks like I have a lot of homework to do.

[FruitFreak]

Become very familiar with zoning for your property, local ordinances and CA statutes. 

In Florida we have what is known as "The Right to Farm Act" which offers a plethora of protections. "Florida adopted right-to-farm legislation curtailing the rights of neighboring landowners to bring nuisance suits to prohibit certain farming operations. The Florida Right to Farm Act also limits local governments from imposing regulations on farming operations"  You definitely have enough fruit trees planted out to qualify for some sort of Ag classification too.  Last month Florida also passed legislation protecting the rights of property owners to grow gardens in their front yards which was a HUGE win.  I've dealt with backstabbing neighbors in deed restrictive communities and it was a PITA.

Although these are examples of FL laws, CA may have similar legislation in place.  Your best bet is to start researching within the Dept of Agriculture. 

Do what you can to satisfy the code violation first AND DOCUMENT, set up LLC to "legitimize" your landscape, obtain a local business license, obtain a USDA farm license (if possible), request an alternate date for hearing (delay if possible).  Remember any correspondence with the local/state governments should be in writing.  Sorry your going through this.  Is some type of fencing an option?

[Cookie Monster]

I don't think a right to farm act would help this individual. Had his farm been established prior to the urbanization of the neighborhood, then it would definitely be protected (under FL law at least). But establishing a new farm in a residential area is going to be an issue. A lot of cities specifically prohibit the conducting of commercial businesses in a residential area. In the case of Florida, one even forfeits their right to homestead protection if the home is used to conduct business.

OP should attend the hearing and try to work out a compromise. They are very likely going to want some trees to be removed and the mulching to be curtailed to some degree. But trying to defy them is going to be an uphill battle. If the situation is not addressed, they will ultimately place a lien against the property, at which point lawyers will need to get involved... a messy situation.

Alternately, OP could consider fencing in the property?

Here's the section of code that they are probably referencing:

"(2) The condition of the property is unsightly in appearance and is out of harmony or conformity with the maintenance standards of adjacent properties so as to cause a substantial diminution of the enjoyment, use or property values of such adjacent properties;"

[WaterFowler]

[WaterFowler]

Just out of curiosity. What was your reaction to the neighbor's complaints when they approached you before they went to the city? Did you tell them to go fly a kite? Or did they just go directly to the city to complain?

It's going to look pretty cool once the trees are big, like mini forest in the neighborhood but it does look kind of junky atm with all the mulch you can see in between them.

Alternately, OP could consider fencing in the property?

Very good point

[minh]

@WaterFowler : My neighbors complain directly to the city.  I asked the enforcement officer how many people complained about my yard.  He said two people.  Everyone in our neighborhood doesn't get along with the same two neighbors.  I heard from my other neighbors that something happened 30 years ago and they don't get along anymore.  When I first moved in 11 years ago, it was ok.  However, when an inspector came out to check my solar panel installs, he noticed my next door neighbor had illegally installed a solar pool heater on his roof.  My neighbor ended up ripping out his solar pool heater and that was when our relationship turned sour.  Shrug.

@Cookie Monster : With a fence, i would lose too much of my yard space.  That is the reason why I planted a mango hedge instead.  I will let the mango grow out more to cover the mulch on the ground.

I spoke with city planning today about the parkway.  They told me to put more plants in and to submit new drawings to denote the spacing between each plant. 

She briefly mentioned about the mulch and I explained to her that it is used to surpress weeds and to reduce my water usage.  So the mulch really didn't bother her, just not enough plants to cover the parkway.

She raised a new issue with my raised garden out in front.  She said it cannot be made of wood but needs to be something like bricks or stones.  She said I might be able to paint it to look brick-like or do a faux brick covering over the wood.  However, it is up to the enforcement office discretion.

Once I'm done with the parkway, I will need to speak with the landscape planning division to see if the mulch on my property is compliant.  This is to check if the ratio of mulch to ground cover is correct.  Oh, dang.

The city planner was pretty nice and accommodating.  The saga continues.

[gnappi]

When I moved into Coral Springs (So. Flo.) I asked the code folks if there were codes making grass in the back yard mandatory. They asked what I intended to do and I said I was going to grind up the grass, plow it under and mulch. That was 11 years ago.

OTOH, in FRONT I've been cited for not having ENOUGH mulch. They are worse than an HOA :-) But they don't care if it's natural, or comes from home depot.

Get your city regs read them and comply. You may need more grass, less mulch, but I have a hard time believing that they MUST approve the mulch.

At any rate, I called an attorney and he said their firm gets a LOT of complaints about code enforcement and there is absolutely nothing you can do about it. Go to the meeting and promise to comply.

[spaugh]

your yard looks fine, those neighbors need to get a life. 

[Cookie Monster]

I think City of Tamarac changed their code since I last looked. They used to have a calculation that described the amount of nonliving ground cover permitted based on tree size. Now it reads as follows:

"All lot areas not covered by driveways, or other paved areas or structures shall be planted with lawn grass, ground cover or other appropriate landscape materials, free of weeds. Lawns shall be neatly maintained at a height of four (4) inches or less."

And they define landscape materials as

"Landscape material means any of the following, or a combination thereof, including, but not limited to, grass, ground cover, shrubs, vines, hedges, trees or palms and other materials such as rocks, pebbles, sand, mulch; but not including paving."

Victory for the Tamarac mulchers?

[minh]

Jeff, you win.

I read the cerritos design manual but I don't see how they define the different types of mulch.  So my violation is the ratio of orgain living material (80%) with non-organic material (20%).  So now the question is, how do they measure it?  I hope they will use the tree drip line as the way to measure the square footage of living material.

http://www.cerritos.us/RESIDENTS/_pdfs/residential_front_yard_landscape_design_manual.pdf

Mulch should be replaced upon completion of the first year from installation. Mulch should also be
replaced or refreshed as needed to maintain the desired thickness to control weed growth,
eliminate soil erosion, and minimize moisture evaporation from the soil.

The text below doesn't include "mulch" but I hope it fits the definition of "earth mounds"

“Landscaping” means the installation and maintenance of some combination of organic plant
material which include trees, shrubs, vines, ground covers, annuals, perennials and lawns; and in
addition, the combination or design may include non-organic plant material, earth mounds, and
other acceptable ornamental horticultural features. Structural features may include but are not
limited to fountains, walkways, arbors, walls, fences and benches. Landscape design
accessories such as decorative bark, volcanic rock, decomposed aggregate, pea gravel, or
similar non-organic material can be used to accent the organic plant material but not as the
predominant landscape feature. The use of materials such as silk plants, plastic trees, and
shrubs is prohibited. "

[pineislander]

Most city folk are accustomed to grass, pure green uniform clipped off grass. They see a forest floor as being covered with trash. They don't recognize the mulch you are using as ordinary mulch because it isn't uniform it has variations, some fragments are large, some leaves, some grass. If you could top it off with a uniform material it would become more acceptable to most people

I doubt that it will ever be acceptable to people just out to spite you. They will try to work their evil no matter what you do, there is no satifaction for them, they are miserable and want to share it. Good luck to you I think your place looks very nice.

[arc310]

just visually speaking..what if you put some like borders around the mulch circles. maybe could make it look "cleaner" and your neighbors might not complain.

you're brave to plant so many trees out front. i've been hesitant about any fruit trees in the front cause it would suck to watch them grow and someone takes them.

[behlgarden]

I have a huge side yard at the end of cul de sec too. I had metal fence, for privacy reasons I put in tall hedge and now inside hedge I got fruit orchard. Another frost side yard is huge orchard but have no HOA and it looks like a tropical jungle there.

[Seanny]

Those mulch look like trash.
I used to mulch my banana plants in the side yard. I got tired of the trashy look from walking on the sidewalk so I removed it.

[behlgarden]

one thing you could do is blend in few California native low water succulents or cactus plants in open spaces, it will really give great appeal to your neighbors and it it looks great too.

[minh]

@Seanny : I agree with you.  The last load of mulch that I received from the local arborist had more eucalypus leaves than actual bark.  I think the city considers only bark as mulch but not the shredded leaves mixed in.

@behlgarden : You and my wife have the same idea.  For the parkway, we are planning to use succulents to fill in the gaps.

My pickering mango hedge is slow growing.  They would rather flower to death than to sprout new leaves.  I think once it grows out, it will fill in the gaps nicely.  However, in the meantime, I will rake in the mulch and probably put down a paver path to make it look neater.

Here is my yard from google maps about 4 years ago.  It was mostly covered in grass and about $200 dollars in water bill.  Now, its cut in half.  Maybe I need to commit myself to the 12-step Tropical Fruit Anonymous.

[behlgarden]

Another idea is to throw in 3-4 big boulders between sidesknand side yard if city allows. Make it look like a desert

[sahai1]

On my farm I dig 3 feet wide by 6-8' feet deep pits and fill with homemade mulch, and cover the top with a mound like burying a dead body, eventually it becomes level with the surrounding area.  These become premium planting sites after a year, and also help break up the water locked stratum in my soil that exists at about 3'.  But also tap into ground water which is sucked up by the mulch.  The trees then send their roots towards the pits for a supply of water and nutrients.  This is extremely time intensive way of dealing with leaves, twigs, mulch, etc... but I think it will be rewarding long term.  It definitely has helped reduce the amount of beetles.

Maybe you should try burying some of your mulch.

[minh]

@ sahai1 : You have to have heavy machinery to get to that deep.  I'm jealous.  I do bury some of my mulch, but not to the extent of it being 6-8 feet deep.  Mine is usually a shallow trench, enough to cover the branches after my yearly pruning.

Today, the city planner approved my parkway design including the mulch.  She said it must be clean looking, that is, the mulch should not spread to the sidewalk or the street.  However, when I took the approved plan to the code enforcement officer and showed it to him, he said mulch cannot include dead leaves.  Dead leaves equal dead vegetation and you cannot have dead vegetation visible for public view.  I think mulch as defined by him is a bag of mulch that you get from the big box store. 

[Cookie Monster]

That doesn't sound right. I don't see any references to your city code defining mulch. You may want to politely ask him for the reference from municipal code that defines mulch as such.

Moreover, most cities encourage tree trimmer mulch, as it diverts waste from landfills. For example, here's what the city of Long Beach has to say on the subject:

Every year the City of Long Beach produces an average of 12,000 tons of green waste from standard tree trimming maintenance. The City works to keep this resource from going to landfills by placing mulch on vacant property owned by the City. Every year, Operation Mulch-A-Lot places 6,000 tons of mulch on vacant City lots, with an additional 600 tons annually being delivered to Long Beach residents through our Mulch Delivery Program.

Mulch from City tree trimming operations offers a number of landscaping advantages including weed reduction, added nutrients, soil temperature moderation, water retention, improved soil structure, beautification, and improved root systems. We recommend the mulch be used as ground cover, at least 2" thick (4" if being used for weed reduction). After about 12-18 months, the mulch will become a fine, compost material that can then be worked into the soil.

http://www.longbeach.gov/sustainability/programs/mulch-delivery-and-pickup/

Today, the city planner approved my parkway design including the mulch.  She said it must be clean looking, that is, the mulch should not spread to the sidewalk or the street.  However, when I took the approved plan to the code enforcement officer and showed it to him, he said mulch cannot include dead leaves.  Dead leaves equal dead vegetation and you cannot have dead vegetation visible for public view.  I think mulch as defined by him is a bag of mulch that you get from the big box store.

[Seanny]

That 4 year old picture looks pretty!

Would they let you build raised borders around each tree?
If the mulch stay in those confined spaces they would better than in mounds.

[sahai1]

@ sahai1 : You have to have heavy machinery to get to that deep.  I'm jealous.  I do bury some of my mulch, but not to the extent of it being 6-8 feet deep.  Mine is usually a shallow trench, enough to cover the branches after my yearly pruning.

I dig by hand with a shovel and a large prybar.  I've gotten quite good at doing by hand.  By quite good I mean it takes about 4 hours. I don't go past 6-8 feet because difficult to get dirt out because of water, plus I'm only 6'4 tall. Just have to have patience and sometimes need a helping hand for obstacles like in the picture.  But all the reason why these holes help me to improve soil conditions.



Here is a very large one, which is actually 3 near each other, filled with chopped banana trees.  Not pictured here, but now 2 months later it is almost level.