Author Topic: RootMaker RootBuilder 2 / II Expandable Container for Side-Yard Avocado Project  (Read 29931 times)

z_willus_d

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Hi Kris, sure I do.  I've been babying them all season, though they really didn't set any viable fruit this round.  But as is the usual, the trees look best about this time of year before the cold snaps hit.  I'll aim to take some pictures of the five RootBuilder bound trees to show their progress.  Their size is impressive, on most (ignoring the weeping Holiday).  How are your trees fairing?

zephian

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I've lost most of my trees. Only one that is pushing growth is my stewart. Mexicola looked good for most of the summer then just roasted that last 100+ heatwave we had. Hopefully my guava and papayas will help shade that area next year but I'm probably only going to replace one plant, I'm a lazy gardener...
-Kris

z_willus_d

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I'm sorry to hear about your losses.  That's a real bummer.  It's usual the cold that gets them not the heat.  I thought you were going to use Surround or something like that to protect the plants?  I still have a bunch if you want some.  Here's an updated set of pics from this morning (10/3/2019).  I recently top-dressed everything with worm-castings from my warm farm (mainly fed coffee-grinds).

Pinkerton (gets the most sunlight):


Sir Prize:


Holiday, drooping as always:


Stewart:


Lamb-Hass (the best looking of the bunch):


Lamb-Hass Close-up:


Holiday Close-up:


z_willus_d

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I also figure I might as well post updated pics of the three Avocado trees I transplanted to the front yard earlier (either this year or late last -- somehow I can't recall).  They had a hard go early on, but they've recovered well through the summer.  I hope they can weather the winter and come through next Spring to set (and hold) a lot of fruit.  Each tree has fruited a bit previously while in pots, but they dropped all fruit after the transplant this Spring.










spaugh

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Trees are looking amazing well done.  Yard looks tidy too, I bet the neighbors will be jealous of your trees.  Not a lot of people around there with their own avocado trees. 
Brad Spaugh

z_willus_d

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Hi Brad, nice to hear from you.  Thank for the kind words.  I just hope the trees can survive the winter and produce.  I always enjoy following your posts.  All the best.

behlgarden

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I've lost most of my trees. Only one that is pushing growth is my stewart. Mexicola looked good for most of the summer then just roasted that last 100+ heatwave we had. Hopefully my guava and papayas will help shade that area next year but I'm probably only going to replace one plant, I'm a lazy gardener...

were you fertilizing your plants during summer? its a recipe for disaster if you fertilize during summer heat wave in dry California climate.

zephian

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Trees were painted and covered in surround. Stewart still had some burn but is pushing growth. Mexicola and reed seedling couldn't handle it.
Probably my fault for planting them so late in the season. I hope to replant one earlier in the spring next season. I also learned to never order directly from four wind growers. I received a fuerte from them that died within two weeks of receiving it and all they would offer me is 50% off and I had to pay shipping again.

Trees did not receive any fertilizer, just mulch. Mine were on an elevated sand and dirt pile I hauled in by the truck.
-Kris

Mark in Texas

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Ditto z_willu_d, place looks amazing!

Trees were painted and covered in surround. Stewart still had some burn but is pushing growth. Mexicola and reed seedling couldn't handle it.
Probably my fault for planting them so late in the season. I hope to replant one earlier in the spring next season. I also learned to never order directly from four wind growers. I received a fuerte from them that died within two weeks of receiving it and all they would offer me is 50% off and I had to pay shipping again.

Trees did not receive any fertilizer, just mulch. Mine were on an elevated sand and dirt pile I hauled in by the truck.

Yeah am really sorry but this doesn't make sense.  We have heat, lots of it.  In fact we had a very weak "cold" front move thru yesterday afternoon and when I checked on the greenhouse it was 110F.  I didn't have my fans going.  It's hit 112F this summer and most daily temps were 100F + especially in July.  Trees are fine.

Are you giving them enough water in respect to your sandy soil structure and how is the water quality?  My citrus really started looking stressed out until I really upped up my watering.  However, our water quality is the pits with bicarbs of Ca and Mg thru the roof.  TDS is like 800 ppm at times.  Rains stopped (we're in a drought now) so I had to resort to well water rather than rain as I ran out of the latter.  Surprisingly they are fine.  FWIW, most of my trees are on Florida pits which have W. Indies genes in them, those big fat watery greenies.  I've tried a lot of rootstocks but nothing is a better match for our well water or imparts more vigor than Florida pits seedlings.

My Reed can take all the heat you throw at it. Here's a list of avocado varieties that take heat well during a SoCal heatwave.
http://gregalder.com/yardposts/heat-tolerance-of-avocado-varieties/

zephian

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Ditto z_willu_d, place looks amazing!

Trees were painted and covered in surround. Stewart still had some burn but is pushing growth. Mexicola and reed seedling couldn't handle it.
Probably my fault for planting them so late in the season. I hope to replant one earlier in the spring next season. I also learned to never order directly from four wind growers. I received a fuerte from them that died within two weeks of receiving it and all they would offer me is 50% off and I had to pay shipping again.

Trees did not receive any fertilizer, just mulch. Mine were on an elevated sand and dirt pile I hauled in by the truck.

Yeah am really sorry but this doesn't make sense.  We have heat, lots of it.  In fact we had a very weak "cold" front move thru yesterday afternoon and when I checked on the greenhouse it was 110F.  I didn't have my fans going.  It's hit 112F this summer and most daily temps were 100F + especially in July.  Trees are fine.

Are you giving them enough water in respect to your sandy soil structure and how is the water quality?  My citrus really started looking stressed out until I really upped up my watering.  However, our water quality is the pits with bicarbs of Ca and Mg thru the roof.  TDS is like 800 ppm at times.  Rains stopped (we're in a drought now) so I had to resort to well water rather than rain as I ran out of the latter.  Surprisingly they are fine.  FWIW, most of my trees are on Florida pits which have W. Indies genes in them, those big fat watery greenies.  I've tried a lot of rootstocks but nothing is a better match for our well water or imparts more vigor than Florida pits seedlings.

My Reed can take all the heat you throw at it. Here's a list of avocado varieties that take heat well during a SoCal heatwave.
http://gregalder.com/yardposts/heat-tolerance-of-avocado-varieties/
Mark: Somehow I never saw this post. It may be worth noting our 110+ degree summers are at 0% humidity. I have no idea how the water quality is but I've never had any leaf burn issues so I don't think that's an issue. Well see how they do this summer.

Naysen, how are your trees holding up? mine seem to be doing pretty well with rain(LOL, what little we've had) and frost. I'm only noticing minor tip damage on one tree. They look like they're about to push new growth.
-Kris

z_willus_d

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Hi Kris, I think we only dipped below freezing a couple times, and briefly, this winter (so far).  I hope this weather holds through late winter and spring.  If so, all the avocado trees will be thriving come late spring.  The side yard trees are all looking great, except that some of the leaves took a bit of discoloration and damage after the one large freeze we had a month or maybe two back.  They all look ready to push new buds.  One of the trees, a Bacon I believe, that I transplanted to my front yard -- one of three older Avos actually pushed out new blooms when we had a warm streak of days after that cold drop.  I guess the tree though Spring had come early.  I'm not sure what will become of all the blooms.  I'm thinking I might lose any chance of a crop on that one.  You can see some pics in the big avocado thread.

The five trees in my side yard all seem to have grown up some with beefier trunks, which is nice to see.  I probably need to expand their RootMaker containers by one slab each this Spring.  I think they're ready for a little extra room there.  I'll post an update after Spring if/when they set any fruitlets.  I hope your endeavors are growing well.

Mark in Texas

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I probably need to expand their RootMaker containers by one slab each this Spring.  I think they're ready for a little extra room there.  I'll post an update after Spring if/when they set any fruitlets.  I hope your endeavors are growing well.

Happy to here all is well.  When I add panels I add no fewer than to make the resulting gap 4". That's approximately how much lateral root growth you'll get behind the terminated root tip.  IMO adding just one panel is make work and not effective.  I usually go 3-4.  I only have about 2-3 beds to increase and i'm done with my dozen or so trees.

z_willus_d

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Hi Mark, thanks for the insight.  I had imagined a new panel each year, but you're probably right that it's not worth the effort at such a low incremental volume increase.  Do you bump up the volume every year, or more infrequently?  We've had an extra warm winter so far here, so I'm hoping all the trees come through without the usual heavy leaf drop and reset.  How's it going there?

Mark in Texas

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Hi Mark, thanks for the insight.  I had imagined a new panel each year, but you're probably right that it's not worth the effort at such a low incremental volume increase.  Do you bump up the volume every year, or more infrequently?  We've had an extra warm winter so far here, so I'm hoping all the trees come through without the usual heavy leaf drop and reset.  How's it going there?

I get to a certain size and stop expanding.  No need to go any bigger since they are rooted in the ground.   There is one exception, this Meyer lemon on Flying Dragon rootstock has been in it's own little "pot" forever.  I had to butcher it so I can get to the panels to process them soon.  I bet this tree gave us 600 lemons this year.  I gave away most of them.
 


This is my no-shit treatment of heavy clay loam, knife subsoiler with a foot.  ;D 2' down, criss cross passes.  Field planted stuff goes nuts since the roots find the fractures and root in quick.  It's all about the roots. I actually ran this thing in the greenhouse over the proposed spots before the walls went up.





z_willus_d

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Hi Mark, I just saw your reply (a month late).  The lemons on that Meyer!  I hope you're taking care and living well off the land.

Mark in Texas

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Hi Mark, I just saw your reply (a month late).  The lemons on that Meyer!  I hope you're taking care and living well off the land.

Howdy, doing pretty damn good, hope you are too.  Going to put a Lisbon lemon t-bud on the Meyer soon.   Am trying to deal with all the Covidiots that are hoarding this and that. 

Yesterday I finished up caging my maters using RootBuilder.  Key is to give them a damn good root system and shade them on the (due) east of the greenhouse from about 2:00 p.m. on. They get full sun before then.  Subsoiled, fractured, the clay loam 2' deep.

Citrus crop was/is over the top.  Am enjoying Moro blood oranges now.

Newly grafted, 10' X 8' W Sharwil/Lamb Hass is exploding in blooms, setting fruit.  Newly grafted Ardith, GEM, Pinkerton are blooming and setting fruit. Big Reed has yet to show blooms.  Very exciting!



Don't put up with any shit from a Covidiot.  ;D

z_willus_d

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Hi Mark, one positive of this Shelter in Place is that I'm really catching up on all the chores at home.  I had been out of the country and abroad for 5 out of 6 weeks (work stuff), and all the trees and gardening suffered.  I now have a late garden sprouting in the garage, and today I finished juicing/freezing/canning the:
- Limes
- Lemons
- Pomelos
- Grapefruits
- And left-over oranges

I'm well stocked for citrus for the year, to say the least.

Plenty of other choirs in the outdoors getting accomplished as well.  The Avocado trees are looking good so far.  We had a super mild winter, so I'm hoping for a banner year there.  I'll post some pics and an update later in April.  Have fun!

Mark in Texas

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Yep, catch up time for ya'll.  Been retired for 15 years and can't ever seem to catch up.  Maybe if I got off this device once in a while......  :)

z_willus_d

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I haven't given an update on the side-yard Avocado trees since early Oct. last year.  The trees have fleshed out somewhat and have dropped most of their "last-year leaves"; their replacements are coming in well enough.  I've also had good fruit set through Spring, however roughly 80% of the set has now dropped, and with the 105F+ highs here this week, I'm actively seeing and expecting more dropping.  The Lamb-Hass and Pinkerton are holding the most fruit at present, and they set at opposite ends of the side-yard alley.  Certainly, the Pinkerton gets far more sunlight, which may now be a detriment for the first time this year with the temps where they are at.  The other three trees are holding between 2 and 6 fruitlets with the droopy Holiday performing the worst of the bunch by any metric.  Here are the pics with some annotations.

Here's a view from the start of the side-yard alley with Lamb-Hass in the foreground:


Lamb-Hass:




Stewart (note the 3-panel wider container):




Holiday:




Sir-Prize:




Pinkerton:




Melting hot:

« Last Edit: May 27, 2020, 05:14:27 PM by z_willus_d »

odin.9

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z_willus_d your trees look great! wow!
How much water a week do they take right now?

z_willus_d

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Hi Odin-

Thanks.  It's been a long journey to get here, and it continues... I have the small quarter-inch soaker dripline hose you can buy at the H.D./Lowes/the web, embedded in circles around the base of the trees in the RootMaker containers. I'd estimate each sees around 5-8' of hose, and there is a 0.5 GPH dripper every foot along the hose.  Right now, I have them set to water with my drip system for all the other backyard plants (but not the main garden and several other trees I have) 3-4 times a day.   I was doing a 4-min dwell, but I recently turned it up to 8-min with the crazy heat we're getting here.  I am probably over-watering, but I saw some droopy leaves in the midday a while back when it was only in the mid 80's, so I decided better to waste some water than have the trees drop too much fruit just for lack of water.

Also, my soil mixture is very well draining.  In fact, I'm in the tedious process of expanding the RootMaker RootBuilder 2 containers for the first time.  I'm learning about a few things that I overlooked that I will show with some pics later.  The soil mix I'm using right now is roughly 1/3 Peat (and/or Coco coir fibers), 1/3 decomposed granite, and 1/3 a mix of this and that including things like aged chicken manure from my birds, worm castings from my worms (and some purchased), pathbark fines, and various amendments like humic acid, gypsum, mycos, etc.

A lot of the roots for the trees are escaping the RootMaker containers at the bottom periphery of the container where I mistakenly allowed mulch (the black wood chips) to abut and build-up .  This gave the roots, over time, and escape route through the first one, two, and a few cases three RootMaker air-holes.  Once the roots had a way out, and with all the water run-off, they took off and spread flat along the available space below the mulch and above the weed guard layer I ran to block the ground below.  This means that when I walk on that mulch, I likely damage the roots.  It also makes it damn near impossible to actually expand the container, but I've developed a painful work-around.  I'll describe that in a follow-up post along with some pics.

z_willus_d

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I've finished expanding the five expandable RootBuilder 2 enclosures I have holding the five avocado trees along the side of my house.  One warning for anyone (including future me) trying this is to take care not to allow mulch, dirt, debris, detritus or otherwise to build up around the bottom rows of the perforated "container."  What can happen, as was the case with my trees is the roots will find themselves an escape route out the bottom rungs of the enclosure where ever they don't meet atmosphere at the exit holes.  This presents a serious issue when trying to expand the container, especially for root sensitive plants like an Avocado.

My solution was to cut out the container losing the bottom two rows of holes (or ~2-3").  This shortened the height of my expanded container but allowed me to expand without further damaging the roots.  The roots were spreading out the lower row(s) of holes and developing under my wood-chip mulching, where I assume the excess water was leaking and spreading out over the weed barrier I had laid down beneath the mulch.

I'm sure my avocado roots took something of a beating from all the stepping on the mulch and extraction process, so I've certainly dropped a good 75% of my fruit.  But I'm sure the long term outlook is improved with these plants with the 3 additional panels of RootMaker.

I'd love to hear from anyone else using the containers on how they've managed with them, results and outcomes.

Thanks!

Here are some pics of one of the containers during the expansion process:






Mark in Texas

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Excellent job, pots are working as designed. 

I hand water, FLOOD the "pots" which takes about 30 minutes.  Don't want to chance any dry channels with drip.

I need to take some pix.  Greenhouse has become a jungle and moving around is getting hard to do.  I too lost about 80-90% of my avocado fruit sets but most on fairly new grafted trees that are 6-10' tall.

In haste while pruning I took off a newly grafted Orange Sherbet branch holding 17 nice fruit.  Oh well.  I mailed a friend some scions yesterday.



odin.9

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FLOOD the "pots" which takes about 30 minutes.

what's your method for this?

Mark in Texas

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FLOOD the "pots" which takes about 30 minutes.

what's your method for this?

Cold beer in one hand, fireman's nozzle on a garden hose on the other.  Most times rain water, sometimes well.