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Author Topic: New winter protection for Changsha.  (Read 737 times)

Citradia

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New winter protection for Changsha.
« on: November 13, 2016, 01:28:16 PM »




My woodlanders Changsha is getting tall and I was afraid to let it go without protection this year, I made a frame of 3 4x4's and PVC pipes with 4mil plastic stapled to the frame. Plastic door rolls up to vent. 3 water barrels and small space heater with thermo cube switch as backup.

Delvi83

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Re: New winter protection for Changsha.
« Reply #1 on: November 15, 2016, 12:20:17 PM »
Did you use the same protection last years? It seems pretty big and should have passed more winters...as it becomes bigger it increases its hardiness...

Anyway how are its fruits? When do they ripe?

Citradia

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Re: New winter protection for Changsha.
« Reply #2 on: November 15, 2016, 07:40:16 PM »
This one is on its own roots so is destined to get big. In years past I protected it with 4 mil plastic sheeting over PVC pipe frame. Last year's frame got crushed under snow but the water barrel next to tree helped minimize damage.  Now tree is over 10 feet tall and a long branch at top has no thorns so that branch may bloom next year, so I didn't want to risk loosing this newer growth this winter. I never know what kind of winter I'll have here, so I try to protect the citrus just in case. It has not fruited yet. I had planted a lot of trees on own roots or grew from seed before I learned that it's better to have grafted shorter varieties. I just can't stand to see a beautiful tree killed so I'll protect them as long as I can.

eyeckr

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Re: New winter protection for Changsha.
« Reply #3 on: November 17, 2016, 02:05:24 PM »
Nice protection measures Citradia. I used to do the same thing until my trees got too big form me to protect. It is worth the effort though. Hopefully you get some blooms and fruit next year. You could always clip a small part of that long branch with no thorns and store it in your fridge just in case the tree gets burned back. That way you could graft it back onto the surviving part of the tree or onto a trifoliate rootstock.

Citradia

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Re: New winter protection for Changsha.
« Reply #4 on: November 17, 2016, 03:26:17 PM »
Thanks eyeckr. Do I wrap the cutting in seranwrap, and how long should it be? I have no PT rootstock yet. Just harvested my first PT fruit today and planted seeds. Grafting is a future plan though.

eyeckr

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Re: New winter protection for Changsha.
« Reply #5 on: November 17, 2016, 03:37:28 PM »
Some people just use grafting tape and wrap the whole scion making it virtually air tight, put it in a ziplock bag and stick it in the crisper drawer in the fridge. I usually place the scion (usually 5-6 inches, around pencil diameter thick) in a zip lock bag with a very small, damp, but not overly wet paper towel or napkin next to the scion but not touching it. That has worked pretty well for me as far as preserving cuttings. Congrats on your first PT! Soon you'll have all the rootstock you want.

LaCasaVerde

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Re: New winter protection for Changsha.
« Reply #6 on: December 17, 2016, 10:22:01 PM »
What type of heat source are you using? Just the water barrels...?

Citradia

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Re: New winter protection for Changsha.
« Reply #7 on: December 18, 2016, 06:31:43 PM »
I have small desk space heaters in each enclosure, except my larger Kimbrogh greenhouse has a regular space heater that could warm a small room. Each enclosure heater is regulated by a Thermo cube to turn heat off when temp gets to 45 degrees. Comes on at 35 degrees. The Changsha may not need the heater, but I've already had a low of 15 degrees and high of 26 degrees last Friday. I'm also keeping some potted ichangs and sanguinelli seedlings in these two larger greenhouses. My in ground Rio red, owari, crocston, Meiwa, Ichang, are protected with 35 gallon water barrels, the small space heaters, and 4mil sheet plastic covering pvc dome frames. I vent all when highs above freezing and especially if temp in 50s or above to keep trees dormant.

Citradia

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Re: New winter protection for Changsha.
« Reply #8 on: December 18, 2016, 06:46:13 PM »
I just use water barrels in the high tunnel containing the hardier trifoliate hybrids, ichangs, and Nansho dai dai.








Tom

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Re: New winter protection for Changsha.
« Reply #9 on: December 18, 2016, 08:57:44 PM »
Wow. Thanks for the great pictures ! Tom

LaCasaVerde

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Re: New winter protection for Changsha.
« Reply #10 on: December 18, 2016, 09:48:16 PM »
Citradia, Yes, Very neat.  I can see why your redesign for snow load was important. Im impressed at the dedication and all the testing and tinkering that goes along with it. Having temp regulated smaller cold frames in that climate is not easy especially stand alone as you are doing.. But the process inevitably leads to better more efficient set ups.
Ill bet you trudge out there on cold mornings to check on all of them!

 I cold frame here in Pensacola as we get cold weather but nothing like that. I use Christmas lights, the old fashioned ones, and they keep my enclosures about 40-45 degrees. Stake flood lights with 150 watt halogens also work very  well. Ive found that the trees though will grow larger and larger requiring bigger and bigger enclosures. Ive now got a 10 foot blood orange in an enclosure I rebuild every year. Im at the point where Im profecting faster  expandable set ups as these cold frames are time intensive.

I noticed your using small desk heaters. Ive been looking for ones that are thermostatically controlled in the 300 watt range... Are you using the thermocubes to turn yours on and off? If so - how is that working for you?

I remotely monitor my enclosures with this-
Ambient Weather WS-21 Wireless 8-Channel Thermometer .  Can have I think up to 8 different remote sensors. shows me high and low for each monitor.

Currently experimenting with an ibc water tote with an aquarium heater element suspended inside. water is preheated by the sun with an array of heliatos ez connect panels...
http://www.heliatos.com/


Tom

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Re: New winter protection for Changsha.
« Reply #11 on: December 19, 2016, 10:03:27 AM »
Citradia,

I use a thermostat very similar to the therma cube. I have several in different locations. Sometimes I've had one fail I think. It could have been an electricity outage in a bad location. I've read horror stories in reviews on line but my wife keeps reminding me sometimes rivals post bogus bad reviews. Needless to say it scares me to death. In critical installations I try to have a backup system. It's the best I can do right now.

I've heard of heating a water barrel with an aquarium heater in cold citrus situations, much like LaCasaVerde describes here. That makes sense too but I have not tried it. Good luck this winter and Merry Christmas !

Tom

Citradia

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Re: New winter protection for Changsha.
« Reply #12 on: December 19, 2016, 07:57:57 PM »


Yes, the thermocube works well and the "my heat" heaters have kept my Meiwa, crocston, owari, Rio red alive and unscathed for the past three winters, even through the polar vortex years when I had lows of 0 degrees for several nights, and one January when it hardly ever got above freezing for the whole month; I remember thinking highs in the twenties was warm that January! Ha-ha!  Once, I forgot to plug in the extension cord to my Rio red in January when the overnight temp was 19 degrees, and the 4mil plastic cover and 34 gal barrel of water kept it alive, but it partially defoliated and didn't bloom that year. I lost all my trifoliate hybrids that year that it stayed freezing all January, except the Thomasville did come back from roots, and is now 10 feet tall. That's why I built high tunnel over my line of trifoliate hybrids with each having a water barrel next to it. The roof of high tunnel caved in from snow this past winter and I had to reinforce it. My experience here the past few years is why I find it hard to fathom a grapefruit tree living unprotected in a cemetery in Knoxville,TN.

Citradia

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Re: New winter protection for Changsha.
« Reply #13 on: December 19, 2016, 09:05:33 PM »
Tom, you're welcome for the pictures. Yes, I've thought about the water heater approach too, but I've noticed dieback on some of my young trees just above the height of the water barrel the winter before last in the unheated high tunnel; I think the area of heat given off by the water barrel is small, maybe only a few inches. I think the space heater with fan is better because it keeps the warm air moving and distributed throughout the enclosure. The water barrels help reduce the amount of air space that my little heaters have to warm up. Merry Christmas to you too, Tom.

LaCasaVerde

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Re: New winter protection for Changsha.
« Reply #14 on: December 20, 2016, 09:47:48 AM »
Thank you Citradia for the pics and info . Found the Lasko #100 MyHeat Personal Ceramic Heater.  Im going to pick one up and try it out.

Citradia

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Re: New winter protection for Changsha.
« Reply #15 on: December 20, 2016, 07:40:37 PM »
You're welcome LaCasaVerde. The MyHeat puts out just enough hot air to warm a small enclosure and doesn't take too much electricity. I used to get them at Walmart but the last few I got, I had to get from Amazon.

LaCasaVerde

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Re: New winter protection for Changsha.
« Reply #16 on: December 21, 2016, 08:32:37 PM »
A.M Leonard Poly remnants have saved me a bundle on my cold frames. Beats out everyones pricing and the shipping is very reasonable. 6mm IR  poly will trap additional heat in the enclosures. I like the fact that I can buy smaller quantities of remnants without breaking the bank.
http://iteminfo.amleo.com/poly/

Might come in handy in the future. I took two layers and placed it on an enclusure last year and kept much higher temps. Not inflated just double layered.

Laaz

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Re: New winter protection for Changsha.
« Reply #17 on: December 22, 2016, 08:48:00 AM »
How do you like the Changsha? I have found they have a skunky after taste & cut my tree down...

Millet

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Re: New winter protection for Changsha.
« Reply #18 on: December 22, 2016, 02:26:33 PM »
Citradia have you ever thought about putting a heating cable  3-inches under the soil line in the  high tunnel?  I purchased a 100-ft. heating cable which is placed around several of my trees.  The cable is plugged into a thermostat set at 80-F supplying heat to the tree's roots plus to the surrounding soil, which in turn radiates heat up into the trees.

Citradia

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Re: New winter protection for Changsha.
« Reply #19 on: December 22, 2016, 07:28:38 PM »
Thanks for the link La casa Verde. Laaz, I don't remember tasting Changsha before. I'm trying to grow it since it should be a more cold hardy citrus here. I'm not really picky about how citrus taste; I like the lemony taste of Swingle citrumelos, thought Ichang lemon was fabulous, think dunstan citrumelo tastes like good old fashioned grapefruit that grandpa used to eat, and didn't find the taste of my trifoliata fruit offensive. If my Changsha ever produces I hope to find it palatable.  Millit. I've never heard of heating cables. Interesting idea, but don't know that I'd want to run electricity out to my orchard where high tunnel is. Furthermore, this is probably the last year for my high tunnel since my trees are getting tall in there; those trees areal Ichang or trifoliata hybrids and am hoping they can survive next winter without being covered since they will probably be 15 feet tall then at the rate they are growing.

 

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