Alkaline Sandy Soil.

[Tropicalgrower89]

Like the title says, my soil has a pH in the 7 to almost 8 range. In the high 6 range in the top layer of the soil to mid 7 range deeper into the soil around my younger pace mamey ( tree growing vigorously). High 7 range all the way through around my older pace mamey (growing very slowly). It's in the high 6's around the avocado. Low 7's around my mangoes.

My well water has a pH of 6.1 .

What should I use to help my fruit trees by lowering the pH of the soil?

138 Chelated iron?



Thank you,

[FlyingFoxFruits]

Like the title says, my soil has a pH in the 7 to almost 8 range. In the high 6 range in the top layer of the soil to mid 7 range deeper into the soil around my younger pace mamey ( tree growing vigorously). High 7 range all the way through around my older pace mamey (growing very slowly). It's in the high 6's around the avocado. Low 7's around my mangoes.

My well water has a pH of 6.1 .

What should I use to help my fruit trees by lowering the pH of the soil?

138 Chelated iron?



Thank you,

Espoma sells organic sulfur derived from gypsum.

Its what you need...that and/or Turfpro Iron formula...is what I would use...in combination...they are a force to be reckoned with.

Both being organic, and effective!

[Tropicalgrower89]

Like the title says, my soil has a pH in the 7 to almost 8 range. In the high 6 range in the top layer of the soil to mid 7 range deeper into the soil around my younger pace mamey ( tree growing vigorously). High 7 range all the way through around my older pace mamey (growing very slowly). It's in the high 6's around the avocado. Low 7's around my mangoes.

My well water has a pH of 6.1 .

What should I use to help my fruit trees by lowering the pH of the soil?

138 Chelated iron?



Thank you,

Espoma sells organic sulfur derived from gypsum.

Its what you need...that and/or Turfpro Iron formula...is what I would use...in combination...they are a force to be reckoned with.

Both being organic, and effective!

Thanks Adam.  The combo sounds like a good idea.

[Saltcayman]

From what I have read, raising the amount of organic matter in or on top of sandy calcareous soil is key to  lowering ph. A heavy mulch will also give the garden sulpher a layer to linger in rather than passing right through the root zone. Do not overdo the sulpher in any one treatment. 
Peat moss, which is very acidic, can also lower ph but must be incorporated into the soil. Some people claim pine bark or pine straw mulch will also lower ph but others say it loses it's acidity when it decomposes.    Dave

[zands]

Tropicalgrower89 ----
Best I have learned is this\

• you can spend a lifetime trying to raise the ph of alkaline soils unless you have a few dump truck loads of straight sulfur
• not all fruit trees are bothered by alkaline soil
• mangoes are relatively immune
• citrus is more affected and same for carambola
• Iron and magnesium uptake are the major problems
• chelated iron can be used in calcerous soils where simple iron sulfate cannot.... right on soil not as a foliar
• but I'm thinking simple iron and magnesium sulfates with a soap wetting agent will do better as foliars than most of what iron and magnesium you place at ground level
• Epsom salts=magnesium sulfate

[Tropicalgrower89]

From what I have read, raising the amount of organic matter in or on top of sandy calcareous soil is key to  lowering ph. A heavy mulch will also give the garden sulpher a layer to linger in rather than passing right through the root zone. Do not overdo the sulpher in any one treatment. 
Peat moss, which is very acidic, can also lower ph but must be incorporated into the soil. Some people claim pine bark or pine straw mulch will also lower ph but others say it loses it's acidity when it decomposes.    Dave

Thanks Dave. I'll look further into pine bark or straw mulch.

[Tropicalgrower89]

Tropicalgrower89 ----
Best I have learned is this\

• you can spend a lifetime trying to raise the ph of alkaline soils unless you have a few dump truck loads of straight sulfur
• not all fruit trees are bothered by alkaline soil
• mangoes are relatively immune
• citrus is more affected and same for carambola
• Iron and magnesium uptake are the major problems
• chelated iron can be used in calcerous soils where simple iron sulfate cannot
• but I'm thinking simple iron and magnesium sulfates with a soap wetting agent will do better as foliars
• Epsom salts=magnesium sulfate

Thanks for your help Zands. Have you used this ? :   http://www.lowes.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/ProductDisplay?langId=-1&storeId=10151&catalogId=10051&cId=SEARCH&productId=3083599&cm_mmc=SCE_gps-_-gps-_-gps-_-Green%20Light%20Gallon%20Iron%20and%20Soil%20Acidifier%20Concentrate&CAWELAID=1103445107#BVRRWidgetID

My older mamey is closer to the house and the soil there has a higher pH (alkaline) and seems to be struggling compared to the mamey that's planted further away from the house where the pH is a bit lower. 

[zands]

Tropicalgrower89____

Phone up Los Reyes De Mamey and mention your calciferous soil....   ask them.  I am serious

[zands]

Thanks for your help Zands. Have you used this ? :   http://www.lowes.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/ProductDisplay?langId=-1&storeId=10151&catalogId=10051&cId=SEARCH&productId=3083599&cm_mmc=SCE_gps-_-gps-_-gps-_-Green%20Light%20Gallon%20Iron%20and%20Soil%20Acidifier%20Concentrate&CAWELAID=1103445107#BVRRWidgetID

My older mamey is closer to the house and the soil there has a higher pH (alkaline) and seems to be struggling compared to the mamey that's planted further away from the house where the pH is a bit lower.


As far as that stuff goes you have to.... have to... have to... check out what kind of soil (acid alkaline or all so they claim)  it works in. The 138 chelate you mention is for alkaline soils and can be used as drench or foliar.  But there is a Ferriplus chelate (other than 138) that is for acid soils go figure

[Tropicalgrower89]

Thanks for your help Zands. Have you used this ? :   http://www.lowes.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/ProductDisplay?langId=-1&storeId=10151&catalogId=10051&cId=SEARCH&productId=3083599&cm_mmc=SCE_gps-_-gps-_-gps-_-Green%20Light%20Gallon%20Iron%20and%20Soil%20Acidifier%20Concentrate&CAWELAID=1103445107#BVRRWidgetID

My older mamey is closer to the house and the soil there has a higher pH (alkaline) and seems to be struggling compared to the mamey that's planted further away from the house where the pH is a bit lower.


As far as that stuff goes you have to.... have to... have to... check out what kind of soil (acid alkaline or all so they claim)  it works in. The 138 chelate you mention is for alkaline soils and can be used as drench or foliar.  But there is a Ferriplus chelate (other than 138) that is for acid soils go figure

I bought a PH meter. It's no the most accurate meter, but the needle was in the alkaline territory when I stuck the probe into the soil, within the root zone. I was actually growing a gardenia plant and it just deteriorated after planting it in the ground in the recommended location and took care of it based on the instructions. Then I read that gardenias did not like alkaline soils. They prefer acidic soils. Based on that evidence and what the pH meter was reading, my soil is alkaline, so I need an iron chelate/soil acidifier for alkaline soil. Since my other mamey is currently doing fine, I'll use my other mamey as a test for the product I showed you. In the advertisement, it mentions that it is suppose to reduce alkalinity in alkaline soils.

My glenn mango leaves are yellow around the edges and green in the middle. Is that normal due to cold weather?

[Tropicalgrower89]

I found some helpful info on preferable soil conditions for mamey sapote to thrive.

"The optimum soil seems to be deep and acid, with moderate permeability, good drainage, and at least average fertility."

http://www.rarefruit.org/PDF_files/THETASTESOFFABULOUSEXOTICTROPICALFRUITS.pdf

Bottom of page 1 into page 2. 

[bsbullie]

Thanks for your help Zands. Have you used this ? :   http://www.lowes.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/ProductDisplay?langId=-1&storeId=10151&catalogId=10051&cId=SEARCH&productId=3083599&cm_mmc=SCE_gps-_-gps-_-gps-_-Green%20Light%20Gallon%20Iron%20and%20Soil%20Acidifier%20Concentrate&CAWELAID=1103445107#BVRRWidgetID

My older mamey is closer to the house and the soil there has a higher pH (alkaline) and seems to be struggling compared to the mamey that's planted further away from the house where the pH is a bit lower.


As far as that stuff goes you have to.... have to... have to... check out what kind of soil (acid alkaline or all so they claim)  it works in. The 138 chelate you mention is for alkaline soils and can be used as drench or foliar.  But there is a Ferriplus chelate (other than 138) that is for acid soils go figure

I bought a PH meter. It's no the most accurate meter, but the needle was in the alkaline territory when I stuck the probe into the soil, within the root zone. I was actually growing a gardenia plant and it just deteriorated after planting it in the ground in the recommended location and took care of it based on the instructions. Then I read that gardenias did not like alkaline soils. They prefer acidic soils. Based on that evidence and what the pH meter was reading, my soil is alkaline, so I need an iron chelate/soil acidifier for alkaline soil. Since my other mamey is currently doing fine, I'll use my other mamey as a test for the product I showed you. In the advertisement, it mentions that it is suppose to reduce alkalinity in alkaline soils.

My glenn mango leaves are yellow around the edges and green in the middle. Is that normal due to cold weather?

What cold weather ?

[zands]

My glenn mango leaves are yellow around the edges and green in the middle. Is that normal due to cold weather?

Post a photo and one of our experts can give a diagnosis. I have clorosis problems on my property. I lost 3 citrus to it. One tree did great through. I bought Ferriplus 138 and use on a scraggly mango tree but not on other mango trees. I use it on citrus. But now I bought some iron sulfate and am going to experiment with using that and Epsom salts (magnesium sulfate) as foliars. They won't work if applied to the ground....due to the alkalinity... Ferriplus and other similar products...the iron is chelated (making it expensive) so it will work in ground as a drench or foliar

[Tropicalgrower89]

Thanks for your help Zands. Have you used this ? :   http://www.lowes.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/ProductDisplay?langId=-1&storeId=10151&catalogId=10051&cId=SEARCH&productId=3083599&cm_mmc=SCE_gps-_-gps-_-gps-_-Green%20Light%20Gallon%20Iron%20and%20Soil%20Acidifier%20Concentrate&CAWELAID=1103445107#BVRRWidgetID

My older mamey is closer to the house and the soil there has a higher pH (alkaline) and seems to be struggling compared to the mamey that's planted further away from the house where the pH is a bit lower.


As far as that stuff goes you have to.... have to... have to... check out what kind of soil (acid alkaline or all so they claim)  it works in. The 138 chelate you mention is for alkaline soils and can be used as drench or foliar.  But there is a Ferriplus chelate (other than 138) that is for acid soils go figure

I bought a PH meter. It's no the most accurate meter, but the needle was in the alkaline territory when I stuck the probe into the soil, within the root zone. I was actually growing a gardenia plant and it just deteriorated after planting it in the ground in the recommended location and took care of it based on the instructions. Then I read that gardenias did not like alkaline soils. They prefer acidic soils. Based on that evidence and what the pH meter was reading, my soil is alkaline, so I need an iron chelate/soil acidifier for alkaline soil. Since my other mamey is currently doing fine, I'll use my other mamey as a test for the product I showed you. In the advertisement, it mentions that it is suppose to reduce alkalinity in alkaline soils.

My glenn mango leaves are yellow around the edges and green in the middle. Is that normal due to cold weather?

What cold weather ?

36 degree cold spell, which caused my guanabana to lose 95 percent of it's leaves and singed some new growth on my older pace mamey. And the mild 43 degree cold spell which singed some of the new growth of my guanabana. I might be living in a cool micro climate.

[Tropicalgrower89]

My glenn mango leaves are yellow around the edges and green in the middle. Is that normal due to cold weather?

Post a photo and one of our experts can give a diagnosis. I have clorosis problems on my property. I lost 3 citrus to it. One tree did great through. I bought Ferriplus 138 and use on a scraggly mango tree but not on other mango trees. I use it on citrus. But now I bought some iron sulfate and am going to experiment with using that and Epsom salts (magnesium sulfate) as foliars. They won't work if applied to the ground....due to the alkalinity... Ferriplus and other similar products...the iron is chelated (making it expensive) so it will work in ground as a drench or foliar

I'll post pics tomorrow. Thanks Zands. 

[Tropicalgrower89]

Well, it turns out that rinsing the probe with highly alkaline city water was resulting in a higher pH reading when I stuck it into the soil.  Just before putting it away, I rinsed it with distilled bottle water. Today I used it again and stuck it into the soil surrounding the older pace mamey where it previously gave an alkaline reading and, this time, it read right on the 6.8-7.0 mark.

[Guanabanus]

I prefer to put some soil in a glass, pour enough distilled water to cover the soil, stir, let sit a few minutes, then stick in the probe.

My sandy yard was about 6.8 pH.  After sheet composting with fresh prunings and leaves brought from my job, and after adding one ton of phosphatic clay spead over my 85' x 110' lot, it went down to 6.4 pH.

Phosphatic clay is also called colloidal phosphate or soft phosphate or soft rock phosphate.  It settles out in the wash ponds of rock phosphate mines.  The main ingredient is Tricalcium phosphate.  As there is so much calcium in it I had supposed that it might raise my soil's pH too much--- not so--- the pH went down.

Both organic matter and phosphatic clay, when added to sandy soils, help to suppress harmful nematodes.

[Tropicalgrower89]

I prefer to put some soil in a glass, pour enough distilled water to cover the soil, stir, let sit a few minutes, then stick in the probe.

My sandy yard was about 6.8 pH.  After sheet composting with fresh prunings and leaves brought from my job, and after adding one ton of phosphatic clay spead over my 85' x 110' lot, it went down to 6.4 pH.

Phosphatic clay is also called colloidal phosphate or soft phosphate or soft rock phosphate.  It settles out in the wash ponds of rock phosphate mines.  The main ingredient is Tricalcium phosphate.  As there is so much calcium in it I had supposed that it might raise my soil's pH too much--- not so--- the pH went down.

Both organic matter and phosphatic clay, when added to sandy soils, help to suppress harmful nematodes.

Cool. Thanks for the info Har.   

[jb_fla]

I use this for my blueberries:

http://www.tigersul.com/products/agriculture/bentonite-sulphur/tiger-90-cr-sulphur.html

Locally I can get a 50# bag for $12.