california drought relief on the way?

[gnappi]

Problem is as soon as the reservoirs fill up Californians will go back to watering their front and back lawns in the middle of the day. Have seen this cycle already so many times.
Really what should be done is to increase number and size of reservoirs. Drainage systems should be enlarged and improved and diverted so the water is processed and stored rather than run off into the ocean. New homes should be required to have built in cisterns. But i doubt any of that will really happen.

A. Lawns should be outlawed and the government should award a contract for a breakneck development of a weed that covers the ground that needs less water.

B. I don't know the reserviors on the west coast, but those on the East coast like New York and Lake Okeechobee in Fla are so badly silted I'll bet they're less than half the capacity than when they were made. DREDGE THE DAMN THINGS!!!

C. Some states like Florida have at times an annual surplus of water and it's dumped in the ocean, and that as you said should not be dumped. Dumping is also bad for short term salinity inshore by the reefs.

[ricshaw]

A good article in the ny times about the challenges Cali faces in storing rainwater

http://www.nytimes.com/2015/12/22/science/california-wants-to-store-water-for-farmers-but-struggles-over-how-to-do-it.html

Thanks for the article. Where I live we already have a aquifer-recharging system in place.

[shaneatwell]

A private water market would solve it.

[ricshaw]

After another very dry year. It looks like California will finally get some El Niño influenced rain this week.

January 2, 2016 — Drought-stricken California braces for El Niño
http://www.cbsnews.com/news/drought-stricken-california-braces-for-el-nino/

[Mark in Texas]

Yep, it's proving to be "The godzilla of El Nino's"

Cali looks like it's in pretty good shape for the next few months. http://www.cpc.noaa.gov/products/predictions/long_range/seasonal.php?lead=1

El Nino has had a huge impact on Texas and Louisiana rainfall, setting many new records.  My well water's TDS has dropped from a norm of 800 + ppm to 513 ppm a month ago.  We are and have been saturated.

[JF]

Yep, we are on the cusp of El Niño. I hope it doesn't give us more than we can handle

[Mark in Texas]

Yep, we are on the cusp of El Niño. I hope it doesn't give us more than we can handle

I'm sure if it's too much your state government will find some way to put a tax on it....and everything will be just fine!   

[michsu]

yeah, we have a drought surcharge tax already.. my bill is only $70 (for a family of 4 adults and two kids), and they are charging over $10 in surcharge taxes and other fees too..

[zands]

Yep, we are on the cusp of El Niño. I hope it doesn't give us more than we can handle

I am hoping and praying California gets so much El Nino rain your reservoirs are overflowing. You all need that excitement and I am hoping! Lots of Your water comes from Northern California so you better hope they get hit hard up there!

In South Florida we are getting a wetter winter that usual due to El Nino effect but mango season will only be delayed at most and some will taste watery. This will be  a good mango season. My carambolas confirm this/.

[Mark in Texas]

yeah, we have a drought surcharge tax already.. my bill is only $70 (for a family of 4 adults and two kids), and they are charging over $10 in surcharge taxes and other fees too..

That's ridiculous.  Move to Texas as so many Californians are so you don't have to put with that crap.   

[fyliu]

yeah, we have a drought surcharge tax already.. my bill is only $70 (for a family of 4 adults and two kids), and they are charging over $10 in surcharge taxes and other fees too..

That's ridiculous.  Move to Texas as so many Californians are so you don't have to put with that crap.

Michu, it sounds like your city is one of those that don't have to charge at the same rate that water costs. How is this surcharge calculated? As a simple percent of the bill? or based on usage tiers?

[ricshaw]

see how using less water can cost more
http://www.latimes.com/local/california/la-me-water-power-html-20151020-htmlstory.html

[gozp]

No rain as of now in the valley, as yahoo weather & accuweather confirmed there will be rain Sunday night, & Monday through Sunday. As predicted, they are not an accurate weather predictor-stations.


As stated, 100% rain today. HOPEFULLY.

[goosteen]

I heard in 97 we had 10 inches of rain by December... is this the first el nino where there was almost no rain for November and December?

[michsu]

Hi fyliu, we have the tier system for our water.. but $70 isn't that much to use (for 4 adults, 2 children), and I get charged with a "drought surcharge" for using too much water.. then if I don't use enough (I think we had that last year when her parents went back, and before I had my 2nd child).. our bill was down to $40-50 and they tack on a "water offset" charge too.. so use too much, get charged... use too little, get charged.. I should get my last water bill and post it up..

yeah, I hope we get the rain guys.. looks to be 1.6 inches (predicted) in my area this morning, but that's never right.. we were supposed to start "raining" Sunday night a few days ago, but that never happened.. and not much yesterday.. I could spit more into the ground and that would help more..

as I speak, it starts dropping lower..

http://www.accuweather.com/en/us/hacienda-heights-ca/91745/daily-weather-forecast/332143?day=1

1.49 inches.. but supposedly tomorrow we get 1.5 inches the whole day (and night) too..

[Mark in Texas]

I just got thru with a 2 hour on site chat with a rain collection expert who's been installing systems all his life, even does 3rd world collection systems in S. America, Mexico, etc. Lot's ot trenching, plumbing, 1 HP Grundfos pump, guttering, switches, electricity utility work, 20,000 gal. tank....the works and a rough estimate is under $30K.  Wife is about to have a fit considering we have a well that has a potential output of 150 gpm for only pennies cost per day for electricity to drive the 1 HP pump..  Kicker is that well water is hard enough to make concrete out of - 800 + PPM TDS, mostly bicarbs of Mg and Ca.

Hasn't rain water collection caught on yet in Cali?

[michsu]

you said it.. "rain" water.. if we had enough rain, I would buy a barrel and start collecting too.. 

http://www.usclimatedata.com/climate/california/united-states/3174
10-15 inches annually?

Here is Texas
http://www.usclimatedata.com/climate/texas/united-states/3213
30-35 inches? (rough estimate)

Florida
http://www.usclimatedata.com/climate/florida/united-states/3179
60 inches? (must be nice  )

[fyliu]

Looks like the utilities are really out to get you.

It's a good time to collect rain water this year. A little rain can be a hundred gallons. The water districts offer $75 rebate/barrel up to 4. LA offers $100, I'm not sure how many.
Companies convert plastic food barrels into rain barrels and sell for $80, making good profit. Some cities have barrel distribution days where residents can sign up to reserve a couple of barrels for free.

[Mangosurf]

Fyliu,

Despite the fact that we only average 8 in of rain per year in SD, since installing my 2,000 gallon rain harvesting system last year I haven't used a drop of our high chlorine, high TDS city water. A 1 inch storm is enough to fill the system and it typically will last me 2-3 months. With all the rebates for tanks from the State Water Board and local municipalities it is definitely a great investment. My plants no longer suffer tip burn, and the leaves are much greener with more vigorous growth.

[Mark in Texas]

you said it.. "rain" water.. if we had enough rain, I would buy a barrel and start collecting too.. 

http://www.usclimatedata.com/climate/california/united-states/3174
10-15 inches annually?

Here is Texas
http://www.usclimatedata.com/climate/texas/united-states/3213
30-35 inches? (rough estimate)

Florida
http://www.usclimatedata.com/climate/florida/united-states/3179
60 inches? (must be nice  )

You'd be surprised what even a dew or a mist will bring.  My dermatologist who turned me on to the installer of today went thru our 2011 drought, about 5", and he has a family of 6.

I will put in valves and in seconds can switch back and forth to well or rainwater.  You could do the same with city water if you have a place to place the tank.  My 20K gal. is only 7' tall so a 9' tall gutter system will gravity feed it.

[michsu]

oh cool.. thanks guys.. I might think about doing one then.. I assumed a 1 inch rain like today wouldn't amount to much.. I think I usually use more water in a week to water my plants.. not sure..

[ricshaw]

Hasn't rain water collection caught on yet in Cali?

It does not rain enough in California to make residential home owner rain collection practical.

Many cities offer discount vouchers for rainwater catchment systems. A neighbor did a cost analysis and it does not pay to collect rainwater.

[ricshaw]

It's a good time to collect rain water this year. A little rain can be a hundred gallons. The water districts offer $75 rebate/barrel up to 4. LA offers $100, I'm not sure how many.
Companies convert plastic food barrels into rain barrels and sell for $80, making good profit. Some cities have barrel distribution days where residents can sign up to reserve a couple of barrels for free.

This was a neighbor's reply to our local city rain barrel rebate program:

Hate to be a bummer but that holds about .35 cents of water at today's rates. Your money is better spent upgrading your planters to drip and using Native drought plants with mulch and installing a ET based controller plus adjusting your lifestyle in the house. Our problem is our rain comes all at once then nothing or very little for 8 months. Even Arizona gets summer monsoonal rains. It will take 128 fill times to break even or something like 12 years. If it makes you feel good then I guess so but this is no answer. In 10 years all sewer water will be reused and injected into the wells and this will help during thees swings. It is already being done in SD and Orange county toilet to tap. Even Ventura has started the water delivered from the treatment plant to River Ridge Golf course is so pure it eats away at the pipes as it is so pure it is acidic they have to treat it with lime stone to raise the PH. If you cut usage by 30% that will save you about 250.00 a year as the average house uses about 12 units a month or 300 gallons a day a day. Just a thought on real economics about it.



Thanks all I was trying to say was we get rain when the plants do not need it in the winter. After the rain the ground is saturated no need for water, maybe inside the house for plants? So at best you maybe and I say maybe you get 10 cycles were it rains then you go a long time with no rain and your plants will need watering. But during that time of year the ET is low ( Evaporation and Transpiration) . So as sexy as it sounds not that efficient. Plus how are you going to water hook a hose up and have the water weight create pressure? very low flow if you are below the level of water in the tank or dip it out with a bucket? if not then you need to install a pressure pump. I think you can see were I'm going with this it snow balls. Plus if we want to use 500,000 as number and two for a household that is one million plastic barrels from China I would guess.Then we would have to dispose of those. So Plant native and maybe even pollinators to help bees and butterflies use mulch and drip, Plus monitor your landscape and ask your City officials to stop building until they can show trough methods they have reclaimed water that was just going to waste to justify the permit to build new. Why build new units and ask us to walk around with buckets from our toilets tag that cost on to the permits for new construction to reclaim more water to be reused plus all of us conserve.

[Mark in Texas]

Texas has been using waste water on most golf courses for ages.  Problem is it's very hard so grass selection is critical.    Xeriscape has also been popular for decades both for commercial and private landscaping.

Having said that, last night's news coverage of rain in Cali looked very promising.  Of course they always cherry pick areas hardest hit. LA looked like it was getting slammed.

[Mark in Texas]

A private water market would solve it.

It's being done.  Water has now replaced oil as a valuable mineral commodity.

Take a look at T. Boone Pickens, for instance. The Texas billionaire is one of the best-known and perhaps largest individual water investors in America.

Pickens has been investing in water for decades. He used to hold rights over the Ogallala Aquifer in the Texas panhandle, the third-largest underground aquifer in the world supplying 27% of all irrigation in the United States. He subsequently sold these water rights and more recently has invested in ranches through Sporting Ranch Capital, putting his money into properties between 200 and 1,000 acres with live water (a minimum of a mile for a stream or a river).

The basic issue here  is not water, it's just another resource.  Controlling world population that drives up demand is the issue.