The Tropical Fruit Forum
Tropical Fruit => Tropical Fruit Discussion => Topic started by: simon_grow on April 06, 2017, 03:00:57 PM
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I was absolutely wowed when I saw the Japanese style of ultra low pruned and espalied Mango and Avocado trees. I have a tiny yard with horrible heavy clay soil filled with rocks so I decided that I will attempt to create a few similarly shaped trees with different types of rootstocks. Just to get you excited, here is my inspiration.
http://www.trbimg.com/img-53d95a05/turbine/fl-fairchild-garden-column-080314-20140730 (http://www.trbimg.com/img-53d95a05/turbine/fl-fairchild-garden-column-080314-20140730)
I will have a smaller footprint as I don't want my trees to get as large as the one in the picture and I will also have four different trees of various rootstocks to pack into my side yard that is only about 4-5 feet wide. I will have to trellis and tie down growth and my aim is to grow these in a flat plane.
As far as development of the trunk and branching, I will follow the direction from mr John Yoshimi Yonemoto from the Japan Tropical Fruit Association.
http://download1594.mediafire.com/74ntoorj7fmg/eec74at7pr3rvbz/PruningYonemoto.pdf (http://download1594.mediafire.com/74ntoorj7fmg/eec74at7pr3rvbz/PruningYonemoto.pdf)
http://download1971.mediafire.com/4od67760m28g/swujm3xodlx9cgj/2012_Producing_Consistent_High_Quality_Fruit_in_Japan.pdf (http://download1971.mediafire.com/4od67760m28g/swujm3xodlx9cgj/2012_Producing_Consistent_High_Quality_Fruit_in_Japan.pdf)
http://download937.mediafire.com/9gfg1c9as1ig/6ikqa9b0uxoz4el/Breakoutyonemoto.pdf (http://download937.mediafire.com/9gfg1c9as1ig/6ikqa9b0uxoz4el/Breakoutyonemoto.pdf)
These articles have been posted numerous times in multiple threads and I give a big thanks to those that originally found the article, I don't remember whom it was.
Simon
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I believe that tree is 25 years old! Truly inspiring. They do extensive root pruning on their rootstock before and after getting into the ground. Think bonsai. Once it is in the ground the roots are contained in a metal trough. The root zone is primarily made up of secondary feeder roots.
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My side yard is South facing and my roof overhang will help minimize damage from the ocassional frost I get at my location. By planting these trees against my South facing wall, I will also reduce energy costs by blocking the sun in Summer time.
These planters have been used to raise my mango seedlings and is also used for my veggie garden. I just cleared out all the debris and will be topping off the planters with good potting mix. These planters are about 3x6 and approximately 14 to 18 inches tall, I can't remember exactly. They are fabric material and the frame is PVC. I can easily brick around it if I wanted a permanent planter.
(https://s4.postimg.cc/rgk8gkn7t/IMG_1788.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/image/rgk8gkn7t/)
(https://s4.postimg.cc/r52s3t6rt/IMG_1789.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/image/r52s3t6rt/)
(https://s4.postimg.cc/luxtcimix/IMG_1790.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/image/luxtcimix/)
Simon
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Thanks for the info Vernmented. I have a special rootstock I'm experimenting with
http://tropicalfruitforum.com/index.php?topic=20852.0 (http://tropicalfruitforum.com/index.php?topic=20852.0)
This rootstock should have a decent fibrous rootsystem because of the Microkote I applied to the pot.
http://tropicalfruitforum.com/index.php?topic=20852.0 (http://tropicalfruitforum.com/index.php?topic=20852.0)
I'll post pictures and give descriptions of each rootstock once the planters have been refreshed and are ready for planting.
Simon
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I finished topping off my planters with new planting mix.
(https://s21.postimg.cc/vcmile1qb/IMG_1820.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/image/vcmile1qb/)
I have 4 of these large planters so I'll be using 4 different types of rootstocks. All of the rootstocks will be ungrafted seedlings in order to minimize chances of early flowering.
The first rootstock will be a regular Kent seedling as I find these to grow vigorously from seed and I want to test out a Monoembryonic type seedling.
The second rootstock will be a Lemon Zest or Sweet Tart seedling. These are Polyembryonic and will not require grafting.
The third rootstock will be a Lavern Manilla which I believe is a polyembryonic variety that has shown excellent growth and good disease resistance in SoCal.
The fourth rootstock will be one of my California Super Mango rootstocks. These rootstocks have been multiple approach grafted with various mono and polyembryonic varieties. My CSM rootstocks have all been grown in pots treated with Microkote to encourage a dense fibrous feeder root structure and to inhibit encircling of the roots. I'll post pictures of the trees as soon as I get them planted.
Simon
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I got three of my trees planted, I can't find any Lavern Manilla right now but they should be showing up in the garden centers soon.
This first picture is my California Super Mango rootstock with multiple supporting rootstocks of various varieties. All the other seedlings in this bed are just random seedlings I'll use for future grafting.
(https://s27.postimg.cc/twde38ijz/IMG_1896.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/image/twde38ijz/)
Next is my Lemon Zest seedling. This guy is ugly with only a few leaves left. I keep plucking leaves off of it to show other growers that this seedlings sap smells just like the actual grafted Lemon Zest variety.
(https://s7.postimg.cc/78dicxeav/IMG_1897.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/image/78dicxeav/)
Next is a very vigorous Kent seedling.
(https://s21.postimg.cc/7dis76wtv/IMG_1898.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/image/7dis76wtv/)
I disturbed the roots a bit while planting these seedlings so I'm going to let them recover a bit before topping them in order to develop a low canopy.
Simon
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Simon,
Wishing you success, that espaliered mango looks incredible! So your planters are essentially huge bags supported by PVC frames? Will the roots grow through to the clay soil underneath?
Trung
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I was wondering about the same thing, considering the max. height is only about 14 to 18 inches for the roots to grow in...
But, looking at the 1st picture, seems that the bottom is not your natural soil, but concrete, right?!
This means that the root system will be mostly "running" horizontally within the 14-18 inches amended soil thickness, Simon? (Without the benefit of reading those listed 3 pdf-s above, - later - ).
This, would be very interesting undertaking project to follow through on to see the outcome...good luck, Simon!
"thumbs up"!
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Thanks guys. Trung, the raised beds are made up of fabric and you are correct that they are supported by PVC framing. These raised beds are filled with potting soil and are set on top of concrete so there is nowhere for the roots to go except to stay inside the confines of the raised bed.
Sam, you are correct, the raised beds are only about 14 inches tall and that is all the vertical height the plants roots will receive. I am trying to follow the directions given by the attached articles as closely as I can.
These beds are planted along my South facing wall so this spot will give them the most sunlight and the concrete flooring will heat up the soil faster and also wick away excess moisture. I have no issues growing mangos in raised beds or in pots because the soil is slightly acidic to begin with. Most my issues planting mango arises when I plant the trees into the ground where the pH is too high and there is much buffering capacity from the high mineral content of my clay soils.
I'll try to keep this thread updated with pictures so that everyone can follow along on another crazy mango growing adventure. As these trees grow, I will take their growth rate and structure into consideration and if there are any trees that are significantly lagging behind the others in growth, I will replace it.
I've had these raised bed planters for about 4 years now and my main concern is that they will soon begin to deteriorate. If this happens, I will probably frame around it with vinyl or wooden panels.
Simon
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Simon, hope I am wrong, but I have some concern that the 14" "soft" soil won't be strong enough to hold the roots, thus , the tree , to be sturdy enough once it reaches a certain height...(unlike a natural soil...).
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Sam you are absolutely correct that I should be concerned because the trees can become unstable in high winds. I'm not so worried about the roots busting out of the fabric because they will be air pruned as soon as they grow out of the container.
I am closely following the Japanese method and I will be tying down branches when the time comes and I already have stainless steel C hooks screwed into my roofline about every 2-3feet for holding up branches and supporting fruit. I will not allow these trees to grow too tall but I do want them to grow tall enough to partially shade my South facing wall so that it will cool down my house in the Summertime so that I can save some money by running my AC less often.
I consider this project as living artwork with real designed benefits for me and the plants. Aside from the cooling affects from shading my wall, the plants benefit from being planted in the sunniest spot in my yard which in turn means the mangos get more actual heat and foot candle units which hopefully will translate into higher quality and sweeter fruit.
I will likely stick with the guidelines set by Dr Yonemotos articles and only allow 1 fruit for every 80 leaves in order to maximize quality.
My side yard is literally only 4-5 feet wide and I'm now able to utilize this space for fruit production instead of leaving it empty.
Simon
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Nice project Simon, your inspiration tree is a work of Art! I think this is the way to go for many different fruiting trees. Espalier to the ultimate ;) 8)Keep us posted on this worthy effort i like it! :)
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I was absolutely wowed when I saw the Japanese style of ultra low pruned and espalied Mango and Avocado trees
As far as development of the trunk and branching, I will follow the direction from mr John Yoshimi Yonemoto from the Japan Tropical Fruit Association.
Simon
FYI he's coming to the Hawaii tropical fruit growers conference in Hilo this year....
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I was absolutely wowed when I saw the Japanese style of ultra low pruned and espalied Mango and Avocado trees
As far as development of the trunk and branching, I will follow the direction from mr John Yoshimi Yonemoto from the Japan Tropical Fruit Association.
Simon
FYI he's coming to the Hawaii tropical fruit growers conference in Hilo this year....
Please tell him he's an inspiration and tell him about my experiments if you get a chance to speak with him, maybe he will have some tips for me.
I wonder if Dr Yonemoto knows about the newer Zill varieties like Lemon Zest, Sweet Tart, Phoenix, Cotton Candy? I know they are selecting for red colored mangoes for gifts but I think they can have a whole new market for superior tasting mangos that many if not most would consider is much better eating quality than Irwin. These new Zill varieties can have Brix averaging 22-28%.
Simon
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Espalier mangos look incredible and maybe a great idea.
I wonder if this will work with those weeping varieties.
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I'm considering planting my Cotton Candy on Florida/Turpentine rootstock in my last bed and the droopy growth may actually be easier to Espalier. My only issue is that it is grafted so it will flower in Winter and will ultimately delay my trees reaching production size.
Simon
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I read those articles yet not sure if they removed the tap root. Did you remove the tap root? How are your trees doing?
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I got a late start and changed a few things around but things are looking great so far. The Lavern Manilla seedling trees just started showing at my local nurseries so I recently planted it into the raised bed.
One of my Lemon Zest seedlings got killed so I'm replacing it with an Orange Sherbet seedling which was recently planted and hasn't sprouted yet.
I had so many random seedlings popping up in my raised beds that I had dig many of them up and transplant them elsewhere and during the transplant, some of the small feeder roots got damaged but the seedlings are finally starting to settle in now.
In the articles, they pruned the roots and used root limiting sheets to keep trees small. I have some seedlings like my California Super mango rootstock that was grown in MicroKote treated pots which chemically root prunes. I also have a couple in-situ planted seeds which will have undisturbed root growth until it hits the bottom or sides of my raised bed which is fabric so it should cause root pruning as well unless the roots decide to follow the contours of the raised bed like I've observed previously.
I'll post some updated pictures shortly.
Simon
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I read those articles yet not sure if they removed the tap root. Did you remove the tap root? How are your trees doing?
I believe in the talks he mentioned he used a sawzall to remove the taproot. I can ask him again this year at the HTFG conference. Last year at the conference I talked to him for a couple hours about ideas. He is a great resource. Especially his pruning workshop... it was amazing. I think I have some of it on video somewhere.
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I read those articles yet not sure if they removed the tap root. Did you remove the tap root? How are your trees doing?
I believe in the talks he mentioned he used a sawzall to remove the taproot. I can ask him again this year at the HTFG conference. Last year at the conference I talked to him for a couple hours about ideas. He is a great resource. Especially his pruning workshop... it was amazing. I think I have some of it on video somewhere.
I would love to see any videos you have of Dr Yonemoto speaking about mangos!
Simon
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Those PDF look like his presentation handouts. It would be great if you would post any video of the actual presentation on Youtube.
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https://youtu.be/SYDNhaDWdYc
The video quality isn't that great. I only recorded 8 mins, and the whole session was probably 20+ minutes long. This is the second pruning workshop. The second time he worked on this tree. The prior time was 2 years earlier. The goal was to get the tree to sit lower.
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Thanks for the video.
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I used one of my California Super Mango Rootstock seedlings planted in a MicroKote treated pot for this Japanese inspired ultra low tree. I have my original experiments still growing but they are developing slower because they only have a single rootstock.
I like the idea of having one of these Japanese inspired trees inside a plastic half barrel because it will be somewhat transportable when small or if heavily pruned back. This tree has nice branching and a thick trunk considering it is only a little over one year old.
Because I intend to keep this tree relatively small, I am not planning on it producing lots of fruit. The focus will be on producing fewer, ultra high quality fruit of top tier varieties. Because this tree is potted and will be wide and relatively short in stature, I need to keep the overall width of the tree to a reasonable size, maybe 3x3 or at most 4x4 so that I can perform annual or biannual root pruning and re potting.
I will also have to graft low so that if/when I need to cut the tree back for rejuvenation or for transport, the cuts will be above the graft line.
I plan on making this a designer tree and will treat it as much as artwork as I will treat it as a fruit producing tree. So far, I plan to graft the following varieties onto it:
1) Lemon Zest
2) Sweet Tart
3) Fruit Punch
4) Piña Colada
5) Peach Cobbler
6) Pineapple Pleasure
7) Cotton Candy
8) Phoenix
In the future, I plan on creating more themed trees such as the Citrus themed consisting of PPK, Lemon Zest and Orange Sherbet Seedling.
Anyways, here are my first ties on the first tree. These bends/ties are to keep the branches low but still angled upwards but only slightly. I am also positioning the branches in a manner that will fill in all the empty space.
(https://s1.postimg.cc/222r9dyn8b/30_C26_FD8-_A592-4575-_B9_DE-_C28_EFDF93811.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/image/222r9dyn8b/)
(https://s1.postimg.cc/1rfxg8i4sb/4_D260_B9_D-_FC03-46_BE-9714-6_C8593_B5_BB8_C.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/image/1rfxg8i4sb/)
(https://s1.postimg.cc/4825v5rla3/96349_B66-70_F5-43_D6-_A0_F3-2_F5_EB405_B12_D.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/image/4825v5rla3/)
(https://s1.postimg.cc/1d9hpdc6sr/D89931_D3-7_C18-42_CD-_B8_DA-6_D47_DD636_A28.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/image/1d9hpdc6sr/)
(https://s1.postimg.cc/9fxgi5lg3f/E5_D7171_C-_C79_D-4224-_A1_B6-_A6724_D04_A50_A.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/image/9fxgi5lg3f/)
Simon
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Simon - You are undertaking a fascinating project which looks to be doing very well. Congratulations.
A mundane question that may be relevant to others too is whether your trees may become a violation of building ordinances. The 4' side yard is mandated as a fire break and a tree may be considered a fire hazard. It probably won't be a problem unless you have a grumpy neighbor who complains but it's just a heads-up in case you want to check. I had trees on the south side of my house and Santa Monica (an arbor day tree city) demanded that I cut them down after they changed city ordinances to limit "fences" in front of houses to 4'. Apparently an anonymous neighbor complained. I managed to save them by appealing directly to the city council but the whole process was time consuming and expensive.
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Simon - You are undertaking a fascinating project which looks to be doing very well. Congratulations.
A mundane question that may be relevant to others too is whether your trees may become a violation of building ordinances. The 4' side yard is mandated as a fire break and a tree may be considered a fire hazard. It probably won't be a problem unless you have a grumpy neighbor who complains but it's just a heads-up in case you want to check. I had trees on the south side of my house and Santa Monica (an arbor day tree city) demanded that I cut them down after they changed city ordinances to limit "fences" in front of houses to 4'. Apparently an anonymous neighbor complained. I managed to save them by appealing directly to the city council but the whole process was time consuming and expensive.
Hello BajaJohn, that’s a good point. My neighborhood is not governed by HOA and many homes in the area have trees surrounding their homes. The fire codes are their for a reason and my side yard has enough room for me to knock out the windows and their is enough clearance next to the fence to make a get away.
My upcoming plans are to create more of these trees in half barrels so that they are more easily transported. Being able to transport them will allow me to lend it out to the local California Rare Fruit Growers Association to garner more interest in growing rare fruit.
Simon
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I have a Malika Espalier against my house.
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That’s awesome, I would love to see a picture if you have time to post it here.
Simon
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I will when i get a chance.
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I have a Malika Espalier against my house.
How old is the tree?
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4 years 3 in the ground.
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I believe that tree is 25 years old! Truly inspiring. They do extensive root pruning on their rootstock before and after getting into the ground. Think bonsai. Once it is in the ground the roots are contained in a metal trough. The root zone is primarily made up of secondary feeder roots.
I noticed that. Am confused about the botany, the relationship behind root pruning and production. Don't they also hit their trees with a PGR aka Bonzi at bloom time? Speaking of secondary feeder roots, I have a network of fine feed roots on top of the soil and underneath the mulch. Got that forest thang going on!
(https://s1.postimg.cc/9rlhy9pqgr/avocadoroots.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/image/9rlhy9pqgr/)
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I believe that tree is 25 years old! Truly inspiring. They do extensive root pruning on their rootstock before and after getting into the ground. Think bonsai. Once it is in the ground the roots are contained in a metal trough. The root zone is primarily made up of secondary feeder roots.
I noticed that. Am confused about the botany, the relationship behind root pruning and production. Don't they also hit their trees with a PGR aka Bonzi at bloom time? Speaking of secondary feeder roots, I have a network of fine feed roots on top of the soil and underneath the mulch. Got that forest thang going on!
(https://s1.postimg.cc/9rlhy9pqgr/avocadoroots.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/image/9rlhy9pqgr/)
Damn those are healthy dense roots! I’m just starting my experiments with rooting hormones for my non fruiting trees. The density of your roots tells me how healthy your tree is. Awesome!
Simon
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I believe that tree is 25 years old! Truly inspiring. They do extensive root pruning on their rootstock before and after getting into the ground. Think bonsai. Once it is in the ground the roots are contained in a metal trough. The root zone is primarily made up of secondary feeder roots.
I noticed that. Am confused about the botany, the relationship behind root pruning and production. Don't they also hit their trees with a PGR aka Bonzi at bloom time? Speaking of secondary feeder roots, I have a network of fine feed roots on top of the soil and underneath the mulch. Got that forest thang going on!
(https://s1.postimg.cc/9rlhy9pqgr/avocadoroots.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/image/9rlhy9pqgr/)
Damn those are healthy dense roots! I’m just starting my experiments with rooting hormones for my non fruiting trees. The density of your roots tells me how healthy your tree is. Awesome!
Simon
Yep, proud of dem puppies. BTW the only thing I use on my trees is a slow release 18-4-9 which I've mentioned and a mulch of pine needles and avocado leaves.
Being you're one our amateur botanists always on the cutting edge, what are you doing with rooting hormones Simon? What are you looking for? Using synthetic auxins like the naptha. stuff?
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Hey Mark, I’m just trying to play with the big dogs and continuing to push the boundaries. I’ve already had success using the MicroKote and air pruning type pots but if I can get a denser, more wide spread system of roots in a shorter amount of time, why not go for it.
I’ve already purchased a product which I believe uses IBA but from my Botany class, there are many different PGRs I can use. Different species react differently to PGRs so the concentration and ratio of hormones will be important. I don’t want to spend resources figuring out what PGR and what ratio works best for Mango so I picked up something from off the shelves. I’ll take a picture of the product later when I get home. If you have a product you recommend, I would love the info.
I’m able to get a newly planted seedlings to become bushy and about 4 feet tall without the use of hormones and I’m hoping that the hormones will just speed things up even more. I will not be using hormones on producing trees however. My goal is to fill a large pot, say around 45-55 gallons as fast as possible using any technique available.
Simon
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That’s awesome, I would love to see a picture if you have time to post it here.
Simon
(https://s1.postimg.cc/2yb8kdcl8r/IMG_20171020_092619.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/image/2yb8kdcl8r/)
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Thanks for the picture, yesterday ur tree is beautiful! Has your tree produced any fruit yet?
Simon
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Here is a picture of the root stimulator I purchased.
(https://s1.postimg.cc/1135ktv8u3/E0954697-7_E45-49_B1-95_E8-_A266386_A38_D3.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/image/1135ktv8u3/)
Simon
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I went trough a few bottles of that stuff this year on some bare root plants and plumerias. Works decent. It has the same ingredient as powder root hormones. You can mix that powder to make the same type of thing and just water with a little. And then use the fertilizer you prefer seperate.
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Thanks for the advice Spaugh, I picked up this product on a whim. Hopefully I can find something stronger that can significantly increase root mass.
Simon
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I went trough a few bottles of that stuff this year on some bare root plants and plumerias. Works decent. It has the same ingredient as powder root hormones. You can mix that powder to make the same type of thing and just water with a little. And then use the fertilizer you prefer seperate.
Studies suggest that too much of these synthetic auxins will work against you, that they inhibit root cell division/elongation and can produce undesirable top growth. When it comes to messing with Mama's (nature) hormones, I'm a minimalist. Check these out.
https://www.google.com/search?source=hp&q=auxins+root+growth&oq=root+auxins&gs_l=psy-ab.1.1.0i22i30k1l2.69966554.69973664.0.69977948.17.16.0.0.0.0.761.2232.6-3.3.0....0...1.1.64.psy-ab..14.3.2232...0j0i131k1.0.y7ibmZikShU (https://www.google.com/search?source=hp&q=auxins+root+growth&oq=root+auxins&gs_l=psy-ab.1.1.0i22i30k1l2.69966554.69973664.0.69977948.17.16.0.0.0.0.761.2232.6-3.3.0....0...1.1.64.psy-ab..14.3.2232...0j0i131k1.0.y7ibmZikShU)
In horticulture, auxins, especially NAA and IBA, are commonly applied to stimulate root initiation when rooting cuttings of plants. However, high concentrations of auxin inhibit root elongation and instead enhance adventitious root formation. Removal of the root tip can lead to inhibition of secondary root formation.
Simon, I've played with root tip pruning systems for decades. The most fool proof, the most reliable one is painting the inside of the pot with a copper hydroxide laden latex paint. My Rootbuilder pots are doing what they are designed to do too.
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Here is a picture of the root stimulator I purchased.
(https://s1.postimg.cc/1135ktv8u3/E0954697-7_E45-49_B1-95_E8-_A266386_A38_D3.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/image/1135ktv8u3/)
Simon
Thank you , no fruit yet.The center needs to be thinned out to make it more defined but i'm holding off pruning till I see if it fruits this year. do you notice the two lowest branches seem to be stunted and the two above it are taking over. I'm thinking of top working those vigorous two branches to other varieties to see if that will give the lower branches a boost ,It had a center leader at one time and when i cut it out the two vigorous ones that you see took off, maybe to much.
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I went trough a few bottles of that stuff this year on some bare root plants and plumerias. Works decent. It has the same ingredient as powder root hormones. You can mix that powder to make the same type of thing and just water with a little. And then use the fertilizer you prefer seperate.
Studies suggest that too much of these synthetic auxins will work against you, that they inhibit root cell division/elongation and can produce undesirable top growth. When it comes to messing with Mama's (nature) hormones, I'm a minimalist. Check these out.
https://www.google.com/search?source=hp&q=auxins+root+growth&oq=root+auxins&gs_l=psy-ab.1.1.0i22i30k1l2.69966554.69973664.0.69977948.17.16.0.0.0.0.761.2232.6-3.3.0....0...1.1.64.psy-ab..14.3.2232...0j0i131k1.0.y7ibmZikShU (https://www.google.com/search?source=hp&q=auxins+root+growth&oq=root+auxins&gs_l=psy-ab.1.1.0i22i30k1l2.69966554.69973664.0.69977948.17.16.0.0.0.0.761.2232.6-3.3.0....0...1.1.64.psy-ab..14.3.2232...0j0i131k1.0.y7ibmZikShU)
In horticulture, auxins, especially NAA and IBA, are commonly applied to stimulate root initiation when rooting cuttings of plants. However, high concentrations of auxin inhibit root elongation and instead enhance adventitious root formation. Removal of the root tip can lead to inhibition of secondary root formation.
Simon, I've played with root tip pruning systems for decades. The most fool proof, the most reliable one is painting the inside of the pot with a copper hydroxide laden latex paint. My Rootbuilder pots are doing what they are designed to do too.
I just give the plants one dose when planting. Ive compared plumerias with and without and there is a big difference in root size, whiteness, and root vigor when the plants get a dose of this stuff. I wouldnt bother with it on trees with established root systems. For cuttings or bare rooted trees its worth a shot.
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Thank you , no fruit yet.The center needs to be thinned out to make it more defined but i'm holding off pruning till I see if it fruits this year. do you notice the two lowest branches seem to be stunted and the two above it are taking over. I'm thinking of top working those vigorous two branches to other varieties to see if that will give the lower branches a boost ,It had a center leader at one time and when i cut it out the two vigorous ones that you see took off, maybe to much.
Espalier is nice!
I don't really care for the taste of Mallika. Makes a nice compact tree but the fruit tastes like a pasty carrot to us. So, I cut it back to a stub and recently grafted 7 scions, all took - Cotton Candy, Fruit Punch, Pineapple Pleasure and Juicy Peach. Unlike Mallika they are a bit leggie with long internodes but look fantastic with stocky branches and big leaves.
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I have tasted Mallika when it was excellent and when it tasted like a carrot but its not my favorite either that's why I'm thinking of top working the two vigorous branches about twelve inches after the 90 degree bend maybe with some of the variety's you mentioned
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I went trough a few bottles of that stuff this year on some bare root plants and plumerias. Works decent. It has the same ingredient as powder root hormones. You can mix that powder to make the same type of thing and just water with a little. And then use the fertilizer you prefer seperate.
Studies suggest that too much of these synthetic auxins will work against you, that they inhibit root cell division/elongation and can produce undesirable top growth. When it comes to messing with Mama's (nature) hormones, I'm a minimalist. Check these out.
https://www.google.com/search?source=hp&q=auxins+root+growth&oq=root+auxins&gs_l=psy-ab.1.1.0i22i30k1l2.69966554.69973664.0.69977948.17.16.0.0.0.0.761.2232.6-3.3.0....0...1.1.64.psy-ab..14.3.2232...0j0i131k1.0.y7ibmZikShU (https://www.google.com/search?source=hp&q=auxins+root+growth&oq=root+auxins&gs_l=psy-ab.1.1.0i22i30k1l2.69966554.69973664.0.69977948.17.16.0.0.0.0.761.2232.6-3.3.0....0...1.1.64.psy-ab..14.3.2232...0j0i131k1.0.y7ibmZikShU)
In horticulture, auxins, especially NAA and IBA, are commonly applied to stimulate root initiation when rooting cuttings of plants. However, high concentrations of auxin inhibit root elongation and instead enhance adventitious root formation. Removal of the root tip can lead to inhibition of secondary root formation.
Simon, I've played with root tip pruning systems for decades. The most fool proof, the most reliable one is painting the inside of the pot with a copper hydroxide laden latex paint. My Rootbuilder pots are doing what they are designed to do too.
Hey Mark, I got most of my Copper Hydroxide and rootbuilder info from you and it’s worked great for me. I used to work in the field of research where I used a lot of different chemicals and hormones but I followed pre written protocols that gave specific concentrations for the target species that we were trying to promote root, shoot or both.
It’s amazing what can be done. Some plants are super easy to work with and you can make a leaf cut out grow into a full plant with roots and branches.
Some things that I’ve learned is that pot size is extremely important for a good head start for Mango trees and other trees as well. If you don’t up pot at the proper time, you can severely stunt a tree. At the same time, you don’t want to just plop a small seedling into the largest pot you can find. By planting seeds at the proper time of year and gradually stepping up the size of the pot and fertilizing properly, there is an additive effect I can compound with the multiple rootstock technique and greatly accelerate growth in my marginal climate.
Simon
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Simon your knowledge base is broad, passion is intense. it's fun experimenting.
Regarding pot size, all of my small newly grafted tropical trees have been upcanned into their permanent huge bottomless pots without any stepping up. I guess they're anywhere from 30 - 50 gals. Never had any root rot. Potting mix is anything I have in bulk in the field or bagged - perlite, vermiculite, pine bark, cypress bark, peat....whatever. it drains very fast.
For example, veneer graft of a Reed stick onto a Florida pit, a seedling:
(https://s1.postimg.cc/6l90ycj39n/Reed_Veneer_Graft5-6-12send.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/image/6l90ycj39n/)
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By planting seeds at the proper time of year and gradually stepping up the size of the pot and fertilizing properly, there is an additive effect I can compound with the multiple rootstock technique and greatly accelerate growth in my marginal climate.
Simon
Hey Simon, when is the most appropriate time in the year to up pot a seedling (i am speaking about soursop), now in the fall when it is going to go dormant or in the beginning of spring ?
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Hey Simon, when is the most appropriate time in the year to up pot a seedling (i am speaking about soursop), now in the fall when it is going to go dormant or in the beginning of spring ?
According to an expert source on avocado anatomical characteristics avocados have 2 major root flushes. For the N. Hemisphere that would be a peak in early April and again in late August. I would think the same effect would apply to the growing cycle of soursop. I'd upcan now.
No matter what the plant material I like to upcan when its cool and preferably when the tree is dormant. For deciduous trees best time would be fall. The more established that tree is before the summer heat hits.... the better.
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By planting seeds at the proper time of year and gradually stepping up the size of the pot and fertilizing properly, there is an additive effect I can compound with the multiple rootstock technique and greatly accelerate growth in my marginal climate.
Simon
Hey Simon, when is the most appropriate time in the year to up pot a seedling (i am speaking about soursop), now in the fall when it is going to go dormant or in the beginning of spring ?
Sorry Shinzo, I know next to nothing about Soursop.
Simon