Author Topic: Soil Analysis for my yard Southwest Ranches 2020 - Recommendations Welcome!!!  (Read 12039 times)

cbss_daviefl

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Re: Soil Analysis for my yard Southwest Ranches - Recommendations Welcome!!!
« Reply #25 on: January 30, 2018, 12:15:46 PM »
Delivery just arrived. Here is the label for anyone else interested:


Brandon

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Re: Soil Analysis for my yard Southwest Ranches - Recommendations Welcome!!!
« Reply #26 on: January 30, 2018, 08:21:02 PM »
That 8-2-12 is great, but I supplement with 0-0-6, which has a much higher fe, mn, and zn (14%, 4.18%, and 1.4% respectively). Was magic for my orchard.
Jeff  :-)

cbss_daviefl

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Re: Soil Analysis for my yard Southwest Ranches - Recommendations Welcome!!!
« Reply #27 on: January 31, 2018, 12:28:21 AM »
The interesting thing about all this is how the different soil variable values change the strategy required to deal with a problem. Mn is difficult because my pH makes soil application ineffective and foliar is only effective in new growth. Chelated Mn has been found to make deficiencies worse because  chelates will drop from the Mn and attach to Fe and transport the Fe into the plants. But when pH is below 6, Mn in soil becomes easily available and sometimes causes toxicity. Based on those findings, I was just resigned to doing foliar Mn applications. Then I start reading about how to fix my phosphorous deficiency and multiple formulations. One formulation monoammonium phosphate creates a very localized 4.3 pH area around the granules. Then I read it can be combined with Mn granules because the low pH area will keep the Mn from getting bound. When used together, they solve both my P and Mn deficiencies in my alkaline soil. For my boron deficiency, the 0.22% in the 8-2-12 should cover it. On the trees with dieback, I will do one foliar spray with borax at 1 teaspoon per gallon. I will suppliment potassium with 100 lbs 0-0-50 potassium sulphate granules. And of course, another 600 lbs tiger90 sulfur granules.
Brandon

pineislander

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Re: Soil Analysis for my yard Southwest Ranches - Recommendations Welcome!!!
« Reply #28 on: January 31, 2018, 05:53:35 AM »
I finally took the time to get my soil analyzed.  I wish I had done this when I moved in.  I am pretty lazy and hard headed.  My thanks to Jeff (Cookiemonster) and others for posting so much great information on soil testing and analysis.  I can now see that my pH, calcium, and zinc are way high. My potassium is way low(causing magnesium problems), phosphorus and manganese are low too.  I bought 550 pounds of Tiger90 before I did the test. It is still sitting in a shed. After I bought it, I stopped myself from applying it until I got the testing done. 

 


Comparing my spectrum report to yours of last year I notice the numbers in "Optimal" column are different for some reason.
Not sure why this would be....perhaps they vary over different pH ranges, different crops, relationship between other elements, soil type, organic matter, or some unknowns?




Guanabanus

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Re: Soil Analysis for my yard Southwest Ranches - Recommendations Welcome!!!
« Reply #29 on: January 31, 2018, 08:04:42 AM »
Brandon's crop for this sample was specified  as Jakfruit.  Yours, apparently is generic.
Har

cbss_daviefl

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Re: Soil Analysis for my yard Southwest Ranches - Recommendations Welcome!!!
« Reply #30 on: January 31, 2018, 09:04:51 AM »
The crop is different. The recommendations are specific to the crop. I have 53 Fruit Orchard selected for most samples. 606 Mango for my mango section. They do not have many sub tropical fruit profiles available, mango, avocado, guava, papaya, pineapple, and a few others.  You can change the crop to get different recommendations.  I am not 100% sure of the specifics but the CEC, pH, and soil type may also change the "optimal" levels on some elements. I see you have 14 ppm Mn and it shows in good green. I have similar levels of Mn and it shows in low red.
Brandon

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Re: Soil Analysis for my yard Southwest Ranches - Recommendations Welcome!!!
« Reply #31 on: January 31, 2018, 09:41:59 AM »
Can someone recommend which soil sample test should be good enough for Mango Trees for homeowners?

From Texas A&M AGRILIFE

1. Routine Analysis (R) $12 per sample
(pH, NO3-N, P, K, Ca, Mg, Na, S and Conductivity)
(This test is a base test for basic fertilizer recommendations.)

2. R + Micronutrients (Micro) $19 per sample
(Adds Zn, Fe, Cu, and Mn to test 1.)

3. R + Micro + Boron (B) $26 per sample
( Includes Test 2 plus boron)
(Recommended for individuals applying compost and manures.)

4. R + Detailed Salinity $34 per sample
(Includes Test 1 plus detailed salinity analysis)
(Recommended for individuals using lower quality irrigation water.)

5. R + Micro + Detailed Salinity $41 per sample
(Includes Test 2 plus detailed salinity analysis)

6. Routine Analysis + Organic Matter $32 per sample
(Includes Test 1 plus organic matter analysis)

7. R + Micro + Organic Matter $39 per sample
(Includes Test 2 plus organic matter analysis)

8. R + Micro + B + Organic Matter $46 per sample
(Includes Test 3 plus organic matter analysis)

9. R + Texture (determines % sand, silt, and clay) $32 per sample
(Includes Test 1 plus textural analysis)

10. R + Micro + Texture $39 per sample
(Includes Test 2 plus textural analysis)

11. R + Micro + B + Organic Matter + Detailed Salinity $68 per sample
(Includes Test 8 plus detailed salinity)

12. R + Micro + B + Org. Matter + Detailed Sal. + Texture $88 per sample
(Includes Test 8 plus textural analysis and detailed salinity and provides the most comprehensive
data needed for troubleshooting most plant/soil growing issues {does not address pathogen, pesticide or
hydrocarbon issues}).
“When life gives you lemons, throw it back & say, “I said I wanted a MANGO!”

cbss_daviefl

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Re: Soil Analysis for my yard Southwest Ranches - Recommendations Welcome!!!
« Reply #32 on: January 31, 2018, 10:57:07 AM »
Boron seems to be a factor in my yard and seems like it may be a common issue in southern Florida. I have no knowledge of your area or what the common pitfalls may be so test 3 as a minimum would help you to make decisions on a fertilization program.  Most of my mango trees seem to power through even though my soil is alkaline and highly deficient in 2 major and 2 minor elements.
Brandon

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Re: Soil Analysis for my yard Southwest Ranches - Recommendations Welcome!!!
« Reply #33 on: January 31, 2018, 10:57:52 AM »
In my case, I was able to rectify fairly severe chlorosis with heavy soil application of Mn, Zn, and Fe (in conjunction with tiger-90 to lower the pH). The products I used were: techmangam, tiger zinc 18%, sequestrene 138, and 0-0-6. It took several applications that spanned a couple of years, but the end result is that all of my trees are a beautiful dark green -- even the more pH sensitive species, such as carambola. But I do have a very high organic matter content, which stores a lot of what I'm applying.

Foliar application helped some in my case, but not nearly as much as heavy soil application. And in order for foliar sprays to be  most effective, you really need to time it to when the leaves are fully formed but yet still tender. Otherwise, you get chlorosis with green freckles. At this point, I don't even need to apply foliar nutrition and haven't done so for quite some time.

With tiger-90, you should be able to lower the pH quite a ways. As an experiment, I applied it at the rate of about 10,000 pounds per acre to soil which had visible chunks of calcium carbonate. My calculations were off, and I ended up lowering the pH down to the low 3's :-). Three to four years on, it's now pretty close to 7 again, which is a good thing, because some plants weren't fond of the acid situation :-).

The interesting thing about all this is how the different soil variable values change the strategy required to deal with a problem. Mn is difficult because my pH makes soil application ineffective and foliar is only effective in new growth. Chelated Mn has been found to make deficiencies worse because  chelates will drop from the Mn and attach to Fe and transport the Fe into the plants. But when pH is below 6, Mn in soil becomes easily available and sometimes causes toxicity. Based on those findings, I was just resigned to doing foliar Mn applications. Then I start reading about how to fix my phosphorous deficiency and multiple formulations. One formulation monoammonium phosphate creates a very localized 4.3 pH area around the granules. Then I read it can be combined with Mn granules because the low pH area will keep the Mn from getting bound. When used together, they solve both my P and Mn deficiencies in my alkaline soil. For my boron deficiency, the 0.22% in the 8-2-12 should cover it. On the trees with dieback, I will do one foliar spray with borax at 1 teaspoon per gallon. I will suppliment potassium with 100 lbs 0-0-50 potassium sulphate granules. And of course, another 600 lbs tiger90 sulfur granules.
Jeff  :-)

snowjunky

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Re: Soil Analysis for my yard Southwest Ranches - Recommendations Welcome!!!
« Reply #34 on: October 17, 2018, 05:36:42 AM »
That 8-2-12 is great, but I supplement with 0-0-6, which has a much higher fe, mn, and zn (14%, 4.18%, and 1.4% respectively). Was magic for my orchard.

Where do you buy Helena products as a home gardener?  Do you have to be in the gardening business to buy it?

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Re: Soil Analysis for my yard Southwest Ranches - Recommendations Welcome!!!
« Reply #35 on: October 17, 2018, 09:34:58 PM »
If Helena has a supply house in the Phoenix area, they will probably deliver purchases above $250, if your place is truck and piggyback loader accessible.   First you will need to open an account in person, and they will prefer some sort of nursery, farm, or landscape license.
Har

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Re: Soil Analysis for my yard Southwest Ranches - Recommendations Welcome!!!
« Reply #36 on: October 18, 2018, 02:56:56 AM »
If Helena has a supply house in the Phoenix area, they will probably deliver purchases above $250, if your place is truck and piggyback loader accessible.   First you will need to open an account in person, and they will prefer some sort of nursery, farm, or landscape license.

Thanks for the info.  I guess I'll just have to settle for Dyna Gro.

Mark in Texas

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Re: Soil Analysis for my yard Southwest Ranches - Recommendations Welcome!!!
« Reply #37 on: October 18, 2018, 10:42:34 AM »
Highly recommend Keyplex 350DP for micros, either foliar or soil applied.

Used to use Aggie labs. No mas.  Ward labs is far superior regarding service and are also a certified lab, Aggie lab is not.  You'll get your results within 24 hrs. of receipt via email.   Great tech help too.
https://www.wardlab.com/

I just worked in a boat load of sulfur powder in my veggie garden which is super high in Ca.  I also have Sulfur pastules which are easy to broadcast and dissolve fairly quickly, especially considering the recent record floods here the hill country.  10" will do it.  ;)
« Last Edit: October 18, 2018, 10:45:00 AM by Mark in Texas »

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Re: Soil Analysis for my yard Southwest Ranches - Recommendations Welcome!!!
« Reply #38 on: October 18, 2018, 11:30:31 AM »
I'll give ward labs a shot.

Curious to see the updated soil test from cbss.
Jeff  :-)

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Re: Soil Analysis for my yard Southwest Ranches - Recommendations Welcome!!!
« Reply #39 on: October 19, 2018, 06:11:04 PM »
I was using Osmocote total 18-6-8 with micronutrients 180 day 100% slow release fertilizer from distributor Diamond -R. It is a very good choice because with the 100% slow release feature nothing gets wasted during rainy season. They stopped carrying it instead offering an inferior mix. This week I found the Rep for Howard fertilizer and his price for the same product sounds about the same as it did, $56 for 50 lbs. I do know that fertilizer prices sometimes follow fuel prices. They will deliver if the order is over $500.

Here are their locations:
 http://www.howardfertilizer.com/locations

Mark in Texas

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Re: Soil Analysis for my yard Southwest Ranches - Recommendations Welcome!!!
« Reply #40 on: October 22, 2018, 07:53:24 AM »
I was using Osmocote total 18-6-8 with micronutrients 180 day 100% slow release fertilizer from distributor Diamond -R. It is a very good choice because with the 100% slow release feature nothing gets wasted during rainy season. They stopped carrying it instead offering an inferior mix. This week I found the Rep for Howard fertilizer and his price for the same product sounds about the same as it did, $56 for 50 lbs. I do know that fertilizer prices sometimes follow fuel prices. They will deliver if the order is over $500.

Here are their locations:
 http://www.howardfertilizer.com/locations

Buy Polyon then from Harrell's.   For starts, it's a better product regarding the science behind the nutrient release.   I've been using a couple of bags for years.



My juvenile mangos love it.  Glad they can't read.  ;D

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Re: Soil Analysis for my yard Southwest Ranches - Recommendations Welcome!!!
« Reply #41 on: February 15, 2019, 07:37:49 PM »
Here is 2019's results. Not much improvement. I was pretty busy with work so I was not able to push things according to plan.




Here is the Yearly comparison

« Last Edit: February 15, 2019, 07:53:59 PM by cbss_daviefl »
Brandon

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Re: Soil Analysis for my yard Southwest Ranches - Recommendations Welcome!!!
« Reply #42 on: February 16, 2019, 08:35:04 AM »
pH improved a decent bit. It's a logarithmic scale, so it's actually fairly substantial.

Here is 2019's results. Not much improvement. I was pretty busy with work so I was not able to push things according to plan.




Here is the Yearly comparison

Jeff  :-)

Mark in Texas

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Are you guys considering the nutritional value your rootstock plays?  I thought Turpentine was a great match for your calcareous soils?  pH of 7.5 aint too shabby.  Mine is 8.2.

tiger-90, sulfur pastules.  Weird but a bag of it is much cheaper than sulfur powder at local feed stores.

Heads up - A.M. Leo is having free shipping thru the 18th.  I just got a bag of this incredible food for $85 shipped!!!!!!!!!  I put the word out at several fruit groups so I don't know if they have any in stock.  Free shipping is pretty nice.
https://www.amleo.com/

Osmocote 19-5-8 Slow Release Fertilizer, 9 mo., 50#, $85 shipped.  What a steal!
https://www.amleo.com/slow-release-fertilizer/c/P15B/filter/100000002311eq100000004951/

I know, too much N for some of you.   :D I'm a N freak based on my soil analysis.  I'm also in the camp that young mango trees need such a high N food which also increase micros.   

Lots to choose from - https://www.amleo.com/slow-release-fertilizer/c/P15B/

 

Cookie Monster

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Mangoes will perform adequately on pH of 8.2. That's where most of Homestead is at, and they seem to do well there.

That osmocote is a good deal. Back when I was growing trees for sale, that was my goto fert for the potted trees. The N is way too high for an in-ground mango, but could work for just about anything else. (BTW, pretty much all of the non-mango trees do far better with a good supply of N.)

Are you guys considering the nutritional value your rootstock plays?  I thought Turpentine was a great match for your calcareous soils?  pH of 7.5 aint too shabby.  Mine is 8.2.

tiger-90, sulfur pastules.  Weird but a bag of it is much cheaper than sulfur powder at local feed stores.

Heads up - A.M. Leo is having free shipping thru the 18th.  I just got a bag of this incredible food for $85 shipped!!!!!!!!!  I put the word out at several fruit groups so I don't know if they have any in stock.  Free shipping is pretty nice.
https://www.amleo.com/

Osmocote 19-5-8 Slow Release Fertilizer, 9 mo., 50#, $85 shipped.  What a steal!
https://www.amleo.com/slow-release-fertilizer/c/P15B/filter/100000002311eq100000004951/

I know, too much N for some of you.   :D I'm a N freak based on my soil analysis.  I'm also in the camp that young mango trees need such a high N food which also increase micros.   

Lots to choose from - https://www.amleo.com/slow-release-fertilizer/c/P15B/
Jeff  :-)

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Are you guys considering the nutritional value your rootstock plays?  I thought Turpentine was a great match for your calcareous soils?  pH of 7.5 aint too shabby.  Mine is 8.2

Ours is 5.9
 8)
 :P

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whew....8.2 makes me not feel so bad.
but 5.9 makes me jealous  ;D

Mark in Texas

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A.M. Leonard sells quite a few different NPK slow release prills.   Back Order went in, got a 50# bag of Oscomocote for $85 shipped come March!

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That is great for my potted plants but that is not economical or balanced properly for my yard. I have over an acre of trees planted and require over 30 bags of fert for a single year, most available at $20 - $25 a bag. Being that my phosphates are low, I think I am going to do one or two rounds of 10-10-10. Helena's 8-2-12 slow release during the rainy season. Howards 8-2-12 before the rainy season. 20 bags of Tiger/Rocket 90 sulfur. Maybe 10 bags of 0-0-50 granular, 50 pounds mangenese sulfphate, 20 pounds 10% boron granular.  That is the plan anyway. What actually happens will probably be less.

A.M. Leonard sells quite a few different NPK slow release prills.   Back Order went in, got a 50# bag of Oscomocote for $85 shipped come March!
Brandon

Mark in Texas

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That is great for my potted plants but that is not economical or balanced properly for my yard. I have over an acre of trees planted and require over 30 bags of fert for a single year, most available at $20 - $25 a bag

You're right, it's not economical for field trees.  I have applied it to all new plantings on my farm - 10,000 trees over a 10 year period, vineyard, etc.  Here's an old pic of me doing a head down hiney drill with the initial planting of 1,750 one gallon pots.  And no, I don't use a measuring spoon anymore!  I throw a handful at the base, scratch it in with my foot and move on.  They love it.