Buddy Tapesters Vs Parafilmers

[Cookie Monster]

How long before you start to see that kind of cracking? A good graft will start to bond within a couple of weeks. And, once the cambium bonds, the scion can live totally uncovered. If the scion hasn't fully bonded within about 4 weeks, the graft would likely fail no matter what you use to cover it. So, the crack in the parafilm shouldn't make any difference unless it's cracking 2 to 3 weeks into the graft.

Joe,

It happened to me too in some Cherimoya grafts. Note that Cherimoya union expands hard during union bond and parafilm cracks instead of expanding along with it. see the attached picture. I did not have this problem in say plums or apricots, but Cherimoya and Guava grafts got high failure rates with Parafilm.



Yes, I blame Parafilm on some of the failures that I endured, scions are very hard to get anyway and then lose them because of stupid parafilm is very disturbing.

[behlgarden]

I would say about 3 weeks in this case and I saw cracking. I saw cracking in one other scion and water had gotten into the crack and rotted the union. Here in So Cal we had very fluctuating weather in last 30 days. Regardless, the point here is that Parafilm is for sealing, and if it cant flex and crack instead it defeats the purpose IMHO

James, on another roll of buddy tape, check out the 3rd order post and see how many remaining. we may have one or two before we place the order.

[emegar]

Jeff,

I've had a similar experience to Behl.  I've had some successes with Parafilm, certainly, but also some failures due (I think) to cracking of the product and dessication of the scion.  As an example, I did some grafting about two months ago on my cherimoya, using parafilm, that only broke dormancy in tha last week or so.  I had given up on them, but the parafilm held moisture in the scions all that time, and they were still viable when the tree began to push new growth.  On the other hand, earlier in the spring, I did quite a few stonefruit grafts, and only had 50-70% success.  When I inspected the failed grafts, within about a month of performing them, they had already cracked in the sun.  My guess is that success with Parafilm is dependent on not overstretching the tape.

James

[Patrick]

I guess the Buddytape handles sun exposure better? I really never have a problem with parafilm stretching to the size I need, and its ALOT cheaper for sure.  I almost felt bad using Buddytape on Avocado as if they werent worthy of the almighty Buddytape..I guess I will use it as a "topshelf" grafting material for those really "important" situations.

[behlgarden]

I would say that parafilm is good for covering the scion without much stretching, but at union I would recommend using buddy tape as it would stretch and not crack.

In my mango grafts I exclusively used buddy tape

[fruitlovers]

ha -- you'd trip if you saw how they do it in other countries. My brother-in-law (a horticultural researcher from El Salvador) just takes plastic bags, cuts them into 1 inch wide strips, and uses that :-). I guess that would be considered 'fire', 'wheel', or maybe even bronze age technology :-).

Honestly, the kind of tape you use doesn't make a difference on rate of take. And, a skilled grafter can speed through the grafting process regardless of what he's using to wrap. They get pretty agile at their craft. This forum is the first place I've ever heard of anyone complaining about parafilm ;-). As long as you can protect your graft against water intrusion and prevent desiccation -- whether it's with a recycled grocery bag, buddy tape deluxe, or parafilm -- then the other variables in the grafting process (skill level, cut, time of year, health, etc) are the ones that dictate rate of take.

oh btw, parafilm is like dial up modem to me...antiquated.

buddy tape is like having spider silk...like spiderman of splicing.

There's someone here that swears by black electrical tape for grafting. It also stretches! Other good qualties are that you can buy it almost anywhere and it's very cheap!

[edself65]

If you place the sticky side in contact with the bark it will pull tender bark and cambium off at removal.

Ed

There's someone here that swears by black electrical tape for grafting. It also stretches! Other good qualties are that you can buy it almost anywhere and it's very cheap!

[FlyingFoxFruits]

I wonder if anyone has grafted with their bare hands?  snap the branches in half and then jam them together, and wrap with spit and hair.

[Cookie Monster]

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA If you're stranded on a deserted island and need to graft a mango tree where u gonna find buddy tape.. have to be resourceful :-).

I wonder if anyone has grafted with their bare hands?  snap the branches in half and the  jam them together, wrap with spit and hair.

[fruitlovers]

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA If you're stranded on a deserted island and need to graft a mango tree where u gonna find buddy tape.. have to be resourceful :-).

I wonder if anyone has grafted with their bare hands?  snap the branches in half and the  jam them together, wrap with spit and hair.

Chinese were grafting plants hundreds of years ago without buddy tape or parafilm or even electrical tape or plastic bag strips. Wonder what they used? Maybe some kind of rattan, jute, or maybe even hemp fibers?

[behlgarden]

Dang it, found two more casualties  , thanks to cracked parafilm at union, the wedge and another t-bud had dried out.

I will use parafilm for wraping scion only, that too without much stretching. I can also blame hot and cold weather too.

[fruitlovers]

Dang it, found two more casualties  , thanks to cracked parafilm at union, the wedge and another t-bud had dried out.

I will use parafilm for wraping scion only, that too without much stretching. I can also blame hot and cold weather too.

Is it possible the parafilm you have is somehow defective, or a cheap pirated version? I've never experienced what you're talking about with parafilm cracking.

[behlgarden]

Mine looms genuine in original packaging,, its parFilm.M from reputed Amazon.seller.

[murahilin]

Is it possible the parafilm you have is somehow defective, or a cheap pirated version? I've never experienced what you're talking about with parafilm cracking.

I have not experienced it either...

[fruitlovers]

Mine looms genuine in original packaging,, its parFilm.M from reputed Amazon.seller.

I've bought stuff from "reputed Amazon seller" that was pirated. Came in pirated packaging, very well done with brand name, serial number, etc. all quite fake. No doubt made in China. Not saying that is case with your stuff only that it can happen! What i bought was an expensive Kingston 128GB flash drive. The packaging looked so genuine i had to call the company to verify that the serial number was fake.

[FlyingFoxFruits]

Oscar, miruhalin, behl,

the buddy tape doesn't crack in FL or HI, but in the cooler drier CA, it will crack!

seems humidity is a crucial factor in determining the duration of parafilms retention of elastic properties.

Dang it, found two more casualties  , thanks to cracked parafilm at union, the wedge and another t-bud had dried out.

I will use parafilm for wraping scion only, that too without much stretching. I can also blame hot and cold weather too.

Is it possible the parafilm you have is somehow defective, or a cheap pirated version? I've never experienced what you're talking about with parafilm cracking.

[FlyingFoxFruits]

cloth with bees wax???

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA If you're stranded on a deserted island and need to graft a mango tree where u gonna find buddy tape.. have to be resourceful :-).

I wonder if anyone has grafted with their bare hands?  snap the branches in half and the  jam them together, wrap with spit and hair.

Chinese were grafting plants hundreds of years ago without buddy tape or parafilm or even electrical tape or plastic bag strips. Wonder what they used? Maybe some kind of rattan, jute, or maybe even hemp fibers?

[adiel]

Never had any problems with ParaFilm.  Make sure you are using the roll-type parafilm that was intended for grafting and not the parafilm medical strips.

[Squam256]

Sounds like you've got crappy parafilm.

Parafilm has always worked great for me. I love it.

[FlyingFoxFruits]

Sounds like you've got crappy parafilm.

Parafilm has always worked great for me. I love it.

ya 'ya ,

I used to say the same thing...but if you've never used a roll of buddy tape, how would u know the difference.


the last two positive comments about parafilm came from FL...sounds like the CA growers have issues with parafilm getting brittle fast.

[Patrick]

I worked in the Environmental Chemistry field for over 10 years, we used Parafilm in the worst conditions possible.. It was commonly used to seal Erlenmeyer Flasks in acid digestion and in Dry Oven environments, its totally inert and sterile, and never failed..

[behlgarden]

I used to say the same thing...but if you've never used a roll of buddy tape, how would u know the difference.


the last two positive comments about parafilm came from FL...sounds like the CA growers have issues with parafilm getting brittle fast.
[/quote]

Well, CA weather plays a very big role where we got low 30's to high 70's being hit daily, the vatiation is big. Also, where union does not expand, you dont see cracking, but try that on Annona grafts, I will be hard pressed to see CA folks not seeing cracking.  Again, Parafilm may be a great product, for for my conditions Buddy Tape is a sure winner!

[edself65]

You are right PJ it never failed to seal for me either. It sealed so well that it suffocated my scions. Which led to graft failure. When I started grafting in the mid 80's I thought parafilm M was the absolute best product in the world! I recommended it to countless new grafters. It was the only product of that type that I was aware of at the time. Now that I have a choice I choose Buddy Tape. I think everyone should use whatever they are successful with. We are just trying to share our success with Buddy Tape. I wish everyone success with all grafts regardless of which product you use. I don't think any of us work for either manufacture or hope to get rich selling grafting film.

Good Luck!

Ed

[quote authorpj1881 link=topic=1246.msg16837#msg16837 date=1336661218]
I worked in the Environmental Chemistry field for over 10 years, we used Parafilm in the worst conditions possible.. It was commonly used to seal Erlenmeyer Flasks in acid digestion and in Dry Oven environments, its totally inert and sterile, and never failed..
[/quote]

[Cookie Monster]

Now I'm confused. Some say that parafilm cracks and others say that parafilm seals so well that it suffocates :-).

A water tight, air tight seal is precisely what you want on your grafts. The only exception I can think of is spanish lime, which can't deal with 100% humidity.

Fungal infection will thrive in a high humidity situation, so you do need to deal with that. Keep those instruments clean.

Remember - if you've done a good graft, the cambium will bind within 2 to 3 weeks (or sooner). Once the cambium bonds, fungal infection is a non issue.

Grafts that start to push and fail aren't due to suffocation. In the case of annonas, they are in fact failed grafts that simply push due to break from dormancy. As a couple of members have pointed out, annona budwood thrown on the ground will sprout and then die. If you cut a piece of annona budwood, wrap it in parafilm and leave it in a shaded area, it will begin to sprout and then dry up.

Other species (eg, loquat, mango) will start to push then fail if the rootstock has no leaves nor sufficient wood (carb reserves). Again, this is not an artifact of the tape used to wrap -- it's simply a bad graft.

[WhitH]

Does anybody use the "green tape" used to stake up young trees as grafting tape? I think they sell that as "grafting tape" in stores and nurseries.