The Tropical Fruit Forum

Hey Victoria,

Unfortunately, the Sweet Tart seeds are not viable. Underdeveloped embryo. Actually, I was lucky to get any fruit this year considering the poor pollination in early spring. Changing my micronutrient application for all of my mango trees and as previously mentioned pulling early flowers off my ST next year. If I can ever get this tree to consistently produce this tree would be worth its weight in gold for me.

If I was growing from seed good candidates are Cac, Seacrest, and Guava. All three grow fast at my coastal location and would even do better in your area. I would contact some of our Florida mango munching friends in June-July next year to see if you can get some seeds. I would get at least 6-8 of each and select the best one or two for planting in the ground.

Johnny

Yea hear in SoCal mango trees tend to grow slowly anyway and excessive flowering takes a four-cylinder subcompact car and turns it into a two-cylinder vehicle. In general 2.5 years of California growth are equivalent to one Florida year. The Pacific ocean influence really slows us down from a growth perspective especially if you are close to the coast in SoCal.

Johnny

If your rootstock is strong and healthy and the root system of your mango tree is robust then I would allow 3-4 shoots to form just below your graft and let the shoots grow this year (2021) for grafting in 2022. A strong tree can easily support multiple young shoots and a young graft.

If the mango tree is young with a weak or immature root system then I would remove all growth below the graft and focus the tree's resources toward the new graft only. Each situation is different and this largely depends on the quality and vigor of the mango rootstock that is used. You have to use your best judgment to determine that.

Removing the lower branches was good since those were essentially suckers taking away growth and vigor from the upper branching.

Johnny

Sapote,

I keep a photo record of all the fruit trees. Looks like I hit peak bloom in mid to late March 2021 at my location with this grafted Sweet-Tart. Below are a few photos from early, mid, and late March. At my other more inland location I am not getting fruit crack so I believe the cooler temps and earlier blooming at my location has something to do with the fruit splits with no seed.

Johnny



Sweet Tart Early Bloom (3-3-2021)


Sweet Tart March Bloom (3-13-2021


Sweet Tart Bloom Close up 3-13-2021


Sweet Tart Bloom 3-25-2021

This year, my sweet-tart Mango Tree had over (40) fruit on the tree but one by one they cracked open on the tree with no seed. Looks like a total loss this year on my Sweet Tart.  Most of the fruit started to split heavily at about eight ounces in weight. Interestingly my Nam Doc Mai tree located nine feet away had no such issues. As Simon said likely a pollination issue or perhaps the tree is still too immature at this stage.

Enclosed are a few photos to illustrate.

Johnny

 

Sweet Tart Split 8-14-2021


Sweet Tart With No Seed 8-14-2021

A more wide-angle photo of the LZ tree you have would be helpful as well as the rootstock tree you plan to graft it onto. The LZ scion you previously posted is not yet ready for harvest. Best to wait or order some scions from Alex at Tropical Acres Farms. I just Grafted (15) scions I purchased from Alex last week to some of my older mango seedling trees and others I am partially top working. 

If I could go back in time and do this whole mango thing over again I would likely purchase 20-30 poly seeds from Florida, germinate them all, and put the best ones in 5-gallon pots to grow over the next year to year and a half. After one year+ I would move the best growing specimens into larger seven-gallon pots for further root development and observation. After two years+ take the top 25-30% of the seeds you germinated and plant them in the ground with sandy soil. That's just my take if I had more time and could start from scratch. I would grow seeds like Cac, Sweet Tart, Lemon Zest, OS, Fruit Punch, Seacrest, or any other faster and more vigorous variety preferably Poly. I would also observe if the young tees have a tendency to flower very young, if so then these would likely not be the ones I would pick to put in the ground as I prefer strong vegetative growth for the first four years if possible to maximize canopy development. Being able to hand select strong growing mango seedling trees will prove to be a huge advantage long term.   

Good Luck

Johnny

I live in a similar area to yours and my Lemon Zest is flushing with its first growth flush of the year. Many factors affect growth, including disease, root-stock type and vigor, type of soil, and micronutrients supplied or not supplied.

Hard to say what your issue is. Other than the photos you did not supply much information on the rootstock and other things mentioned above.

Lemon Zest once established is fairly upright vigorous. For successful grafting, you need the scion pushing and the root-stock pushing new growth at the same time. Then it comes down to grafting skills.

Grafted Mango trees are difficult to grow in this area, but success is possible if everything is done correctly. Growing seedling trees is probably easier long term but most people are too impatient to wait 5-7 years for success. Note: not all seedling are vigorous. Grow (10) and select the top (3) after one year plus of growth. I start my seeds out in five-gallon pots with sandy soil and 15% pumice and 15% peatposs.

Johnny

Sorry for the Duplicate. I was just trying to add addition information.

In my opinion, you can keep the lower branches on your tree until the scions take and you get your first flush. Then I would remove all of the lower growth to force the vigor to the new scions.

Good Luck

Johnny

Why do you want a young mango tree like this holding fruit?  If you want any chance of success you should be focused on the root development and vegetative growth of your young tree. It needs to put on girth and foliage if you want long-term success. Do not graft for two years.

Flowering is not lucky in SoCal. It is a curse as it takes away from growth from a young mango tree.

Best to let your tree fill out and most importantly let the roots spread out. Hopefully, you planted your tree in sandy soil otherwise you will have slow growth in the heavier clay type soils so common in SoCal.

Johnny

Simon,

Glad to hear you liked Pineapple Pleasure. I successfully grafted this scion onto an Ataulfo seedling tree I have in a seven-gallon container. Once the tree gets bigger I will graft it onto several other older Manila trees I have in the ground later this summer. Hopefully, this cultivar will do well in California.  Should have fruit to try out in 2-3 years. 

Johnny

Good to see other people are having success growing Sweet Tart mango. Simon looks like you will have a bountiful harvest this year with your tree.

As far the the critters go the squirrels are busy stealing my macadamia nuts and the rats and possums are happy to eat my strawberry's and apples. Hopeful my mangos will be ripen without be munched on.

A few years back I also grafted Sweet Tart and Angle onto a single mango seedling tree in Alhambra which is much further inland, and much hotter, than my location. I was there last fall and the tree was doing very well with both varieties growing robustly, I will go back again in a few weeks to see how the trees are doing. I actually have (4) mango trees with various grafts at that location. Will be interesting to compare the fruit and trees over time at the two different locations.

Johnny

Holy cow, what a shame 7 years and this is what you have with your mango tree. In Burbank, you have much more heat than I in Huntington Beach but my oldest mango Trees (5years) have a much stronger and robust lower rootstock with relatively healthy growth (at least by California standards).  Here are the four golden rules I came up with over time if you want to have success in SoCal growing mango trees.

1.  Grow in sandy soil. Mango trees do poorly long-term in heavier clay-type soils. The smaller feeder roots need to spread out laterally and this is more challenging in heavier soils found in many parts of SoCal.

2.  Do not use Florida Turpentine rootstock in California if possible. Mango seedling trees work best (for later grafting) but not all seedling trees are vigorous growers. Out of 10 seedlings trees, 3-4 will be excellent for rootstock. I use Ataulfo Seeds from Mexican yellow mangos I buy at the store. Germinate 10 seeds and after 1-2 years plant the top 3-4 growers. You can also get Poly seeds from Florida and do the same thing as both methods should work well.

3.  When Grafting scions to the mango lower rootstock select faster and more vigorous varieties that do best in our marginal climate. Cac, Seacrest, Peach Cobbler, Lemon Zest, Guava, 0-15, and Buttercream are some examples of fast growers at my location. Sweet Tart, Val-Carrie, Mallika, Nam Doc Mai, and Angie are examples of moderately vigorous varieties that seem to do well at my location but they grow slower than the first group in general.

4.  Plant your mango trees South facing with full sun and no blockage from other trees or man-made obstacles. Maximum heat and Sun are some of the keys to long-term success.  Roots need space and oxygen for healthy growth. Avoid planting mango trees near cement or bricks that block nutrient intake from above.

Good Luck

Johnny

My two Mac trees started to produce nuts four years after I planted them in the ground. They were in 15-gallon containers when I purchased them at Atkins Nursery years ago.  Excessive trimming will reduce nut production.

Jack is right about seedling trees I just did not want to wait 10+ years. If your patent and have good sandy soil go for it.

The original Linda mother tree at Clausen's Nursery does seem to produce well but the trees that are being sold now are all seedlings of the Linda. Clausen does not graft Macadamia trees but Atkins does.

Enclosed are a few photos of the original Linda Macadamia tree taken in 2019.  The tree is quite large.

Johnny

Lina Macadamia Tree at Clausens


Linda Mac Tree