The Tropical Fruit Forum
Tropical Fruit => Tropical Fruit Discussion => Topic started by: johnb51 on July 02, 2020, 10:53:32 AM
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I've decided to broaden this discussion. If you could plant only 4 or 5 mango trees but wanted compact, healthy, productive varieties that would extend the season as much as possible and give you all different flavor profiles, which trees would you plant?
ORIGINALLY I WROTE:
Of the "new" Zill mango varieties are there any that are similar to Pickering and Carrie as far as being slow-growing, compact, and very easy to keep small? I know that Honey Kiss might qualify. Any others? I've seen some photos of young M-4s where they look compact. What about Sugarloaf? Pina Colada isn't new, but it, too, seems to be on the small and compact side.
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M4 seems compact so far for me, but now is starting to push upwards.
Sugar Loaf is going real nice for me. Really like the shape.
(https://i.postimg.cc/CBftmzC8/Sugar-Loaf72020.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/CBftmzC8)
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M4 seems compact so far for me, but now is starting to push upwards.
Sugar Loaf is going real nice for me. Really like the shape.
(https://i.postimg.cc/CBftmzC8/Sugar-Loaf72020.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/CBftmzC8)
Great! Thanks. What are others observing about these and the other varieties? The goal would be to keep them at 10-12 feet in a garden setting.
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Honey Kiss
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Coconut cream
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Coconut cream
Coco Cream is NOT dwarfish. It is long and lanky. Vigorous.
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Coconut cream
It is vigirous with serious undulation habit to the branches. It requires constant trimming of lower branches (annually). Each year the lowest branches seem to have the undulating issue and need removing.
With its growth habit and short/poor shelf life, it has been trounced by many other varieties on the "best of" releases.
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Honey Kiss. Pina Colada too
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Little Gem is compact as grown in my yard and has a nice natural shape. Very healthy tree. Late season,precocious, heavy bearing small-med fruit with a very small seed. Slightly more vigorous than Pickering in my yard. Relatively little pruning needed.
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Little Gem is compact as grown in my yard and has a nice natural shape. Very healthy tree. Late season,precocious, heavy bearing small-med fruit with a very small seed. Slightly more vigorous than Pickering in my yard. Relatively little pruning needed.
What's the flavor profile? I like TAF's description.
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Little Gem is compact as grown in my yard and has a nice natural shape. Very healthy tree. Late season,precocious, heavy bearing small-med fruit with a very small seed. Slightly more vigorous than Pickering in my yard. Relatively little pruning needed.
What's the flavor profile? I like TAF's description.
(I might be starting my garden over with a 9000 sq. ft. lot with zero trees, full sun! My wife says she won't allow me to plant 25 trees this time. We have to keep 50% sod.
Crazy, huh? 12 max, she says, and we'd have to include 2 guanabana trees, 2 avocado, and one sapodilla because she likes those. She's allergic to mangos. I'll have to convince her that jaboticaba is not a tree; it's a bush, right? Right? And banana and papaya plants are not trees.)
Bananas and papayas are definitely not trees, you should be able to slip those by no problem. Heck, papaya is just an herb. :)
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I've heard Orange Essence tends to be slow growing. not sure maybe Rob could chime in.
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Little Gem flavor is excellent if not picked too early. It has Julie parentage but easy to grow and productive. Not as dwarf as Julie but looks like it will be easy to maintain at a relatively small size. Complex with strong coconut pineapple and fresh orange juice flavors, maybe a hint of apricot, a great sugar acid balance and medium soft texture. Juicy too. It has a bit of resin flavor too closest to the peel, not a lot but it is detectable. Flesh color should look like pics in the following linked post when at its peak. My tree is holding about 45 fruit this year.
http://tropicalfruitforum.com/index.php?topic=29084.0 (http://tropicalfruitforum.com/index.php?topic=29084.0)
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Carrie vs. Dwarf Hawaiian vs. Little Gem?
Pickering vs. M-4 vs. Sugarloaf vs. Pina Colada?
A decent substitute for Lemon Zest/PPK?
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You cant compare Pickering and Pina Colada to M4 or E4. Pina Colada should be compared to Gary.
Pickering is ok but nowhere near the class of the other three you mentioned.
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I think the original post was about choosing a few compact trees for a yard with limited space. Sometimes the elite mangos aren't productive or have other problems for a home grower. Pickering is pretty awesome overall even if it can't quite match the elite mangos. The sum of its good qualities as a tree and fruit for the home grower make it elite in its own way.
Carrie gives some edible fruit as early as late April near me, most of the fruit is fairly early, May and June but usually holds some fruit into midseason. I would consider Carrie a moderate grower as far as tree size, a step up from compact. I would say it is on the low end as far as productivity goes based on my Dad's tree in North Ft. Myers.
I just got Dwarf Hawaiian this year.
Pickering is Late May through early July, highly productive and precocious. One of the very best choices. A well ripened Pickering is almost as good as Coconut Cream or Pina Colada with sort of a toned down blend of those flavor profiles. I ate a Coconut Cream yesterday for the first time and it reminded me of a perfect Pickering with the coconut flavor turned up a notch. I tried them back to back and it would be like trying to chose between beautiful women. It is better to choose the one that is easier to live with... Mango trees don't get jealous if you have more than one.
Sugarloaf looks like it will be fairly compact but I believe it is midseason to late? I planted Sugarloaf this year.
M4 is supposed to be late.
Pina Colada tastes awesome and is intense but is small and has a poor flesh to pit ratio. I don't have it planted but seems to be available locally during midseason. I go out of my way to buy a few fruit every year.
I have heard several reports it is not very productive. Maybe it is not precocious and will crop better as trees age. Anyone have a productive Pina Colada tree?
I am hopeful about Dwarf Hawaiian as an early mango at my location near the coast, and M4 and Sugarloaf as being good choices for mid to late. I don't have M4 planted but have heard that it can be alternate bearing. I have some friends that have it planted so I will find out eventually if it holds up against disease.
If you only have room for a few trees, alternate bearing makes a tree less desirable even if the fruit is awesome.
If I had room for only 2 trees at this point in time, my choices would be Pickering and Little Gem. Both seem compact, disease resistant,nice tree shape, highly productive and excellent fruit. Those two trees will cover most of the Mango season with Pickering early and Little Gem late. Once Pickering's season is done, if you started picking Little Gem a week or so early and ripen off the tree it will taste like a firmer Carrie. Pickering and Little Gem are both best if not picked too early and then fully ripened off the tree before eating. If you prefer a milder mango for late season go with Honey Kiss.
I planted Seacrest AKA TripleSec as my citrus mango this year. Haven't tasted it yet. In a few years I will find out if I was right or wrong planting it over Lemon Zest. I like lemon zest but it might be a bit too intense for some people in my family.
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Thank you, Tony, for your kind and detailed response. My goal would be to have 4 or 5 productive, disease-free, manageable (compact) mango trees that cover a long season and most of the major flavor profiles. I've grown Pickering before, and I've always been a big fan due to the sum total of its qualities. It may have to suffice as my "coconut-flavored" mango. I'd like to include one or two flavor bombs, and Lemon Zest seems like an obvious choice because of the outstanding citrus flavor. I guess my question is whether there's anything else from the new Zill group which is manageable, disease-free, and productive and should definitely also be considered. I've grown Honey Kiss, which is a late mango, and I like it.
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If your trees are limited, you may want to rethink LZ. It is for the most part vigorous plus its susceptibility to MBBS.
If you must have the cutrus taste, you are probably better off with OS sue to being what seems to be less prone to MBBS.
You may be better off with Phoenix (not for citrus but flavor in general) and I think you should be able to keep it shaped. I think you could also keep M4 in check sizewise (with limited trees, unless you really love it, why go with Pickering?). Pina Colada, Cac and Guava should be on your short list.
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If I may chime in I have an opinion about the subject at hand.
I live on a half acre corner lot in Kendall Florida and I have almost 290 fruit trees. ApproxImately 260 mango, 32 avocado and 3 lychee trees. I became addicted to planting trees and then I had to justify what I did and keep everything in total control in order to not look like a total fool. Well the experiment has been a smashing success so far and it’s been almost 20 years of planting but the majority of the mango trees have only been in the ground going on 3-4 years. How is this possible? And this is to address the question of dwarf trees. Because we have the power of free choice(but every cut I make I actually feel) and we control our trees so if one loves the flavor of a super fast big growing tree like Valencia Pride plant it and keep it small. I try to keep all my newest variety ultra ultra high density mango trees “skinny.” And after harvest time I cut the producing trees that are over 3 years old down to 6 feet and don’t cut the tops again till after each harvest. Then I hand prune and tip each and side branch again only this time until after it’s fruits are picked the following year. If After a rain when the branches can get weighted down by the water and it looks like it’s heading towards an adjacent tree I’ll prune it back. I’m on constant guard to not let a single branch of 1 tree cross and pass another branch from a different tree.
What does all this neurotic “work” accomplish. On my less than 3 year old trees I prune every branch with new growth from about 4-5 inches up because I want a very fully branched tree and I don’t know when I’ll be passing by that tree again and be able to tip it again. Result is 3-4 or more times yield of fruit than planting 1 tree every X number of feet. Also way healthier looking trees better able to withstand droughts and high winds. Why? Because those roots continue to grow out even though the tree is kept at 6-8 feet so the roots get a lot of sq footage to feed from and they hold the short tree with its bigger growing thicker trunk to resist the wind and the smaller tree gets the same nutrition that a giant tree would have gotten. So if you prune the inside branches out s air can circulated throughout the tree your incidence of fungus disease will be just about zero.
So my advice is buy the tree that you love the fruit from and plant it and nurture it and control it like the master. (Woman or Man) and enjoy the hell out of it. Because dwarf or no dwarf you can make it fit.
PS Yes Pickering is a 1 of a kind tree in the yield vs size argument. This year out of all my 3 years or older trees even though my Pickering was only 6’ tall at harvest it made more fruit by weight than almost every other of my trees and this is one of if not the main reason it stays short because the weight of all that fruit pulls the branches down so much that when it puts out leaves and branches a month or 2 after the fruit is picked the branches start out very low from that low position. On the other hand I have a young Pickering that had no fruit and it’s growing upward and fast just like all its adjacent varieties. So my opinion on the growth habit of Pickering is it is only called dwarf because all the fruit it produces keeps the branches growing mostly laterally or down. But a young Pickering grows at a normal rate.
A short video. https://share.icloud.com/photos/00suh1p5bilpG35WuoVl8Yfeg
I have no problems of people giving opinions, but they should be based on knowledge not just thought. Regarding Valencia Pride, you are not going to keep it small to matter what you do unless you just keep hacking it back and eliminate the fruit. Don't be fooled by what you see after 2 or 3 years growth. You are also in Miami on a lime rock bass which is not the greatest for mangoes. Go up into Broward Palm Beach and other areas where it is more sand and/or other type of substrate, they growth will be exponential and crazy fast with no ability to keep it to size and small.
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I've decided to broaden this discussion.
If you could plant only 4 or 5 mango trees but wanted compact, healthy, productive varieties that would extend the season as much as possible and give you all different flavor profiles, which trees would you plant? Try to throw in one or two flavor bombs, which might be new Zill varieties. Basically looking to get the most bang for my buck in a very limited number of trees! And I want to keep the trees about ten feet tall.
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Dwarf Hawaiian Pickering Mallika Honey Kiss [Dot and OS] Icing on the cake IMHO
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This year I thought I had Mallika all figured out but it has been really frustrating to pick them correctly. My Dad in North Ft Myers has a tree that has been fruiting about 5 years and this year only a handful out of maybe 50 so far tasted good. None have even had the carrot flavor they sometimes get. A lot of them have been sour and haven't ripened properly, others have had the off flavor I call "mango death"
It can at times rival the very best mangos with a smooth orange creamsicle taste but this year very few are even edible. This is after 5 years of picking experience and I really was sure I knew when to pick them. The best one this year actually turned almost all yellow on the tree and fell into my hand. Every year up to this one they have been at least decent even if I was off with the timing. Usually picking them when the shoulder starts turning yellow or a few days after and holding them about a week gave me good to excellent flavor. This is the first year I was too busy to hit the tree with trace elements and Potassium in the spring, maybe that is the problem.
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I have a similar goal of finding the best compact productive,very good tasting, disease resistant mango varieties.
I don't spray my trees. Not all the mangos that fit your original requirements are new Zill varieties.
Varieties I have for my yard are Florigon, Dwarf Hawaiian, Pickering, Edgar(seems to get black spot but ripens early enough that I haven't lost any fruit), Maha Chanok, Mun Khun See, White Pirie, Cac, Seacrest , Duncan, Buttercream, Nancy(closest I have seen to a Keitt replacement,beautiful purple red blush and huge fruit but done by late Aug.),Deloris, Sugarloaf, Cotton Candy( a better balanced mango than I expected,very sweet,has a little acidity and hint of coconut flavor),Little Gem. I will probably add Orange Sherbert,Honey Kiss and Super Alphonso.
How many of those have you tasted? I have tasted over half of the varieties I have planted and probably at least 50 others. With the varieties I have planted I have most of the flavor profiles from mild to wild covered and season from very early to very late.
I can live with a few trees that are less than compact but even those I will just prune more. I passed on buying Guava and Pina Colada trees locally in the past because they already seemed to have fungal problems and just did not look healthy in the nursery pots. I have tasted Dot from Pine Island nearby and I love it. I would have planted it but I am worried about fungal problems.
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My obsessive novice opinion:
Julie
Sugarloaf
Sweet Tart
PPK
Maha Chanok
Should give you a fairly long season and a nice flavor range with FAIRLY compact trees
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My obsessive novice opinion:
Julie
Sugarloaf
Sweet Tart
PPK
Maha Chanok
Should give you a fairly long season and a nice flavor range with FAIRLY compact trees
PPK and Sweet Tart definitely not compact trees or anything remotely compact. Julie, for the most part, is a fungus magnet mess in SFla.
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BSBullie you are one guy I can never say a negative word to because your opinions allowed my orchard to be like heaven BUT please come down and visit my place some day because it will be eye opening for you especially for trees growing on solid rock!!
Don't you have a recent video showing the planting? If you can point out the age of your older trees that would help.
One row at my place is of smaller trees. Graham, Cogshall, Harvest Moon Juliette, Jean Ellen, Springfels.
Out of these the most compact is Springfels, then Graham. Springfels makes just a few huge mangos but is the smallest, yet the canopy is rather thin and open..
Graham has a unique short internode growth habit which makes the canopy very dense, it needs more internal canopy thinning than most.
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BSBullie you are one guy I can never say a negative word to because your opinions allowed my orchard to be like heaven BUT please come down and visit my place some day because it will be eye opening for you especially for trees growing on solid rock!!
I am not saying trees wont grow at your place or in Miami-Dade/limerock but it can be a deterrent, hamper establishment and slow growth a bit in their juvenile stage. For the most part, your trees are still on the young side (and planting closer together can have an effect on a tree's growth...curious to see a video in 5-7 years and how much annual pruning you will have to do to avoid a true jungle). Simetimes less us mire.
The annual growth rate of a fully mature Valencia Pride is ridiculous. It is the fastest growing variety here in SFla. The amount if pruning it will take to keep in control on a small yard would be exhausting and would definitely sacrifice production.
If size is not an issue, and one likes the flavor, go for it. If someone wants to grow it with little to no maintenance, it does make a great shade tree as it towers to 50 - 75 feet (I have seen a tree in the upper range that loses large pieces to the top of the tree annually in just a strong afternoon Tstorms (when I say large, I mean branches arm to leg caliper and a good five plus feet. Due to its height and the wind increase at that height, it gets selectively pruned by the weather.
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Ok, so definitely no Julie, PPK, Sweet Tart, or Mallika (which is too unreliable in flavor). Lemon Zest would be hard to keep compact and the fruit clean, but I still might try to work with it. It's one of Har's Essentials and I love it, and I'm not sure Orange Sherbet is as good. (I've tasted LZ and PPK but not OS.) Is there any Indian variety of mango that stands out from the rest?
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Based on the trees I've observed and/or grown.
Dwarf Hawaiian (early)
Pickering
Pina colada
Honey kiss (late)
They might not win flavor awards (although I think Pina colada is up there) but they should meet you criteria.
I can't imagine that many people have had grafted trees of the recent zhpp mangos long enough to know for sure.
If your willing to take a chance then you'll have more exciting flavors for sure
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Ok, so definitely no Julie, PPK, Sweet Tart, or Mallika (which is too unreliable in flavor). Lemon Zest would be hard to keep compact and the fruit clean, but I still might try to work with it. It's one of Har's Essentials and I love it, and I'm not sure Orange Sherbet is as good. (I've tasted LZ and PPK but not OS.) Is there any Indian variety of mango that stands out from the rest?
No offense to Har, who cares if its one of his essentials. That is based on his taste alone and nothing to do with your taste or tree's physiology.
With LZ, its not about keeping fruit clean, its about losing your crop, year after year (and running the risk of exposing your other mangoes to MBBS in a more concentrated way).
If you like PPK, you may be better off with that over LZ. Both are on the vigorous side but PPK is cleaner and will give you your early fruit. I am not that impressed with Dwarf Hawaiian (again, my taste...but if it came in later in the season I bet it would be ignored) and I have seen some uneven ripening to the fruit
For Indian, if you are eliminating Mallika, then you are essentially left with Son Pari and Kesar for varieties that do well in South Florida...I would personally go with Son Pari.
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I know Fairchild is not a Zill tree but a great little mango and a small compact footprint, Honey kiss is a awesome mango, compact footprint, guava is an amazing mango..... lots to choose from... I can tell you that you do not want a VP or a LZ if your looking for small compact trees... those 2 trees alone will take up all your space within 4-5 years left unchecked.
Best of luck with your selections
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For Indian, if you are eliminating Mallika, then you are essentially left with Son Pari and Kesar for varieties that do well in South Florida...I would personally go with Son Pari.
Alex, WPB grower, says Son Pari is highly prone to MBBS.
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For Indian, if you are eliminating Mallika, then you are essentially left with Son Pari and Kesar for varieties that do well in South Florida...I would personally go with Son Pari.
Alex, WPB grower, says Son Pari is highly prone to MBBS.
If you went by his statements like that (as a commercial grower), there would be few varieties to grow (I have a feeling nothing is resistent, just some "might" be less prone based on exposure). I have seen MBBS affect almost every variety at Walter's grove which started from his 3 LZ being badly infected. You should read and interpret based on context and what is also going on as a whole. It should never be taken as gospel. LZ is however known to be a mess in many Counties and all the while, some have no issues.
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Hello, I'm new to this forum and wanted to post a similar question when I saw this thread. I want to plant a couple mango trees (definitely not vigorous kind). I would like trees that are heavy producer, above subpar taste and highly disease resistant. Currently I have Carrie, Mallika and Pickering. Carrie and Mallika are very poor producers in my backyard (zone 9b, Florida). Pickering has been really good in all three areas for me. It does have some fiber but not objectionable. My family loves the sweetness of Pickering.
Now, I would love to add couple more to my collection and was thinking of Kesar and M-4. What do you all think of these two? Since my yard space is limited I don't want to compromise on the production aspect. Thanks :)
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Hello, I'm new to this forum and wanted to post a similar question when I saw this thread. I want to plant a couple mango trees (definitely not vigorous kind). I would like trees that are heavy producer, above subpar taste and highly disease resistant. Currently I have Carrie, Mallika and Pickering. Carrie and Mallika are very poor producers in my backyard (zone 9b, Florida). Pickering has been really good in all three areas for me. It does have some fiber but not objectionable. My family loves the sweetness of Pickering.
Now, I would love to add couple more to my collection and was thinking of Kesar and M-4. What do you all think of these two? Since my yard space is limited I don't want to compromise on the production aspect. Thanks :)
My two cents Glenn and Honey Kiss
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Hello, I'm new to this forum and wanted to post a similar question when I saw this thread. I want to plant a couple mango trees (definitely not vigorous kind). I would like trees that are heavy producer, above subpar taste and highly disease resistant. Currently I have Carrie, Mallika and Pickering. Carrie and Mallika are very poor producers in my backyard (zone 9b, Florida). Pickering has been really good in all three areas for me. It does have some fiber but not objectionable. My family loves the sweetness of Pickering.
Now, I would love to add couple more to my collection and was thinking of Kesar and M-4. What do you all think of these two? Since my yard space is limited I don't want to compromise on the production aspect. Thanks :)
Everybody seems to like Honey Kiss including me. I had a tree at the house I sold in March. If you like the flavor of Carrie but it's not producing well for you, you could replace it with Angie with a similar flavor profile, which I also had. It was somewhat compact and easily managed and a fairly reliable producer of clean fruit. Some other varieties for you to consider (which I am also considering) are Sugarloaf, Phoenix, Cecilove, Orange Essence, and Carla. Glenn is a beautiful, usually dense-growing tree, but the flavor can often be weak or washed out so I'd never grow it. Kesar sounds pretty good. I hope Alex of TAF finds the time to give me his recommendations.
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Spring season: Rosigold , Dwarf Hawaiian
May: Angie
June: Pickering
July: Orange Sherbet. Little Gem
August: honey kiss
September+: Neelam
There are also some others that I think fit the description but not commonly Available in the nursery trade like Itamaraca, Arka Neelkiran, and Fairchild’s Saigon.
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Hello, I'm new to this forum and wanted to post a similar question when I saw this thread. I want to plant a couple mango trees (definitely not vigorous kind). I would like trees that are heavy producer, above subpar taste and highly disease resistant. Currently I have Carrie, Mallika and Pickering. Carrie and Mallika are very poor producers in my backyard (zone 9b, Florida). Pickering has been really good in all three areas for me. It does have some fiber but not objectionable. My family loves the sweetness of Pickering.
Now, I would love to add couple more to my collection and was thinking of Kesar and M-4. What do you all think of these two? Since my yard space is limited I don't want to compromise on the production aspect. Thanks :)
Everybody seems to like Honey Kiss including me. I had a tree at the house I sold in March. If you like the flavor of Carrie but it's not producing well for you, you could replace it with Angie with a similar flavor profile, which I also had. It was somewhat compact and easily managed and a fairly reliable producer of clean fruit. Some other varieties for you to consider (which I am also considering) are Sugarloaf, Phoenix, Cecilove, and Carla. Glenn is a beautiful, usually dense-growing tree, but the flavor can often be weak or washed out so I'd never grow it. Kesar sounds pretty good. I hope Alex of TAF finds the time to give me his recommendations.
Thank you. I used to have Glenn; planted as a 3g and was killed after 5 years in one night's frost. It gave me just 3 mangoes altogether. I didn't care much about flavor either. Thus far, I have tasted 1 Carrie mango from my tree. Honestly, I don't remember the taste. It was 2 years ago. I like Pickering's flavor though. I think I'm leaning towards Honey Kiss now over Kesar.
What is the verdict on M-4 though? Perfect for home backyard or no?
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My obsessive novice opinion:
Julie
Sugarloaf
Sweet Tart
PPK
Maha Chanok
Should give you a fairly long season and a nice flavor range with FAIRLY compact trees
Sweet Tart and PPK are not compact trees.
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[/quote]
PPK and Sweet Tart definitely not compact trees or anything remotely compact. Julie, for the most part, is a fungus magnet mess in SFla.
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Is Julie that bad? Just bought a Julie tree, should I plant it away from the other mango trees to prevent the fungus from spreading?
Where should I plant the tree, in a well ventilated area?
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A slow-growing dwarf tree just be prepared to spray it for anthracnose. Being that it's a small tree logistically it shouldn't be that difficult. This is something you should probably study up on anyway. Put anthracnose in forum search engine and study it. It's all part of the Adventure.😊 If you were planting commercially that would be a different story. Yes air circulation is good/pre]
PPK and Sweet Tart definitely not compact trees or anything remotely compact. Julie, for the most part, is a fungus magnet mess in SFla.
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Is Julie that bad? Just bought a Julie tree, should I plant it away from the other mango trees to prevent the fungus from spreading?
Where should I plant the tree, in a well ventilated area?
[/quote]
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For a Julie, its more than the average Anthracnore found on susceptible varieties. It can be more that the trouble. It also has the propensity to be a shy bearer inland and away from the coast.
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It seems Julie should not be on a "Best 4-5 Mangos to Grow" list!
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Can the fungus from Julie spread to other mango trees?
I am not too far west, located in between i95 and Turnpike.
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Can the fungus from Julie spread to other mango trees?
I am not too far west, located in between i95 and Turnpike.
If it's going to stress you out and cause you to lose sleep just call the people that you got it from and ask them to swap for another variety.😊 does it look like a clean tree if it's ate up with anthracnose I don't know why you would purchase it😊
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If it's going to stress you out and cause you to lose sleep just call the people that you got it from and ask them to swap for another variety. does it look like a clean tree if it's ate up with anthracnose I don't know why you would purchase it
My tree looks fine, take a look. Is my location somewhat safe against fungus? I am located between i95 and turnpike.
(https://i.postimg.cc/QVMbndGs/IMAG0636.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/QVMbndGs)
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I think you'll be much better off with a dwarf Hawaiian similar flavor to Julie. Dwarf size and very precocious.
I'm willing to have that fight for Julie because my wife was raised on coconut milk and Julie mangoes. In my opinion even if you could see the ocean from your doorstep you're still going to have to spray for anthracnose and powdery mildew so you might as well just get schooled up on it
(https://i.postimg.cc/7JXbkp1F/20200707-171837.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/7JXbkp1F)
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I think you'll be much better off with a dwarf Hawaiian similar flavor to Julie. Dwarf size and very precocious.
I'm willing to have that fight for Julie because my wife was raised on coconut milk and Julie mangoes.
I am gonna give this tree a try, it is healthy and it is branching nicely. Wish me all the best!
Had also taught about a graham, but it drops a bunch of fruit and the tree is not small.
Julie is deliciously spicy, small, compact, precocious and it blooms multiple times.
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Okay I wish you all the best. You're not in this fight alone I also have an ice cream mango
(https://i.postimg.cc/w7QxSbJX/20200707-174247.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/w7QxSbJX)
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I think you'll be much better off with a dwarf Hawaiian similar flavor to Julie. Dwarf size and very precocious.
I'm willing to have that fight for Julie because my wife was raised on coconut milk and Julie mangoes. In my opinion even if you could see the ocean from your doorstep you're still going to have to spray for anthracnose and powdery mildew so you might as well just get schooled up on it
(https://i.postimg.cc/7JXbkp1F/20200707-171837.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/7JXbkp1F)
Yeah the flavor is exceptional.
I see that you planted yours next to a wall, was it because of space? Having full sun and in a ventilated area should help against fungus right?
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That is for cold protection on the south side of my house. The wall retains heat sometimes it gets cool up here. Julie is an island girl she's cold sensitive 8)
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I think you'll be much better off with a dwarf Hawaiian similar flavor to Julie. Dwarf size and very precocious.
I'm willing to have that fight for Julie because my wife was raised on coconut milk and Julie mangoes. In my opinion even if you could see the ocean from your doorstep you're still going to have to spray for anthracnose and powdery mildew so you might as well just get schooled up on it
(https://i.postimg.cc/7JXbkp1F/20200707-171837.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/7JXbkp1F)
Yeah the flavor is exceptional.
I see that you planted yours next to a wall, was it because of space? Having full sun and in a ventilated area should help against fungus right?
Yes, correct. Keep middle open and lifted iff the ground so air can flow throughout.
Ice Cream is also very prone to fungus and I have seen the fruit prone to scab. It will be problematic up against the wall like that.
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That is for cold protection on the south side of my house. The wall retains heat sometimes it gets cool up here. Julie is an island girl she's cold sensitive 8)
They are no more cold sensitive than any other variety.
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The good news is Dot has prime real estate but yes space is limited so they are prioritized
(https://i.postimg.cc/5Q2cD1CT/20200628-132802.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/5Q2cD1CT)
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Would this combination work against fungus and powdery mildew?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yFD97jAdtKU (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yFD97jAdtKU)
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Are there any fans of Duncan?
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Are there any fans of Duncan?
It is very productive and a workhorse year after year, but the mangoes are usually washed out in the first half of the season. It also has a distinctly bitter taste near the skin that I have not seen in any other mango.
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Are there any fans of Duncan?
It is very productive and a workhorse year after year, but the mangoes are usually washed out in the first half of the season. It also has a distinctly bitter taste near the skin that I have not seen in any other mango.
It actually has two crops. Yes, first crop is not usually good although there are exceptions. The later crop is usually much better and lacks that offputting taste near the skin. I am not saying its a great mango, just stating a fact.
ZINC also seems has two crops and similarly the late crop is usually distinctly better.
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To summarize, it would be a tough choice (!) but some combination of five out of the following nominees: Pickering*, Angie, M-4, Sugarloaf, Dwarf Hawaiian*, Little Gem, Guava, Honey Kiss*, Orange Sherbet, Pina Colada, Orange Essence, Phoenix, Mahachanok, and Graham. I'd like to add Carla (but I'm not sure about tree size) and also Cecilove (if only it were being propagated)!
*=most votes.
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Back to the 4-5 trees...I think what I would plant might be Dwarf Hawaiian, Orange Sherbet, Sugarloaf, Mahachanok, Phoenix or Carla, and Honey Kiss to get the most flavors and a long season. Yup, that's six. Maybe I could topwork an extra variety on two trees.
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I’m saying this opinion from my own tastes and if the reader has other tasting opinions please forgive me.
I am converting 4 of my trees by coincidence right now because their fruits aren’t even close to the qualities of some old standards and especially the new Zill’s and they are my 1 Dwarf Hawaiian and my 3 Maha’s. The novelty of the earliness of DH is outweighed by its inconsistent flavors. If you are from the Islands and love strong and spicy like Julie go for it. Maha is perhaps the most beautiful mango but also the novelty of its beauty and shape and color doesn’t make up for its less than great taste. So why waste a space when you can get a “supremely” delicious Zill.
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I’m saying this opinion from my own tastes and if the reader has other tasting opinions please forgive me.
I am converting 4 of my trees by coincidence right now because their fruits aren’t even close to the qualities of some old standards and especially the new Zill’s and they are my 1 Dwarf Hawaiian and my 3 Maha’s. The novelty of the earliness of DH is outweighed by its inconsistent flavors. If you are from the Islands and love strong and spicy like Julie go for it. Maha is perhaps the most beautiful mango but also the novelty of its beauty and shape and color doesn’t make up for its less than great taste. So why waste a space when you can get a “supremely” delicious Zill.
Thanks for your input. I consider your opinion and experience to be of great value. Now.....if I could only grow two mango trees, I think one would have to be Pickering--it's such a foolproof, productive tree--and the other?
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For what it’s worth if you don’t like spicy strong or turpentined flavors everything that bsullie (Rob) says is gospel not me. Yes for a slow growing smaller tree that makes a lot of mangoes that are pretty good your Pickering is a good choice. The next one is up to you but read all of Robs comments over the years and you’ll make a great 2nd choice too. I based all my decisions for over 200 Mango trees on his comments over the last 5 years and Im happy as heck with what I have. He has an amazing talent which goes way further than just experience. You can probably start at the 2020 tastings then go back to 2015 forward. Or start at 2015 and go forward looking at his entries.
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Unfortunately for me somebody else bought the house on the 9000 sf lot. When we finally get around to finding a house, it will probably have room for only TWO mango trees if I'm lucky! Anyway, back to the 4-5 trees...I think what I would plant might be Dwarf Hawaiian, Orange Sherbet, Sugarloaf, Mahachanok, Carla, and Honey Kiss to get the most flavors and a long season. I know. I can count. That's six.
Sorry to hear about the house, if you can only have two I would do an early and a late mango.
But if you can have 2 you can always try to squeeze in a 3rd. ;)
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For what it’s worth if you don’t like spicy strong or turpentined flavors everything that bsullie (Rob) says is gospel not me. Yes for a slow growing smaller tree that makes a lot of mangoes that are pretty good your Pickering is a good choice. The next one is up to you but read all of Robs comments over the years and you’ll make a great 2nd choice too. I based all my decisions for over 200 Mango trees on his comments over the last 5 years and Im happy as heck with what I have. He has an amazing talent which goes way further than just experience. You can probably start at the 2020 tastings then go back to 2015 forward. Or start at 2015 and go forward looking at his entries.
His opinions and comments are always legit and good. I'm a fan, too.
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The 2020 season in South Florida ended with some strong reviews of Little Gem, so now I'm thinking Pickering (early: COCONUT) and Little Gem (late: INDIAN/W.INDIAN) might be the way to go. In between should be other flavor groups. Orange Sherbet for CITRUS? And how about something representing INDOCHINESE? Keep in mind "compact, productive, and disease-free."
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The 2020 season in South Florida ended with some strong reviews of Little Gem, so now I'm thinking Pickering (COCONUT) and Little Gem (INDIAN/W.INDIAN) might be the way to go. In between should be other flavor groups. Orange Sherbet for CITRUS? And how about something representing INDOCHINESE? Keep in mind "compact, productive, and disease-free."
I need to try Little Gem. Hopefully it has some spice to it. What about Cecilove? I have heard it is very manageable :)
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Yes, I think Cecilove could be a good choice for INDOCHINESE. Has anyone tasted or had any experience with Fairchild's Saigon? (Not Dupuis Saigon) Mahachanok is not considered INDOCHINESE flavor, correct?
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It seems as though the majority of indo-chinese mango trees are vigorous Growers but if you were my neighbor I would cross my fingers and hope that you would plant Zill indochinese zinc. I really like it chalky tartness
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It seems as though the majority of indo-chinese mango trees are vigorous Growers but if you were my neighbor I would cross my fingers and hope that you would plant Zill indochinese zinc. I really like it chalky tartness
I want to be your neighbor. I'm tired of SoFlo. I'm moving up there!
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For some reason my Sugar Loaf has grown more wider than taller, so it is compact so far. But others with more aged trees can tell how there's been growing. Disease free for sure but can not say anything about productivity. Fruit cocktail is doing the same but again my trees are 3-4 yrs old and not yet a good example , will evaluate them to see if they stay compact. Both are kind of midseason i think. What about Phoenix? Truly tropical had a compact Phoenix on some rootstock. Phoenix will check the boxes for citrus, complex taste.
I am growing Fairchild Saigon, grafted it from Alex to Glenn, it has very short internodes and certainly a compact grower. However it seems to be prone to anthracnose, saw a lot on branches and i have suspicion the flowers will need heavy spraying as well. Don't know about productivity yet.
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It seems as though the majority of indo-chinese mango trees are vigorous Growers but if you were my neighbor I would cross my fingers and hope that you would plant Zill indochinese zinc. I really like it chalky tartness
I want to be your neighbor. I'm tired of SoFlo. I'm moving up there!
Okay but you may get altitude sickness we are 62 feet above sea level. I prefer you do not bring any iguanas with you. How much did Al Gore say the oceans going to rise LOL
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As someone with limited space and who had advice from BSbullie through my planting, these are my experiences. PPK, first tree we planted, did well for about 5-6 years with a very heavy pruning. But it was definetly affecting total number of fruit. After last couple years the growth was so upright and it was flushing at faster rates to this year had to pretty much pug it back to start it over as we had lost the pruning battle. Takes more than an annual decent pruning to keep I in check. Second tree we planted was coconut cream. While the overall size has been manageable for now, like Rob said, the growth is freaking erratic as hell, and hard to give it a good shape. And the lower branches tend to shoot straight to the ground and either need to be propped up significantly or pruned off. Pickering has been easy to maintain and truly compact. Still takes a good pruning to keep it maintained, but responds well to one pruning. Honey kiss about the same as pickering, although it does seem to grow a hair faster. Fairchild has been easy to maintain at medium sized tree with annual pruning. But the Fairchild has not fruited heavily. Pickering is always a monster producer and the honey kiss does 2nd best. Coconut cream has been super unreliable and has never produced more than 30 fruit on a good year, about a dozen on bad year. PPK always 30-60. Pickering every year has increased crops, this year about 100-120 mangoes and the tree is about 7 ft tall by 7-8 ft wide.
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As someone with limited space and who had advice from BSbullie through my planting, these are my experiences. PPK, first tree we planted, did well for about 5-6 years with a very heavy pruning. But it was definetly affecting total number of fruit. After last couple years the growth was so upright and it was flushing at faster rates to this year had to pretty much pug it back to start it over as we had lost the pruning battle. Takes more than an annual decent pruning to keep I in check. Second tree we planted was coconut cream. While the overall size has been manageable for now, like Rob said, the growth is freaking erratic as hell, and hard to give it a good shape. And the lower branches tend to shoot straight to the ground and either need to be propped up significantly or pruned off. Pickering has been easy to maintain and truly compact. Still takes a good pruning to keep it maintained, but responds well to one pruning. Honey kiss about the same as pickering, although it does seem to grow a hair faster. Fairchild has been easy to maintain at medium sized tree with annual pruning. But the Fairchild has not fruited heavily. Pickering is always a monster producer and the honey kiss does 2nd best. Coconut cream has been super unreliable and has never produced more than 30 fruit on a good year, about a dozen on bad year. PPK always 30-60. Pickering every year has increased crops, this year about 100-120 mangoes and the tree is about 7 ft tall by 7-8 ft wide.
I would like to hear more about your struggle with PPK. What was the size of it before you plugged it? What size would you of ideally liked to of maintain it? If you have other producing trees and are just producing for your immediate family. I think the heavy pruning trade off of lower crop yield would be justified or okay to have that quality fruit. :)
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Pickering has been easy to maintain and truly compact. Still takes a good pruning to keep it maintained, but responds well to one pruning. Honey kiss about the same as Pickering, although it does seem to grow a hair faster. Pickering is always a monster producer and the honey kiss does 2nd best. Pickering every year has increased crops, this year about 100-120 mangoes and the tree is about 7 ft tall by 7-8 ft wide.
Yup, that's why I feel it's one tree everyone should have. And the very best Pickering mangos are a solid 8.5 in flavor and 10 in appearance!
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Bovine, the PPK had a very upright growth, and the under canopy was just getting higher and higher by the year. Pretty much got to 15ft even with me fighting to keep it under 15 ft. Yes it is worth the heavy pruning and low yield since only for us. But it was just getting to big to control. Decided to restart it and that will let me reshape it etc...… it has much longer internodes than all my other mango trees.
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Bovine, the PPK had a very upright growth, and the under canopy was just getting higher and higher by the year. Pretty much got to 15ft even with me fighting to keep it under 15 ft. Yes it is worth the heavy pruning and low yield since only for us. But it was just getting to big to control. Decided to restart it and that will let me reshape it etc...… it has much longer internodes than all my other mango trees.
Do you think Orange Sherbet would be a better tree to grow?
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From my understanding, no experience as I have not grown OS, is that OS has a bit more compact growth than PPK and LZ, also has better disease resistance than LZ supposedly.
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Neelam is a good late season variety.
* can't spell with a "u" evidently, keeps editing my edits, lol
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From my understanding, no experience as I have not grown OS, is that OS has a bit more compact growth than PPK and LZ, also has better disease resistance than LZ supposedly.
This is my understanding as well.
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Are there any fans of Duncan?
I think Duncan may be my favorite mango I grow. Flavor is a 9 out of 10 for me. Disease resistant. Very productive. Season this year was long for me with first fruit being eaten first week of April and last being in July. There are other better tasting mangoes out there but for an all around workhorse it wins for sure. I know a lot of people plant Glenn for this reliable productive role but I think Duncan wins the title. I will likely be moving to a different house within a year or two and the first I plant will be another Duncan.
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Are there any fans of Duncan?
I think Duncan may be my favorite mango I grow. Flavor is a 9 out of 10 for me. Disease resistant. Very productive. Season this year was long for me with first fruit being eaten first week of April and last being in July. There are other better tasting mangoes out there but for an all around workhorse it wins for sure. I know a lot of people plant Glenn for this reliable productive role but I think Duncan wins the title. I will likely be moving to a different house within a year or two and the first I plant will be another Duncan.
Later season Duncans were surprisingly superb tasting for me this year had a combo of classic and indochinese flavor. Earlier ones in the season were a bit washed out but never had any bad taste. Agree with the disease resistance. Is the tree compact or vigorous upright grower ?
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Are there any fans of Duncan?
I think Duncan may be my favorite mango I grow. Flavor is a 9 out of 10 for me. Disease resistant. Very productive. Season this year was long for me with first fruit being eaten first week of April and last being in July. There are other better tasting mangoes out there but for an all around workhorse it wins for sure. I know a lot of people plant Glenn for this reliable productive role but I think Duncan wins the title. I will likely be moving to a different house within a year or two and the first I plant will be another Duncan.
Did you find a big difference between early and late Duncans, as others have mentioned?
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will have to retry Duncan; all I've had in the past were mediocre at best
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Are there any fans of Duncan?
I think Duncan may be my favorite mango I grow. Flavor is a 9 out of 10 for me. Disease resistant. Very productive. Season this year was long for me with first fruit being eaten first week of April and last being in July. There are other better tasting mangoes out there but for an all around workhorse it wins for sure. I know a lot of people plant Glenn for this reliable productive role but I think Duncan wins the title. I will likely be moving to a different house within a year or two and the first I plant will be another Duncan.
Did you find a big difference between early and late Duncans, as others have mentioned?
To be honest very little difference. They get awfully close to tree ripe wince the yellow on one side touches the bottom of the fruit it is about to drop. Take it off the tree and it’s ready in as little as 24-48 hours inside. The early ones if picked early can have a slight washed out taste but it’s all in when they are picked for me. I had maybe 2 that were a little bland the rest were excellent.
As for growth habit mine has not been in ground very long and I never topped it or tipped it until this season. I got it as a 7 gallon from Excalibur and it has grown well and fruited with about 20 fruit the second summer it was in ground. I would love to see what it looks like for some other people that have had them in ground for a while.
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I recently bought a 7 gallon Duncan and planted about 3 months ago.
It flushed once and now has four panicles each holding 6-7 small fruit.
My nam doc mai is also flowering now but hasn't held any yet. The Nam Doc Mai
is not a recent plant and held fruit last season.
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I had a later Duncan from Truly Tropical and it was delicious. Not to bitter close to the skin like some are.
Sweet pleasant Indochinese flavor. I was trying it along side with a K3 Kathy and I was actually liking the Duncan a little more for my taste buds but the Kathy was still good.
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I had a Duncan from Alex this summer in Late April. It was washed out and bitter close to skin. I had a Duncan from the same Alex in June and it was OUTSTANDING. Beautiful, big, and DELICIOUS. I asked Alex about it(I respect Alex very very highly) and he said Duncan kept him in business this year. It was by far his best producer and the second crop is always very good if not excellent. He said first is usually mediocre. For production, I’d say Duncan wins by a landslide in Near coastal south Florida, based on what Alex Told me.
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Ok, y'all, I'm gonna keep Duncan in mind!
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A year and a half later...this is what I finally went with: Orange Sherbet, Sugarloaf, Honey Kiss, Little Gem, and I ordered a Cecilove from Alex. I still may find a spot for Pickering. I had also considered Amrapali. Covering early season right now, my good friend has PPK, and my neighbors have propagated a seedling (let's call it "Edmundo") with an Indian/West Indian flavor profile and an excellent sweet/acid balance.
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A year and a half later...this is what I finally went with: Orange Sherbet, Sugarloaf, Honey Kiss, Little Gem, and I ordered a Cecilove from Alex. I still may find a spot for Pickering. I had also considered Amrapali. Covering early season right now, my good friend has PPK, and my neighbors have propagated a seedling (let's call it "Edmundo") with an Indian/West Indian flavor profile and an excellent sweet/acid balance.
(https://i.postimg.cc/hXczNZm6/20220222-181627.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/hXczNZm6)
Cecilove seems to be precocious
(https://i.postimg.cc/G4v0TzSL/20220222-181630.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/G4v0TzSL)
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(https://i.postimg.cc/hXczNZm6/20220222-181627.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/hXczNZm6)
Cecilove seems to be precocious
(https://i.postimg.cc/G4v0TzSL/20220222-181630.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/G4v0TzSL)
So is Little Gem! The 3-gal. tree that I bought at Truly Tropical had blossoms, which I removed.
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A year and a half later...this is what I finally went with: Orange Sherbet, Sugarloaf, Honey Kiss, Little Gem, and I ordered a Cecilove from Alex. I still may find a spot for Pickering. I had also considered Amrapali. Covering early season right now, my good friend has PPK, and my neighbors have propagated a seedling (let's call it "Edmundo") with an Indian/West Indian flavor profile and an excellent sweet/acid balance.
Great choices John! May your trees grow and produce.
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Thanks! I'd like to try and get creative and at some point add M-4 to the Sugarloaf and Lemon Zest to the Orange Sherbet, and something else to the Honey Kiss.
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A year and a half later...this is what I finally went with: Orange Sherbet, Sugarloaf, Honey Kiss, Little Gem, and I ordered a Cecilove from Alex. I still may find a spot for Pickering. I had also considered Amrapali. Covering early season right now, my good friend has PPK, and my neighbors have propagated a seedling (let's call it "Edmundo") with an Indian/West Indian flavor profile and an excellent sweet/acid balance.
Awesome choices, John!
I loved the info on this thread. I am am looking for 3-4 mango trees that match your criteria. Can you tell me why you settled on your final choices?
I already got a Mallika because we tried the fruit and it was amazing! I also read that they can be kept small and are more disease resistant. However, after reading about the difficulty in knowing when to harvest, I may have gone with something else. However, I bought it so in the ground it went. We will see how it goes.
My other picks were: Carrie, Pickering, Fairchild, Orange Sherbet, Cotton Candy, and Honey Kiss. If I could go with only 3 of those which ones should I pick for compact, productive, disease resistant, and longer mango season?
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Awesome choices, John!
I loved the info on this thread. I am am looking for 3-4 mango trees that match your criteria. Can you tell me why you settled on your final choices?
I already got a Mallika because we tried the fruit and it was amazing! I also read that they can be kept small and are more disease resistant. However, after reading about the difficulty in knowing when to harvest, I may have gone with something else. However, I bought it so in the ground it went. We will see how it goes.
My other picks were: Carrie, Pickering, Fairchild, Orange Sherbet, Cotton Candy, and Honey Kiss. If I could go with only 3 of those which ones should I pick for compact, productive, disease resistant, and longer mango season?
My final choices were based on each one having a different flavor profile and also ripening at different times.
I don't think Mallika was a bad choice. You'll figure out when to pick them and how to ripen them.
Pickering is early season, and Honey Kiss is late season, and they're both compact, so they might be obvious choices. In between, maybe orange sherbet for the intense citrus flavor?