Author Topic: please: ID this jabuticaba  (Read 5773 times)

huertasurbanas

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please: ID this jabuticaba
« on: August 03, 2014, 11:10:28 AM »
Hi

The seller said he bought the mother tree 20 years ago in Sao Paulo, Brazil, and they sell it as "enana" variety... just because it does not grows taller than 5m tall. He also said it's different to what we usually found in Misiones, Argentina, and that these other trees from Misiones are 30m tall and the fruit is very acid.

His tree is 3m tall now, and these are photos of the leaves, old leaves and new growth; he didnt measured the fruits, but he think they are 3cm (bigger that the usually found in Misiones) and very sweet.

To me, it's very similar to my sabaras:







pauloc

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Re: please: ID this jabuticaba (it should be sabará)
« Reply #1 on: August 03, 2014, 12:21:47 PM »
Huertas, this looks like Myrciaria coronata. The leaves have a strong resemblance to this, but there are some varieties of Myrciaria cauliflora which also has similar leaves .... if you get pictures of the fruit is easier to identify

Sabara is certainly not

huertasurbanas

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Re: please: ID this jabuticaba (it should be sabará)
« Reply #2 on: August 03, 2014, 07:03:18 PM »
Very thanks Paulo, I was almost sure it was sabara: what are the differences in the leaves of sabara and coronata?

Do you know that in Brazil used to sell this species as anão?

We should wait to see some fruits... and I will take more photos when the plants are here in our house.


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Re: please: ID this jabuticaba (it should be sabará)
« Reply #4 on: August 04, 2014, 04:43:52 PM »
Does someone knows about a close up photo of m. coronata leaves?

i bet i have posted some before...

I have about 5 coronata varieties....and the appearance of foliage can be variable.

there are many varieties of M. coronata....and M. cauliflora...so it would be best to have pics of fruits...

M. coronata has the crown (whitish/green disc shape  at apex of fruit)....cauliflora does not.

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huertasurbanas

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Re: please: ID this jabuticaba (it should be sabará)
« Reply #5 on: August 04, 2014, 05:35:20 PM »
I will show the seller photos of coronata fruits and cauliflora fruits... so he can compare and tell me if his fruits are similar to coronata or not.

I am discovering at least 4 cultivated myrciaria species in the argentinian north, some of them are not yet described by the science, and I bet there should be dozens more to discover here.

huertasurbanas

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Re: please: ID this jabuticaba (it should be sabará)
« Reply #6 on: August 05, 2014, 12:31:13 AM »
Update: he said it has some crown, but not so big and not so colorful/remarkable

so?

I showed him these photos found on the net:






pauloc

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Re: please: ID this jabuticaba (it should be sabará)
« Reply #7 on: August 05, 2014, 05:29:33 AM »
Huertas, this is a picture with two varieties of Myrciaria jaboticaba the center, and two varieties of Myrciaria coronata on the sides.

Usually the Myrciaria coronata leaves are larger and  long compared to Myrciaria jaboticaba.


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Re: please: ID this jabuticaba (it should be sabará)
« Reply #8 on: August 05, 2014, 09:32:02 AM »
Huertas,

if I recall correctly, I've seen both pictures you've posted

the top is coronata, the bottom (with passiflora in photo) is actually paulista (from a grower in Ca) and actually doesn't have the crown feature....sometimes paulista can be confused for coronata....but the scar on paulista is less conspicuous and also is not green...it's more of a dull (almost bark colored circle).

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huertasurbanas

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Re: please: ID this jabuticaba (it should be sabará)
« Reply #9 on: August 05, 2014, 10:33:35 AM »
Great Paulo and Adam, if we have photos of developing fruits, would it help?

Paulo: the leaves of the m coronata from the right are very similar to m jaboticaba, but bigger, for sure. So, m. jaboticaba leaves never grow larger than 3 or 4 cm?

I think this man should have some m cauliflora, because the "crown" on his fruits seems to be not so remarkable and not so colourful

More data:

It took 10 years to fruit


"My grandmother brought a plant from the Brazil jungle and she had it in her
yard for over 70 years (hence I got my mother plant), its 2 plants never exceeded 5m high (in 70 years).

In San Pablo they fruit 2 or 3 times a year.

Mine in the province of Corrientes, Argentina, is fruiting for me in October (spring), blooms in winter and always a little, few flowers, and sometimes offers one or 2 fruits in winter ... I think that because lack of water it does not bears in winter, and pulled the conclusion now because it rained a lot this winter and it has many flowers now...."

Does it helps?

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Re: please: ID this jabuticaba (it should be sabará)
« Reply #10 on: August 05, 2014, 10:50:16 AM »
yes based on your information it sounds like it could be a form of M. cauliflora....(other than Paulista) that makes large sweet fruit.

there are varieties of M jaboticaba (like Cascuda) that have leaves which can be larger than Sabara (over 4cm length), but also consider the fact that Sabara will produce larger leaves if it's planted in shade, and some seedlings of sabara seem to just have slightly larger leaves than others....I'm sure half is nurture, half is nature.
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Re: please: ID this jabuticaba (it should be sabará)
« Reply #11 on: August 05, 2014, 10:52:55 AM »
Huertas, this is a picture with two varieties of Myrciaria jaboticaba the center, and two varieties of Myrciaria coronata on the sides.

Usually the Myrciaria coronata leaves are larger and  long compared to Myrciaria jaboticaba.


also notice on M. coronata, the mid-vein is more conspicuous.
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huertasurbanas

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Re: please: ID this jabuticaba (it should be sabará)
« Reply #12 on: August 05, 2014, 01:46:49 PM »
Ok, now we have better photos, even some flowers (it should be cauliflora? I dont know):

























huertasurbanas

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Re: please: ID this jabuticaba
« Reply #13 on: August 06, 2014, 04:17:13 AM »
I believe the new growth is very different to my m. cauliflora var paulista... but I am not good identifying plants yet...

huertasurbanas

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Re: please: ID this jabuticaba
« Reply #14 on: August 07, 2014, 02:30:33 PM »
By the way: in 1 month I would be able to taste their fruits and take some photos!

what is the best (or a good) way to send fresh fruits of jaboticaba in a mail?

The package with fruits of Jaboticaba by ecommends take between 3-5 days to arrive (by a national service, 1000km by truck), then the man tells me that if the fruit is very mature will rot before ... says he has to harvest them a little immature, and so will be less sweet...

What is the best way to send fresh Jaboticaba fruits unrefrigerated? we will be in late winter when he send them to me.

huertasurbanas

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Re: please: ID this jabuticaba
« Reply #15 on: August 27, 2014, 08:27:00 PM »
These photos are from the seller, does it seems to be m. cauliflora? or coronata? I would say coronata, because this crown is somewhat green...




huertasurbanas

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Re: please: ID this jabuticaba
« Reply #16 on: August 31, 2014, 08:50:51 PM »
So! I have better photos from my first ever tasted jaboticabas! see:

http://tropicalfruitforum.com/index.php?topic=12329.0







now can you tell what should they be? cauliflora?

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Re: please: ID this jabuticaba
« Reply #17 on: August 31, 2014, 09:50:17 PM »
My guess is one of the many forms of coronata.
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huertasurbanas

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Re: please: ID this jabuticaba
« Reply #18 on: September 01, 2014, 08:59:05 AM »
Great Adam, so maybe I tasted one of the best myrciarias... some brazilians think that coroada is very good.

I dont know how to label it (as I have 2 little trees of this species and grafted a coroada over sabara)... maybe will label them as m. coronata or myrciaria sp. corrientes