Leaf miner problem

[lotusblos]

Can anyone recommend an effective treatment for getting rid of leaf miners? Last year I used a systemic poison, lost a good years growth on my tree, and now they're back. Why does everything have to be so hard?

[bsbullie]

Imidacloprid...this treatment will not cause you to lose any growth.

[lotusblos]

bsbullie, has this treatment worked for you? Because it's what I used last year and the leaf miners came back strong.

[bsbullie]

bsbullie, has this treatment worked for you? Because it's what I used last year and the leaf miners came back strong.

Yes, works for me.  What product did you use, at what strength  and how did you apply it?

[Millet]

Imidacloprid (Bayer Advanced Fruit, Citrus, and Vegetable Insect Control) applied to the ground at the base of citrus trees provides the longest period of control, 1 to 3 months. Imidacloprid should only be applied once a year. Imidacloprid applications should be timed to protect periods of leaf flushing, such as in the spring and fall. Imidacloprid takes 1 to 2 weeks to move from the roots to the leaves, so it should be applied as soon as new flush begins to appear. To protect bees, avoid applying imidacloprid during the period 1 month prior to or during bloom. Removing blossoms before they open on young trees will prevent honey bee exposure to imidacloprid in the nectar/pollen. - Millet

[bsbullie]

Disagree somewhat with Millets post above.  First off, Bayers advanced is about useless.  It is extremely weak, compred to commercial strength and compared to what citrus growers use.  It should be appled approximately  every six months r
to citrus, which would be twice per year.

[Millet]

bsbullie, here in Colorado we do not have leaf miners, so personally I never have a need for any of the control chemicals.  As a home tree owner can you purchase the commercial strength chemical? - Millet

[Galka]

Disagree somewhat with Millets post above.  First off, Bayers advanced is about useless.  It is extremely weak, compred to commercial strength and compared to what citrus growers use.  It should be appled approximately  every six months r
to citrus, which would be twice per year.

bsbullie, could you tell what kind you use? How do you apply it? Is it a liquid or granules? I bought something with spinosad last year on amazone. It helped a little but I had to apply it on new growth each time.

[redster]

im curious myself, whats the concentration, application and ratio differences between commercial and bayer advanced?  I apply it as late as I can and a little heavy, it lasts most of the growing season for me. even my mileage varies per tree though.

[lotusblos]

I used the Bayer Advanced Fruit, Citrus, and Vegetable Insect Control, and followed the directions on the label. I don't remember what the amount per gallon ratio was, but since I'd never used the product before I tried my best to be accurate with the dosage. Almost all of the affected leaves dropped off over the winter months and then in late summer the leaf miners struck again. My trees seem healthy otherwise (except for my Valencia orange which has come down with something over the last 2-4 weeks).

[redster]

what do you mean affected leaves? by the leafminers?  they shouldn't fall of the tree that easily, maybe you have something else going on with it

[Millet]

DO  commercial growers actually have a more concentrated formula of imidacloprid? Most all commercial growers almost never bother to spray anything for the control of leaf miners, unless they have a grove of young trees.  Leaf miners may cause a tree to look unsightly,  but do not cause much damage for older citrus trees. - Millet

[Riverland]

Agree with Millet.  Non bearing trees less than 5 years old get a treatment, but otherwise they are not sprayed for CLM. Certainly not with Imidacloprid, where the withholding period here is very long.
If the CLM pressure is high, there is a beneficial wasp that is used that does a very good job at keeping their numbers down.
Far more damaging for commercial growers here is the citrus gall wasp. Currently no systemic works on it.

[marklee]

Add nitrogen when the miners are not active in the cooler months since they are only attracted to new growth. Apply the imidicloprid a few months before the weather warms up. Also you can start feeding the tree with phosphorous to get it to flower, just try to keep the nitrogen down so you don't get new growth, Once you see the miners it is too late for the imidicloprid  to get to the leaves on bigger trees, on smaller trees you can add the chemical when you start seeing miners or get a pheromone trap to detect the adults.

[lotusblos]

Redster, I'm no expert, but I assumed this is what leaf miner damage looked like. Most of the new growth last year had markings like in the attached photo. If it's not leaf miner, please set me straight. Thanks for your help.

[lotusblos]

marklee, does the imidacloprid affect the fruit? As I remember, their were no restrictions as to harvesting the fruit after application.

[So_Cal_Mike]

lotusblos, That is indeed CLM damage.

[bsbullie]

Commercial grade imidacloprid has a 21% - 22% active ingredient  (imidacloprid ) in comparison to  Bayer Advanced  which has a .235% aactive ingredient  (imidacloprid ).  The commercial grade is available for purchase by the homeowner in Florida.  In Florida i havecseen leaf miner damage on both soft new growth and hardened off growth.  Because our climate here in SFla applications twice a year can be very important depending on the pests effects on your trees.  For growers and nurseries selling citrus here there are aslo requirements to keep tags on the trees showing the application that must be within 6 months of the date of inspections (at any time) on the tags.

[Mark in Texas]

bsbullie, could you tell what kind you use? How do you apply it? Is it a liquid or granules? I bought something with spinosad last year on amazone. It helped a little but I had to apply it on new growth each time.

Best bang for the buck @ 75% AI - http://www.ebay.com/itm/Adonis-75-WSP-InsecticideTermiticide-Imidacloprid-4-x-2-25-oz-Water-Soluble-Paks-/200797562870

I apply it foliar to Christmas trees for pine tip moth control and as a soil drench on citrus, avocados for control of leaf miners, white flies, aphids, etc.  I have seen no damage to wild bees.....they are everywhere at my farm.  My citrus is covered in hundreds of bees.  They come and go daily via my greenhouse vents.

Admire Pro, Merit and other products are a rip off by comparison.  Same label too.

[Mark in Texas]

Commercial grade imidacloprid has a 21% - 22% active ingredient  (imidacloprid ) in comparison....

Try 75%.   

[bsbullie]

Commercial grade imidacloprid has a 21% - 22% active ingredient  (imidacloprid ) in comparison....

Try 75%.   

Yes, i know you can get 75% however  the 22% does fine if properly applied.  Also, I personally would never buy a pesticide off of ebay. I just wouldnt trust it.

[karpes]

I have an old  unopened quart of imidacloprid that I have not use because I just don't have a good feeling about it. I found out that it has the same imidacloprid ingredient that is used in Dominion 2L termite control. A friend that works for a termite control company  told me that Imidacloprid will remain active in the ground for several years. Follow up treatment for termite control is 7 years so that's the life expectancy of Imidacloprid. I don't know but that just raises the hair on my neck about using it.
 I have sprayed light horticultural oil on new flushes but have discontinued this after a conversation with LSU agcenter. What I was told is yes leaf miners are ugly and make you angry but the damage done is minimal to the health of the tree. Young trees on the other hand can be hurt by them but the older trees handle the damage just fine.
 Maybe for a large orchard grower these chemicals make a difference but for me it is just not justifiable when I give away most of my crop to friends, and  Food Banks.

[Mark in Texas]

Commercial grade imidacloprid has a 21% - 22% active ingredient  (imidacloprid ) in comparison....

Try 75%.   

Yes, i know you can get 75% however  the 22% does fine if properly applied.  Also, I personally would never buy a pesticide off of ebay. I just wouldnt trust it.

No different than buying a gallon of Borden's milk from your grocery store.

Facts before feelings........

[Mark in Texas]

I have an old  unopened quart of imidacloprid that I have not use because I just don't have a good feeling about it.

I rest my case.

[bsbullie]

Mark - dont really understand your comparison about the milk.  I would not be worried about what is inside the bottle of milk that I purchased from the super market. I would be confidentvthat the use by date was from the manufacturer and ths t the bottle contained milk.  Ebay, not so much...

As for facts...I have been ripped off on eBay a number of times and on every occasion PayPal sided with the other party.  I can buy products locally st discounted rates and that's good enough for me.