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Author Topic: Update on Russells Sweet Garcinia  (Read 17573 times)

Mike T

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Update on Russells Sweet Garcinia
« on: July 19, 2012, 04:53:20 AM »



Today I had coffee for an hour with with a highly respected and experienced tropical fruit researcher who works for the state government.He is involved with international and local projects and advises growers and has many publications on numerous tropical fruit species and varieties.I quizzed him on Russells Sweet Garcinia to get an expert opinion.It is definately an undescribed species with fruit of exceptional quality.The species is dioecious and lone females produce small seedless fruit and fertilized females produce masses of very large fruit with seeds.The lack of acceptance that it is dioecious contributed to it not successfully being spread around.There are 6 fruiting trees and all are on one property with a single male tree.They can easily be grafted onto G.dulcis.The trees survived 300km/hr cat 5 cyclone winds in 2011 and are recovering after a battering. Now I know where they are and who has them I hope to get some seeds.

BMc

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Re: Update on Russells Sweet Garcinia
« Reply #1 on: July 19, 2012, 05:38:40 AM »
shotgun!  ;D

fruitlovers

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Re: Update on Russells Sweet Garcinia
« Reply #2 on: July 19, 2012, 06:25:22 AM »
Great fruit detective work. Hope you can send some this way!  ;D
Oscar

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Re: Update on Russells Sweet Garcinia
« Reply #3 on: July 19, 2012, 06:51:37 AM »
Start grafting up some plants to get the numbers up!  Is this location a place you can go and visit?  If so, some pictures would be worth a 1000 words here!  Look forward to more updates.

Mike T

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Re: Update on Russells Sweet Garcinia
« Reply #4 on: July 19, 2012, 07:20:28 AM »
The property is about 120 miles away and my connections are tenuous.Garcinia dulcis rootstock would be hard to get as they are not very popular.I will try to get there and take snaps and it would be good to have some dulcis of suitable size to graft both male and female sections on.Getting seeds which presumably have a 50:50 sex ratio would be a good first step.

Ethan

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Re: Update on Russells Sweet Garcinia
« Reply #5 on: July 19, 2012, 01:52:48 PM »
3 gold stars for you! 8) 8) 8)  Please put me on the list. ;D

-Ethan

Soren

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Re: Update on Russells Sweet Garcinia
« Reply #6 on: July 19, 2012, 03:08:43 PM »
Yup - sign me up for this one as well Mike.!
Søren
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BMc

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Re: Update on Russells Sweet Garcinia
« Reply #7 on: July 19, 2012, 06:09:22 PM »
Mike, did you ask about the possibility of grafting onto faster growing garcinia. G. dulcis is so slow that I wouldnt expect it to make a great rootstock and seed grown would overtake the grafted plants in minutes. How about something like yellow mangosteen or G. warrenii - it seems to be fast growing and bulletproof.
Another collector here has a grafted one, but its a few years off fruiting yet. From talking to him about his plant, the grafted ones can take quite a while (up to 2 years) to really do anything much.

fruitlovers

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Re: Update on Russells Sweet Garcinia
« Reply #8 on: July 19, 2012, 06:47:45 PM »
The property is about 120 miles away and my connections are tenuous.Garcinia dulcis rootstock would be hard to get as they are not very popular.I will try to get there and take snaps and it would be good to have some dulcis of suitable size to graft both male and female sections on.Getting seeds which presumably have a 50:50 sex ratio would be a good first step.

Mike, if it is easier to get G. xanthochymus rootstock then that one should also be compatible as it is almost identical to G. dulcis.
Oscar

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Re: Update on Russells Sweet Garcinia
« Reply #9 on: July 19, 2012, 06:51:45 PM »
Mike, did you ask about the possibility of grafting onto faster growing garcinia. G. dulcis is so slow that I wouldnt expect it to make a great rootstock and seed grown would overtake the grafted plants in minutes. How about something like yellow mangosteen or G. warrenii - it seems to be fast growing and bulletproof.
Another collector here has a grafted one, but its a few years off fruiting yet. From talking to him about his plant, the grafted ones can take quite a while (up to 2 years) to really do anything much.

G. warrenii may not work. This species is much closer to cherapu (G. praniana), so might be good rootstock for that. If by yellow mangosteen you mean xanthochymus i'm sure that would work.
BTW, how is the fruit of warrenii? I think i asked this before? Forget now.
Oscar

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Re: Update on Russells Sweet Garcinia
« Reply #10 on: July 19, 2012, 07:51:22 PM »
I was just throwing the idea out there as Russells Sweet has a pretty upright looking habit, somewhere between the droopy yellows and upright purples/pinks.
I've only had one warrenii, but I liked it. Flesh is a bit mangosteen like - more so than the pulpy dulcis types. Flavour was reminiscent of mangosteen, but sweet/sour ratio was way outta wack - very sour, but can taste the goodness way under there. I dont mind super sour things though and am pre-disposed to liking many natives - I eat Davidson's Plum outta hand with glee. The general line is that warrenii (or the 'sour plum') is 'great for jam'. Fruit look like a squat mangosteen without a calyx and the tree is very pretty and tough: http://www.flickr.com/photos/42087530@N02/4940588169/#in/photostream/



Mike T

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Re: Update on Russells Sweet Garcinia
« Reply #11 on: July 19, 2012, 07:58:09 PM »
Oscar,Bmc I have tried wild warrenii a number of times  and it peaks at somewhere less than ordinary.I would need a more fertile imagination and go on a limb to detect mangosteen.They actually get to be a fairly big tree.

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Re: Update on Russells Sweet Garcinia
« Reply #12 on: July 19, 2012, 09:26:14 PM »
Oscar,Bmc I have tried wild warrenii a number of times  and it peaks at somewhere less than ordinary.I would need a more fertile imagination and go on a limb to detect mangosteen.They actually get to be a fairly big tree.

How fast and vigorous is warrenii?
Oscar

Mike T

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Re: Update on Russells Sweet Garcinia
« Reply #13 on: September 30, 2013, 10:48:59 PM »
To further update the Russells Sweet Garcinia story the whole crop failed again.I bumped into Russell himself in the street and he let me know why this fruit he considers the finest of all Garcinias and an undescribed species has failed to take hold.The original group of trees included a male and interestingly several rare fruit folk decided no male was needed and this belief has caused numerous problems up until the current time.The penny has finally dropped and males need to be retained and the grafted female plants originally spread around did not produce for a reason.There are at least 2 male trees left,somewhat by accident in the only producing grove of them.The production line of grafting entire males and male limbs on females has begun and I need a male as well.Still this Garcinia was never relocated in SE Asia and according to Russell it is clearly distinct from G.dulcis and far superior.
Steadfast belief in not needing males (stupidity) has caused the decline of this fruit with huge potential.I hope it promise can be realized.

Tim

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Re: Update on Russells Sweet Garcinia
« Reply #14 on: October 01, 2013, 12:36:13 AM »
Good luck obtaining a male plant, or maybe score some budwood to graft onto yours... Gotta show us your grafting skills from down under
Tim

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Re: Update on Russells Sweet Garcinia
« Reply #15 on: October 01, 2013, 01:07:14 AM »
Wow sounds yum..sign me up for seeds too please!

Mike T

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Re: Update on Russells Sweet Garcinia
« Reply #16 on: October 01, 2013, 01:24:16 AM »
http://rfcarchives.org.au/Next/Fruits/Mangosteen/YellowMangosteen9-94.htm

I will just put in the original link in again telling the story and how it was thought to be a strange G.dulcis at first.

***mod edit: fixed link***
« Last Edit: October 01, 2013, 02:48:47 AM by Tim »

Mike T

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Re: Update on Russells Sweet Garcinia
« Reply #17 on: October 01, 2013, 02:47:42 AM »
http://rfcarchives.org.au/Next/Fruits/Mangosteen/YellowMangosteen9-94.htm
This is the link sorry. Originally it was tagged as an unusual G.dulcis. 

bangkok

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Re: Update on Russells Sweet Garcinia
« Reply #18 on: October 01, 2013, 07:47:47 AM »
xx
« Last Edit: October 01, 2013, 05:16:33 PM by bangkok »

Mike T

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Re: Update on Russells Sweet Garcinia
« Reply #19 on: October 01, 2013, 03:28:03 PM »
Bangkok I don't think that is the same as the skin and shape are different.

bangkok

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Re: Update on Russells Sweet Garcinia
« Reply #20 on: October 01, 2013, 05:17:08 PM »
Okay i removed the picture.

Would be nice to have a pic of that fruit though.

Mike T

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Re: Update on Russells Sweet Garcinia
« Reply #21 on: October 01, 2013, 05:19:05 PM »
The one in the link in black and white seems to be the only one around.

Tomas

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Re: Update on Russells Sweet Garcinia
« Reply #22 on: October 01, 2013, 07:20:05 PM »
Hi Mike,

There should be more like you in the world trying to help the survival or rare species. Perhaps next year will bring some fruits.

Tomas

luc

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Re: Update on Russells Sweet Garcinia
« Reply #23 on: October 01, 2013, 07:29:10 PM »
Y'all wait till your Mexican Garcinia start fruiting , when you'll have a totally ripe one I wanna hear the comments .....

I was able to eat a lot of  G. dulcis in Lancetilla ( all seedless unfortunately ) they were not that ' DULCIS ' so I wondered why they gave it that name .

Being a Garcinia fanatic , put me on the list for seeds of the Russells , Mike , if they ever become available .
Luc Vleeracker
Puerto Vallarta
Mexico , Pacific coast.
20 degrees north

Mike T

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Re: Update on Russells Sweet Garcinia
« Reply #24 on: October 01, 2013, 09:25:19 PM »
Luc,
You bet Luc, it is one of the big game I need to 'pull down' but won't keep giving me the slip.
From my experience duclis comes in a few forms including big trees to dwarf bushes with fruit ranging from sour and xanthochymus like to sweet/sour. They peak at a sugar/acid balance south of achachariu.I am yet to eat the Russells sweet but it is like an echo from the past with lamenting fruit enthusiasts speaking in hushed tones about the one that got away.Cyclone damage also caused big problems and hopefully not another fruitless season will pass.That also goes for my other white whale, Durio macrantha.They are like migaloo not minkes.

 

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