The Tropical Fruit Forum

I've been doing a bit of reading on this. From what I can tell, microclimate plays a large role, though the ability to sit on a tree for an extended period appears to be the key. It seems that the varieties most highly acclaimed don't need a long hang time to achieve a characteristic flavor. Typically these are all varieties similar to Black Madeira. There are a number of other varietals in different categories however, and it has been stated repeatedly that for most, the unique flavors come out when they've been allowed an extended hang time, and this can often be to the point of sugar spotting. I've even noted on the riper Excels that there's a light melon note I don't see others talking about, so I do understand when others talk about something needing a long hang time to exhibit full flavor.

Microclimate and hang-time aside, it also appears that caprification plays a role for some, and it was mentioned that at certain tastings, the figs that were caprified were more highly appreciated than those that were not. Since San Diego is one of the few places where wild caprifigs grow(and in some cases wasps overwinter), it's an important consideration.

I would start at microclimate though, as near the coast in San Diego, it's very different than the continentally influenced inland valleys. This especially applies to the ripening periods for early figs that ripen when marine layer affects the majority of SD residents.

I'm still new to figs as well, and noticed that performance during the first three years is not indicative of the long-term character of a cultivar, especially in regards to flavor. My VdB was not a desirable fruit at all the first three years, but year four the flavors really came through.

If you choose a C-35 tree, when you go to graft it, stick the removed portion(s) into a propagation box with peat pellets and bottom heat and you'll have lots of rootstock in no time.

I sent you a PM with an excellent local source.

I've picked up a several cuttings from him this year, all are pushing growth excellently, and should be rooted in a month or two.

Quote from: johnb51 on April 19, 2020, 01:23:34 PM

Quote from: Squam256 on April 19, 2020, 11:04:13 AM

A properly ripened Mallika is very similar in flavor to Lemon Zest.

Whoa!  Really, Alex?

Mallika is a hybrid between Neelam and Dasheri, but it really doesn’t taste like Neelam at all. It inherited its flavor from the Dasheri which is known for having that citrus component.

Dasheri is originally from  northern India in the area of Lucknow. A theory that Ive mentioned here before and I think may hold merit is that the citrus-flavored Burmese/Lemon Meringue mangos And the Dasheri May share a common ancestor. Not only is their flavor similar, but they have similar shape, color, and another interesting trait: you may have noticed before that Lemon Meringue And Lemon Zest Can get these green splotches in their pigmentation when they ripen. One of the mangos that also gets that same green splotch pigmentation? Mallika.

Since PPK lacks the green spotting, and the LZ has a flavor more similar to Mallika, doesn't that imply that Mallika may be the pollen parent of LZ?

Time for some mango daytime TV.

I'd LOVE to plant both... as well as about 30 other varieties!!!

But I was hoping to pare that 30 down to less than a dozen. 

You could always multi-graft and then prune off the limbs of the less desired ones.

The clay that you plant on will only hold onto the salt ions, it's not feasible to amend it to the point where you will not encounter salt build-up issues, specifically chlorides.

In loose soil, chloride ions are carried away during the winter-spring rainy season, you notice the effects of buildup in the autumn when the Santa Ana winds blow through and all the avocados get burnt leaf margins. (except those on West Indian rootstock).

Since horse manure is high in these ions, it does not bode well to add it to the trees in your situation. It will exacerbate the issue, which is not one easily resolved, as there is no outlet for the ions once caught by the clay.

The leaf curl on the citrus is the leafminer, easily controlled by spraying spinosad in the morning early enough for it to dry before the bees arrive. It's best to spray when you see new flushes developing, but not before an anticipated rain. This year my trees had no issue on the first flush like they did last year, but spraying will be necessary if you want a good looking second or third flush, but the trees will do just fine with curled leaves if you don't mind the aesthetic. I believe the common brand in our area is Capt. Jacks deadbug.

All the best citrus I've tasted in our area were grown with minimal care. They had minimal organic matter in the soil, and were given water deficit treatment. I've only noticed citrus performance and quality diminish with the addition of organic matter.

I would seek out an alternative source of organic matter for adding to avos and stonefruit, my neighbor in Spring Valley (on a sandy clay) had excellent performance from his avocados by adding homemade compost/worm castings to the raised beds, seems like the earthworms enjoyed it very much.

Originally I was planned on getting a Santa Teresa but it isn't available for some reason.

Unfortunate, I would strongly recommend getting one when it comes back into stock.

I'm in your area, and in a similar situation. Let me share some of what I've learned regarding what you're interested in doing.

First and foremost, when using horse manure, consider that not all feeds are equal, and horses are not the best digesters. What comes out comes out hot, and it's good that your source already composts it or ages it for you for some additional fungal breakdown. When fresh it tends to work well as mulch with the caveat that it is quite hot nutritionally speaking and can cause a spike in nutrition which is not ideal for nitrogen sensitive plants, and can lead to aphid attacks. When composted as you're getting it, it tends to work better. Adding a thin layer to the surface seems to show some benefits to mangoes when watered in well (more on that in a little).

Another major consideration, as horses are poor digesters, if the feed contains viable seed, the manure often spreads the living seed around and can lead to a yard full of grass, specifically the potential for Bermuda grass. It's important to make sure the feed has been treated to remove this possibility or you will have an uphill battle in the coming years.

Next, you should consider whether horse manure is a good idea at all in your situation. The most important factor being the type of soil you are growing in. Being in La Mesa, it's very likely you have what is referred to as "Diablo Clay". If that is the case I would strongly recommend against the use of horse manure. If you are lucky and have a more friable soil with good drainage, then horse manure may be useful to you. The reason for this is that horse manure tends to be quite high in salts. In our climate, despite the ample rain recently, the general trend is for salt accumulation in the topsoil. This is exacerbated by our long, dry, hot, summers and municipal water with exceptionally high Total Dissolved Solids or TDS. If you are on Helix water this may not apply to you, but that is very dependent, you should consult the published figures that your water district sends out yearly.

Particularly Mango and Avocado are salt sensitive, and will quickly show it when the soil begins to dry out. If you have Diablo Clay, expect poor drainage and high salt accumulation and poor reaction towards horse manure. This can be avoided somewhat in Avocado by resorting to West Indian type rootstock which are more salt tolerant, but are more frost sensitive (situational).

By watering heavily you do lose some of the nitrogenous and potassium benefit, but you also potentially avoid the buildup of salts.

So I'd really say it depends on your soil. What kind of soil do you have? On our coarse, silty loam it's very beneficial to add horse manure to increase cation exchange capacity, but every situation is different.

Even if you stand to benefit from the use of horse manure, I would not add it to the citrus, just the stone fruit, mango, and avocado. Don't expect the manure to last long, it barely lasts a year if that, and yes, too much compost is entirely likely.

Anyone inspected the seed from Pineapple Pleasure? I found some reports that the seeds were mono, I'm just looking for more people to confirm.

I hear great things about Arctic Star, and I really like Tropic Snow. Unfortunately their seasons overlap leading to a glut. I'm not above eating dried peaches though, and I've considered a freeze drier for the future.

My peaches(Red Baron) have flesh that is far too soft and juicy (more like watery), I'm thinking it's a Calcium issue.

Our normally trouble-free springs interrupted by some rain. My peach has some leaf curl as well. Just a little more upkeep than usual.

Maha Chanok , Mallika, Edgar, Sunrise, Orange Essence..

Interesting, I've noted in the past that certain trees seem resistant for some but not for others, and this is more evidence to that end.

https://www.tropicalacresfarms.com/product-page/mallika

Mallika is highly prone to bacterial black spot and lost most of the fruit to it

Alex has also stated that Maha has similar issues in his grove.

Also CM has noted that some Keitt trees are sensitive to MBBS while others seem less affected.

Seems like there's a factor involved that needs further investigation.