when to pick black sapote?

[brian]

My seedling black sapote's first fruits seem to be starting to reach full size.  When should they be picked?  Are they like avocados where they must be picked and left to ripen off the tree?  Or can they be left on the tree until they become soft enough to eat?

They are still very hard if I give them a slight squeeze.

[RodneyS]

When the calyxes by the stem curl off the skin.

Let them soften on the counter till the fruit looks rotten, starts to collapse on itself, and the stem starts to tear off when picked up

[ben mango]

They can be left on the tree to ripen.

[brian]

I had read about the calyxs lifting, but it isn't clear to me what "fully lifted" looks like.  Mine are rippled, half one half off.

If it is safe to let them ripen on the tree I will do so until they begin to soften noticeably, then note the calyx appearance for future reference

Thanks guys

[RodneyS]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZwoCKG3mT5w

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g93sWdOP9hs

[elouicious]

Just have to say congrats on getting the fruit in Z6 brian!

[brian]

Just have to say congrats on getting the fruit in Z6 brian!

Thanks!  But to be fair this tree is in a container and is kept in a heated greenhouse over winter, I seriously doubt it would survive outdoors here!

[elouicious]

I am well aware of your growing situation! no chance it would make it out there outdoors-

giving hope to us zone pushers that things can be accomplished in pots

[brian]

So the one I picked in September sat on my counter for a month or two and eventually shriveled up, never becoming properly ripe.  I cut it open out of curiousity and the flesh was still white.  So I left the rest of the fruits on the tree.  They seemed to go into stasis all winter, and just in the past few weeks resumed softening.  I just cut one open, six months later and it was quite nice.  Large, good texture, only three seeds (of which two already sprouting inside the fruit).  Could be a bit sweeter, but overall I'm pleased for a seedling grown tree at this latitude.  Should have cut it in half for a picture before I ate it, but meh it looks like what you'd expect inside and size comparable to this other one

[elouicious]

major accomplishment brian!

I think these, like other persimmons, are best when left to fully soften on the tree as you mentioned. Six months on the tree seems about right- my Diospyros kaki have set flowers last month and they will not ripen until October/November-

I think they are best as an ingredient fruit-smoothies or as a marinade for some meats

[brian]

I mean it was six months since the fruit reached full size, about a full year from flower!

I have seen such "fruit stasis" before on other fruit trees where undersized immature fruits would cease growing, but they always colored up and dropped shortly after.  This is the first time I've seen a fruit seem to pause for the entire winter then resume ripening as if nothing happened.

[elouicious]

very interesting- are you growing mamey by any chance?

[brian]

I have a green sapote but I think it is dying from some trunk damage it sustained last year.  Not sure if I will replace it with another green sapote or mamey.  I really do like mamey and they are supposed to be very similar

[elouicious]

having tasted both I can say they are almost indistingushable-

Maybe viridis is a bit more sweet and colorful but this can also be fruit to fruit variation and growing location as the mamey I had in DR were the reddest and sweetest I have ever tried.

The reason I was interested is these can hang on the tree for almost 2 years in ideal climate and was wondering if you would have to wait something like 4 in the greenhouse

I may have another viridis seedling down the road if you are looking to replace

[brian]

I appreciate your experience, I will likely get whatever grafted type is available at the time - mamey or green sapote.  The mamey fruits certainly are more attractive looking. 

I understand these take a long time to fruit from seed, I will gladly pay the premium for a grafted tree instead of trying seedlings .  My grafted green sapote and canistel both flowered within a year or so of purchase.  I recall seeing a picture here recently of somebody with a huge seedling pouteria in their yard that still hadn't flowered yet! 

I have a Ross Sapote seedling that I might end up tossing if I have to wait a decade for fruit... when I already have a nice canistel fruiting already.