Tropical Fruit Forum - International Tropical Fruit Growers

Tropical Fruit => Tropical Fruit Discussion => Topic started by: NewGen on March 06, 2018, 05:43:47 PM

Title: Need advice on how to prune a cherimoya tree.
Post by: NewGen on March 06, 2018, 05:43:47 PM
Hi,

This Honeyheart has only given me about 5 fruits per season. The tree is about 5' tall, maybe 4 years old. I haven't really done much to it, basically just let it grow on its own. So now I've decided to prune it properly. First step was to strip off all the leaves. I have no idea which branches to remove. Please look at the photos.

"A" has some of the larger branches numbered for easier reference.
"B" shows some drastic pruning. Is that too much? Should I aim for something in between "A" and "B"? Which of the numbered branches should be removed?

What is your recommendation?

Thanks for your advice,

(https://s10.postimg.cc/6egzd6f2t/image.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/image/6egzd6f2t/)

(https://s10.postimg.cc/qluf5i7f9/image.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/image/qluf5i7f9/)
Title: Re: Need advice on how to prune a cherimoya tree.
Post by: Bananaizme on March 06, 2018, 05:56:10 PM
    Trung

 Alex Silber has a good instructional video showing how to prune cherimoya on YouTube. He states on the video that heavy pruning stimulates 3 times as many flowers. I have a 15 year old fino de jete that I need to cut way back this spring.

William
Title: Re: Need advice on how to prune a cherimoya tree.
Post by: NewGen on March 06, 2018, 09:52:48 PM
Thanks William,

I will check out the videos.

Trung,
Title: Re: Need advice on how to prune a cherimoya tree.
Post by: Si Duong on March 07, 2018, 02:49:53 AM
May be this Video will help.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zL3N5kf_Muc (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zL3N5kf_Muc)
Title: Re: Need advice on how to prune a cherimoya tree.
Post by: OCchris1 on March 07, 2018, 03:07:30 AM
Hey NewGen, i would clip anything is growing inward or downward. They tend to be upright and weighing down (upright) branches serves you best IMO. You will want the optimum growing area- i.e.;new growth, Chris
Title: Re: Need advice on how to prune a cherimoya tree.
Post by: gozp on March 07, 2018, 05:01:56 AM
Hey NewGen, i would clip anything is growing inward or downward. They tend to be upright and weighing down (upright) branches serves you best IMO. You will want the optimum growing area- i.e.;new growth, Chris

I agree. Also to increase your yield. Fertilize your soil. Once you see flowers. Dump potassium sulfate & calcium for brix.
Title: Re: Need advice on how to prune a cherimoya tree.
Post by: behlgarden on March 07, 2018, 04:52:28 PM
if you want perfect shaped cherimoya tree, keep it under 6 feet after pruning height. this allows you to pollinate flowers up to 6 feet max. I seldom see fruits higher than 6 feet. I like my trees to start canopy/side branching at 12-18 inches max, then cap height at 6 feet every year and maintain it there.
Title: Re: Need advice on how to prune a cherimoya tree.
Post by: fyliu on March 07, 2018, 05:04:52 PM
I think the B plan is better. You especially don't want that right upper branch to develop too much and become top heavy so soon. The lower branches on the right branch are fine. Watch out for the vigorous growth from the higher points this summer. You'l probably need to control those. How tall is the highest point in B anyway? It looks really tall compared to the fence. My fence is 6 ft.

Behl, how many levels of branching do you suggest for your ideal 6 ft pruned tree? It's good to get a rough idea. I have 5 smaller trees that I need to shape this year. First I need to figure how many grafts will take and how many varieties I can get on them.
Title: Re: Need advice on how to prune a cherimoya tree.
Post by: behlgarden on March 07, 2018, 05:10:48 PM
there is no set rule of thumb other than center leader trunk is cut off at no more than 24 inches. then side branches each is allowed to grow no more than 12 inches. I prune back. Then branches from them grow another 12 inches. I let them grow 24 inches so when I prune back to 12 inches, they are thick.  Idea is to keep center of the tree open for light and air like a funnel. So cut off any growth that grows inwards towards the center. 

My Nata was growing weird, so was pierce. I fixed nata and this year I am fixing pierce.

If you dont cut the center leader trunk off at low height, you charimoya tree will look tall and spindly. Folks worry about cutting/pruning, trust me these monsters grow fast in CA and I almost do two prunings.

Cherimoya trees should look like a bush and not a tree. Dr. Angel is who I got inspired by who maintains small height and his cherimoyas put large fruits too.
Title: Re: Need advice on how to prune a cherimoya tree.
Post by: johnb51 on March 08, 2018, 09:53:12 AM
Any difference in pruning atemoya?  Or would you follow the same general guidelines?
Title: Re: Need advice on how to prune a cherimoya tree.
Post by: behlgarden on March 08, 2018, 10:59:06 AM
Any difference in pruning atemoya?  Or would you follow the same general guidelines?

I would assume the same. these anonas require hand pollination, you have hard time pollinating anyting taller than 6-7 feet as you cant reach.
Title: Re: Need advice on how to prune a cherimoya tree.
Post by: Ulfr on March 09, 2018, 01:07:40 AM
Any difference in pruning atemoya?  Or would you follow the same general guidelines?

My oldest are only two years in the ground but I treat them the same as Behl said. Some are pretty vigorous and I prune more than once a year. I know little of cherimoya so cannot compare in that regard.
Title: Re: Need advice on how to prune a cherimoya tree.
Post by: RollingInTheWeeds on April 15, 2018, 09:27:19 PM
Since you began your post by pointing out that your cherimoya hasn't been setting much fruit, it sounds like you're hoping to not only give the tree a good structure, but improve its yield in the process.  My tree is younger than yours and hasn't set fruit yet, so I can only share some of the info I've gathered on maximizing cherimoya fruit yield *without* pollinating by hand.

1.  Here's a video of someone who has a Honeyheart cherimoya tree who gets plenty of fruit without hand pollinating, and the tree structure (shape of the canopy really) he says it's due to: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DKAmrsBnOmA (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DKAmrsBnOmA)  He calls his video "Never hand pollinate cherimoya again."
2.  And here's a study that talks about another cherimoya tree structure that improves self-pollination (but I can't quite tell from the abstract what the structure is!?!)   www.tandfonline.com/doi/abs/10.1080/14620316.2010.11512706 (http://www.tandfonline.com/doi/abs/10.1080/14620316.2010.11512706)  It's title is “Flowering and fruit set in cherimoya (Annona cherimola Mill.) as affected by the tree-training system.”

I'm sure I'll know a lot more about what I *should* have done ten years from now.   :(
Title: Re: Need advice on how to prune a cherimoya tree.
Post by: simon_grow on April 16, 2018, 09:21:09 AM
Thanks to the link to the video and reading.

Exotica has a huge Cherimoya tree that is widespreading and produces tons of fruit without hand pollination although most the fruit are small and misshaped.

I feel that those wanting larger and better shaped fruit are better off hand pollinating although the pruning technique is definitely worth a try.

I’ve also heard people talking about hanging ripe Bannanas around the interior of the tree which is supposed to attract certain bugs but I don’t know if there is any truth behind it.

Simon
Title: Re: Need advice on how to prune a cherimoya tree.
Post by: barath on April 16, 2018, 01:36:40 PM
Thanks to the link to the video and reading.

Exotica has a huge Cherimoya tree that is widespreading and produces tons of fruit without hand pollination although most the fruit are small and misshaped.

I feel that those wanting larger and better shaped fruit are better off hand pollinating although the pruning technique is definitely worth a try.

I’ve also heard people talking about hanging ripe Bannanas around the interior of the tree which is supposed to attract certain bugs but I don’t know if there is any truth behind it.

Simon

Edgar Valdivia told me once that he leaves white sapote fruit under cherimoya trees to attract bugs that pollinate his cherimoyas.
Title: Re: Need advice on how to prune a cherimoya tree.
Post by: fyliu on April 16, 2018, 02:03:02 PM
I want to summarize these sources so people won't have to go through them like I have.

1.  Here's a video of someone who has a Honeyheart cherimoya tree who gets plenty of fruit without hand pollinating, and the tree structure (shape of the canopy really) he says it's due to: [url]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DKAmrsBnOmA[/url] ([url]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DKAmrsBnOmA[/url])  He calls his video "Never hand pollinate cherimoya again."

The video is very shaky and hurt my head even though it's not very long. Skip to the end where he shows the shot of the exterior of the small tree. The main point he makes is to let the skirt go low to the ground.
Quote
2.  And here's a study that talks about another cherimoya tree structure that improves self-pollination (but I can't quite tell from the abstract what the structure is!?!)   [url=http://www.tandfonline.com/doi/abs/10.1080/14620316.2010.11512706]www.tandfonline.com/doi/abs/10.1080/14620316.2010.11512706[/url] ([url]http://www.tandfonline.com/doi/abs/10.1080/14620316.2010.11512706[/url])  It's title is “Flowering and fruit set in cherimoya (Annona cherimola Mill.) as affected by the tree-training system.”

This research used the tall spindle training method where there is a single trunk with weak branches coming out of it. It's the opposite of the open center style where there are multiple branches. The key to the tall spindle is to keep all the side branches weak. Only the trunk is strong. As branches become strong, they need to be pruned back close to the trunk in a way that encourages growth of new weak branches.
Title: Re: Need advice on how to prune a cherimoya tree.
Post by: behlgarden on April 16, 2018, 03:06:51 PM
The video is very shaky and hurt my head even though it's not very long. Skip to the end where he shows the shot of the exterior of the small tree. The main point he makes is to let the skirt go low to the ground.
Quote

that is how my Behl cherimoya is. I like low branching and canopy with tree mature height maintained under 8 feet max, gets pruned down to 6 feet every year. However, I did cut the middle section of tree for open V shape for light and air, looks like that is not recommended so I will try not to prune the V this year.
Title: Re: Need advice on how to prune a cherimoya tree.
Post by: RollingInTheWeeds on April 17, 2018, 03:19:56 PM
Because the subject line for this thread only mentions pruning, I'm beginning a new thread today on "Getting cherimoyas to fruit without pollinating by hand".