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Tropical Fruit => Tropical Fruit Discussion => Topic started by: FlyingFoxFruits on September 23, 2012, 06:59:58 PM

Title: Rubber Sugar Apple....quite nice and unusual
Post by: FlyingFoxFruits on September 23, 2012, 06:59:58 PM
Hey Ya'll

http://fruitingplants.wordpress.com/?attachment_id=93 (http://fruitingplants.wordpress.com/?attachment_id=93)

http://fruitingplants.wordpress.com/?attachment_id=92 (http://fruitingplants.wordpress.com/?attachment_id=92)

I've been thinking about this Rubber Sugar apple I got from cookiemonster, and it's starting to get me confused!  Above are some pics (and captions with the pics in the links)

I remember reading about a name for this variety that wasn't just simply "rubber"...as I bought the tree labeled.

I'm sure this is an alternate name adopted by American growers who couldn't pronounce or remember its original and alien sounding name.

Any ideas what the old name might be?

Rubber does fit the description somewhat..because when the fruits are full sized, but not yet fully ripe...the fruits are rubbery when squeezed!  The tree seems to be a late season cultivar.

I've only tasted one fruit so far, but was amazed by the unusual texture and similarity to a mix of coconut and sugar apple...just in texture...not coconut taste!

Enjoy the pics yous guys!

thanks for posting in advance.
Title: Re: Rubber Sugar Apple....quite nice and unusual
Post by: Future on September 23, 2012, 07:03:13 PM
That pot looks small.  What size is it?  How old is the tree?  Grafted?
Title: Re: Rubber Sugar Apple....quite nice and unusual
Post by: fruitlovers on September 23, 2012, 07:14:28 PM
Hi Adam, nice photos. Did you know you can insert the image right into your post? If you do that then the image will appear for all to see without having to go to your website. Just click "insert image" button on lower bottom left side when posting and paste the URL there.
Title: Re: Rubber Sugar Apple....quite nice and unusual
Post by: FlyingFoxFruits on September 23, 2012, 07:46:29 PM
That pot looks small.  What size is it?  How old is the tree?  Grafted?
to answer your 3 questions,

3 gal pot, about 3 ft tall, about 3 yrs old.

it's not grafted its a seedling I bought.

it's has only made three fruits.

Title: Re: Rubber Sugar Apple....quite nice and unusual
Post by: kh0110 on September 23, 2012, 08:17:57 PM
Adam, originally, when you used the term "rubber", I thought you were talking about a kind of sugar apple found in SE Asia that is a bit bigger than normal SA but the skin resemble that of a Petch Packchong (thin skin) and it would come off very easily leaving the flesh whole in one piece. I called it Chewy SA, translated from Cambodian. To split the fruit, you really have to put a little effort by actually tearing it apart. And the consistency of the flesh resemble that of a Geffner atemoya but a bit more chewy/elastic. Another thing about Chewy SA is that it has much less seeds than normal SA.

Now that you have posted a picture of your Rubber SA, I could tell that it's not the same as the one I described above. The skin is thick and rough. This looks more like Giant Green SA that Mike T has. Or even the Noel's Big Green.

Title: Re: Rubber Sugar Apple....quite nice and unusual
Post by: edself65 on September 23, 2012, 08:38:13 PM
Any photos of a cut fruit Adam?
Title: Re: Rubber Sugar Apple....quite nice and unusual
Post by: FlyingFoxFruits on September 23, 2012, 09:12:50 PM
Hi Adam, nice photos. Did you know you can insert the image right into your post? If you do that then the image will appear for all to see without having to go to your website. Just click "insert image" button on lower bottom left side when posting and paste the URL there.


I'm having trouble figuring it out!  for now this will have to suffice!  thanks for trying to help me understand this devil, some call a computer...it pisses me off to no end.

and thanks for the compliments on the photo...I might have to send you a pair of free seeds. 

I'm not really sharing these this year though! I'm planting them all..I'm very impressed with this fruit so far..so I'm hoping this one catches on...or is good for breeding or some other application where it can excel due to its strange characteristics.

PS  The two individuals who requested seeds will still get some though!  Tim and Davidgarcia I believe got the only seeds I was selling.  They will come out of the largest fruit on my tree I have yet to harvest.  I will keep u posted.

Any photos of a cut fruit Adam?


I have one real crappy one....here it is!

http://fruitingplants.wordpress.com/?attachment_id=102a (http://fruitingplants.wordpress.com/?attachment_id=102a)

I will make sure to take another pic, way better...also I'd like to be able to show how firm the texture is...I might try to grate some up like coconut..or slice the pulp thin...like chips or something...to show how crisp it is.

Title: Re: Rubber Sugar Apple....quite nice and unusual
Post by: FlyingFoxFruits on September 23, 2012, 09:21:27 PM
Adam, originally, when you used the term "rubber", I thought you were talking about a kind of sugar apple found in SE Asia that is a bit bigger than normal SA but the skin resemble that of a Petch Packchong (thin skin) and it would come off very easily leaving the flesh whole in one piece. I called it Chewy SA, translated from Cambodian. To split the fruit, you really have to put a little effort by actually tearing it apart. And the consistency of the flesh resemble that of a Geffner atemoya but a bit more chewy/elastic. Another thing about Chewy SA is that it has much less seeds than normal SA.

Now that you have posted a picture of your Rubber SA, I could tell that it's not the same as the one I described above. The skin is thick and rough. This looks more like Giant Green SA that Mike T has. Or even the Noel's Big Green.

hi kh0110,

thanks for your help!

I grow one called a giant mexican sugar apple..and its not that one for sure.  I don't think this fruit is giant either....its normal sized, and bears quick from seed.

The giant mexican sugar apples seem to take a while longer to fruit from seed, being that the fruits need more support!  They get huge!

I'm excited to report more about this so called rubber sugar apple.  I've only eaten one fruit...but it was a real turn on...and I'm ready for more.

I will share some better pics soon...hopefully we can get this figured out!

Cookiemonster might have the info we seek.





Title: Re: Rubber Sugar Apple....quite nice and unusual
Post by: fruitlovers on September 23, 2012, 09:24:06 PM
Oh please! Don't make me do it for you. I know you can figure it out!(http://fruitingplants.files.wordpress.com/2012/09/9-16-2012-018.jpg?w=848)
Title: Re: Rubber Sugar Apple....quite nice and unusual
Post by: FlyingFoxFruits on September 23, 2012, 09:33:01 PM
thanks Oscar!

I still don't know how u did that!

Is the link to make the picture appear on this website? or wordpress?

I also wanted to comment about the pic real fast,

I forgot to say that when I cut the fruit in half, that chunk of pulp, you'll see directly left of the knife, popped out!  like a piece of soap slipping out of my hand!  It was funny...I've never had such a firm annona.

Maybe the second fruit will be mushier?
Title: Re: Rubber Sugar Apple....quite nice and unusual
Post by: FlyingFoxFruits on September 23, 2012, 09:37:55 PM
(http://fruitingplants.files.wordpress.com/2012/09/9-23-2012null-opuntia-016.jpg?w=848)

wait wait!  here is a test run with a pic of my Cogshall and the other seven dwarfs..pickering...can u spot the loner?

I think I figured it out!!

thanks again Oscar!

Title: Re: Rubber Sugar Apple....quite nice and unusual
Post by: fruitlovers on September 23, 2012, 10:25:19 PM
I;m sure you know this already also Adam, but here goes anyway. If you ever decide to market these plants you will have to call them something other than rubber. Somehow rubber has gotten a bad name. You know: tastes like rubber. Don't think it would be a hot seller with that name.
Title: Re: Rubber Sugar Apple....quite nice and unusual
Post by: FlyingFoxFruits on September 23, 2012, 10:38:47 PM
I;m sure you know this already also Adam, but here goes anyway. If you ever decide to market these plants you will have to call them something other than rubber. Somehow rubber has gotten a bad name. You know: tastes like rubber. Don't think it would be a hot seller with that name.

I know I know...I think of profilactics when u say rubber.

that's what I bought it as...I'm actually hunting for the original name now!!  I will find it!

I'm like dog the cultivar name hunter!  I need some beads in my hair, and a more weathered face...maybe I can find the name then.
Title: Re: Rubber Sugar Apple....quite nice and unusual
Post by: fruitlovers on September 23, 2012, 10:51:49 PM
I;m sure you know this already also Adam, but here goes anyway. If you ever decide to market these plants you will have to call them something other than rubber. Somehow rubber has gotten a bad name. You know: tastes like rubber. Don't think it would be a hot seller with that name.

I know I know...I think of profilactics when u say rubber.

that's what I bought it as...I'm actually hunting for the original name now!!  I will find it!

I'm like dog the cultivar name hunter!  I need some beads in my hair, and a more weathered face...maybe I can find the name then.

If you can't find the original name just find out the word for a rubber in Vietnamese. It will sound very exotic, and you will have a good laugh every time you say it.  ;)
Title: Re: Rubber Sugar Apple....quite nice and unusual
Post by: FlyingFoxFruits on September 23, 2012, 11:13:01 PM
Michelin apple?

bibendum apple?  lol

that's the Michelin mans real name.
Title: Re: Rubber Sugar Apple....quite nice and unusual
Post by: Cookie Monster on September 24, 2012, 09:51:56 AM
:-) I'm not really sure of the american name. Rubber was the term that Noel gave me to describe it. I got the plant / seeds from a vietnamese fellow. The fruits are normally more of a yellowish green when ripe. The flesh is very similar to a geffner, as pointed out by one of the previous posters, and the skin can be peeled away from the inner flesh quite easily.
Title: Re: Rubber Sugar Apple....quite nice and unusual
Post by: Squam256 on September 24, 2012, 10:16:29 AM
([url]http://fruitingplants.files.wordpress.com/2012/09/9-23-2012null-opuntia-016.jpg?w=848[/url])

wait wait!  here is a test run with a pic of my Cogshall and the other seven dwarfs..pickering...can u spot the loner


The one in the front right pushing out new growth is the Cogshall. Cogshall is one of the few mangoes that can often be ID'd without any fruit on it.
Title: Re: Rubber Sugar Apple....quite nice and unusual
Post by: FlyingFoxFruits on September 24, 2012, 11:04:49 AM
right u r squam.

maybe it will decide to out grow my pickerings??  it been lagging behind...like a few other cogshalls i have.

jeff,

thanks for the info...it's funny, maybe I ate mine way too early, but it had a texture way more firm than gefner.

i will let u know how the other fruits are
Title: Re: Rubber Sugar Apple....quite nice and unusual
Post by: Jackfruitwhisperer69 on September 24, 2012, 03:15:56 PM
Michelin apple?

bibendum apple?  lol

that's the Michelin mans real name.

 ;D ;D ;D

Adam, The Michelin sugar apple, sure loooks yummy 8) The tree ain't huge too 8)

THX for sharing :)
Title: Re: Rubber Sugar Apple....quite nice and unusual
Post by: Tim on September 24, 2012, 06:11:28 PM
Jeff - As far as I know Vietnamese call any chewy textured sugar apple MĂNG CẦU DAI.  I've never heard of anyone calling it "rubber".  I bet they have named varieties over in VN but  if you ask your Vietnamese friend, you'll most likely get "MĂNG CẦU DAI."  My father-in-law used to have a small orchard growing nothing but these so I hear all about it from my wife.

MĂNG CẦU = annona
DAI = chewy
Title: Re: Rubber Sugar Apple....quite nice and unusual
Post by: FlyingFoxFruits on September 24, 2012, 06:18:27 PM
Sounds about right Tim,

That's probably how it got stuck with the latex name.

It is quite bouncy though!

I wonder if mine will have less firmness on the second go round...and also if you can harvest this fruit early to have a different texture?  The one I harvested early, was still sweet and nice...hmmm??

Jeff - As far as I know Vietnamese call any chewy textured sugar apple MĂNG CẦU DAI.  I've never heard of anyone calling it "rubber".  I bet they have named varieties over in VN but  if you ask your Vietnamese friend, you'll most likely get "MĂNG CẦU DAI."  My father-in-law used to have a small orchard growing nothing but these so I hear all about it from my wife.

MĂNG CẦU = annona
DAI = chewy
Title: Re: Rubber Sugar Apple....quite nice and unusual
Post by: Cookie Monster on September 24, 2012, 08:29:41 PM
Yep, I think you're right. Thanks for the vietnamese name. Funnily, the guy's first name is Dai (pronounced dye).

Jeff - As far as I know Vietnamese call any chewy textured sugar apple MĂNG CẦU DAI.  I've never heard of anyone calling it "rubber".  I bet they have named varieties over in VN but  if you ask your Vietnamese friend, you'll most likely get "MĂNG CẦU DAI."  My father-in-law used to have a small orchard growing nothing but these so I hear all about it from my wife.

MĂNG CẦU = annona
DAI = chewy
Title: Re: Rubber Sugar Apple....quite nice and unusual
Post by: FloridaGreenMan on September 24, 2012, 08:30:53 PM
I first ran across this "firm" fleshed sugar apple many years ago in Homestead. A few collectors had trees and they all called it the "rubber" sugar apple. It never was real popular and then kind of faded away. I thought it was cool but I did not plant any trees.         
Title: Re: Rubber Sugar Apple....quite nice and unusual
Post by: FlyingFoxFruits on September 24, 2012, 10:39:24 PM
thanks kindly to all who've contributed to this discussion!

I think we found the name...and I don't even remember it, or know how to spell it still.  :D

I can see why sticking to the original name can be a pain.  it would be nice though to keep the name as a reference somehow, almost like a root cultivar name, but also choose a new improved name.

thanks again to all!

Title: Re: Rubber Sugar Apple....quite nice and unusual
Post by: FlyingFoxFruits on September 25, 2012, 12:13:11 AM
Update,

While I was watering late this evening, I noticed that the rubber sugar apple was falling off the tree! with ants invading the top of the fruit at the stem!

I quickly plucked it, and washed it up...then photoed it, and ate it!

It didn't have the texture of the first fruit I ate (a bit early I assume), this one was like a super firm gefner., or similar in texture to some of the canned jackfruit I've had....not near as firm as the first fruit.  Maybe that one was a fluke? or if you open and eat them early, they can be even more firm?


seed count was low as well.

Maybe this is your sugar apple, if you don't like the soft texture of all of the others you've had, but enjoy the taste?

here are some pics.

I tried to demonstrate how the pulp could be thin sliced, like swiss cheese!  maybe u can tell from the pic?

hope u enjoy.
(http://fruitingplants.files.wordpress.com/2012/09/9-24-2012rubberannon-003.jpg?w=848)

(http://fruitingplants.files.wordpress.com/2012/09/9-24-2012rubberannon-002.jpg?w=848)

(http://fruitingplants.files.wordpress.com/2012/09/9-24-2012rubberannon-004.jpg?w=848)

(http://fruitingplants.files.wordpress.com/2012/09/9-24-2012rubberannon-006.jpg?w=848)

(http://fruitingplants.files.wordpress.com/2012/09/9-24-2012rubberannon-008.jpg?w=848)

(http://fruitingplants.files.wordpress.com/2012/09/9-24-2012rubberannon-009.jpg?w=848)








Title: Re: Rubber Sugar Apple....quite nice and unusual
Post by: FlyingFoxFruits on September 25, 2012, 12:21:12 AM
btw...

My favorite part of an annona is the carrot (core of the fruit, where the stem is attached..usually shaped like a taproot).

they usually taste bland, or even bitter...but I taste the carrot on each variety, just for craps and laughs.

This variety has a short stout carrot, with a mild flavor...just in case there are any others who eat the supposed inedible cores of annona fruits...i figured I'd post about annona carrots.  :)

insipid, yes..Inedible no.  healthy???

I have a feeling someone might pop up to say, what I'm doing isn't only flat out wrong, but disgusting.   ;D  ;)

but oh well...I keep eating them.

I'm just glad to finally have some varieties of my own homegrown annonas, on a regular basis finally!!!
Title: Re: Rubber Sugar Apple....quite nice and unusual
Post by: edself65 on September 25, 2012, 12:22:48 AM
Great pictures and info Adam! As Always! The flesh definitely looks firm! Keep ups, the good work!

Ed
Title: Re: Rubber Sugar Apple....quite nice and unusual
Post by: Tim on September 25, 2012, 11:08:14 AM
His name in Vietnamese is spelled with this Đ instead of this D.  Đại means big~great~grand~tough.  If you spell it with Dại, it translate to "Stupid" or foolish" amongst many other meanings.

But you can him Tiểu Đại or Đại dụ, he'd love it   ;D    don't bother with google translate, you'll get nothing  ;D ;D ;D

Yep, I think you're right. Thanks for the vietnamese name. Funnily, the guy's first name is Dai (pronounced dye).
Title: Re: Rubber Sugar Apple....quite nice and unusual
Post by: HMHausman on September 25, 2012, 01:57:43 PM
Nice documentation, Adam.  The fruit looks to be on the smaller size for sugar apple.  You didn't weigh it, did you?  The intial cut looks like the fruit is much more atemoyish than sugar appleish.  The seed's readily apparent on the first cut were only three....which is pretty low for a sugar apple.  The further progression cuts also looked like low seed count.  But, when all was said and done....errr, eaten, looks like you got about 30 seeds in a fairly small fruit. That's a pretty good number of seeds.  Seed counts are usually one of my big objections in sugar apples.  In any case, the fruit's flesh textrue looks great
Title: Re: Rubber Sugar Apple....quite nice and unusual
Post by: FlyingFoxFruits on September 25, 2012, 05:29:13 PM
Thanks Harry!

I didn't weigh the fruit...but I'd say its average sized for sure...it may even get larger, due to the fact my tree is in a 3 gallon and root bound..

this is the first time it's fruited...and I could have watered it more...once or twice the leaves wilted quit bad, but bounced back.

I'm used to all the common sugar apples having about 1/3 or more seed, but maybe I've been subjected to substandard fruits?   I wouldn't be surprised if this is the case.  Good sugar apples have been hard to find in the store, and my trees don't make a ton of fruits...so my experience is somewhat limited.

it was much easier to eat this sugar apple than the normal ones I've had, because the seeds don't cling to the pulp the same way as the soft fleshed varieties...the seeds seem to jump right out.

I wish they only had 10 seeds per fruit though....I know where u are coming from...I'm bothered by sugar apples that leave u spitting out a mouth full of seeds.





Nice documentation, Adam.  The fruit looks to be on the smaller size for sugar apple.  You didn't weigh it, did you?  The intial cut looks like the fruit is much more atemoyish than sugar appleish.  The seed's readily apparent on the first cut were only three....which is pretty low for a sugar apple.  The further progression cuts also looked like low seed count.  But, when all was said and done....errr, eaten, looks like you got about 30 seeds in a fairly small fruit. That's a pretty good number of seeds.  Seed counts are usually one of my big objections in sugar apples.  In any case, the fruit's flesh textrue looks great