Tropical Fruit Forum - International Tropical Fruit Growers

Citrus => Citrus General Discussion => Topic started by: JoeReal on May 12, 2019, 03:23:41 AM

Title: Bark inversion tutorial
Post by: JoeReal on May 12, 2019, 03:23:41 AM
I have done this on many fruit trees not only citruses  and had excellent results.

I have successfully used it on citruses. It can control the growth of citruses without pruning and it induces early blooming for citruses grown from seeds. The major advantage is that the tree size doesnít grow vigorously and so you donít need to prune for about 4 years and then you do light trimming and another bark inversion again. You do this when you want to maintain the size of the tree, citruses specially because if you prune citruses, especially snipping off the terminals, you would have severe reduction in fruit production.

Bark inversion has been practiced by utility folks in Canada to maintain the roadside trees so they only need to prune the trees once a while instead of every year and saves a lot on labor.

Basically, you remove a ring of bark near the base of the tree on the main trunk, pull it out the ring of bark, turn it upside down and put it back and seal with parafilm. It reverses the polarity of the cambium in the ring of bark, limiting but not stopping the supply of nutrients into the roots. Without big roots, the tree remain small and so it concentrates the photosynthates into fruit production, improving the quality of the fruits. Similar in effect to mild girdling done on grapes or on selected branches of citruses.

Hereís a tutorial that I did to illustrate what Bark Inversion is all about. Make sure to read the descriptions on each picture as it has very good explanations and minor discussions about each step.

https://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set=a.10153177092416804.1073741952.762176803&type=1&l=594794f248 (https://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set=a.10153177092416804.1073741952.762176803&type=1&l=594794f248)
Title: Re: Bark inversion tutorial
Post by: Luisport on May 12, 2019, 04:31:14 AM
Impressive! Thank you very much!  ;D
Title: Re: Bark inversion tutorial
Post by: Laaz on May 12, 2019, 07:52:37 AM
Interesting. I have yet to have a seedling take more than 5 years to begin fruiting. I wonder if this would speed it up even more? Even my Ruby red grapefruit starting blooming at 5 years old.
Title: Re: Bark inversion tutorial
Post by: Vlad on May 12, 2019, 10:16:23 AM
Joe,
What is the youngest (smallest) seedling you have done this on and did it decrease the time to fruiting?
Title: Re: Bark inversion tutorial
Post by: tve on May 12, 2019, 11:51:27 AM
Very interesting, thanks for posting! What is the failure rate one should expect?
Title: Re: Bark inversion tutorial
Post by: SeaWalnut on May 12, 2019, 01:41:23 PM
Thats interesting but its something only verry experienced people can do.If id try that myself ,i have no doubt that i would kill the tree .
Title: Re: Bark inversion tutorial
Post by: tve on May 12, 2019, 02:05:58 PM
SeaWalnut: no pain, no gain  :) Just pick a tree and give it a try! Or buy a cheap tree at a sale and try...

Joe: what is the impact of the bark inversion on the long term health of the tree? (I don't think the canadian power companies really care much about that aspect...) Doe it make the tree more susceptible to diseases? And how about drought tolerance? If the bark inversion restricts flow of nutrients it must also restrict the flow of other beneficial chemicals, no? I'm just wondering about pros and cons and what to watch out for... This seems really interesting for potted citrus, maybe I don't need to chase that elusive flying dragon rootstock after all  ;D
Title: Re: Bark inversion tutorial
Post by: Laaz on May 12, 2019, 02:29:21 PM
Nah, pretty easy if you use a piece of tape & a sharp blade.
Title: Re: Bark inversion tutorial
Post by: shaneatwell on May 12, 2019, 02:33:23 PM
Very cool. Thanks!
Title: Re: Bark inversion tutorial
Post by: Laaz on May 12, 2019, 02:45:44 PM
I'll try this on some of my blood clementines when they get big enough.
Title: Re: Bark inversion tutorial
Post by: edweather on May 12, 2019, 10:13:06 PM
Excellent tutorial, thanks!
Title: Re: Bark inversion tutorial
Post by: luak on May 13, 2019, 11:30:34 AM
Will try one very soon. For me this is a boon to keep all my trees in check. I now have the finest in mandarins treeís and as they grow I can managed them easier, thanks Joe!!
Title: Re: Bark inversion tutorial
Post by: JoeReal on May 13, 2019, 03:57:32 PM
Joe,
What is the youngest (smallest) seedling you have done this on and did it decrease the time to fruiting?

Two year old avocado seedling. It bloomed on the third year instead of 7th or 8th. Maybe I got lucky?
Title: Re: Bark inversion tutorial
Post by: JoeReal on May 13, 2019, 04:03:11 PM
SeaWalnut: no pain, no gain  :) Just pick a tree and give it a try! Or buy a cheap tree at a sale and try...

Joe: what is the impact of the bark inversion on the long term health of the tree? (I don't think the canadian power companies really care much about that aspect...) Doe it make the tree more susceptible to diseases? And how about drought tolerance? If the bark inversion restricts flow of nutrients it must also restrict the flow of other beneficial chemicals, no? I'm just wondering about pros and cons and what to watch out for... This seems really interesting for potted citrus, maybe I don't need to chase that elusive flying dragon rootstock after all  ;D

I haven't seen any impact at all. I've had trees that are bark inverted every 4-5 years for 25 years now. They behave like grafted trees.
Title: Re: Bark inversion tutorial
Post by: JoeReal on May 13, 2019, 04:04:58 PM
Thats interesting but its something only verry experienced people can do.If id try that myself ,i have no doubt that i would kill the tree .

That's why I stress the importance of sterilizing your tools, doing it on relatively dry days with no rain nor moisture in the air, no wind to spread contaminants around.  I haven't killed any tree with it so far.
Title: Re: Bark inversion tutorial
Post by: lebmung on May 14, 2019, 05:51:01 AM
It would be nice if someone did and experiment. PT seedling rootstock, inverted bark, old PT interstock and whatever seedling you are trying to flower.
Title: Re: Bark inversion tutorial
Post by: Laaz on May 14, 2019, 07:27:10 AM
Joe why did you make a gap in the bark & not use the entire piece?
Title: Re: Bark inversion tutorial
Post by: Laaz on May 14, 2019, 07:30:00 AM
(http://oi68.tinypic.com/2ewfite.jpg)
Title: Re: Bark inversion tutorial
Post by: Sylvain on May 14, 2019, 08:27:26 AM
It is said somewhere that it is retractation.

For the people (like me) who cannot stand facebook, I made a pdf:
http://pafranceparamoteur.free.fr/datas/perso/Agrumes/Invers%20bark%20graft.pdf (http://pafranceparamoteur.free.fr/datas/perso/Agrumes/Invers%20bark%20graft.pdf)
Title: Re: Bark inversion tutorial
Post by: Laaz on May 14, 2019, 10:01:33 AM
OK, thanks Sylvain.
Title: Re: Bark inversion tutorial
Post by: JoeReal on May 14, 2019, 10:26:39 AM
Joe why did you make a gap in the bark & not use the entire piece?

The gap wasn't intentional. I have to do the tutorial pics, so I did it longer than necessary and the air was so dry that the ring of bark shrank a little, and that's why the gap. Normally it won't have the gap.
Title: Re: Bark inversion tutorial
Post by: Laaz on May 14, 2019, 10:31:17 AM
OK, thanks.
Title: Re: Bark inversion tutorial
Post by: Millet on May 14, 2019, 06:07:08 PM
Joe excellent tutorial.  It looks easier to do for beginners  than many types of grafts.  Tell me, what is Benny doing these days?
Title: Re: Bark inversion tutorial
Post by: brian on May 14, 2019, 09:07:22 PM
This is really neat.  I have a few calomondins I was planning on getting rid of, I think I will try this on one of them.  I have never successfully grafted anything, but I try occasionally.

And thank you, Sylvain, for posting a PDF.  I would never have been able to access it otherwise as I have no facebook account.
Title: Re: Bark inversion tutorial
Post by: Millet on May 14, 2019, 09:40:20 PM
Joe, I take it that the bark inversion technique is used mostly on seedling trees.  I guess it could also be used on grafted trees to keep them shorter.  I have a Red Clementine seedling with a trunk diameter of approximately 1/4 inch.  Can the bark inversion be done on a trunk that small?  I thinking of doing the inversion to reduce the time of flowering.
Title: Re: Bark inversion tutorial
Post by: JoeReal on May 15, 2019, 10:33:23 AM
Joe, I take it that the bark inversion technique is used mostly on seedling trees.  I guess it could also be used on grafted trees to keep them shorter.  I have a Red Clementine seedling with a trunk diameter of approximately 1/4 inch.  Can the bark inversion be done on a trunk that small?  I thinking of doing the inversion to reduce the time of flowering.

Am doing it on my grafted trees as well, same effect, unless the rootstock is ultradwarfing, then very little effect. I have done it small calipers like 1/4" but you'll need the band around it to be smaller also.
Title: Re: Bark inversion tutorial
Post by: brian on May 15, 2019, 04:29:13 PM
I just tried it on a tree with fresh new growth but the bark band started breaking into pieces as I was removing it so I stopped 1/3 of the way through and put the pieces back.  I feel like the bark on my trees is never slipping enough to graft. 
Title: Re: Bark inversion tutorial
Post by: Laaz on May 15, 2019, 05:03:15 PM
When you see new growth the bark is slipping...
Title: Re: Bark inversion tutorial
Post by: shaneatwell on May 15, 2019, 06:37:26 PM
I was just going to ask about timing. Do it when bark is slipping?
Title: Re: Bark inversion tutorial
Post by: Laaz on May 15, 2019, 06:51:28 PM
Yes.
Title: Re: Bark inversion tutorial
Post by: shaneatwell on May 16, 2019, 11:47:11 AM
I did a rose apple, wax jambu, white sapote and key apple last night. Tried Java Plum too, but could not find edge of bark. It was like cutting into a watermelon.

Will keep y'all updated.
Title: Re: Bark inversion tutorial
Post by: JoeReal on May 16, 2019, 12:51:26 PM
I just tried it on a tree with fresh new growth but the bark band started breaking into pieces as I was removing it so I stopped 1/3 of the way through and put the pieces back.  I feel like the bark on my trees is never slipping enough to graft.

It would still have an effect, although mild. The scoring and the 1/3 removal and putting back would be equal to mild girdling technique.
Title: Re: Bark inversion tutorial
Post by: John Smith on May 17, 2019, 07:16:39 PM
as a novice grafter, I find this extremely interesting.
I have a nice Loquat I want to "try" to maintain at about 6ft tall.

thanks for sharing this !

and - Sylvain thank you for the time you took to make the PDF !!
.

.
Title: Re: Bark inversion tutorial
Post by: shaneatwell on July 22, 2019, 12:13:46 AM
My experiment was mostly a bust.

Rose apple just made roots, no flowers:
(https://i.postimg.cc/xcQmNZtL/20190720-141950.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/xcQmNZtL)
Wax jambo as well.

White sapote only sprouted a new branch below the inversion:
(https://i.postimg.cc/64X8R7LB/20190720-142241.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/64X8R7LB)

Kei apple actually flowered (out of season), but only a handful:

(https://i.postimg.cc/ct0JCp0H/20190720-142544.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/ct0JCp0H)
Title: Re: Bark inversion tutorial
Post by: brian on July 22, 2019, 08:56:45 AM
JoeReal, is the expected dwarfing effect from this reduced vigor or actually shortened node distance? 

Btw my gold nugget failed attempt has recovered just fine with no leaf loss.  I'll try again on another tree at some point.
Title: Re: Bark inversion tutorial
Post by: loneroc1 on July 22, 2019, 09:26:19 AM
Howdy all,

Two questions:
Anyone try this on trees grafted to Flying Dragon?
Is there any effect on fruit quality?

OK four questions
Would this be useful on potted trees? (I'm mostly thinking of lemons here.)
Does the width of the removed bark strip have any consequences?

Thanks Steve H.


Title: Re: Bark inversion tutorial
Post by: JoeReal on July 26, 2019, 12:58:00 PM
My experiment was mostly a bust.

Rose apple just made roots, no flowers:
(https://i.postimg.cc/xcQmNZtL/20190720-141950.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/xcQmNZtL)
Wax jambo as well.

White sapote only sprouted a new branch below the inversion:
(https://i.postimg.cc/64X8R7LB/20190720-142241.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/64X8R7LB)

Kei apple actually flowered (out of season), but only a handful:

(https://i.postimg.cc/ct0JCp0H/20190720-142544.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/ct0JCp0H)

Interesting. Keep us updated next season. The effect is usually the next season, not almost immediately.
Title: Re: Bark inversion tutorial
Post by: JoeReal on July 26, 2019, 12:59:51 PM
JoeReal, is the expected dwarfing effect from this reduced vigor or actually shortened node distance? 

Btw my gold nugget failed attempt has recovered just fine with no leaf loss.  I'll try again on another tree at some point.

The effect is reduced vigor due to less root growth, not shortened internodes. It should increase fruit quality and size.
Title: Re: Bark inversion tutorial
Post by: JoeReal on July 26, 2019, 01:05:41 PM
Howdy all,

Two questions:
Anyone try this on trees grafted to Flying Dragon?
Is there any effect on fruit quality?

OK four questions
Would this be useful on potted trees? (I'm mostly thinking of lemons here.)
Does the width of the removed bark strip have any consequences?

Thanks Steve H.

I don't think it would help much on Flying Dragon, but it would be good to try. I have a 15 year old Flying Dragon and it's height stayed at 4 ft without any pruning, so I didn't bother to do the inversion.

On semi-standard trees, like citrange trifoliate rootstock, it will improve fruit quality, size and flavor, at least from my trees.
Yes, it is useful on potted trees. I am maintaining apple trees, pear trees, stone fruit trees on pots and I do bark inversion on them. It's a good way to keep them small and their fruits large and tasty.

The larger the width of the band, the larger the effect. If very wide enough, it might kill the tree slowly, and you should do a bridge graft when you see slight symptoms that the tree starting to fail.

Treat this like mild girdling of the tree where the tree is able to heal the girdle around it.

Title: Re: Bark inversion tutorial
Post by: brian on July 26, 2019, 02:24:51 PM
Thanks Joe
Title: Re: Bark inversion tutorial
Post by: simon_grow on July 26, 2019, 09:34:57 PM
JoeReal, thanks for posting this technique. Great pictures and descriptions on how to perform the operation.

Have you experimented with any other unusual or novel grafts?

Simon
Title: Re: Bark inversion tutorial
Post by: Millet on July 26, 2019, 10:42:52 PM
I have an in ground Cara Cara grafted on Flying Dragon,  I no longer exactly remember the age of the tree, but it must be around 15 years old.  It is now 11-ft tall and 11-feet wide.
Title: Re: Bark inversion tutorial
Post by: JoeReal on July 29, 2019, 03:28:58 PM
I have an in ground Cara Cara grafted on Flying Dragon,  I no longer exactly remember the age of the tree, but it must be around 15 years old.  It is now 11-ft tall and 11-feet wide.

At that age it must give you high quality fruits! less than a foot a year!
Title: Re: Bark inversion tutorial
Post by: Millet on July 29, 2019, 03:31:16 PM
Yes Joe, the fruits are excellent.