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Messages - mikkel

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Citrus General Discussion / Re: Poncirus
« on: Today at 09:02:28 AM »
The trifoliata that falls from my tree sprouts in clumps where the fruit fell in the fall, nothing will touch it. We have coons, possums & armadillos around & they never touch the poncirus.

This might be the advantage of Poncirus tastes.... when seen from the Poncirus point of view.

Citrus General Discussion / Re: Poncirus
« on: Today at 08:40:55 AM »
Nice thought, I thought about it too.
I think pollinating flowers in the wild is a gamble. Fruits taste the same and initially have no advantage.
It would be easier to plant a hybrid aside. More fruit, more chance of distribution by animals, perhaps cross-pollination, but it still takes generations.
Malus sieversii is said to have been developed by bears through natural selection. If so, then it still took thousands of years.

There might be already hybrids in nature. I've never been to the USA and I can't judge it. But I got seedlings from the wild when it was still legal. It turned out that they were hybrids.

Just a thought game:
I wonder whether the typical Poncirus taste could be advantageous in nature? If animals prefer citrus fruits, as you observe, there should be seedlings around citrus plantations (especially some time ago when seedless varieties were not so common). Not necessarily much, but there should be. If there are none, the seeds seem to have some disadvantage. Maybe animals eat the seeds with them.

yesterday I saw a fruiting Eriobotrya at the cologne zoo. This winter was very warm (I have no idea how cold it was in Cologne) The specimen at Botanical Garden in Bonn is not the only one in that region this year.

Citrus General Discussion / Re: Eremomandarine
« on: May 08, 2019, 09:09:53 AM »
Where did you purchase it?

Cold Hardy Citrus / Re: N1triVoss
« on: May 04, 2019, 03:17:32 PM »
Recently I received seeds of N1tri from Ilya. Here are some seedlings
N1tri F2 by michaelbasso, on Flickr
N1tri F2 c by michaelbasso, on FlickrN1tri F2 b by michaelbasso, on Flickr

leaves are different from palnt to plant, mostly monofoliate but some are more or less trifoliate. Some are bi or trilobed like e.g. Passiflora leaves.

Cold Hardy Citrus / Re: Poncirus seed
« on: April 27, 2019, 03:00:33 AM »
I want some of the seeds from the parent that is almost thornless. Poncirus grows everywhere here and in groves. Like to look for mutations.

Why not take budwood for grafting? You could get seeds at home?
Would be interesting to see if there is a re thornless Poncirus in the wild. In the old forum was a guy who found one plant in the wild, but can`t find the post anymore.

 a genetic population with 220 hybrids between F. hindsii and F. crassfolia has been successfully bred and cultivated on a just 10 m2 horticultural shelf. Based on this population, a fine genetic map for fruit-related traits has been under construction in our lab. In addition, a juvenile period of eight months of F. hindsii is the shortest among the early flowering germplasms in the citrus taxa to our knowledge (Tong et al., 2009), suggesting the prospects of generating BC1, F2 or even introgression lines based on F. hindsii. More importantly, all previous transgenic F. hindsii lines carrying different sequences blossomed and bore fruits in their first or second year (Cao et al., 2015; Liu et al., 2017c; Zhang et al., 2009), suggesting that genetic modification does not disturb its intrinsic feature of short juvenility.

interesting. hindsii plants are easier accessable and crossings are easier reproducable than those with C.wakonai. But in case of of early flowering it might be still topped by C.wakonai. But in opposite to it hybrids still keep precocious flowering trait. As far as I know C.wakonai hybrids loose this trait in further generations.

I have seen a tree in the Botanical Garden Aarhus too. Climate  there isn`t so different from northern Germany.  Some days ago I was in the Botanical Garden Oslo and was curious if there is a Poncirus too. I couldn`t find one.

Cold Hardy Citrus / Re: F2 citrange winter hardiness trial
« on: April 26, 2019, 10:17:22 AM »
Found the link: This is the plant from Horst. The same as Sylvains.

Cold Hardy Citrus / Re: F2 citrange winter hardiness trial
« on: April 25, 2019, 05:09:51 PM »
Mine looks like the one on the 4th picture. It comes originally from BG Darmstadt.
I just tried to find the pictures of the flowering plant  to see if it is different but I can not find the link. Maybe later...
usirius do you have both types?

Cold Hardy Citrus / Re: F2 citrange winter hardiness trial
« on: April 25, 2019, 02:36:34 AM »
@usirius okay. This encourages me to give it another try.
Do you have any picture of the two types you spoke of?
I know of a plant in a botanic garden in Germany and another one in a private collection which is already flowering. But I haven`t heared of fruits so far. No idea if these are the same plant.

Cold Hardy Citrus / Re: F2 citrange winter hardiness trial
« on: April 24, 2019, 07:03:53 AM »
It is way less winter hardy than P.t.. I had diebacks at -6C at least it recovered. Usirius how is yours? Is hardy it in open ground for you?

Citrus Buy, Sell, & Trade / Re: Fast flowering trifoliata plants.
« on: April 03, 2019, 04:31:15 PM »
Are these seedlings zygotic offspring to your impression? Is there variation in the offspring?

You should ask Lenzi directly. The shop isn`t up to date often.

I don't know if a seller from Romania can be trusted, however

The seeds are likely not going to germinate unless they're harvested from fresh fruits

I think this seller is good in using photoshop. :)
His location is Portugal in Romania.... :P

Cold Hardy Citrus / Re: Long term cold hardy citrus breeding project
« on: April 03, 2019, 03:34:22 PM »
If I understand it right certain traits controlled by multiple genes are always expresses like the Gaussian distribution curve in the offspring . Which would suggest if you only have a large amount of offspring you always can find the desired level of expression of this certain trait. (if it is inside the possible range of the gaussian bell)
Mass selection is easier to manage in annuals but in theory also possible in trees like Citrus.
Am I right?

Cold Hardy Citrus / Re: F2 citrange winter hardiness trial
« on: April 02, 2019, 02:03:03 PM »
I will. By now the tallest are around 10 cm high. There are others beside still just germinating.

Cold Hardy Citrus / Re: F2 citrange winter hardiness trial
« on: April 02, 2019, 12:03:37 PM »
"it should be roughly reproducible on a repeat test under similar conditions."

If done in a zone 7 environment there should be even more survivors.

Cold Hardy Citrus / Re: F2 citrange winter hardiness trial
« on: March 27, 2019, 05:34:02 PM »
Now to find how much it differs in fruiting aspects! I hope it's not an exact replica of Poncirus.

But if so offspring could be still interesting. In many years from now :)

Here's a video touching on this subject: I found this intriguing, but it probably requires a greenhouse to perform it ideally. This topic starts at 1:00
I just noticed it.

a picture of grafted immature hybrids on strong rootstocks in S.Korea.
Copyright Malcom W. Smith

Is there a report about this method somewhere to find?
I guess  it is not possible to have 3,3m growth within 2 years in northern german climate.

I don`t give up easy, but I think it is nearly impossible to get other species then japonica. Even BGCI lists only 2 BG`s for it.
Any news on Piera?

Cold Hardy Citrus / Re: How hardy is TaiTri?
« on: March 11, 2019, 05:30:54 PM »
another TaiTri seedling in a garden in western Germany.
It is much bigger by now.
Probably never protected.

Cold Hardy Citrus / Re: F2 citrange winter hardiness trial
« on: March 09, 2019, 06:06:42 PM »
Great! Congrats!
Mass selection always works :)

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