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Messages - Walt

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Citrus General Discussion / Re: Rooting Root Stock?
« on: September 12, 2018, 12:07:38 PM »
I prefer seed grown, non-transplanted, roots for apples a plums, because they have tap roots.  Is this an issue for citrus?

Citrus General Discussion / Re: Rooting Root Stock?
« on: September 11, 2018, 12:47:50 PM »
I see you are in Georgia, where I expect humidity is high.  High compared to mine at least.  I would need the dome, or up-side-down aquarium, in my case.

Citrus General Discussion / Re: Latest Video From Dan Willey The Fruitmentor
« on: September 11, 2018, 12:44:37 PM »
My seedlings don't grow near that fast.
Good video.

I will be pollinating every time I have a flower.  I might as well keep track and report back, someday.
I'll google and try to see if someone has published such stuff.

Has anyone checked whether there are other things, like temperature, the change the percent of zygotic seedlings?  Temperature seems to change the percent of successes in interspecific wheat crosses, and also sunflowers.  This is a whole different thing, of course.

Citrus General Discussion / Re: finger lime
« on: September 07, 2018, 01:22:54 PM »
How was the KNO3 applied?

This is something for me to pay attention to.  I'll be making many crosses, and I will of course try to use seed parents with a high percent zygotic seedlings.  But now I'll be paying attention to pollen parent too, and see which ones give higher percent zygotic seedlings.  It may not make any difference, but it won't be extra work to keep track.

Citrus General Discussion / Re: Natural pest control
« on: September 04, 2018, 01:16:26 PM »
Looks like the toad is guarding his tree.

Granddad said a barn isn't worth having if barn swallows don't nest in it.

Cold Hardy Citrus / Re: Long term cold hardy citrus breeding project
« on: August 21, 2018, 03:27:54 PM »
My plans are to aim at growing 200 per generation.  They will spend their first summer outside, in pots, then their first winter in the greenhouse.  Outside again for their second summer, then back into the greenhouse, but take cuttings which will be labeled, then packed in moist sawdust, then put in a freezer set at a temperature to be determined later, but the temperature chosen to kill some but not all of the cuttings.  Then the cuttings will be grafted back onto their origional plants to see if they survived.  Or perhaps I'll try to root the cuttings, or maybe I'll learn to identify freeze damage just by look or feel.  I am open to everyone's ideas.  Most of you have much more experience than me.
I do see problems with my plan.  Weather before taking the cuttings will determine degree of hardening off.  And different genotypes will respond differently to the hardening off.  I'm studying work done in apple breeding for ways to select for winter hardiness.  Again your ideas are welcome.

I will also be selecting for % zygotic seeds, precocity, and flavor, so I plan to keep most of the seedlings to bloom, or at least for a few years and then dump those that haven't bloomed.
I expect to build an additional greenhouse each year for 4 years.  I expect to start a new crop of seeds each year, 200 per year. 
Now, if my breeding stock would just bloom already.

Cold Hardy Citrus / Re: Soon To Be Released By The USDA
« on: August 20, 2018, 03:29:15 PM »
This one is on my bucket list.

Cold Hardy Citrus / Re: Long term cold hardy citrus breeding project
« on: August 19, 2018, 03:10:09 PM »
Ilya wrote that he had discarded all seedlings with the leaf smell of P. trifoliata.  I think that got rid of all nucellar seedlings and left only zygotic seedlings.
I think he also got rid of some zygotic seedlings, as not all zygotic seedlings would lack that smell.  But while the discarded zygotic seedlings might have some good traits, one does have to set standards and stay with them unless something unexpected turns up.  Space is always limited.

Cold Hardy Citrus / Re: Long term cold hardy citrus breeding project
« on: August 18, 2018, 12:40:28 PM »
I still believe , that current number of seedlings is not sufficiently high.
I read somewhere that even when crosses are made between two high quality citrus varieties you need at least 200 hybrids to select something new and valuable.

Most citrus breeders aren't using P. trifoliata as a grandparent.  While larger population is better, I would expect some of your seedlings will not have the Ponciris flavor, mot even a little.  That would be an improvement right there.
Look at Dr. Brown's work.  His populations were about 10% of yours.  But he is said to have had improvement over what was available.  Of course, I don't know first hand.  But I find it encouraging.
That said, I working toward populations of about 200. but so far I have mostly populations of zero.  So you are way ahead of me.

Cold Hardy Citrus / Re: Long term cold hardy citrus breeding project
« on: August 17, 2018, 01:57:44 PM »
I wish that were true, that some F2 plants were more winter hardy than the F1.  But I doubt it.  Not that I know of any F2 Ponciris x Citrus.  But I'll give my thinking, as you gave yours.
I assume that P. trifoliata has many genes involved in winter hardiness.  Many are incompletely dominant, as shown by the F1 which are more winter hardy than their citrus parent, but less winter hardy that the Ponciris parent.
I have read in an old publication from government citrus research, that the F2 is less winter hardy than the F1. and that it decreases in later generations. 
Now I don't believe that last statement, about the F3.  I have seen no reports on growing a large F3 generation from a large F2 population.  I would think that at most they selected the best F2 and grew out some F3 plants.  If they selected the F2 for eating quality, then the citrus genes for flavor, etc., would be linked to other citrus genes for less winter hardiness.
Don't forget gene linkage when planning crosses!
I'm am not saying not to do the crosses you have in mind.  They are much like I've planned.  I'm saying not be discouraged if what you have in mind isn't in the F2.  I for one, plan to continue select for cold tolerance and good flavor in Ponciris x Citrus in generation after generation, as long as I live.  I certainly don't want to talk you out of doing what you are doing.  I just think it will take longer than one generation.
I think you are in a milder climate than I am.  I think you can succeed quicker than I can.
Good luck.

Has anyone tried it as a pollen parent?  I'm wondering about the inheritance of the seedless trait.

Citrus General Discussion / Re: When to repot
« on: August 12, 2018, 02:54:51 PM »
I am a novice compared to many here.  But a few years back I bought a 1 gallon pot with about 30 trifoliate orange seedling for root stocks.  They were about 6 months old.  When I transplanted them each to a 1 gallon pot, I didn't loose even one.  So it must not be too hard.

Very interesting.  Thanks for the link.

Cold Hardy Citrus / Re: Long term cold hardy citrus breeding project
« on: August 04, 2018, 02:34:24 PM »
Are these crosses that exist, or crosses you plan?

Cold Hardy Citrus / Re: Yuzu - Not branching
« on: July 26, 2018, 11:40:34 AM »
I've never done this with citrus, but it works on most woody plants.
Cutting off the dominant apical bud does indeed work.  But another way I prefer is to make a cut above the bud you want to become a branch.  This cuts off the IAA, etc. from the apical bud and the lateral bud below the notch starts to grow.
I learned this from North Merica Fruit Explorers.  It is too slow for commercial orchards, but hobbiest with few trees find it gives more control of branch spacing.
When I used this method, not on citrus, I found it was enough to just push a razor blade into the tree past the cambium, and pull the razor blade back out.  It left no scar, good for bonsai, and it was effective.
This method works on any branch or trunk that is immature enough you can still see buds.  I find that with my shaky hands, I can't use this method on really small new growth because I end up slicing off the twig.  In my younger days I was able to do it on really tiny twigs.  When I was doing bonsai, I could get every bud to branch.  It left me with lots of options.
Note:  Millet's metod has worked on citrus and all kinds of trees for centuries.  I don't know if my method works on citrus, but I'd bet it does.

Citrus General Discussion / Re: Want To Avoid Macular Digeneration?
« on: July 26, 2018, 11:21:47 AM »
Too late.  Pepsi already did the.  I Pepsi didn't help my eyes.

I have some seedlings from the citrange 'Sanford'.  Sanford is supposed give zygotic seeds.
It will be years before they bloom. 
I haven't checked, but I'm sure none of them will be hardy for me in zone 6.

Ilya said he has little seedlings that are 3/4 Pt, 1/4 grapefruit or pommelo.  Also not bloomed yet.  Also unknown hardiness but no doubt hardier than the F1 was.

Anyone else?  This is an important question to me too.

Citrus General Discussion / Re: Want To Avoid Macular Digeneration?
« on: July 13, 2018, 03:09:33 PM »
So I can deduct oranges from my taxes as a medical expense.  That is good to know.

Cold Hardy Citrus / Re: Long term cold hardy citrus breeding project
« on: July 12, 2018, 02:39:58 PM »
Thank you for the information. 
Am I right in assuming that a scion from a plant that has bloomed, grafted onto a meter tall P.t. seedling, will bloom within a year or two? 

Cold Hardy Citrus / Re: Long term cold hardy citrus breeding project
« on: July 11, 2018, 02:46:15 PM »
How tall do P. trifoliata have to be to flower.  I'm asking about both precocious and regular.

I used to have  a greenhouse sunk about 1 1/2 M into the ground.  This was in cenrtral Kansas, USA, zone 6.  Tomatoes survived the winters in it without any extra heat.  Just sun and heat stored in the walls and floor.
Tomatoes didn't grow during December until late March.  But green fruit stayed good through that time and began growing again and  ripened when longer days arrived in late March.
My fig also did fine in that greenhouse.
I think many citrus would do fine in such a greenhouse. 
The greenhouse only had automatic vent openers.  No fans.  In fact no electricity or gas.

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