Heinrich and Ilya11, you are both being illogical and drawing faulty conclusions.

Heinrich, you said "Nucellar seedlings are never derived from meiosis". I did not imply that they were.
In fact by the very fact that they were (presumably) not derived from meiosis, you can conclude something about meiosis.
If there were no triploids resulting from meiosis, what does that tell us? And it would certainly seem to indicate something about the origins of that tetraploid they found.

Ilya11, go back and read over everything I posted. I never said that triploid plants gave rise to haploid offspring that were alike. You seem to be assuming I said something that I did not.

Ilya11 has still failed to give any reasoning why what I wrote is wrong.

Pollination of Oroblanco with diploid clementine pollen is giving only diploid plants due to unfavorable completion of diploid gametes   with haploid ones.
(Citrus Genetics, Breeding and Biotechnology,edited by Iqrar Ahmad Khan, p.205)

That's not necessarily true. That's just an assumption they made. 

My alternative theory offers an explanation. If Oroblanco is not producing any diploid gametes then of course there would not be triploid offspring. No haploids are resulting because the Clementine pollen is not triploid and is therefore unable to induce gynogenesis in the Oroblanco, and besides, the female parent being triploid might have something to do with it (apparently it may take triploid pollen pollinating a diploid plant for this effect to happen). Sometimes, in certain species, nucellar seed formation can be induced by pollination, when the resulting embryo is not very strong as a result of chromosomal differences/abnormalities, so if the majority of the pollen is not triploid, that could be an explanation for the lack of nucellar formation.

Hey guys, I know this post is super old, but I was wondering how does Luc's Garcinia taste in comparison to an achacha?

Probably a little bit better

And how would you compare it to a purple mangosteen?

Depends on personal preference.

Here's the best analogy I can think of. For lychees, do you prefer Brewster or Mauritius? If you prefer Mauritius I believe there's a higher chance you will prefer achacha/Luc's over purple mangosteen.

Just wanted to add: it's not really true that pomelos are always that cold vulnerable. Limes are probably more cold vulnerable than pomelo trees. Pomelo might fall somewhere close to lemon. To some degree it depends on the cultivar variety. Pomelos usually come from tropical countries like Thailand, Malaysia, Vietnam (particularly the southern half), although there is a variety in Thailand that grows in a slightly more mountainous area in zone 9b and is known to be just a little more cold hardy. Then there are the "Chinese grapefruits" which I personally suspect might actually not have 100 percent pomelo ancestry, but who knows... They are grown in Southern China. The winters there can be cold, if not freezing, going all the way into Spring, cold and wet. (Though after that it's hot and humid, great growing conditions) It is zone 10, but the early Spring is far colder and wetter than what those in zone 10 California experience. Each climate zone has its own subtleties I suppose.

The pomelos towards the more cold hardy end of the spectrum probably have as much cold tolerance as the average orange, if I had to guess, while there's certainly many pomelos in Thailand that wouldn't be happy with anything lower than zone 10. (necessary heat for ripening is a different matter)

I suspect most pomelos in Thailand and Malaysia would be happier in zone 11 than they would in zone 10. Or to be a little more exact, happier in 10b bordering on the edge of 11a than they would be growing right on border between 10b and 10a. Chandler is probably just a tiny bit more cold hardy than the average pomelo variety in Asia (but I could be wrong about this).

Going back to the Chinese grapefruits really quick, they are probably all or mostly pomelo, and are classified under Citrus maxima. I'm just thinking there might be somewhere like 10 percent C. reticula in there, since they are sweeter and do have a thinner rind than other pomelos. "Chinese grapefruit" really isn't the best terminology, that's just the common English translation, from a time Americans were much more familiar with grapefruit than having any idea what a pomelo was. In Asia though they're both considered the same thing ( "Chinese grapefruit" and pomelo I mean), they don't think of the different varieties as a fundamentally different fruit. Maybe I should have best avoided using the word "grapefruit" altogether to avoid confusion and just called it Chinese-type pomelo. (by using the word grapefruit I was just trying to emphasize that it might not be completely C. maxima)

An interesting paper:
https://ejournal.sinica.edu.tw/bbas/content/2009/3/Bot503-06.pdf

Thank you so much.

If I can summarize the results here: They looked at the seeds of triploid citrus (this particular cultivar having resulted from a tetraploid cross between Hamlin orange x rough lemon, which then was crossed with diploid tangerine) which was open-pollinated, and out of 25 well-developed seeds, 13 were triploid, 10 were diploid, 1 was tetraploid, and 1 was aneuploid. What was particularly interesting was that all of the triploids appeared to be nucellar. This suggests that the likelihood of triploid meiosis being able to produce a complete haploid gamete is far higher than a diploid gamete.
Assuming this is the case, then presumably the single tetraploid seed must have resulted from an unreduced triploid gamete being sexually combined with a normal haploid gamete.
It seems then that the probability of a complete whole diploid chromosome set being able to escape from triploid meiosis is very unfavorable, all the triploids resulting from a triploid fruit will be clones of the parent. (The triploids will be the offspring with very few seeds)

Disclaimer is right, it is wrong.
Triploids never give haploid plants ; theoretically  their gametes  are only  haploid, diploid and triploid.

I believe you were misunderstanding. Triploid pollen can induce the formation of haploid embryo from the female fruit parent; the single chromosome set would always come from the female parent in such a case.

This study reports haploid plantlet regeneration through gynogenesis in Citrus clementina Hort. ex Tan., cv. Nules, induced by in vitro pollination with pollen grains of Oroblanco, a triploid cultivar of grapefruit. It indicates that parthenogenesis induced in vitro by triploid pollen can be an alternative method to obtain haploids in monoembryonic cultivars of Citrus.

https://link.springer.com/article/10.1023/A:1010627310808


There are a few possible interpretations to these findings (not discussing the link above now). Unfavorable competition of one pollen type was only listed as a possibility, as well as a possibility all the triploid seeds (when they form in Oroblanco fruits) didn't result from pollination.

After several hours of research I came across something.
P. Ollitroult found half diploid and half triploid among the seeds of 'Oroblanco'.
Citrus genetics, breeding and biotechnology, Iqrar A. Khan, p205

Only diploids were found in the progeny of clementine fertilized by Oroblanco pollen, the same source says. But I wonder if they checked to see if the next generation were even hybrids, since very likely the triploid Oroblanco pollen might just have been inducing parthenocarpy. Edit: oops, if that was the case, one would expect haploid offspring (see gynogenesis). Another potential explanation, I did read in some citrus cultivars (particularly many oranges) the surrounding nucellar tissue in the embryo is highly sensitive to triploidy and will abort.

Also, while it is true triploid seeds are most often found in shrivelled up smaller seed (which also causes low viability), this is not necessarily true when the fruit parent happens to also be a triploid. The poor seed development is caused by differences in ploidy between the developing megagametophyte and surrounding nucellar tissue.

I have no idea what the cone of an umbrella pine (Pinus pinea) looks like, but I know the tree grows all around the city of Rome.

Apparently it bears a resemblance to pineapple when you try to depict it in a mosaic.

Just a an aside here, does anyone know what the other fruits in this fruit basket could be?
I would say at first glance: figs, quince, grapes, pomegranate and pineapple.
But, wait a minute, pineapple? In the first century BC in Rome?
What is going on here?

Most scholars believe the mosaic depicts the cone of an umbrella pine (stone pine), from which edible pine nuts come from. They were very popular in Italy.

The pomegranate juice is fantastic!  But yes, I'm always disappointed when I buy one and after all that work realize a bottle of Pom juice would be far easier.

A bottle of Pom juice from the supermarket doesn't taste anywhere near as good as real fresh squeezed juice. Pomegranates are really one of the fruits you have to squeeze fresh to be able to enjoy it, the flavor quality apparently deteriorates a lot with longer term storage and processing. And there's a certain way you have to make the juice too: first separate out the arils from the rind and then press those arils for the juice, because both the seeds inside the arils and the inner white rind can impart off-flavors into the juice if it is made by other methods.

Khasi papeda looks incredibly similar to kaffir lime. I don't think kaffir lime is a pure species though, probably a hybrid between sour mandarin and papeda, or something along those lines. Or quite possibly a hybrid between khasi papeda and citron.
Lemon is a hybrid between citron and sour orange (bitter orange). Meyer lemon is hybrid between citron and mandarin, or something very close to mandarin, much closer to mandarin than orange. Ponderosa lemon I have read several places is supposedly a hybrid between lemon and citron, but I think it more likely it originated from a lemon pollinated from grapefruit or shaddock.
I'm not sure what regular limes are though. Supposedly a hybrid between C. micrantha and citron. There are different types of limes so some might have additional ancestry.

There's a lot of information here and I'm typing this off very quick, so some of the information might not be 100 percent completely literally accurate.

Pomelo oil is similar to grapefruit but has a cleaner more floral smell, without the slightly sewer-like aspect of grapefruit. Unfortunately pomelo is substantially more commercially expensive than grapefruit because there's a much more limited geographic extent in the U.S. where it can be grown.

Thank you.

The seeds are already sprouting, and have tiny little leaflets. I have two different types of Etrog citron: an unnamed one that I assume is the most common, and Yemeni Giant citron, the latter of which can often get bigger than a pomelo, from pictures I've seen (although it doesn't have any pulp inside).

There are actually many different types of citron, I was surprised when I started doing research.
In China it is known as Xiang Yuan. This is actually the same word as Shangyuan (just a different romanized spelling), which just translates as "fragrant ball". Shangyuan in English circles is most commonly associated with the Chinese citrus known as Ichang Lemon (not to be confused with Ichang papeda). And Chinese citron is not Ichang lemon (I don't think Ichang lemon even has any citron ancestry, unlike the European lemon). It can all be rather confusing.
The Chinese citron is commonly used to make a type of jelly tea. (in fact I have a Chinese friend who offered me some from his refrigerator, now that I remember)

These language misunderstandings can be confusing. When the Japanese first encountered Yuzu during the Tang dynasty, they named it after the Chinese word for pomelo.

Well that's your little world history cultural lesson for the day.