I don't consider myself a master fruit grower but I have been succesfully cultivating many fruits plantsduring  my life and it never happened what is going on with chempedak.
I had 8 healthy seedlings, they were growing like rockets for the first 8-10 then they stopped putting new leaves.
I divided them in 4 gropus, some were repotted, some left untouched, some planted in the garden but no way, everything seems useless.
I was extremely careful with watering, i used the best soil, i applied light and well balanced fertilizer, i kept them partially shaded and protected from the scorching sun but nothing.
When i removed the first 2 that died i noticed that their root system was very poor and underdevelopped.
That would explain the reason of that strange leaf chlorosis they all eventually exhibited.
It's like they were growing well until they used the "energy" stored in their big seeds then once it was used up the small roots couldn't just keep up with thep lant growth and well being.
Until now the reason is unknown to me 

There is nothing wrong with your gardening skills. I killed maybe 100, I remember Luc mentioned that about 200 died on him. They all suffer from "sudden death syndrome". Grow fine for a while than die for no good reason.  Only one "Australian" variety had good survival rate, but trees grow pretty slow. Something different about genetics in that variety.  Chempedak grafted on jackfruit grows very well. I think that's by far the best way to cultivate them.

Hi Mikey,

I am growing too some cherimoya seed from Spain and Portugal, I think they are looking good but they old only under 1 years old. I am growing too some Taiwan cherimoya that I bought from supermarket, they seedling grow very well. And now I am ready to sowing some Taiwan Atemoya seed that I bought from supermarket.

In my country some nurseries sale fruiting tree of Atemoya like Pineaple Atemoya, African Pride Atemoya, Pink Mammoth and Atemoya from Australia. But not commercial yet except for Australian Atemoya.


Regards,
Alfian

Thanks for the info.  It is sounding like most of the bush tucker is best just left in the bush.  I have some seedlings of C. lasiantha & may just throw them in somewhere for the heck of it.  Maybe I will try pickling the buds or maybe the fruit might be worth juicing or something if there are worthwhile compounds in it.  If not, it sounds like there are plenty of seeds -- maybe my chickens will like it.  I guess another selection I will not be banking on to get good things from...

John

I honestly would not grow them if space was of any concern. They have unexplored potential as a pickled fruit, but most are not of great quality. In the area my grandparents came from there were three named types - Bunbull (brown), Bedtha (yellow), Dhardanga (yellow-orange). Some of the 'split jack' fruits (C. lasiantha) are reputed to taste like a passionfruit, but most have an off-putting smell. They, like a huge range of Australian natives, are reputed to have rediculous amounts of good stuff in them.

https://open.abc.net.au/posts/dajarra-way-58rg9oq
http://toowoombaplants2008.blogspot.com.au/2008/12/bumble-trees-our-local-native-capers.html

There are so many interesting species of solanum out there. I have 3 different types of lulos and they are very different looking plants. Two of them are from cuttings of california plants and their new growth is purple and they are very spiny, another is spineless, and a bunch of them are spiny but with yellowish green new growth. Also have several cocona from a few different sources and some fruit that a woman at a farmers market gave me that she called "Litchi tomato", though I am not sure on what its scientific name is. I also collected and imported some giant pepino dulce fruits from Hunan china last year, and have around 4 other varieties of pepino dulce. Plus two types of Tzimbalo, one from Oscor and another from another source. Also have a few types of gilo and a saw a simular fruit in borneo that tasted the same, which I will ask if people can ID.  A while back I got some seeds of another similar species called S. Pseudolulo. I have since not heard too much about it and wonder how it compares to the other narajilla-like fruits. There are also about 10 species or so of edible solanums  native to Australia. I had seedlings of 3 or so that were called "bush tomatos" and was wondering what the Australians think of them? If this fruit is really tasty then I am interested in growing this species in future too.

Sorry for the length of my post and that my post isnt entirely on topic, I just have a lot of solunam related questions and have never been sure on the IDs of my species.

Steve, the lychee tomato is Solanum sisymbriifolium‎. It's great to see pepino dulce has made it all the way to China. There are several look alike species to naranjilla, besides quitoense there is hirsutum and pseudolulo. I think the person that might know answer to your questions about these is Anestor in Santa Catarina, Brazil as he is growing them all. How is your portuguese?

Black sap seedling selections are a prime example of people rushing out and stating I have a new black sap variety because..... All these so called Australian named Black Saps were from a handfull of seedlings. I am growing about 40 mature black saps and have been fruiting them as long as anybody. I have seen nothing on my place or Australia that warrants varietal status. None have been superior to the seed I collected from a large oblate prolific black sap @ USDA Miami / Coral Gables. Seedlings I grew, some are as good as parent. I suspect other seedlings from this import are now some of the named variities. Pisses me off.

There are massive variations in fruit quality, taste, size, moisture, tree size, manageability etc. Its absolutely insane to advocate that an average backyarder without a massive closed canopy forrest to play around with grow out 40 seedlings for shits and giggles. Having grafted selections with names helps those without huge properties choose the fruit or tree they like best and that is manageable for thier own growing situation. The difference between a Bernicker and a Mossman is as marked, if not much, much more marked, than the differences in named varietal selections of any citrus species.

Black sap seedling selections are a prime example of people rushing out and stating I have a new black sap variety because..... All these so called Australian named Black Saps were from a handfull of seedlings. I am growing about 40 mature black saps and have been fruiting them as long as anybody. I have seen nothing on my place or Australia that warrants varietal status. None have been superior to the seed I collected from a large oblate prolific black sap @ USDA Miami / Coral Gables. Seedlings I grew, some are as good as parent. I suspect other seedlings from this import are now some of the named variities. Pisses me off.

Because of your name i thought you were an oma (means grandma in Dutch) but now i learned that you are a male and not an oma haha.

Anyway, i know a nursery that sells pulasantree's but without papers and also they don't know if it is the seebabat or not. Most plants in Singapore come from Malaysia but it is illegal to bring seeds out of Malaysia. About plants i don't know but you can find them in Singapore i guess. That forum i mentioned has many locals on it so they can answer your questions i guess.

When you are there you should buy a public transport card for all days and then can travel by skytrain and bus. Taxi's are not cheap there like in Thailand. I still wonder what the punishment will be if you get caught with some plants in your suitcase while entering the USA. In Australia they have big warnings at the customs like you pay 100.000 au$ fine if you bring seeds or fruits into their continent but i have seen many tv-documentary's about that and then people had suitcases full of fruit and had to pay a fine of 200 au$.

It would be great if you get admitted to their scool but if not then Sydney is also a great place to stay/study.

Yeah, I was reading your comment about me in the pomegranate thread, and I had a good laugh. My name is Omar, and my brother's name is Rudy.  I already applied to the Australian National University, and I had a great interview already with Yale and MIT. I get the results in March, I will notify the forum if I get in and get to go to Singapore! And what is the name of the pulasan nursery, and was the plant vegetatively propagated or a seedling?

And plantlover wish you the best of luck too!

I found this on line which may explain differences in taste and fruit set. Unfortunately the article does not address pollen viability of most of the varieties that are commonly available down here in Florida. However based on the experience of another fellow Floridian, Bonita Spring appears to be self fertile and may have viable pollen to help pollinate other varieties as well. Please note conflicting information on Dade as well.
**************************************************************************************************************

Paul Recher says that the vast majority of cultivars are pollen sterile so you must plant a cultivar that has pollen. I spoke to the President of the South Australian Rarefruit Association about the problem and he confirmed the same prognosis so I emailed Peter Young from Birdwood Nursery and here is his reply. “Pollination in White Sapote is critical and is the main reason for many good eating cultivars not being sold to retail as stand alone trees fail to crop. This is why we chose ‘Dade’ as it has good quality fruit and we have found it to be highly self fertile.  It is also a compact grower.  Varieties such as Reinike, Golden Globe, Candy, McDill and Denzler to name a few all need pollinating.  Varieties that are recognised as good pollinators for such varieties are Dade, Vista, Ortego and Vernon.  Lemon Gold that is also very self fertile does everything later than most cultivars.  It is a big tree, small fruit and although it’s good eating, doesn’t make a good pollinator or backyard tree.”  Ref: Sheryl Backhouse
White Sapote is a member of the same family as citrus (Rutaceae), which can have problems of sourness and bitterness improved by applications of Epsom Salts (Magnesium Sulfate). It is easy to broadcast the little crystals under the trees. Sheryl's favourite remedy of boron + urea (see the checklist on the calendar) might help with fruit-setting. Having soil tested is a good idea. Ref: Pat Scott
White Sapote by Richard Frost:   Though the flowers are hermaphrodite, for fruit production it is important to obtain a known, grafted cultivar because seedlings can have partial to total pollen sterility within the flower. Further, some cultivars are known to have all or nearly all dysfunctional pollen: Dade is among them.
Several varieties are reported to have regular production.  These include: Cuccio, McDill, and Suebelle. The taste of the fruit is also reported to vary significantly with soil, quantity of water, nutrients, and climate.
Woolley Leaf White Sapote  Casimiroa tetrameria     The woolley-leaved white sapote usually has 5 leaflets, larger and thicker than those of C. edulis and velvety-white on the underside (Fruits of Warm Climates, Julia F Morton)

Quote from: fruitlovers on May 31, 2014, 02:25:49 AM

Quote from: davidgarcia899 on May 28, 2014, 09:07:30 AM

I've been grafting the pond apple seedlings that have sprouted in my pond. I now have a Custard Apples and a Soursop growing with fully submerged roots, im curios to see how they will grow in the long term.

I bet your custard apple and soursop on pond apple do fine. Pond apple was used some time here by one nursery as rootstock for cherimoyas because it is so rainy here and can easily flood. The problem is that pond apple is a lot more vigorous yhan cherimoya and will send many sprouts from below the graft. If you don't continuously prune these below graft sprouts the upper scion will die out. I bet that is what happened also in Australia with the atemoya grafted onto pond apple, and that is how the pond apple took over vast areas of Australian swamp.

You are correct in this Annalysis Oscar.  I had grafted sugar apple & atemoy gefner on pond apple & we just could not keep up with the pond vigor.  Its the very reason I decide to go on my Pond apple holy grail instead due to frustration of the grafting failure.  Three of my friends have planted 100 selected pond apple out in Loxahatchee when we were snake head fishing four years ago in C-14 canal that hit this canal is brackish, we catch snook, jack trevally, shark & tarpon beside snake head.  Two to three months we be out in this everglade section to taste the fruit if good or not; hope us luck in finding something the local Raccons & Pacu fish can call edible too! 

Fishing out there is the best! I caught a snook, tarpon and bass all in the same spot in west Jupiter Farms. Right next to us was an 11 foot alligator sunning. Coconut if you like the wild edible animals you should try some of the iguanas around here, really tasty!

Quote from: davidgarcia899 on May 28, 2014, 09:07:30 AM

I've been grafting the pond apple seedlings that have sprouted in my pond. I now have a Custard Apples and a Soursop growing with fully submerged roots, im curios to see how they will grow in the long term.

I bet your custard apple and soursop on pond apple do fine. Pond apple was used some time here by one nursery as rootstock for cherimoyas because it is so rainy here and can easily flood. The problem is that pond apple is a lot more vigorous yhan cherimoya and will send many sprouts from below the graft. If you don't continuously prune these below graft sprouts the upper scion will die out. I bet that is what happened also in Australia with the atemoya grafted onto pond apple, and that is how the pond apple took over vast areas of Australian swamp.

You are correct in this Annalysis Oscar.  I had grafted sugar apple & atemoy gefner on pond apple & we just could not keep up with the pond vigor.  Its the very reason I decide to go on my Pond apple holy grail instead due to frustration of the grafting failure.  Three of my friends have planted 100 selected pond apple out in Loxahatchee when we were snake head fishing four years ago in C-14 canal that hit this canal is brackish, we catch snook, jack trevally, shark & tarpon beside snake head.  Two to three months we be out in this everglade section to taste the fruit if good or not; hope us luck in finding something the local Raccons & Pacu fish can call edible too! 

I'm sure the Australian varieties have been spread around as the seeds are so easy to transport.They do grow true from seed but as they outcross easily they can be 'impure'.In nurseries they can be on other rootstocks especially in cooler areas.In my area there are mostly seedlings.
Starling I think that the yellow flavicarpas don't reach their full glory in places cooler than ideal for them.Maybe the little bit edulis blood (sap) in the red allows them to be good in Brisbane.

African gold and Pandora red are growing well , hoping for fruit next year ...

I'd like to grow some bananas, a mango and a few other exotic fruits - kind of make one side of the house be a "jungle orchard".  Where is the best place in the Keys to buy fruit trees?
Thanks and I am really glad I found this forum!

Welcome! I have found that nurseries in the Keys are generally very overpriced, and have very little knowledge. Often they have no idea what they're growing, or may mislabel things. It's rare to find one that knows anything about what cultivar of a plant they have - generally the best they can do is "Banana," "Mango,"...  If you know Spanish you will do well to haggle with the nurseries all around Homestead (make absolutely sure to check out the Fruit & Spice Park, and also 'Robert Is Here' Fruit Stand!). Home Depot does not really cater to our climate, so they will sell a bunch of things that need a much colder climate than we have, or that will waste away the moment they hit our coral soil. [Also, be aware that Home Depot uses pesticides that get into the very cells of the plants that are known to kill honeybees, so even if you have an organic home and plant these plants and bees come to pollinate, they will die anyway.] Local nurseries and Home Depot will also sell plenty of plants that are invasive and very harmful to our fragile ecosystem here - so look up every species online before you buy to check for its invasive potential, so you don't harm the local environment. Native plants - even endangered ones - can be found in local nurseries as well as in Homestead and are very cheap, though, so a little research into that is a good thing, as it will help keep bees and a wide range of other living things (endangered species included) in your yard.

For a huge variety and the ability to ship directly to my house, I have bought a great deal of my trees from Top Tropicals, which is in FL so shipping does not take long or go through cold zones. They have mixed reviews here, you can research it, but for the most part they have a wide selection of rare and special plants and I have mostly had good luck with them. Wait for holidays when they have their sales though, because costs and shipping really add up fast! My experience has been that plants on clearance are cheap because they are nearly dead, so not worth the money they cost.

Outside of a few trees that you need to be full size or nearly mature from the beginning, I would recommend starting things from seed. You can buy seeds or seedling plants of tons of things on Amazon, as well as Etsy, Ebay, and on this forum. This keeps costs low and lets you experiment until you know what will work here and what is worth the effort to you. As I mentioned earlier, in this first year of growing I got hit with an onslaught of various pests and problems (one single plant that has a disease or pest can quickly spread it to your entire yard and wipe it out before you know what hit you!), and I do wish I had taken it more slowly to have more of a handle on care for each plant. I was in a rush for various reasons, and it's been exciting and in some cases it will mean I have mature fruiting trees that fill in my landscape much faster than if I had waited, but you should pick and choose your battles with the items that are most important to you first.

Aside from problems with the soil and water, rats, iguanas, and for you Key Deer, etc, you'll have to contend with our unusual climate. We are far drier than the rest of FL - actually the driest county in the state! - and we alternate between dryness that actually causes brush fires, to sometimes multiple feet of rain in a month (in one June in the 1960s there was a total 21ft of rain!)! It never freezes, but these other factors do limit what naturally does well here without a ton of water waste and endless work and setbacks. On the other hand, some things absolutely flourish here with no help, and I am continually surprised by the things that I've planted that have done well, versus the things that have died under the strain of pests and other factors. Sometimes it's just a matter of the individual plant, and I've found that in my yard, plants that grow from seed (again, often things you wouldn't expect) do much better than trying to transplant a seed. I guess this is because the seed started out used to the conditions of the soil and weather and so is just the kind of seed that will do well - sometimes I have an abundance of seeds from things and just give them a shot in the soil on their own, and the full trees of the same plant that I am giving tons of care and every advantage wither while the lonely seedling continues to grow. Of course, how well they will fruit remains to be seen. I await the time when we have a bad storm to see whether all of this work and money was for naught in the long run! Hopefully not. Since you're in a low flood zone, be aware of things like salt tolerance, flood (and drought) tolerance, and protection from wind. In most years, these ratings will be enough to save your plants. But of course we can't do much to prepare them for hurricane force winds and waves, outside of some careful planting techniques.

A few things I grow in pots/bags on my balcony and indoors, for that reason. I hope not to be completely wiped out in any one season. It is very easy to grow fruiting plants indoors here, since the sun is so strong - I have fruited watermelon, strawberries, peppers, and other plants indoors here.

Some plants that you may already know of but that fruit well here are:

Coconut
Banana
Mango
Mamey Sapote
Black Sapote
Passionfruit
Guava
Lemon
Lime
Calamondin (all of these citrus may have problems with the soil, but so far I have had no problems and have had plenty of fruit)
Papaya (be careful to plant non-GMO only), and be sure to pick them all as papaya are invasive if not)
Tamarind
Pineapple
Barbados Cherry
Surinam Cherry
Starfruit
Pygmy Date Palm
Feijoa
Dragonfruit

And with some extra help...
Guanabana
Pomegranate
Avocado
Muscadine grape

Invasive, grow only indoors:
Guava
Strawberry/Cattley Guava
Sapodilla

Good Fruiting Native Plants to consider:
Wild Coffee
Bahama Coffee
Beautyberry
Cocoplum
Seagrape

If you're interested in growing vegetables as well, you will do best with tropical vegetables which are better known in other countries. Few plants that are well-known in the US can handle the summer heat here - they wither and succumb to whitefly, etc.

A list of native plants in the Florida Keys can be found here:
http://monroe.ifas.ufl.edu/lawn/lawn_keysguide_sec4.shtml

Here is a Gardening Guide for the Florida Keys:
http://monroe.ifas.ufl.edu/lawn/lawn_keysguide.shtml

If you find any Australian Pine or Brazilian Pepper in your yard, please remove them as these are highly invasive and are rapidly destroying the fragile Florida Keys ecosystem.

Consider a rain catchment system if you're going to plant anything that cannot withstand the droughts here. It's best not to use any tap water at all, from an ecological and financial standpoint, as well as the health of the plants. Our fresh water is extremely limited in Florida, and in the Keys it must be piped in from very far away. You can get organic mosquito dunks on Amazon for pretty cheap to prevent the water from harboring mosquito eggs. Here is the Florida Keys Aqueduct Authority's guide on making a rain barrel:
http://www.fkaa.com/buildingrainbarrel.pdf

I realize this is a lot of information, but I wish I had had this info when I moved here a year and a half ago! It has been an extremely steep learning curve.

You may find this document useful if you have not already seen it.

http://www.fruit.usask.ca/Documents/Haskap/MildewSunburnHaskap.pdf

Blue Sky Haskap most likely has mostly Russian genetics. Blue sea is a Japanese seedling selection from what I read. Perhaps the varieties were not the best selections to trial. May want to look into these varieties; Indigo treat, Boreal Blizzard, and the Yezberry (Solo and Maxine) selections. These all seem to be well bred Haskap selections with better disease and sun scald resistance.

I am going to be trialing Boysenberry, Bababerry, and working on germinating some R. Rosifolius seeds for south Florida.

Very helpful, thanks!

I'll look into those. Are they all pollination-compatible with one another (timing-wise)?

I've been wanting to get my hands on Boysenberry for a while, but my yard is full as it is. It gets frustrating, wanting to grow the world on a fraction of an acre.     Bababerry has my attention now. It, Autumn Britten and Caroline seem to be the most heat-tolerant Red cultivars I've seen so far. I have Black Hawk as well, but I'm beginning to wonder if I should've gotten Allen (both are heat resistant, and I've heard good and bad reviews for Black Hawk; not as much ambivalence on Allen's reviews). Rosifolius is fair for my palate, I don't get why it doesn't receive more attention, especially from the locals. I heard one guy claim them to be more productive than the Australian R. probus (which is commercialized), though that remains to be tested. I've had very bad luck trying to germinate brambles (which bodes ill for my breeding projects), so a friend of mine dug up my original Rosifolius right out of the mountain. So far, so good.

I grow these.  They taste delicious (tangy raspberry/blueberry mix) but aren't practical (very soft berries and short harvest season). 

They are meant for a northern climate, even my location in Toronto, Canada, is way too hot for them.  With my weather their season is early and very short (two weeks tops).  They were done fruiting by mid June and shutting down for the year, and they seem to need a lot of chill hours before they fruit again.

The breeding programs I'm aware of are attempts to expand their fruiting season and increase their durability for commercial production.  Current commercial production in Canada appears to be focused on preserves, juices, and wines. 

Well, they sound impractical, but I've got artificial selection on my mind, so I'm willing to take that challenge. I've got worse odds than this in my plans (think Tropical Serviceberries, Pistachios, and other odd projects and hybrids).

Would it be possible that the white sapote fruit that he bought were seedling fruits? I tried to get some white sapotes in the past before finding improved varieties and most of the ones that were available were seedlings. The tree my dad planted 25 years ago on my family's farm and my first impression of white sapote is also a seedling. How are the commercial orchards of white sapote in australia organized? Or is it common for the Australian varieties to have the bitter aftertaste? Just me being curious

We're into August, well into the mango late season here in Florida. I thought I would note some of my mango experiences from this year so far. First let me say that the trees still holding fruit are mostly your standard later varieties........Keitt, Beverly, Golden Nugget, Neelam, Valencia Pride, Palmer, Golden Lippens, Mallika, my seedling of Mallika, and Maha Chanok.  Maha Chanok is noteworthy because one of my four trees has been maturing fruit for a couple of months already. I also still have Ivory on the tree and a few Julie and Carrie that were later blooms on isolated branches. 

Maha, one of my all time favorite mangoes has been quite good this year.  It continues to be a very sweet, complex flavored fruit with great growing qualities.  However, some of the new mangoes produced by Zills have a more "in your face" strong flavor that has taken up lead honors at various tastings that I have conducted this year. Lemon Zest is a definite perennial front runner for lead honors.  I have been very impressed with Sweet Tart both on the flavor profile and the production/disease resistance.  Lemon Zest, although I have planted three trees, has not yet bloomed at my house and seems very susceptible to foliar fungus, especially black sooty mold. Lady's choice, an improved East Indian type, was fruitful, but highly susceptible to fruit fungus such that the entire crop was lost.  There was no spraying done. Pina Colada flowered profusely but set no fruit.  Emerald, a perennial disappointment on the fruit set front, set more fruits than ever, none of which was I ever able to enjoy thanks to poor observation on my part of the onset of maturity. Alphonso also set more fruits this year than in all previous fruiting seasons combined.  The fruit eating quality continues to be very disappointing…..mediocre at best……not a superlative mango in my yard.  Kensington Pride, the Australian wonder, set more fruits than in any previous year.  These were Ok…..nothing to write home about and certainly, at least as grown in my yard, have no business being the rage of a continent.

I was impressed with fruits brought to my various tastings.  High on the list and candidates for tree procurement and planting are Dupuis Saigon, Taralay and Kun See. I better post this before I go further and lose the whole thing by accident.  To be continued…..

Oh and it is no secret I am a big fan of Khun See.  It is one of only a few mangos I know that can be picked at a very wide range of ripeness and still please.  It can be picked crunchy an still taste good and sweet.  It is very unique in this regard.

Does anyone know from where this mango originates?

Dupuis Saigon is also a great tasting mango.