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Messages - pineislander

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1
Tropical Fruit Discussion / Re: Nitrogen Fixers
« on: Today at 08:34:19 AM »
@ Pineislander,i would have chose to use the vinegar instead of glyphosate.
You probably would have failed. Acetic acid is a contact defoliant with no residual or systemic action. Torpedo grass has a network of roots & can go down 12 inches. You would need how many thousands of gallons to saturate an acre of soil that deep. That is why it took 4 applications glyphosate , some tillage and rhizome raking there was still some left and a few criminals still poke their heads up 3 years later.

2
The experience in my area SW Florida was pretty good flowering but very low fruit set. There were exceptions.
There is a big difference between what initiates flowering in subtropical areas and what initiates in tropical areas.
Some of the chemicals used in the tropicas don't work in the subtropics.
There's also lots of variables some can be controlled and some can't.
 http://www.scielo.br/scielo.php?pid=S1677-04202007000400007&script=sci_arttext

3
Tropical Fruit Discussion / Re: Nitrogen Fixers
« on: August 19, 2019, 04:52:21 PM »
Of course you all know that spraying ANY copper, or copper fungicide products and using synthetic fertilizers (pollutants) will kill and starve this bacteria which will interfere with the natural cycling of nutrients which will eventually manifest into plant diseases and nutrient deficiencies like copper, zinc, etc. and pollute our drinking water.
Very interesting especially the concept of rolling down the grass and letting legumes dominate as a ground cover and mulch producer. Maybe a little dogmatic about nitrogen fixing bacteria, though. While I hope that ways can be found to grow large scale without chemicals or tillage saying that ANY chemicals will "kill or starve bacteria" just isn't factual. Millions of acres, admittedly degraded, still record very high rhizobial nitrogen fixation using, for instance, glyphosate resistant soybean and probably all manner of chemical inputs, treated seeds, etc.
Here is a story. When I first came to Florida I (paid) consulted with several people to get a head start understanding what I was facing. I knew te place had been regularly mowed and I had identified that it had, at minimum, four well known perennial grasses well established. The worst was torpedo grass. My intent was to plant fruit trees but to do so using the most environmentally friendly way. When I suggested using glyphosate at first to eliminate the grasses so that I could move on, one of the consultants told me that doing so would "kill everything". His best solution was to soak the place with high test vinegar, or keep pigs on the land for a while to eat the grass down. Knowing that conventional farmers regularly document nitrogen fixation that was about all I needed to know from that consultant.

Bottom line is that if we want to promote better ways of farming we need to understand exactly what we are talking about and not oversell. I know of more than one person in my area who tried to plant fruit trees without removing the torpedo grass first. It is growing right up to the tree trunk & they are steadily mowing and got far poorer results than I did by removing the grass and starting fresh. I can show very good nodulation on many of the legumes I have planted even though I used about 4 applications of glyphosate, some slow release fertilizers and micronutrients. This should be my last year using the chemical fertilizer. I am setting up a large scale vermicomposting system fed by homegrown biomass, and will be continuing to make fish emulsion for other minerals not available in my soil.

4
Tropical Fruit Discussion / Re: Which Mangos Are Left (Florida)?
« on: August 19, 2019, 03:49:14 PM »
I spotted some late bloomed Choc Anon miracle mango this week, just 2 panicles, they may ripen in September/October.
This is my first out of season experience with this variety.


These are still holding and look like they may go to October.

5
Tropical Fruit Discussion / Re: Avocado ID needed
« on: August 19, 2019, 03:44:06 PM »
I've been getting some ID's made locally of avocado. Usually they want to know:
- hands on or good closeup pictures with size and seed(cut)
- Leaf shape and size including back of leaf and color of new growth
- Hands on smell of leaf

6
Tropical Vegetables and Other Edibles / Re: Moringa oleifera
« on: August 17, 2019, 08:13:47 PM »
This vendor advertises PKM1. I haven't bought that product but have ordered from them with good results.
https://www.seedsofindia.com/item/Drumstick-tree-seed-PKM1-Hybrid-127

7
Tropical Vegetables and Other Edibles / Re: Chaya seed
« on: August 17, 2019, 08:07:26 PM »
I've had some volunteers which I think were from seeds though it's possible they came from random stem parts.

8
Tropical Vegetables and Other Edibles / Re: Tree identification
« on: August 17, 2019, 08:06:08 PM »
You'll have to get closer show flowers, leaf, bark and some size reference. Describe the smell of the leaves when crushed.
Those kinds of factors really help. This is the vegetable forum and other fruit growers who might enjoy a mystery usually watch the Tropical Fruit discussion forum more than here.

9
Tropical Fruit Discussion / Re: Nitrogen Fixers
« on: August 17, 2019, 03:28:45 PM »
I recently heard about this new book which discusses the issues of non-native species. It looks like a good read and probably has some new perspectives. The reviews are interesting, including a response by the author to critical comments.
https://www.amazon.com/Beyond-War-Invasive-Species-Permaculture/dp/160358563X#customerReviews

I have one acre covered in invasive trees here in Florida. Brazil pepper, melaleuca and ear acacia. But there is a strong understory of saw palmetto which would ordinarily dominate in my Pine Flatwoods ecosystem. Probably all it needs is a hurricane followed by a dry season fire to revert back. I have thought about planting it in a native species food forest based on what is known about that. The plan would be to establish what *could* have been here in the days of indigenous societies.The area is close to a documented canal which bisected the island when it was headquarters for the Calusa indians when the Spanish arrived. I spoke to some archeologists who can tell me some of the native species they think were grown. However, that is really just a snapshot in time because the coastline of Florida has expanded and contracted, the area was probably alternately exposed/covered by ocean, wiped out by hurricane/fire and who knows?. People have been here off and on so likely there were cultures far different from Calusa before they became established.
We are only 250 miles from Cuba and certainly people from there could have been here bringing anything from their culture. Who knows what the place had 100-200 years before Calusa? Probably nobody. What ws the native vegetation 1000 years before, 3,000 years before, 10,000 years before? Lots to think about.

10
Tropical Fruit Discussion / Re: Insane ,,pest,, control
« on: August 16, 2019, 09:05:20 PM »
Think twice when you enter a debate about carbon with me because im a professional exactly on this matter.
When you write your paper on the subject be sure to let these scientists know you have overturned their work.
https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/BF00255465

11
Tropical Fruit Discussion / Re: Insane ,,pest,, control
« on: August 16, 2019, 08:47:02 PM »
Totally wrong what you say .According to your statement ,coral reefs should not exist because corals produce CO2 that combined with water produces a weak seltzer that dissolves their skeletons.
No, I'm totally accurate, the equation is correct. Coral reefs are well known to be a net carbon source not sink you can research it & won't find disagreement in the literature. Don't forget that the equilibrium of hydrogen ion concentration (ph) in ocean water is also influenced by dissolved calcium, sodium and magnesium carbonates which act as buffers to resist acidification. The ocean is quite different from an aqaurium. I've been responsible for desalination and water boiler equipment in my career as chief engineer on oceangoing ships and understand a bit of water chemistry. 

12
Tropical Fruit Discussion / Re: Nitrogen Fixers
« on: August 16, 2019, 07:51:41 PM »
Pigeon Pea
I forgot about that one and Jack beans(Canavalia ensiformis) . Pokeweed you could try a row of pigeon peas next to your figs. Plant 4 seeds about 12 inches apart and prune to a bush form they will persist till frost.
The jack beans are good because they grow in a large bush form. I let the jackbeans grow up then bend them over to the ground in different directions to create a medium high bush ground cover. The best part about jackbeans is they don't make twining vines that choke out taller plants. Get the whites seeded variety the red seed tends to vine. I also use velvet beans but they can easily smother plants, great for a field use.

Nodulation on jackbean seedlings:


Drone view of pigeon pea borders down each side of fruit trees. I have cut these about 6 times. Each time they are pruned hard they release nitrogen.


Pigeon peas between pruning:


Jack bean around banana:


Velvet bean ground cover in open field(note how it is climbing pine tree):


13
Tropical Fruit Discussion / Re: Insane ,,pest,, control
« on: August 16, 2019, 07:03:04 PM »
Fixing carbonate from the water lowers the CO2 in the atmosphere,greenhouse effect,etc.
This is a common misconception. It works like this:
Ca++  +  2HCO3-   =  CaCO3  + H2O  + CO2

For every calcium bicarbonate corals take in to make calcium carbonate an atom of carbon gets released as a CO2 molecule. Some of the CO2 does vent to atmosphere and when it rains down as carbonic acid toland dissolves crabon stored as limestone.
I love corals and though I'm a Marine engineer I did study chemistry and oceanography at University. Much of my life has been spent living on in or next to warm waters including 12 years on a coral reef and another ten years sailing on the ocean. The big practical global sink for carbon is in soils, so that's where I feed my livestock, underground. If we can figure how to avoid tillage and more land clearing much of the carbon problems will be resolved.


14
Tropical Fruit Discussion / Re: Insane ,,pest,, control
« on: August 16, 2019, 08:17:42 AM »
Corals are not a sink for CO2, they are a source of CO2.

15
Tropical Fruit Discussion / Re: Nitrogen Fixers
« on: August 15, 2019, 03:19:26 PM »
I am using quite a few legumes. For ground cover my main go-to is Mimosa strigillosa. For shorter term ground cover ordinary peanut does well for a year. Longer term Perennial peanut makes a low ground cover. For edible bush yard-long beans(vigna sp) and 2 varieties of cowpeas. For a taller strata I have used Showy Rattlebox (Crotalaria spectabilis) which can go to a 4 foot shrub and can be cut back to regrow. Taller yet and getting into trees I use Leucaena leucocephala, Ice Cream Bean(Inga sp.), Earleaf Acacia (Acacia auriculiformis) and Candlestick cassia(Senna alata). I have some Gliricidia coming along in pots from cuttings but haven't gotten them in the ground yet. For trees in my zone 10-11 climate the best performing trees have been Leucaena and Candlestick cassia both of which grow like weeds and are considered invasive in my area. I control them by heavy pruning before flowers set viable seed.
I consider all of these to be pioneer plants with a function of supporting the main orchard trees as they grow providing some shade, hopefully nitrogen fixing and making prunings to use as mulch. The low ground covers give me a no-mow occupied space between tree rows. Over time I expect to eliminate most of these as the trees mature and dominate the site which is emulating a controlled natural succession like you would see in an ordinary forest.
I'm not sure how some of these would do in your zone, south parts of Houston League city still get some frost.

16
Tropical Fruit Discussion / Re: Insane ,,pest,, control
« on: August 13, 2019, 11:16:08 PM »
Asian carps,especially the jumping ones should be released in any polued lake and river for the benefit of the whole ecosystem and native fish because these fish are the only real and the best solution to eutrophisation like in the dead lake Erie,the Florida red algae blooms .These fish pose no threat and do not harm native ecosystems but instead they clean the water and protect native species from becoming extinct through eutrophisation ,all scientifically prooved ,iet americans are brainwashed into hating them.
This is an insane thing to say.

17
Tropical Fruit Discussion / Re: Bananas are coming in
« on: August 13, 2019, 03:08:22 PM »
Usually the top hands ripen first you can cut them off working your way down. This spreads out the harvest so you don't get stuck with 30 pounds to eat at one time. You can try cooking some green bananas fried or boiled as a starchy vegetable.

Commercial growers clean the bunches removing the non-functional male flower at the botom, the lowest malformed fruits, the red bracts which cover each hand while flowering, and the dead blossoms on the end of each banana, then they cover the bunch with a plastic bag to protect it. Sometimes they leave one fruit on the last hand saying
Those measures tend to reduce disease. I usually only remove the male flower and bracts.

18
Tropical Fruit Discussion / Re: Help us shape our new Atemoya
« on: August 13, 2019, 02:25:29 PM »
Looks like some very low branches. Why aren't you planting this in the ground?
I have had good luck getting branching on Atemoya by basic pruning but have also learned something new. Every branch which grows 1 foot long I break off the tip and strip 4-6 leaves away from that tip. No tool needed just fingers. Within a week or two I get 2-4 buds breaking near the tipped place. Once those grow 1 foot long I repeat. I only learned the technique this year after the tree had grown up to about 5 feet.  Using this method is quickly building a complex well branched trees. Rather strange the grower let those long low branches grow that way.

19
I have gone to a lower vase form for guava pruning with fruiting branches concentrated about breast height. The video linked below shows some details of a commercial guava operation with trees in harvest and how they prune. It is in Spanish but you can set closed caption "on" and auto translate for your language. The video is very good and the grower is sharing what he has learned over 20 years. They look for two main crop cycles per year.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=epk8R4HsYUg

growing guavas means dealing with fruit fly, at least here in Florida. You can beat them with reusable bags, these are $0.15 USD each.
https://www.amazon.com/SOSAM-Organza-Drawstring-Pouches-Jewelry/dp/B07D1R3DXQ/ref=sr_1_fkmr0_1?keywords=COTOSEY+Sosam+100PCS+6x9+Inches+Organza+Drawstring+Pouches+Jew&qid=1565652726&s=hpc&sr=1-1-fkmr0

20
Tropical Fruit Discussion / Re: Weeping banana
« on: August 12, 2019, 07:09:53 PM »
That is an interesting problem. Bananas have to deal with wind damage, sometimes they get very shredded up yours seem to have just gotten broken. Maybe the corner of the house is subject to some wind rotation? If so I'm not sure what you could do about it in an otherwise unsheltered location. Bananas are just susceptible to wind damage, in open areas they get very tattered in anything over 40 mph winds and can get completely ragged. Those broken branches will dry up and can be cut off. Bananas have a root system which likes to extend as much as six feet out from the corm, but your grass is taking up that space. It will benefit from mulch, fertility, and root space to grow.

21
Maybe it needs to go in the ground to stay happy.

22
Tropical Fruit Discussion / Re: Mango Tree Bark Came Out
« on: August 10, 2019, 07:35:19 PM »
I agree it could well have been a woodpecker searching for insects.
This is related but I recently took this photo of a mango tree healing after severe injury. The tree scraped against the posts while being bent over and whipped around in Hurricane Irma September 2017. The callous has almost closed up the injury and if it continues the tree should be fully recovered in a year or so.

 


23
Tropical Fruit Discussion / Re: My Best Pitangatuba
« on: August 08, 2019, 07:14:24 PM »
It looks beautiful. How many fruits like this are you getting per tree?

24
Tropical Fruit Discussion / Re: Iguana Wars
« on: August 07, 2019, 08:27:43 AM »
Yes, you are wrong about pigs plenty of wild pig eaters out here but there are so many most choose young ones and try to reduce the population by shooting many more than they can eat. Plenty of carp eaten too. Many wild pigs and carp even served at schools & restaurants.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZzGpP1ShDHw

https://www.youtube.com/user/deermeatfordinner/search?query=boar

25
Tropical Fruit Discussion / Re: Questions about my avocado tree
« on: August 04, 2019, 04:31:32 PM »
Identifying avocado takes some skill and may not be possible without touching and smelling. I had an assorment of unidentified grafted trees and have been learning about them. The variables are fruit size, shape, color and texture of skin, and season, leaf size, shape, color, and scent. Then there is the possibility of having an unnamed seedling. To really identify you need someone familiar with the tree as it grows in your area and able to assess the listed variables. Even then I've seen differences of opinion between knowledgeable persons. Some of the common varieties are pretty easy though.

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