Author Topic: Buddy Tapesters Vs Parafilmers (Read 23941 times)

FlyingFoxFruits · « **on:** May 08, 2012, 11:54:39 AM »

Have done a few experimental grafts...they seem to push out leaves slightly, but grow slow as heck...so I removed bag and tape around union...only to find that they've healed...and are just growing slow...

Wanted any feedback from others who've experienced this.

behlgarden · « **Reply #1 on:** May 08, 2012, 12:09:19 PM »

I second that thought Adam. All my grafts are open in wild mature trees where tempreature swings are big, grafts are confused as hell. Got very nice success and growth with Plums and Apricots, and apple/pears.

Guava and Annona's are very slow, all I see is bud breaks with no real leaves and its been like that for over a month now. I think we need some real intense heat here in CA to get the big push of growth.

TropicalFruitHunters · « **Reply #2 on:** May 08, 2012, 01:12:45 PM »

I usually try and wait for the polyfilm to bust from the graft site expanding...regardless of whether new growth has pushed yet. I'll then test the graft. I've had this happen before but normally will see new growth appear first. Am hoping to try this with my Imbe soon...

behlgarden · « **Reply #3 on:** May 08, 2012, 01:15:15 PM »

Adam, in your case, did you put the wrap back on to the union and scion OR completely removed it? I am leaving everything on as I dont want the scion to falloff

FlyingFoxFruits · « **Reply #4 on:** May 08, 2012, 02:58:55 PM »

Behl.

IT was bagged up, not wrapped in buddy tape. I just took off the bag, and it still lived...the plant is totally done healing...just growing slow as ever.

I've had a few grafts that were in bags, that dropped the initial pushed of growth...but I removed them from the bags, and carefully wrapped them in buddy tape...and they are still alive!

So don't give up on a graft to quick.

I've been wanting to really challenge myself with grafting lately, so if u can...help me think of some weird graft techniques to try!

I like the thought of just cutting the trees right in half, straight across (like pruning shears), and then just rest the scion on the rootstock, and splint..and wait!

I heard Adolf Grimal (an Engineer by trade, if I recall) grafted like this before.

Patrick · « **Reply #5 on:** May 08, 2012, 03:07:02 PM »

I did a bunch of grafting last night at my house using Buddy Tape.. My only complaint is the "tear-offs" at 1 1/2" intervals.. I was really getting pissed off at the roll, I felt like I was using toilet paper.. I hate to admit it but I finished the night off with Parafilm leaving the Buddy Tape on the counter.. Am I missing something?? I do notice the material is more porous and stretchy..

FlyingFoxFruits · « **Reply #6 on:** May 08, 2012, 03:22:39 PM »

U r still fresh meat, as far as buddy tape is concerned.

It will take time, but you'll get seasoned, and grafts will turn out "well done".

Buddy tape is difficult to work with at first, but it is much more versatile than parafilm...with its unique properties, you can employ an array of techniques for wrapping scions, and graft unions.

It just takes practice...don't give up yet.

I hated buddy tape when I first used it, then the concept caught on... and now this tape is a must.

Quote from: pj1881 on May 08, 2012, 03:07:02 PM

I did a bunch of grafting last night at my house using Buddy Tape.. My only complaint is the "tear-offs" at 1 1/2" intervals.. I was really getting pissed off at the roll, I felt like I was using toilet paper.. I hate to admit it but I finished the night off with Parafilm leaving the Buddy Tape on the counter.. Am I missing something?? I do notice the material is more porous and stretchy..

behlgarden · « **Reply #7 on:** May 08, 2012, 04:26:26 PM »

OK Folks, most people who use parafilm dont stretch it much as it does not stretch much either. On contrary, that 1.5 inch strip of buddy tape stretches to 8 to 10 inches. Adam explained earlier in another post, here it is again:
1. Take one strip off the roll
2. Stretch a 1/4" to 1/2" of strip slowly wrapping the scion, you will get blown away on how much it stretches before it snaps. go slow, once you use the stretched portion, grab the next 1/2" section and wrap, and stretch and wrap.

If you simply are using the buddy tape without stretching it, you are not doint justice to Buddy Tape on how its intended to be used. On 8" long scion, I use mere two strips, including tieine the union and completely wrapping the scion.

Those who know how to stretch and use, they can second my comment here.

behlgarden · « **Reply #8 on:** May 08, 2012, 04:29:41 PM »

oh, and the stretched buddy tape wont crack like Parafilm does. Learn learn learn

Cookie Monster · « **Reply #9 on:** May 08, 2012, 05:11:25 PM »

Interesting. I've done a fair amount of grafting with parafilm M and have never had a complaint with it. I can easily stretch a 2 inch piece of parafilm 8 inches without issue. Older rolls snap pretty easily, but I normally finish off a roll within a year anyway.

That said, 1 1/2 inches is plenty for most grafts/budding. And, for larger / thicker diameter grafts, you could use 2 strips, winding from the bottom up and using the 2nd strip when the 1st runs out.

If you're really sly, you don't even use budding strips or poly tape -- you just wrap with parafilm for both securing the graft and for moisture retention :-).

Parafilm M even makes a good substitute for chewing gum when you''re bored... :-).

emegar · « **Reply #10 on:** May 08, 2012, 05:18:14 PM »

If the perforations are a concern, it seems that non-perforated rolls are also available from the manufacturer: http://www.buddytape.com/application.html.

behlgarden · « **Reply #11 on:** May 08, 2012, 05:19:09 PM »

"Parafilm M even makes a good substitute for chewing gum when you''re bored... :-)."

I do that CM, except that its the one is cracked at Union, LOL. I am wondering when you stretch that much Parafilm, you dont see cracking at union at all? By stretching that much, with few days of heat the portion over the expanding union simply cracks open in all my grafts where union expanded, I am also using parafilm M, fresh!

behlgarden · « **Reply #12 on:** May 08, 2012, 05:23:27 PM »

James, is your tape perforated? I dont think so. If you take a single strip, it is not perforated at all unless we got the perforated order this time. Mine from 1st order is not perforated. May be Adam can confirm that his 2nd lot looks like compared to first one. Dont confuse perforations with the tear perforations as tear perforations are for ease of breaking strips.

FlyingFoxFruits · « **Reply #13 on:** May 08, 2012, 05:25:40 PM »

Quote from: emegar on May 08, 2012, 05:18:14 PM

If the perforations are a concern, it seems that non-perforated rolls are also available from the manufacturer: http://www.buddytape.com/application.html.

u beat me to it!!!

i was gonna mention this!! I'm sure Ed was about to say this to!

for me,the perforated tape is great...I can only imagine this being a problem if u were wrapping really huge scions and such...the tape stretches so much, it can go along way. The strips are a perfect length.

behlgarden · « **Reply #14 on:** May 08, 2012, 05:28:38 PM »

Adam, Buddy Tape also sells tape that has perforations within the strip so go figure! folks are confusing with that comment on buddy tape's site If these perforations are not there in the tape, there is no way for anyone to cut small strips given it stretches so much and you would end up losing more due to snapping!

FlyingFoxFruits · « **Reply #15 on:** May 08, 2012, 05:29:25 PM »

behl,

I though mine was precut??

I've always used this I thought...Is mine not perforated?

behlgarden · « **Reply #16 on:** May 08, 2012, 05:41:47 PM »

OK, what we got is perforated (perforated means its made for ease of tear into strips) and trust me, you dont want non-perforated. If you think you would have liked a continuous reel, try to break one strip into two and see what you get, the strip gets completely messed up.

Its strip by strip use, if you run short, use another strip. No waste at all.

FlyingFoxFruits · « **Reply #17 on:** May 08, 2012, 06:03:59 PM »

Quote from: behlgarden on May 08, 2012, 05:41:47 PM

OK, what we got is perforated (perforated means its made for ease of tear into strips) and trust me, you dont want non-perforated. If you think you would have liked a continuous reel, try to break one strip into two and see what you get, the strip gets completely messed up.

Its strip by strip use, if you run short, use another strip. No waste at all.

Behl
u can easily snap the precut strips into smaller pieces!

you must pull quick! and secure both sides of tape that u r pulling firmly with your fingers!

try it! it snaps like it's brittle!!

I do this all the time.

FlyingFoxFruits · « **Reply #18 on:** May 08, 2012, 06:06:17 PM »

oh btw, parafilm is like dial up modem to me...antiquated.

buddy tape is like having spider silk...like spiderman of splicing.

Cookie Monster · « **Reply #19 on:** May 08, 2012, 06:34:35 PM »

ha -- you'd trip if you saw how they do it in other countries. My brother-in-law (a horticultural researcher from El Salvador) just takes plastic bags, cuts them into 1 inch wide strips, and uses that :-). I guess that would be considered 'fire', 'wheel', or maybe even bronze age technology :-).

Honestly, the kind of tape you use doesn't make a difference on rate of take. And, a skilled grafter can speed through the grafting process regardless of what he's using to wrap. They get pretty agile at their craft. This forum is the first place I've ever heard of anyone complaining about parafilm ;-). As long as you can protect your graft against water intrusion and prevent desiccation -- whether it's with a recycled grocery bag, buddy tape deluxe, or parafilm -- then the other variables in the grafting process (skill level, cut, time of year, health, etc) are the ones that dictate rate of take.

Quote from: ASaffron on May 08, 2012, 06:06:17 PM

oh btw, parafilm is like dial up modem to me...antiquated.

buddy tape is like having spider silk...like spiderman of splicing.

FlyingFoxFruits · « **Reply #20 on:** May 08, 2012, 06:56:49 PM »

Very true...successful grafts are all that counts...It doesn't matter if you use toothpaste and bandaids..whatever works.

Buddy Tape for me is best. Parafilm has led to many failed grafts for me, with it's delayed biodegradability, and reduced elasticity when exposed to sun.

Quote from: Cookie Monster on May 08, 2012, 06:34:35 PM

ha -- you'd trip if you saw how they do it in other countries. My brother-in-law (a horticultural researcher from El Salvador) just takes plastic bags, cuts them into 1 inch wide strips, and uses that :-). I guess that would be considered 'fire', 'wheel', or maybe even bronze age technology :-).

Honestly, the kind of tape you use doesn't make a difference on rate of take. And, a skilled grafter can speed through the grafting process regardless of what he's using to wrap. They get pretty agile at their craft. This forum is the first place I've ever heard of anyone complaining about parafilm ;-). As long as you can protect your graft against water intrusion and prevent desiccation -- whether it's with a recycled grocery bag, buddy tape deluxe, or parafilm -- then the other variables in the grafting process (skill level, cut, time of year, health, etc) are the ones that dictate rate of take.

Quote from: ASaffron on May 08, 2012, 06:06:17 PM
oh btw, parafilm is like dial up modem to me...antiquated.

buddy tape is like having spider silk...like spiderman of splicing.

Cookie Monster · « **Reply #21 on:** May 08, 2012, 07:12:37 PM »

HAHAHAH toothpaste. better be careful, u givin me some good ideas .

Quote from: ASaffron on May 08, 2012, 06:56:49 PM

Very true...successful grafts are all that counts...It doesn't matter if you use toothpaste and bandaids..whatever works.

Buddy Tape for me is best. Parafilm has led to many failed grafts for me, with it's delayed biodegradability, and reduced elasticity when exposed to sun.

JF · « **Reply #22 on:** May 08, 2012, 09:19:33 PM »

Quote from: ASaffron on May 08, 2012, 06:56:49 PM

Very true...successful grafts are all that counts...It doesn't matter if you use toothpaste and bandaids..whatever works.

Buddy Tape for me is best. Parafilm has led to many failed grafts for me, with it's delayed biodegradability, and reduced elasticity when exposed to sun.

Quote from: Cookie Monster on May 08, 2012, 06:34:35 PM
ha -- you'd trip if you saw how they do it in other countries. My brother-in-law (a horticultural researcher from El Salvador) just takes plastic bags, cuts them into 1 inch wide strips, and uses that :-). I guess that would be considered 'fire', 'wheel', or maybe even bronze age technology :-).

Honestly, the kind of tape you use doesn't make a difference on rate of take. And, a skilled grafter can speed through the grafting process regardless of what he's using to wrap. They get pretty agile at their craft. This forum is the first place I've ever heard of anyone complaining about parafilm ;-). As long as you can protect your graft against water intrusion and prevent desiccation -- whether it's with a recycled grocery bag, buddy tape deluxe, or parafilm -- then the other variables in the grafting process (skill level, cut, time of year, health, etc) are the ones that dictate rate of take.

Quote from: ASaffron on May 08, 2012, 06:06:17 PM
oh btw, parafilm is like dial up modem to me...antiquated.

buddy tape is like having spider silk...like spiderman of splicing.

I'm going to have to get on the buddy tape wagon....my grafts on my cherimoya trees that's are on the ground push and stop growing and dry up?

the grafts on containers have no problems.

behlgarden · « **Reply #23 on:** May 09, 2012, 10:36:24 AM »

Joe,

It happened to me too in some Cherimoya grafts. Note that Cherimoya union expands hard during union bond and parafilm cracks instead of expanding along with it. see the attached picture. I did not have this problem in say plums or apricots, but Cherimoya and Guava grafts got high failure rates with Parafilm.

Yes, I blame Parafilm on some of the failures that I endured, scions are very hard to get anyway and then lose them because of stupid parafilm is very disturbing.

emegar · « **Reply #24 on:** May 09, 2012, 11:57:07 AM »

Behl,

Did you have any more rolls from your last order? I think I saw you post that you had two left the other day. If you do, I'd take another. Now that I've tried it, I confess, I'm on the Buddy Tape Bandwagon!

James

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Author Topic: Buddy Tapesters Vs Parafilmers (Read 23941 times)