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Author Topic: Potassium Nitrate to induce mango flowering in Ultra High Density planting  (Read 3909 times)

Mike T

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http://blog.agriculture.ph/tag/flower-induce-carabao-mango
Potassium Nitrate is routinely used to induce flowering in mangoes in the PhilipinesIt doesn't seem to be ever used to my knowledge in Australia.I am wondering if people are familiar with its use and if it is regularly used in other countries such as the USA?

fruitlovers

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http://blog.agriculture.ph/tag/flower-induce-carabao-mango
Potassium Nitrate is routinely used to induce flowering in mangoes in the PhilipinesIt doesn't seem to be ever used to my knowledge in Australia.I am wondering if people are familiar with its use and if it is regularly used in other countries such as the USA?


P. nitrate used a lot in Thailand and in Mexico. Don't know anybody here that uses it, but mango production here is miniscule. Don't think USA makes it to the top 25 (or 50?) mango producing countries.
Oscar

zands

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http://blog.agriculture.ph/tag/flower-induce-carabao-mango
Potassium Nitrate is routinely used to induce flowering in mangoes in the PhilipinesIt doesn't seem to be ever used to my knowledge in Australia.I am wondering if people are familiar with its use and if it is regularly used in other countries such as the USA?


Of course this stuff works! Philippines is poor and hungry so they will do what it takes and I mean this with zero disrespect. They use this to get trees yielding every year instead of biennially. IIRC this reduces the tree lifetime like other stimulants. Philippines exports mango to rich Asian nations so wants to keep production at the best.    lol... not used in Oz and USA because we have the comfortable couches to pontificate from to be eco-moralizing superpowers. Philippines does not have that luxury
« Last Edit: May 30, 2012, 06:53:04 AM by zands »
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GwenninPR

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They use it here in PR at the large mango plantation so they have mangos for sale  all year round.

Bananimal

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I got this tip from a local certified organic farmer and it should work very well for mangos as it did for all my bananas last year.  I posted the following on bananas.org last Nov.

OK ----- here it is. The solution to force a banana flower to push out earlier.

For you guys in California it's cheaper than for me. I had to pay $45.00 for shipping alone.

Peaceful Valley sells a Sulfate of Potash product made by Diamond K. It only comes in 50 lb bags. To get the best fast result use the water soluble, ultra fines version. It meets organic certification requirement.

Using a strainer, I apply 2 tablespoons around the near to fruiting size pstem on each mat -- followed by a second and final application a week later.  Seems like a small dose --- that's because NPK is 0-0-50.  That's it! It's a fine powder - just tap the strainer and you get a good even distribution of the powder.  I put the powder in the strainer sitting on a paper plate to avoid loss. The strainer sits on the plate - not me!

All my fruiting height pstems have produced the flower in 1 to 4 weeks after the S of P sprinkle. Exception is the Pisang Klotek at 9.5 ft.


And that's not all ------ to maintain organic certification he only ferts his naners with Purdue chicken mix (with caiticin, sic, and yucca added by our local Ag supplier -- Diamond R). His appl rate is 2 cups per mat every 2 weeks from March till end of Nov. He uses it on everything from his grafted tomatoes, lettuces, chard, kale, papayas to his bananas, to name a few.

So I started to add the chicken mix (3-2-3) to my mats along with the non-organic 6-3-16. It also helps to bring the nitrogen up closer to K/2 for better K utilization.

Chicken mix breaks down slowly so I expect to see the full effect in next years production.

Dan

Here's a good pic of the 4 to 6 week early result-----------------


« Last Edit: May 31, 2012, 01:35:01 AM by Bananimal »
Dan

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Mike - I tried it on my Mango Tree (in Palm Springs) back in the late late fall of 2010.  Sprayed the tree with the mixture 3 times over2 months.  Nothing happened.  I think for So Cal's climate it's a bad idea cuz of the cold.  I mean if my large Manila had sent out flowers in December they probably would have been chilled too much and dropped.  I'm thinking this works much better in warm climates, South Florida being the minimal kind that might lend itself to this kind of stress-flowering of the mango.

Just my opine of course.....


Gary

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http://blog.agriculture.ph/tag/flower-induce-carabao-mango
Potassium Nitrate is routinely used to induce flowering in mangoes in the PhilipinesIt doesn't seem to be ever used to my knowledge in Australia.I am wondering if people are familiar with its use and if it is regularly used in other countries such as the USA?


Of course this stuff works! Philippines is poor and hungry so they will do what it takes and I mean this with zero disrespect. They use this to get trees yielding every year instead of biennially. IIRC this reduces the tree lifetime like other stimulants. Philippines exports mango to rich Asian nations so wants to keep production at the best.    lol... not used in Oz and USA because we have the comfortable couches to pontificate from to be eco-moralizing superpowers. Philippines does not have that luxury


Don't think use of P. nitrate has much to do with poverty. I think all the major mango producing countries use it. It has to do with maximizing yield, so maximizing profit. Unless ofcourse you want to argue that all the countries that still export food are poverty stricken? Now we know that P. nitrate is also used in USA, thanks to GwenPR.
Oscar

zands

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Don't think use of P. nitrate has much to do with poverty. I think all the major mango producing countries use it. It has to do with maximizing yield, so maximizing profit. Unless ofcourse you want to argue that all the countries that still export food are poverty stricken? Now we know that P. nitrate is also used in USA, thanks to GwenPR.


Philippines and Thailand are the major mango exporters in Asia. They are poor out in their countryside and mango sales to Japan, Taiwan etc bring in much needed money. The grove owners make a profit and the workers are happy to be making money they perhaps could not....If it were not for richer Asians buying their mangoes. Making mangoes fruit every year and not biennially was very important in the Philippines. The man Dr. Ramon C. Barba who figured how to do it was declared a national hero. Please read or skim the below link. Thank you

http://beta.searca.org/searca/index.php/news/745-filipino-mango-hero-conferred-dioscoro-l-umali-award
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Tropicdude

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Amazing coincidence, I was just researching this subject last couple of days.   

One of the main reasons for using saltpeter commercially is to get all the trees in the orchard to flower at the same time, the potassium also helps prevent dropping of fruit.

Another use is to get trees to flower earlier , to get off season prices on the fruit, according to practice in the field, as long as you allow 8 months of rest period, you can force the flowering.

I was looking into UHD Mango plantations, Impressed by the production potential but did not like the fact that under these systems they often use growth retardants to keep trees around 7ft, since they are planted as close as 1 meter apart in rows.

obviously not an organic process, but health wise, I do not see much harm in just a light foliar spray of Potassium Nitrate a couple times, to stimulate flowers and prevent fruit drop, a foliar spray i would hope should not harm any biologicals in the ground even if you do get a bit of run off from rain, anyway i,am still looking into that part.
William
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zands

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Ultra High Density Plantation in Mango


Ultra high density mango plantation in India is explained. Thanks tropicDude. I never heard of this before and am interested because some of my mango trees are planted close together
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fruitlovers

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Ultra high density mango plantation in India is explained. Thanks tropicDude. I never heard of this before and am interested because some of my mango trees are planted close together

As stated in this video the largest exporter of mangos in the world is India, not Phillippines or Thailand as you said in your previous message. Also notice that in the video it is said that limestone soils are not suitable for ultra high density plantings (5:33). Again the emphasis here is in maximum production, not in best quality of mango. Quality of fruits is not mentioned even one time in this video. India already has enough mediocre mangos, and i'm sure that such methods will make the quality go even lower. This method is also too dependent on high inputs of fungicides, growth regulators, chemical fertilizers, and plastic mulch. When a country as large as India switches to such a method the use of petrochemicals goes sky high and so do their prices. I won't even bring up the cost to the environment of using such techniques on a massive scale!
Oscar

zands

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Ultra high density mango plantation in India is explained. Thanks tropicDude. I never heard of this before and am interested because some of my mango trees are planted close together


As stated in this video the largest exporter of mangos in the world is India, not Phillippines or Thailand as you said in your previous message. Also notice that in the video it is said that limestone soils are not suitable for ultra high density plantings (5:33). Again the emphasis here is in maximum production, not in best quality of mango. Quality of fruits is not mentioned even one time in this video. India already has enough mediocre mangos, and i'm sure that such methods will make the quality go even lower. This method is also too dependent on high inputs of fungicides, growth regulators, chemical fertilizers, and plastic mulch. When a country as large as India switches to such a method the use of petrochemicals goes sky high and so do their prices. I won't even bring up the cost to the environment of using such techniques on a massive scale!


I should have included India in the large mango exporter category. Going by this website http://www.mangoexport.com/ it seems India mostly exports to countries which include United Arab Emirates, Kingdom of Saudi Arabia, Kuwait, Kingdom of Bahrain, Qatar and Sultanate of Oman.
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KarenRei

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"a foliar spray i would hope should not harm any biologicals in the ground "

Potassium nitrate shouldn't harm anything in the ground.  Potassium and nitrogen are two of the most in-demand plant nutrients.  In hydroponics, at least, only calcium and sulfur are in the same concentration ballpark.  Also, potassium competes favorably with sodium; potassium can in general be used for everything sodium can, while sodium can't be used for everything potassium can.  Nitrate, likewise, is the preferred nitrogen form for uptake by plants and doesn't have any antagonistic competition.  The only way you'd be causing a direct health problem to other plants is if you added so much you caused osmotic stress.

Now, of course, fertilizing of any sort can have unintended consequences.  The most famous being that if you have fertilizer in your runoff, you fertilize algal growth in waterways, which deoxygenates rivers as it decomposes and thus and suffocates fish.  But also there's also issues of what the plants decide to do with it.  Potassium nitrate is nicely balanced in that nitrogen tends to promote leaf growth while potassium tends to encourage root growth and energy storage - but there's no guarantee that a particular species will balance out its growth so nicely.  And of course, rapidly pushing new growth is often the enemy of flavor (the same reason that too much water can "wash out" a fruit's taste).  But in terms of directly affecting "biologicals", potassium nitrate is simply "feeding" them.  What they choose to do with that "food", however, is up to them  ;)
« Last Edit: May 31, 2012, 11:58:39 AM by KarenRei »
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Tropicdude

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Thank you Karen,  I'am interested in some of the aspects of UHD, and feel that some of the techniques could be applied to more traditional systems, without the use of retardants.

The tendency in modern agriculture is to space trees closer together with varieties that can be kept small.

I think it would be possible to have a "medium" density plantation, using high quality dwarfish varieties, like the  "Pickering" ,  this is all theory , but  i can see a 1 acre plot of land with 264 trees, planted at 3 meters apart in rows, with rows spaced 5 meters apart.  12 rows X 22 trees = 264,  the trees in the row are almost 10 ft apart.

for the small commercial farmer, the benefit here , as in the UHD, is being able to reach a profitable income fast, as compared to traditional plantations.  its not about how many mangoes per tree, its all about how many mangoes per acre.  after a few years in a worse case scenario if trees are too hard to manage, alternate trees could be taken down, and the others allowed to fill in that space. you would then have a grid similar to traditional spacing.  so you really cant lose.

« Last Edit: May 31, 2012, 01:48:18 PM by Tropicdude »
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I have that high density in avocados. My grove was planted in rows 22 feet apart but with trees 10 ft apart in the rows. It got me to break even in year 4 now year 8 I'm removing the weakest  trees by year 12-14 I should have remove every other tree.
« Last Edit: June 04, 2012, 08:04:14 PM by CTMIAMI »
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Tropicdude

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I have that high density in avocados. My grove was planted in rows 22 feet apart but with trees 10 ft apart in the rows. I got me to break even in year 4 now year 8 I'm removing the weakest  trees by year 12-14 I should have remove every other tree.

By the way i just wanted to say i enjoy your very informative videos on Youtube.  good to see this works with Avocados also.
William
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fruitlovers

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I should have included India in the large mango exporter category. Going by this website http://www.mangoexport.com/ it seems India mostly exports to countries which include United Arab Emirates, Kingdom of Saudi Arabia, Kuwait, Kingdom of Bahrain, Qatar and Sultanate of Oman.


That link is very dated. India started exporting mangos to USA about 4-5 years ago. It was G. W. Bush that clinched the deal. Probably only great thing he ever did for this country was to allow India to export mango to USA and we send to India our nuclear active materials for their nuclear reactors: nukes for mangos.
Oscar

 

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