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Author Topic: Growing Mango trees in Southern California  (Read 73618 times)

simon_grow

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Re: Growing Mango trees in Southern California
« Reply #425 on: June 11, 2020, 04:03:57 PM »
Are there any issues I should think about before grafting onto a waist-high seedling in a 5-gallon pot?

Would it be better/worse to keep it under grow lights in my garage for the first week or two after grafting?

If you want faster growth, itís best to plant the tree and not graft it until it is much larger and the scaffold branches have formed. If you graft with mature scions, it will flower in Winter and continue flowering for about 5-6 months every year thereafter.

If you must graft now because you want a lower graft or you donít want to have to go through the troubles of top working multiple scaffold branches, your suggestion of moving the potted tree into the garage for a couple weeks while the union heals is a good idea.

Simon

simon_grow

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Re: Growing Mango trees in Southern California
« Reply #426 on: June 11, 2020, 05:07:48 PM »
Hey Jake,

Everyone would ideally come up with a customized fertilizer routine that suits their specific trees and soil conditions.

Everyoneís yards are different and one of the most important factors to consider is the pH of your soil. If your pH is off, your plants will not be able to uptake the nutrients you give it. For the more advanced gardeners, they will also consider the CEC/AEC by sending out soil samples for analysis. I just want to put out this disclaimer first.

I know some readers are probably thinking that this is overthinking the situation but the more you know about the science behind fertilizing, the better you will be able to troubleshoot if you have issues.

Ok, here is the simplified answer. In San Diego, our soil pH is generally high unless your soil has been conditioned over many years.

In general, I first adjust the pH of my soil with granular soil sulfur which will slowly decrease the pH of your soil. I add sulfur every year around Spring when the weather starts warming up.  A general purpose citrus fertilizer works fine for Mangos. Something you can find at Home Depot like Vigoro 6-4-6 is fine for Mangos.

I usually use 1/4 the recommended dose on the instructions but I fertilize 4x as frequently. I back off on fertilizer around late Summer/early Fall because you donít want vegetative growth going into cold weather as the soft growth can be an entry point for diseases. You have to be especially careful with smart/slow release fertilizer because it can release nutrients well after the application date.

The slow/smart release fertilizers are great for potted plants.

Once the trees are mature, I usually feed with with 0-10-10 or 3-12-12 plus minors and trace. I use this for most my fruiting trees.

In addition to these fertilizers, I add kelp emulsion around pre bloom to fruit set. Fish emulsion is also great for growth.

There are plenty of good organic fertilizers and they are slower acting and release their nutrients as the microbial life breaks them down. Cottonseed meal is a great acidifying fertilizer. I usually us a combination of organic and chemical fertilizers along with foliar feedings.

Because of the fungal issues we get in Winter, I like to add Silica to my fertilizer regimen. I use Potassium Silicate as a drench and a foliar to harden up the leaves and branches.

Around late Summer/early Fall, I apply some Southern Ag Citrus nutritional spray to give it some micronutrients and trace nutrients that Dr Crane recommended. I believe it was Manganese and something else I canít recall at the moment but I do remember that the Citrus Nutritional spray had both nutrients. It is supposed to help prevent Phomopsis.

Foliar feeding is great because you bypass the root system so soil pH does not affect the uptake of nutrients supplied via foliar feeding. A fogging system is recommended for foliar feeding if you have many trees. A spreader/sticker is also very important.

Much of the ground applied fertilizers are washed away and wasted. Slow/smart release fertilizers are more efficient but it is difficult to know how much remaining fertilizer is in the soil.

For potted plants, you can take an EC or PPM 500/700 reading from the runoff to know how much fertilizer is left in the soil.

Simon

greenmango

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Re: Growing Mango trees in Southern California
« Reply #427 on: June 26, 2020, 08:41:38 PM »
I'm new to mango growing. Thank you for this post. I learned a lot after reading the info. on this forum.

I would like to buy the following mango varieties as a fruit or seed. Please let me know how I can obtain them. I would pay for the fruits or seeds and your time to find them for me. I live in SF Bay Area in CA (zone 10a) so shipping may be an issue. If you know a source for these mangoes or seeds please help.

Cac, Xoŗi  Cat Hoa Loc , Nam Doc Mai, Nam Doc Mai #4, Honey Kiss, Maha Chanok, Butter cream,  SugarLoaf (E-4), Florigon , PPK, Lemon Zest, Orange Sherbet, Coconut cream, M4, Pina Colada, Cotton Candy, Pim Seng Mun, Pram Kai Meu.

I have a manilla queen in the ground and it is doing well. I don't know how old it is as the owner didn't know. Bought it from Vista and it was about 4 ft w/ a big trunk.  I have longan, cherimoya, and atemoya and they are doing excellent in the ground. I also bought 6 manilla mango trees from LaVerne Nursery 3gal and waiting for them to establish roots before putting them in the ground. In March I got two and in late May I transplant 1 in a pot and one in the ground and both have not had any new leaves. The leaves seem to be burned bc of salt water or sock? When I took the tree out of the pot the root ball was not attached to any soil, thus my new manilla I just got yesterday (4 of them) will stay in their 3 gal pot until next spring.
I don't know how to graft and I already made a novice mistake of buying a few trees from FL with turpentine rootstocks.
The plan is my gardener knows how to graft so he's going to help me.  I recently took out many trees to make room for the mangoes.
Thanks in advance for your help.
Nga

simon_grow

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Re: Growing Mango trees in Southern California
« Reply #428 on: June 28, 2020, 03:38:13 PM »
Hey Nga,

I would recommend posting your seed want list in the buy/sell forum. Now is a great time to start learning how to raft from your gardener. I would not recommend Lemon Zest as a rootstock in SoCal. LZ seedlings grow fine at first but like an actual grafted LZ, the foliage and branches often get fungal issues and dieback.
Iíve planted out many LZ seedlings and some do fine in certain locations but others have had serious fungal issues.

Simon

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Re: Growing Mango trees in Southern California
« Reply #429 on: June 30, 2020, 12:40:41 PM »
Thank you Simon. I found a seller and ordered some seeds (30 seeds of 10 varieties). 
Does CAC  or Cat Hoa Loc do well in CA? I will have them in pots at first from seeds and was thinking of getting a grafted CAC tree to give it a head start.

I grow blueberries for the last 10 yrs and have bountiful harvest so I know how to work with soil ph for mangoes.  I also have cherimoya and atemoya and longan that seems to do well so far. In the coming years I should know more if any of these are  good for our climate. I also bought sapodilla, soursop, June plum, and sugar apples, Pickering, and Nam doc mai tree in pots, ordered from FL.

Cheers,

Nga

behlgarden

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Re: Growing Mango trees in Southern California
« Reply #430 on: June 30, 2020, 06:38:38 PM »
Thank you Simon. I found a seller and ordered some seeds (30 seeds of 10 varieties). 
Does CAC  or Cat Hoa Loc do well in CA? I will have them in pots at first from seeds and was thinking of getting a grafted CAC tree to give it a head start.

I grow blueberries for the last 10 yrs and have bountiful harvest so I know how to work with soil ph for mangoes.  I also have cherimoya and atemoya and longan that seems to do well so far. In the coming years I should know more if any of these are  good for our climate. I also bought sapodilla, soursop, June plum, and sugar apples, Pickering, and Nam doc mai tree in pots, ordered from FL.

Cheers,

Nga

I have a CAC seedling that is doing excellent, it keeps branching without tip pruning. I like its growth habit too.

simon_grow

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Re: Growing Mango trees in Southern California
« Reply #431 on: June 30, 2020, 10:17:16 PM »
I agree with Behl, CAC is a good grower. CAC is one of those varieties that may need slightly more maturity or cold stimulus to bloom which is a good thing. My grafted CAC is currently holding a few fruit even with the worst Powdery Mildew I have seen in years. I sampled one CAC fruit that was absolutely incredible this year. It was super sweet with perfect acid balance and the texture and overall eating quality was top notch.  I highly recommend this variety for mango growers in SoCal.

Simon

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Re: Growing Mango trees in Southern California
« Reply #432 on: August 19, 2020, 11:32:39 PM »
Hi, I am from Norcal San Leandro zone 10a and I got a Mallika mango I bought from Florida on Turpentine rootstock. I planted it in the ground in January so it is about 8 months now. It is doing well. It flowered and had leaf growth in spring and when I cut the flowers off after it's done blooming, new flowers grew. It now has a bunch of fruitlets and new leaf growth is forming. I am hoping to be the first one in my area to have a mango. lol






ammoun

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Re: Growing Mango trees in Southern California
« Reply #433 on: August 25, 2020, 03:12:13 PM »
Simon, during the early years of a mango seedling in the ground, how many set of leaves should I expect per season please? My seedlings have been kinda slow so I was wondering if it's normal.

UplanderCA

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Re: Growing Mango trees in Southern California
« Reply #434 on: September 06, 2020, 04:55:17 PM »
Hello Everyone,

This current heatwave is baking/frying some of my new growth flushes on my mango trees and avocado tree.  I watered deeply two days (Thursday) before this current heatwave hit.  Saturday's 116 temperature did a number to the mango and avocado trees (only the new growth - the rest of the old growth appears to be doing fine).  Today's current temperature of 115 is not helping.   I'm hoping that I do not lose any of my new grafts to this heat wave.  Any advice on how to help the trees recover (especially the new grafts)?


Mango grafts - not looking good in the the heat (2 days over 114 Deg)


New growth - baked in the heat


New growth



Tony

spaugh

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Re: Growing Mango trees in Southern California
« Reply #435 on: September 06, 2020, 05:02:22 PM »
Tony, I water everyday when its this hot.  Its cooking out here.
Brad Spaugh

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Re: Growing Mango trees in Southern California
« Reply #436 on: September 06, 2020, 07:13:28 PM »
Hi Brad,

Thanks for the reply.  The soil is very damp,  I have a 2 inch layer of mulch.  My Rapidtest digital moisture meter is indicating a high moisture level 7.1-9.4  from a scale of 0-10.  I don't want to create a soggy soil environment for the roots.  I'm lightly spraying the leaves once the sun sets.  Today should be the last of the 110+ daytime temperatures. 

Most of my trees don't have  issues until the temperatures start going above 110.  Should I wait to trim the fried leaves and branches? I'm hoping that I don't see too many dried up blackened branches in the coming days. 

This reminds me of the last heat wave 3-4 years ago where the temps rapidly shot up above 110.  I had to do a lot of heavy pruning to clear out the fried branches from the avocado and mango trees.

Tony

boxturtle

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Re: Growing Mango trees in Southern California
« Reply #437 on: September 06, 2020, 09:21:26 PM »
I agree with Behl, CAC is a good grower. CAC is one of those varieties that may need slightly more maturity or cold stimulus to bloom which is a good thing. My grafted CAC is currently holding a few fruit even with the worst Powdery Mildew I have seen in years. I sampled one CAC fruit that was absolutely incredible this year. It was super sweet with perfect acid balance and the texture and overall eating quality was top notch.  I highly recommend this variety for mango growers in SoCal.

Simon

Hey Simon whats the average size of a cac mango?   

On another note someone said that low vigor mangos don't do well in California.   My Brother's Maha Chanok  is doing great! We did follow Simon's advice on Manila root stock and letting the stock grow first.  The scion was from Frank.  I was lucky enough to taste the fruit from the tree it came from and its still my favorite next to sweet tart.

FlyingFoxFruits

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Re: Growing Mango trees in Southern California
« Reply #438 on: September 06, 2020, 09:26:38 PM »
oh man, the preview for the thread said Growing....and then i saw BoxTurtle...but it was a username associated with the thread, and not part of the title, and i had  this vision of box turtles in pens underneath trees, and people were growing boxturtles, by keeping them fed on fruits and bugs that ate the rotting fruits......

but now i see this isn't what's going on here....

sorry, off topic rant....

bye now.

spaugh

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Re: Growing Mango trees in Southern California
« Reply #439 on: September 06, 2020, 09:33:13 PM »
Hi Brad,

Thanks for the reply.  The soil is very damp,  I have a 2 inch layer of mulch.  My Rapidtest digital moisture meter is indicating a high moisture level 7.1-9.4  from a scale of 0-10.  I don't want to create a soggy soil environment for the roots.  I'm lightly spraying the leaves once the sun sets.  Today should be the last of the 110+ daytime temperatures. 

Most of my trees don't have  issues until the temperatures start going above 110.  Should I wait to trim the fried leaves and branches? I'm hoping that I don't see too many dried up blackened branches in the coming days. 

This reminds me of the last heat wave 3-4 years ago where the temps rapidly shot up above 110.  I had to do a lot of heavy pruning to clear out the fried branches from the avocado and mango trees.

Tony

You can hose your plants down mid day.  This idea that watering plants down in the sun will burn them is a myth. 

If your soil holds a lot of water then theres no point in over watering.  Ours dries out quickly and even with heavy watering some of my trees had burnt new flush like yours.  It happens.  Not a big deal.  The leaves will dry up and turn brown pretty quickly then you can cut them back to a good spot where the new buds will come out spaced out from one another.
Brad Spaugh

simon_grow

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Re: Growing Mango trees in Southern California
« Reply #440 on: September 07, 2020, 01:09:38 AM »
I agree with Behl, CAC is a good grower. CAC is one of those varieties that may need slightly more maturity or cold stimulus to bloom which is a good thing. My grafted CAC is currently holding a few fruit even with the worst Powdery Mildew I have seen in years. I sampled one CAC fruit that was absolutely incredible this year. It was super sweet with perfect acid balance and the texture and overall eating quality was top notch.  I highly recommend this variety for mango growers in SoCal.

Simon

Hey Simon whats the average size of a cac mango?   

On another note someone said that low vigor mangos don't do well in California.   My Brother's Maha Chanok  is doing great! We did follow Simon's advice on Manila root stock and letting the stock grow first.  The scion was from Frank.  I was lucky enough to taste the fruit from the tree it came from and its still my favorite next to sweet tart.

I can take a picture of my CAC fruit tomorrow. Itís about a pound or a bit over.

Slow growers by definition donít grow as fast as more vigorous varieties so if your looking to get a larger more productive tree, I would recommend more vigorous varieties like Sweet Tart.

Maha is one of those varieties that does ok because of its disease resistance. It will produce reliably even in high bioburden locations like mine. My tree did ok but I much prefer the newer Zill varieties so I removed my tree. Some people really like this variety and more power to them.

Simon

simon_grow

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Re: Growing Mango trees in Southern California
« Reply #441 on: September 07, 2020, 01:15:18 AM »
Hi, I am from Norcal San Leandro zone 10a and I got a Mallika mango I bought from Florida on Turpentine rootstock. I planted it in the ground in January so it is about 8 months now. It is doing well. It flowered and had leaf growth in spring and when I cut the flowers off after it's done blooming, new flowers grew. It now has a bunch of fruitlets and new leaf growth is forming. I am hoping to be the first one in my area to have a mango. lol






Nice looking tree but I highly recommend removing fruit from such small trees unless the fruit is already close to ripening. The tree is still full of vigor now but if you let it hold fruit, it will have less stored energy for winter.

You did well white washing the branches! That is extremely important to prevent sunburn.

Simon

simon_grow

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Re: Growing Mango trees in Southern California
« Reply #442 on: September 07, 2020, 01:23:21 AM »
Simon, during the early years of a mango seedling in the ground, how many set of leaves should I expect per season please? My seedlings have been kinda slow so I was wondering if it's normal.

It is extremely variable depending on when the seed is planted, the type of seed and how much you are pushing it. I had one Sweet Tart seedling that grew to about 5 feet tall in under a year but I gave it special fertilizers that Iíve been experimenting with. Iíll try to take a picture tomorrow if I remember.

If you plant late in the season and plant in a small pot with poor soil, your seedling may only have a few leaves in its first year.

If your seedling is growing slow, make sure you are fertilizing it appropriately but before you fertilize, make sure the pH of your soil is appropriate. Foliar feeding is a great way to boost plant growth without the troubles of nutrient lock which you can get if you inappropriately apply ground applications of fertilizer.

Simon

simon_grow

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Re: Growing Mango trees in Southern California
« Reply #443 on: September 07, 2020, 01:35:19 AM »
Hello Everyone,

This current heatwave is baking/frying some of my new growth flushes on my mango trees and avocado tree.  I watered deeply two days (Thursday) before this current heatwave hit.  Saturday's 116 temperature did a number to the mango and avocado trees (only the new growth - the rest of the old growth appears to be doing fine).  Today's current temperature of 115 is not helping.   I'm hoping that I do not lose any of my new grafts to this heat wave.  Any advice on how to help the trees recover (especially the new grafts)?


Mango grafts - not looking good in the the heat (2 days over 114 Deg)


New growth - baked in the heat


New growth



Tony

Hey Tony,

Brad has much more experience protecting trees from heat than I do. I only get to about 100-104F max in the last 10 years or so at my place and Brads place gets to a toasty 117!

The best protection is to have a healthy tree with upright branches that are not droopy. If you have droopy branches, white wash them to protect the branches from sunburn.

In Spring when weather warms up and you begin to see new vegetative growth on your mango trees, you can apply a foliar fertilizer with potassium silicate. This can help a bit but you have do do this well in advance of a heatwave, like many months in advance.

For last minute protection, you can white wash exposed branches or spray Surround Kaolin clay like Brad recommended somewhere.

Also, make sure your tree is well hydrated.

I recently placed new grafts on one of my trees and my buds are just pushing on the two week old grafts and they are doing ok in the 100F heatwave.

My new grafts that were put on last week are wrapped in white paper towels to prevent sun from directly hitting them. Iíll take pictures tomorrow if I remember.

Simon

simon_grow

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Re: Growing Mango trees in Southern California
« Reply #444 on: September 07, 2020, 01:39:51 AM »
oh man, the preview for the thread said Growing....and then i saw BoxTurtle...but it was a username associated with the thread, and not part of the title, and i had  this vision of box turtles in pens underneath trees, and people were growing boxturtles, by keeping them fed on fruits and bugs that ate the rotting fruits......

but now i see this isn't what's going on here....

sorry, off topic rant....

bye now.

Haha, Adam, you crack me up! BTW, the Jaboticabas I got from you almost ten years ago are rocking. I neglected them for years and finally started treating them good a few years ago and theyíre growing like gangbusters now. I owe you my friend!

Simon

simon_grow

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Re: Growing Mango trees in Southern California
« Reply #445 on: September 07, 2020, 01:28:14 PM »
Hereís an average sized CAC mango, approximately one pound



To protect from sunburn, I apply a silica product via foliar feeding when the leaves are young and expanding. Iíve used Dyna Gro Pro-Tekt and other silica products. I also white wash my exposed mango branches to prevent sunburn. My young grafts that are pushing new growth were recently exposed to 100-104F temperatures and didnít burn.

My new grafts, grafted 1 week ago are protected with white paper towels. There are probably better alternatives but I use whatís readily available. Iíve even used large leaves taped together and it works fine. I find that the first two weeks after grafting are critical and keeping direct sun off the graft union reduces condensation build up under the wrap and also prevents overheating of the scion.








Simon

simon_grow

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Re: Growing Mango trees in Southern California
« Reply #446 on: September 07, 2020, 01:51:05 PM »
For those of you that have been to my yard, that white washed mango tree is my(was my) large Lemon Zest on Florida Turpentine rootstock. I was able to get it to grow good by acidifying the soil to bring the pH down below 8. Itís currently around pH 6.5 using the Bluelab soil pH meter. This tree grew well but has issues with fruit set and has horrible issues with Powdery Mildew. These issues are related to the Lemon Zest variety but for some reason, my LZ on Lavern Manilla is able to set fruit but this tree on Florida Turpentine rootstock rarely sets fruit.

I decided a few months ago to completely top work this tree with Sweet Tart, Venus, Pineapple Pleasure, coconut Cream, Edward, Ice Cream, E4, M4, E4 seedling, Pina Colada seedling and probably a few I forgot. The slower growing varieties were grafted on just to test them out, they will likely get shaded out but I wanted to see what would happen if I grafted a super slow grower(Ice Cream) onto the most dominant apical branch available.

Here are a few pictures of Lemon Zest fruit from my LZ grafted onto Lavern Manilla. This tree is squished in between several other trees and right up against a fence so it does not get a lot of sunlight. I only have two panicles of fruit left hanging and strangely enough, one panicle is full of full sized fruit and the other panicle is full of nubbins which are rounder, have more prominent lenticils and typically have aborted seeds.





Simon

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Re: Growing Mango trees in Southern California
« Reply #447 on: September 07, 2020, 01:56:55 PM »
Simon, during the early years of a mango seedling in the ground, how many set of leaves should I expect per season please? My seedlings have been kinda slow so I was wondering if it's normal.

I just counted how many leaves are on my E4 seedling that was planted this year and it has 58 matured leaves and 15 new leaves forming at the tip. I included the tiny leaves at the bottom in the leaf count. Itís about 2.5-3 feet tall right now. Hereís a picture



Simon

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Re: Growing Mango trees in Southern California
« Reply #448 on: September 07, 2020, 11:36:39 PM »
Thanks simon!

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Re: Growing Mango trees in Southern California
« Reply #449 on: September 09, 2020, 12:14:48 PM »
Hey guys,

Anyone have any tips for a mango that slightly tipped over? I have a seedling that is growing rapidly that I desperately need to stake but Im worried about hurting the roots. It is in the ground if that matters and is about 3ft tall with about a 1/2" thick trunk.

Thanks so much!

Sean

 

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