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Author Topic: Mango Bud Grafting T-Bud Graft Method  (Read 14180 times)

behlgarden

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Re: Mango Bud Grafting T-Bud Graft Method
« Reply #75 on: June 15, 2018, 11:27:52 AM »
update on mine,

three are green, rest friend. I think it has more to do with weird weather than me or buds. we kept hitting log to mid 40's after I grafted when we were above 60's night temps. we are getting wild swings in temps. will post pic once it pushes.

Mark in Texas

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Re: Mango Bud Grafting T-Bud Graft Method
« Reply #76 on: June 15, 2018, 11:53:02 AM »
Hi Mark, if you are using buddy tape  why do you   need the cloths pins???

Buddy tape and parafilm do not have near enough strength to clamp well on most situations.  They break too easily.  I have folded parafilm in half or twisted it into a rope but trust me, using a rubber band stretched real tight as you wrap around the union or some kind of clamp insures excellent cambium contact. 

Buddy tape or parafilm is used is to insure the scion doesn't dry out. 

Here's a Pineapple Pleasure stick on a young, green turpentine shoot.  (Mallika froze back to the ground).  Note the clothespin still on it.  Grafted May 29.

I don't like doing green grafts but since the freeze nailed almost everything I'm desperate and use whatever I can get.  Am doing green on green citrus and avocado grafts too.  Most are taking.



behlgarden

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Re: Mango Bud Grafting T-Bud Graft Method
« Reply #77 on: June 15, 2018, 12:02:33 PM »
Hi Mark, if you are using buddy tape  why do you   need the cloths pins???

Buddy tape and parafilm do not have near enough strength to clamp well on most situations.  They break too easily.  I have folded parafilm in half or twisted it into a rope but trust me, using a rubber band stretched real tight as you wrap around the union or some kind of clamp insures excellent cambium contact. 

Buddy tape or parafilm is used is to insure the scion doesn't dry out. 

Here's a Pineapple Pleasure stick on a young, green turpentine shoot.  (Mallika froze back to the ground).  Note the clothespin still on it.  Grafted May 29.

I don't like doing green grafts but since the freeze nailed almost everything I'm desperate and use whatever I can get.  Am doing green on green citrus and avocado grafts too.  Most are taking.



Mark, try folding buddy tape in half length wise, then stretch and wrap, see how tightly it wraps the union. 90% grafts on all fruit types I use exclusively this method. Only time I would use nursery tape to tightly wrap is if scion if too fat, over 3/8" or 1/2"

Zafra

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Re: Mango Bud Grafting T-Bud Graft Method
« Reply #78 on: June 15, 2018, 01:06:51 PM »

I don't like doing green grafts but since the freeze nailed almost everything I'm desperate and use whatever I can get.  Am doing green on green citrus and avocado grafts too.  Most are taking.


When you do green on green citrus what kind of graft do you do? Any advice on that would be most appreciated.

behlgarden

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Re: Mango Bud Grafting T-Bud Graft Method
« Reply #79 on: June 15, 2018, 01:14:08 PM »
green on green, best is cleft for me.

CA Hockey

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Re: Mango Bud Grafting T-Bud Graft Method
« Reply #80 on: June 15, 2018, 02:03:05 PM »
Iím a big fan of modified cleft (off center bisecting cut to Match scion width) or even better veneer graft. I seem to have the most look with veneer grafts as I seem to have really good control over peeling/cutting back a wedge of tissue that matches the width of my scion.


Have lots of citrus grafts pushing now. The ones I did in March took about 2 months to push, but the recent ones have pushed in 3 weeks.

Citrus grafts from scions do much better in terms of growth vs bud grafts.

K

behlgarden

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Re: Mango Bud Grafting T-Bud Graft Method
« Reply #81 on: June 15, 2018, 02:06:51 PM »
I agree with you, buds are thud for me.

Also noted that on Citrus, mandarins got 100% takes on eureka lemon graft (20 out of 20) and same mandarin grafts on golden nugget tree I got 2 out of 15.

CA Hockey

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Re: Mango Bud Grafting T-Bud Graft Method
« Reply #82 on: June 15, 2018, 05:31:04 PM »
Same, on eureka lemon interstices from Home Depot I have > 90% take on mandarins, 100% sweet and blood oranges, 100% on Mediterranean lemons, a whopping 0% 0/8) on traditional limes, and 75% onspecialtty citrus (finger lime, orangequat, tangor and tangelos).

More than 100 grafts total, mosty veneer graft.

I spoke with Rock at ccpp because I was surprised at how dismally poor my line grafting went and he said he was unaware of any incompatibility between lime scion and lemon stock.

I did another set of grafts last week so weíll see.

K


As for mangos, I havenít tried bud grafting but July/August was lucky for me last year. >90% take on veneer grafts with scion covered with foil for 3 weeks. I did use a rubber band last year and parafilm but have transitioned to buddy tape and no rubber band this year (for citrus).

I did some mango grafting about 2 months ago but no take absolutely - it was when trees were about to go in the ground so it wasnít a good timing  for the trees in any case although the weather was warm Enough for a brief period of time.


Furthermore, for bid grafting, I believe Carlos had a video on... reverse bark grafting? I forget what he called it but he inverted the bark graft and I think the purpose was to force maturity or flowering on the rootstock or graft. Ultimately the distal/superior portion failed but I thought it was neat. Has anyone had success with this? I know Iíve seen JFs mantequilla avocado that he girdled and got to fruit early but seems like that variety is precocious.

lebmung

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Re: Mango Bud Grafting T-Bud Graft Method
« Reply #83 on: June 16, 2018, 03:53:49 AM »
If you want to break the dormancy of the grafted bud, cut the    stem above then on the bud apply a quality kaki paste (most of them don't have the homorne properly mixed into the paste thus the failure to work)

Mark in Texas

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Re: Mango Bud Grafting T-Bud Graft Method
« Reply #84 on: June 16, 2018, 09:22:58 AM »
I have folded parafilm in half or twisted it into a rope but trust me, using a rubber band stretched real tight as you wrap around the union or some kind of clamp insures excellent cambium contact. 


Quote
Mark, try folding buddy tape in half length wise, then stretch and wrap, see how tightly it wraps the union. 90% grafts on all fruit types I use exclusively this method. Only time I would use nursery tape to tightly wrap is if scion if too fat, over 3/8" or 1/2"

I do and said so.  :D But there are times when I "feel" I need to really clamp down.
« Last Edit: June 16, 2018, 09:27:20 AM by Mark in Texas »

Mark in Texas

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Re: Mango Bud Grafting T-Bud Graft Method
« Reply #85 on: June 16, 2018, 09:25:24 AM »
When you do green on green citrus what kind of graft do you do? Any advice on that would be most appreciated.

Cleft.  Here's Hamlin orange on a mature key lime tree. Green on green, cleft. If my wood has lignified I will do veneer, cleft, bark, or my fave - T-bud.  All depends.



Mark in Texas

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Re: Mango Bud Grafting T-Bud Graft Method
« Reply #86 on: June 16, 2018, 09:30:59 AM »
If you want to break the dormancy of the grafted bud, cut the    stem above then on the bud apply a quality kaki paste (most of them don't have the homorne properly mixed into the paste thus the failure to work)

What you're doing is messing with apical dominance or redistributing the auxins that collect in the terminal point, top most part of the tree and branches and focus on the dormant bud.  If your tree is small and rather supple, cut the trunk in half or just bend the main trunk/rootstock down and tie it to the pot so that the graft is higher. I usually wait a couple of weeks to do that so the graft has some time to callous over.

lebmung

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Re: Mango Bud Grafting T-Bud Graft Method
« Reply #87 on: June 20, 2018, 05:52:39 PM »

[/quote]

What you're doing is messing with apical dominance or redistributing the auxins that collect in the terminal point, top most part of the tree and branches and focus on the dormant bud.  If your tree is small and rather supple, cut the trunk in half or just bend the main trunk/rootstock down and tie it to the pot so that the graft is higher. I usually wait a couple of weeks to do that so the graft has some time to callous over.
[/quote]

Yes you need to cut the tree once the bud breaks through. It's not about auxins messing around. Cytokines are responsible to break dormancy and mangoes respond well to them.

simon_grow

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Re: Mango Bud Grafting T-Bud Graft Method
« Reply #88 on: June 20, 2018, 11:26:16 PM »
Lebmung, is there any brand of kaki paste you recommend? Anything that can be found on Amazon? Thanks!

Simon

Mark in Texas

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Re: Mango Bud Grafting T-Bud Graft Method
« Reply #89 on: June 21, 2018, 08:31:55 AM »
Lebmung, is there any brand of kaki paste you recommend? Anything that can be found on Amazon? Thanks!

Simon

It's called keiki paste.  Doubt if kaki will return anything on a search.  I used to use it on phalaenopsis orchids.  Should be available from orchid supply vendors or make it yourself - https://www.ebay.com/gds/How-to-Make-Keiki-Paste-/10000000205263270/g.html

Mark in Texas

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Re: Mango Bud Grafting T-Bud Graft Method
« Reply #90 on: June 21, 2018, 08:34:12 AM »
Yes you need to cut the tree once the bud breaks through. It's not about auxins messing around. Cytokines are responsible to break dormancy and mangoes respond well to them.

Correction noted.  Next time I'll be more or less ghetto and use the term "ho-moans".  :D

Mark in Texas

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Re: Mango Bud Grafting T-Bud Graft Method
« Reply #91 on: June 21, 2018, 08:40:01 AM »
Am grafting Aggie certified disease citrus varieties this morn.  Guy had a lot left over, gifted it to me.   Aggies are gotten pretty damn greedy when it comes to selling scions:

3. Citrus budwood shall be ordered based on the NUMBER OF BUDS required. A minimum of 10 buds per variety for each order is required.
4. The schedule of charges for sale of budwood is as follows: (Subject to Change)
a. Buds: $2.50 per BUD
b. Shipping: $35.00 (Charges may vary based on order size) 


One of the Marrs orange sticks has 8 buds on it, shysteburgers!

simon_grow

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Re: Mango Bud Grafting T-Bud Graft Method
« Reply #92 on: June 21, 2018, 03:50:27 PM »
Thanks for the information Mark! I was wondering if there is a specific brand that lebmung uses because I want to induce the bud to push and not grow roots. When I was doing plant research, I used to make my own agarose plates with different concentrations of hormones and the ratios of the hormones would determine if I would induce roots or shoots.

I have some mango bud grafts that are over a month old and they are still green and look like they are about to push. If they donít dry out in this heatwave, Iím hopeful they will push shortly.

Simon

lebmung

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Re: Mango Bud Grafting T-Bud Graft Method
« Reply #93 on: June 21, 2018, 04:33:24 PM »
Thanks for the information Mark! I was wondering if there is a specific brand that lebmung uses because I want to induce the bud to push and not grow roots. When I was doing plant research, I used to make my own agarose plates with different concentrations of hormones and the ratios of the hormones would determine if I would induce roots or shoots.

I have some mango bud grafts that are over a month old and they are still green and look like they are about to push. If they donít dry out in this heatwave, Iím hopeful they will push shortly.

Simon

I am not using any brand I have my own formulation. I gave example for kaki paste because there are some for sale on internet and they work okay sometimes from what I heard. If you have some basic training and understand the dangers to work with chemicals then I can help you make your own, just pm

lebmung

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Re: Mango Bud Grafting T-Bud Graft Method
« Reply #94 on: June 21, 2018, 04:50:07 PM »
It's called keiki paste.  Doubt if kaki will return anything on a search.  I used to use it on phalaenopsis orchids.  Should be available from orchid supply vendors or make it yourself - https://www.ebay.com/gds/How-to-Make-Keiki-Paste-/10000000205263270/g.html
[/quote]

That should work. However like I said before a proper mixture from a quality vendor is necessary. I am not going to explain all the negative factors here because it's too much technical and probably boring for a gardener.
The link on ebay was written by a novice and the method how to make the paste is outrageous.

simon_grow

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Re: Mango Bud Grafting T-Bud Graft Method
« Reply #95 on: June 21, 2018, 07:18:31 PM »
Hello lebmung, thanks for the info. I donít want to bother with making the mix because I got out of plant research and now I donít have easy access to all the chemicals. I used to come up with my own formulation by running gradients with different concentrations of PGRs. Each plant responded differently to the same batch of mixture. If mix A induced roots on Tomatoes, it may induce shoots on tobacco for example.

Simon

simon_grow

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Re: Mango Bud Grafting T-Bud Graft Method
« Reply #96 on: June 21, 2018, 07:29:17 PM »
My bud grafts are actually only 20 days old but Iím still hopeful because theyíre still green. I already pruned back the main growing tip to direct energy to the buds. Iíve successfully bud grafted a bunch of Citrus in this same manner.







Simon

lebmung

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Re: Mango Bud Grafting T-Bud Graft Method
« Reply #97 on: June 22, 2018, 02:39:17 AM »
Simon, it's not difficult only order the chemicals online.
I would send you some paste but I am afraid US customs will confiscate it right away.
You did a nice job with the grafts.
I strongly suggest you to wax the tips or apply a wound sealer. Mango is very susceptible to dieback, and open wounds are the main cause.

Mark in Texas

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Re: Mango Bud Grafting T-Bud Graft Method
« Reply #98 on: June 22, 2018, 07:42:23 AM »
I've recently had 2 grafts fail, one of a Sweet Tart scion on a Pickering.  The rot quickly proceeded down into the main trunk and too close to the graft for comfort.  I cut below the rot into healthy tissue then swabbed the cut and trunk with MagnaBon CS 2005.  This copper treatment always stops the progression of rot dead in its tracks.

Like most I do a tape twistee above the scion and if I see there's quite a bit of moisture collecting there I'll open it up. 

Guanabanus

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Re: Mango Bud Grafting T-Bud Graft Method
« Reply #99 on: June 22, 2018, 09:12:16 AM »
Don't cut off all the root-stock's leaves before there are matured scion leaves.  What must be destroyed are root-stock's buds, not the leaves.
Har

 

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