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Author Topic: Really Good Flavicarpa Passionfruit  (Read 731 times)

Mike T

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Really Good Flavicarpa Passionfruit
« on: August 26, 2018, 01:51:39 AM »
The names given to Passiflora edulis flavicarpa locally are a bit unusual. They are given names from other places even if they have been selected crossed and bred for decades. Panamas are local types that come in yellow and red/purple forms and it has become a bi word for extra sweet types with almost no acidity. ones that are not yellow had some standard edulis crossed in at some stage in the past. Panamas are a group rather than a single variety these days such has been the crossing in back yards. African yellows are very sweet and musky. is a large and very sweet new variety bred from Panama red. Lilikoi seems as a term seems to be more and more referring to sour yellow flavicarpas not just Hawaiian in origin.
While edulis has had over 100 years of selection and breeding with several southern Australian types claimed to be worlds best the richness and complexity of taste and very low acidity seems to have many flavicarpas way ahead of any edulis in the desirability stakes.
This week I tried a red flavicarpa selection from Cooktown that was rather like a 3 sided pyramid in shape and I was advised that a private grower spent 30 years selecting and crossing to get this line. The one I sampled was fantastic being sweet and richly flavoured. My prized red flavicarpa is the offspring of the best tasting flavicarpa I could find after trying 100s of fruit.My standard panama pales by comparison.

Below is my one that I ate today and possibly is the last fruit of the crop.I just cant pick which is better but they do taste disinctively different and are the 2 best passionfruit I ever tried.


Mike T

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Re: Really Good Flavicarpa Passionfruit
« Reply #1 on: September 15, 2018, 09:40:25 PM »






There seems to be lots of new types of passionfruit that are extra sweet in the supermarkets all the time.Flavicarpas much more so than edulis.These are some very good ones.

Ethan

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Re: Really Good Flavicarpa Passionfruit
« Reply #2 on: September 15, 2018, 09:48:17 PM »
Wow Mike they look delicious! Do they also have an intense smell while still whole?

Mike T

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Re: Really Good Flavicarpa Passionfruit
« Reply #3 on: September 15, 2018, 09:59:59 PM »
Heya Ethan not really but manu are aromatic when cut. I also recently tries some very large edulis I found for sale in the market and they were at least as good as misty gem,sweet heart and other classic edulis but still not in the same league and the best flavicarpas.




The more standard dark panamas seem to be getting left behind. Yellow sweet flavicarpas don't fruit through winter like the dark flavicarpas do.

ScottR

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Re: Really Good Flavicarpa Passionfruit
« Reply #4 on: September 16, 2018, 10:46:31 AM »
I'm always amazed how Australia is so far ahead of other country's on development of passiflora it seems, US has hybrids but mostly just flower types! Is this a true assessment or am just not informed?I know that Pat Worley & McCain did some hybridizing in Ca. back in 60's and 70's and came up with some good varieties but any body been doing hybridizing since??
Thanks for post mike :)
« Last Edit: September 16, 2018, 10:56:12 AM by ScottR »

Mike T

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Re: Really Good Flavicarpa Passionfruit
« Reply #5 on: September 17, 2018, 01:33:38 AM »
Passionfruit are just mainstream here and very popular as they have been for over 100 years. Sourness in passionfruit isn't tolerated and people grow them from seeds and compare the fruit to others. It sets the scene for continual improvement. American avos are an example where the US has developed the best.

ScottR

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Re: Really Good Flavicarpa Passionfruit
« Reply #6 on: September 17, 2018, 10:40:26 AM »
Interesting, thanks for reply 8)

Jct

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Re: Really Good Flavicarpa Passionfruit
« Reply #7 on: September 17, 2018, 11:42:13 AM »
Very nice report, thank you!  I'll have to keep an eye on our Asian markets to see if they ever import any.  Our 'standard' markets never seem to get the interesting fruit, but this has been slowly changing over the years.
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beicadad

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Re: Really Good Flavicarpa Passionfruit
« Reply #8 on: September 17, 2018, 12:53:47 PM »
Thanks for the info. Any way to get some seeds to the US? Do they grow true to seeds?

Triloba Tracker

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Re: Really Good Flavicarpa Passionfruit
« Reply #9 on: September 17, 2018, 01:05:01 PM »
This is awesome...i wish I were in a region where I could feast on all these great passionfruits.

To ScottR's comment - I have been into Passiflora incarnata for a few years and I can't understand why more work hasn't been done to improve this species for fruit.
I have done some very rudimentary selection (no controlled crosses) and have vines that i think make great fruit, but haven't had any major breakthroughs.
I have heard that some are working on fruit improvement but it's not out in the open, that I can tell. As Scott said, mostly flower selection happening.

I do have one hybrid that has flavicarpa attributes (floral, etc) but fairly sour.

Jct

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Re: Really Good Flavicarpa Passionfruit
« Reply #10 on: September 17, 2018, 10:37:07 PM »
Thanks for the info. Any way to get some seeds to the US? Do they grow true to seeds?
I just did a quick search on Amazon for Passiflora edulis flavicarpa.  No live plants, only seeds and while there have been very few reviews, their trend was not terribly positive.  I could not find any plants.  Not sure if I'd trust buying from any of these guys, all their fruit shown is yellow while Mike's were purple.  If they show a flower, it's the standard Passiflora Edulis.  I think I'll keep looking and not trust these Amazon sellers.

@Mike T, could you post a picture of the flowers?
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spaugh

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Re: Really Good Flavicarpa Passionfruit
« Reply #11 on: September 17, 2018, 10:55:01 PM »
Thanks for the info. Any way to get some seeds to the US? Do they grow true to seeds?
I just did a quick search on Amazon for Passiflora edulis flavicarpa.  No live plants, only seeds and while there have been very few reviews, their trend was not terribly positive.  I could not find any plants.  Not sure if I'd trust buying from any of these guys, all their fruit shown is yellow while Mike's were purple.  If they show a flower, it's the standard Passiflora Edulis.  I think I'll keep looking and not trust these Amazon sellers.

@Mike T, could you post a picture of the flowers?

Walter andersons has a few types of edulis.  Lowes has them also.  No need to order online.
Brad Spaugh

Jct

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Re: Really Good Flavicarpa Passionfruit
« Reply #12 on: September 17, 2018, 11:01:06 PM »
Brad, thanks!  I'll have to look.  Home Depot only has the one variety. Maybe this weekend I'll pop over to Anderson's and see what they have.  It'd be nice to have a low-acidic variety of passion fruit.
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spaugh

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Re: Really Good Flavicarpa Passionfruit
« Reply #13 on: September 18, 2018, 12:02:53 AM »
The ones at home depot and lowes are probably la verne fredricks.  Its a good one and cheap.  They are much better if you let them sit on the counter for a week or so to let them mellow out after falling off the vine.  The exterior should be wrinkled and that is when its best to eat them.  Ate several fredricks tonight and they were pretty sweet for passionfruit.
Brad Spaugh

Mike T

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Re: Really Good Flavicarpa Passionfruit
« Reply #14 on: September 18, 2018, 12:55:32 AM »
Best ones are sweetest even before they are coloured properly let alone old and wrinkled.

Jct

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Re: Really Good Flavicarpa Passionfruit
« Reply #15 on: September 18, 2018, 10:14:59 AM »
Fredericks is the cultivar that I have.  I really enjoy them and it's producing nicely for me, but it's a bit tart. It's just started its second round of blooms, I spend a few minutes each afternoon hand-pollinating as my local pollinators have a pretty dismal record for me.

I've planted a few seeds from fruit that I've bought from the grocery store, it'll be interesting to see how they compare.  Probably very similar....
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roblack

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Re: Really Good Flavicarpa Passionfruit
« Reply #16 on: September 18, 2018, 11:05:50 AM »
Haven't tried it yet, but have heard p. nitida is mostly sweet. Mine just started flowering, hope it sets fruit and can report back.

ScottR

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Re: Really Good Flavicarpa Passionfruit
« Reply #17 on: September 18, 2018, 11:10:31 AM »
There are seeds available from Australianseeds.com has Panama varieties but I have not had luck starting there seeds, protea seeds yes but not the passiflora. From my understanding passiflora do not come true from seed if I'm wrong please correct me. I would love to get my hands on some of the sweet varieties. ;)
Also a few years ago i had ordered seeds from I believe place was called Georgiavines and they had quite a nice selection but none of those seeds came up either. If passiflora seeds dry out they have very sporadic germination.
Even with g.a., scarification, tea and water soak.   

beicadad

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Re: Really Good Flavicarpa Passionfruit
« Reply #18 on: September 18, 2018, 02:51:30 PM »
The ones at home depot and lowes are probably la verne fredricks.  Its a good one and cheap.  They are much better if you let them sit on the counter for a week or so to let them mellow out after falling off the vine.  The exterior should be wrinkled and that is when its best to eat them.  Ate several fredricks tonight and they were pretty sweet for passionfruit.

Fredricks are tart for me even after let them sit for a week or more. Brad I guess your fruits are sweeter because your place gets more sun and heat.

Black knight is sweeter for me but the vine is very slow growing for me and the fruits are smaller. My yellow (lollikoi?) just started fruiting so I will know within 2 months

barath

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Re: Really Good Flavicarpa Passionfruit
« Reply #19 on: September 18, 2018, 02:53:38 PM »
There are seeds available from Australianseeds.com has Panama varieties but I have not had luck starting there seeds, protea seeds yes but not the passiflora. From my understanding passiflora do not come true from seed if I'm wrong please correct me. I would love to get my hands on some of the sweet varieties. ;)
Also a few years ago i had ordered seeds from I believe place was called Georgiavines and they had quite a nice selection but none of those seeds came up either. If passiflora seeds dry out they have very sporadic germination.
Even with g.a., scarification, tea and water soak.   

I got georgiavines seeds of Australian passifloras to sprout, but they were almost definitely mislabeled because the plants were not normal P. edulis or even flavicarpa, but some other hybrid that refused to fruit or even flower.  (I tried a lot of seeds from them and eventually stopped getting their seeds.)

ScottR

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Re: Really Good Flavicarpa Passionfruit
« Reply #20 on: September 18, 2018, 07:38:15 PM »
Yeah, that's what I"ve decided don't order from them again!! Thanks for tip Barath, how's Southern Ca. treating you!

barath

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Re: Really Good Flavicarpa Passionfruit
« Reply #21 on: September 18, 2018, 09:30:52 PM »
Yeah, that's what I"ve decided don't order from them again!! Thanks for tip Barath, how's Southern Ca. treating you!

Great so far -- not quite settled yet, so everything is in containers, but growing much faster.  Hoping to plant my collection of fruit trees and vines in the ground soon.

As for Passifloras, I managed to get P. laurifolia to flower outdoors here this summer, but it didn't set fruit despite hand pollination.  (The vine is about 5 years old with a thick and woody trunk, in a 40 gallon container.  I had been growing it indoors in the bay area.)  I think P. nitida is closely related, but I don't know if it is easier or harder to fruit.  P. laurifolia is the best passionfruit I've eaten (had it in Maui) but it's considered strictly tropical.  I'm still working on tracking down seeds of P. popenovii which is its highland relative.

Of course Mike's passionfruits probably are even better, and maybe someday we'll get to try some of those types here.

 

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