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Author Topic: Annonaceae that are temperate  (Read 636 times)

Perplexed

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Annonaceae that are temperate
« on: October 15, 2018, 09:26:45 PM »
What genera are temperate? Other than pawpaw.

KarenRei

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Re: Annonaceae that are temperate
« Reply #1 on: October 16, 2018, 07:55:34 AM »
Oh geez... I'll try to remember this thread when I get home, I have a whole database of this sort of stuff.  :)
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Perplexed

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Re: Annonaceae that are temperate
« Reply #2 on: October 16, 2018, 03:48:59 PM »
Alright thanks, the only problem If I do find them is the source of seeds

Triloba Tracker

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Re: Annonaceae that are temperate
« Reply #3 on: October 16, 2018, 04:09:12 PM »
What u got up your sleeve?

I wasn't aware of any temperate annonaceae genera other than Asimina but I'm no expert whatsoever. As vast as the plant kingdom is, i'm likely to be overlooking a lot.

Now, we have some North American native Annona species like Annona glabra but of course it's not temperate (nor desirable for fruit).

KarenRei

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Re: Annonaceae that are temperate
« Reply #4 on: October 16, 2018, 05:20:18 PM »
Awww..

Sorry to report, but I checked my database, and with 177 Annonaceae species in it, not a single one was even close to A. triloba in hardiness  :(  A. triloba's natural range averages a winter low of -4,9░C. The next closest I have is Polyalthia cerasoides, but its average winter low is 7,4░C, followed by Annona longiflora (8,4░C), Annona stenophylla (8,7░C), Annona rugulosa (9░C), Guatteria carchiana (9,6░C; afaik not edible), Xylopia odoratissima (9,7░C), and Annona cherimola (10,5░C).  So basically you have one standout, and things jump straight to "pretty tropical".

(My data in this regard comes from a program I wrote that crossreferences edible species lists, GBIF habitat data, and IPCC climate data)
« Last Edit: October 16, 2018, 05:25:14 PM by KarenRei »
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Perplexed

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Re: Annonaceae that are temperate
« Reply #5 on: October 16, 2018, 05:23:27 PM »
Awh well. I always wanted to find some tropical looking tree that is not usually planted in gardens that can survive in 7b/8a border.

KarenRei

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Re: Annonaceae that are temperate
« Reply #6 on: October 16, 2018, 05:27:58 PM »
You'll have to look outside of annonaceae, unfortunately!  But feel free to assign me any database tasks you might have  :)
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nullzero

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Re: Annonaceae that are temperate
« Reply #7 on: October 16, 2018, 11:57:31 PM »
Nice to hear about Annona stenophylla cold hardiness. I have a few seedlings they are being planted out in zone 10a. Should have to worry about the a rare frost event.
Grow mainly fruits, vegetables, and herbs.

KarenRei

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Re: Annonaceae that are temperate
« Reply #8 on: October 17, 2018, 07:06:31 AM »
Nice to hear about Annona stenophylla cold hardiness. I have a few seedlings they are being planted out in zone 10a. Should have to worry about the a rare frost event.

I wouldn't call being native to an area with an average winter low of 8,7░C cold hardy, but yeah, as far as annonas go, it's native to climates that are on the colder end of the spectrum.  It's not native to as high altitudes as cherimoya (500-1700m vs. 700-2400m) but it's less equatorial and more continental. Its range is densest in highlands in southeast Angola / far east Namibia / northern Botswana / southwestern Zambia, and these areas do get the occasional frost.
« Last Edit: October 17, 2018, 07:16:15 AM by KarenRei »
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linsecte

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Re: Annonaceae that are temperate
« Reply #9 on: February 16, 2019, 08:27:24 PM »
Is Annona stenophylla hardy -8░C for branches or roots? does roots survive more severe frosts?
Could someone provide me seeds? i will buy or swap (ask my long list)
thank you  :D
« Last Edit: February 16, 2019, 08:31:58 PM by linsecte »

mikkel

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Re: Annonaceae that are temperate
« Reply #10 on: February 17, 2019, 02:49:01 AM »
As I understand it it is hardy to 8░Celsius (which means no frost at all) 8░C is 46.7░Fahrenheit

NateTheGreat

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Re: Annonaceae that are temperate
« Reply #11 on: February 17, 2019, 12:10:53 PM »
I doubt that the hardiness of A. stenophylla has been tested much. Since it's rhizomatous, I wonder if it could tolerate much colder in a dormant state. I have one seedling, which took probably 5c in this its first winter before I moved it inside. Has not died back to the ground, though the uppermost leaf is slowly withering from the tip.
« Last Edit: February 17, 2019, 12:17:44 PM by NateTheGreat »

mikkel

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Re: Annonaceae that are temperate
« Reply #12 on: February 17, 2019, 12:59:30 PM »
5░Celsius ?

NateTheGreat

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Re: Annonaceae that are temperate
« Reply #13 on: February 17, 2019, 01:02:22 PM »

mikkel

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Re: Annonaceae that are temperate
« Reply #14 on: February 17, 2019, 01:15:31 PM »
Do you suspect 5░C a problem? It is no frost.

NateTheGreat

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Re: Annonaceae that are temperate
« Reply #15 on: February 17, 2019, 01:27:20 PM »
No, but I wanted to play it safe the first year with the Eugenia calycinas that are in the same pot. A few of those had tip browning, and I figured I'd cold stressed them enough for their first winter. A. stenophylla seems tough so far; it hasn't ever shown any sign of discomfort until this leaf shriveling, and the leaves just feel tough, like those of an oak. Hopefully I get some more germination this year.

linsecte

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Re: Annonaceae that are temperate
« Reply #16 on: February 17, 2019, 03:34:11 PM »
i understand now the temperatures Karenrei 16 oct 2018 wrote,  -5░c for asimina triloba, +8░c for A. stenophylla, and +10░C for annona cherimola, are not the cold limit, but average of winter temperatures in their natural areas of repartition; average doesn't mean cold records, or temperature that makes loose leafes, or branches;
this cold limit is around -20 or -25░C for asimina triloba, and between -5 and -10░c for cherimolas;
in my place, one night per winter is -4 or -8░c, but it usually never frost in the day, but in 2012 it was one hour -16░c one night; one little plant that grows every spring from the roots is interesting to survive such exceptionnal records; so yes, i will be very interested to try A. stenophylla :)
« Last Edit: February 17, 2019, 03:39:49 PM by linsecte »

shiro

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Re: Annonaceae that are temperate
« Reply #17 on: February 17, 2019, 03:56:40 PM »
If the plants are potted, the roots are more fragile in the cold.
Your A. Stenophylla was he potted or in soil NateTheGreated?

If A. Stenophylla took 5 ░ Celsius in Pot, then maybe in soil with mulch it would not have had a problem of recovery for this temperature.
Does it have the power to bloom on the branches of the year (newly released from the Earth by the rhizomes) in the same way as the fig trees or not?

Because in this eventuality it can be interesting to prune and spread mulch during the cold season.
See cover the trunk pruning with a protection.

NateTheGreat

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Re: Annonaceae that are temperate
« Reply #18 on: February 17, 2019, 04:23:28 PM »
Lots of questions, glad I got people excited :D

On flowering on new year's growth, I have no experience, but per UsefulTropicalPlants, "Annona stenophylla is a low-growing perennial plant with spreading, underground woody rhizomes. Annual shoots up to 1 metre tall arise from the rhizome, these stems can be simple or branched and sometimes become woody and persist for more than one year" So it sounds like the answer is yes they normally fruit on first year growth. Source: http://tropical.theferns.info/viewtropical.php?id=Annona%20stenophylla

Here is a picture of it, yes in a pot. It's about 4 inches (10 cm) tall.


linsecte

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Re: Annonaceae that are temperate
« Reply #19 on: February 17, 2019, 07:49:24 PM »
On 15, nate the grate answered his plant, of course, didn't have any damage at 5░C

 

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