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Author Topic: Winter Feeding of citrus  (Read 802 times)

Empoweredandfree

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Winter Feeding of citrus
« on: November 04, 2018, 08:09:23 PM »
Due to the fact many citrus fruit in the winter and are heavy feeders should they be fed full strength throughout the winter? Including potted?

Millet

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Re: Winter Feeding of citrus
« Reply #1 on: November 04, 2018, 08:26:31 PM »
If growing in a greenhouse, then fertilizer.  In a house fertilize lightly.

Vlad

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Re: Winter Feeding of citrus
« Reply #2 on: November 04, 2018, 10:11:44 PM »
Millet, you say if growing in a greenhouse, then fertilize. But doesn't that depend on temperature? For example, my greenhouse temperature setpoint is 55 F (although recent daytime temps have reached into mid 80s) so shouldn't I be fertilizing lightly?
« Last Edit: November 04, 2018, 10:14:36 PM by Vlad »

lebmung

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Re: Winter Feeding of citrus
« Reply #3 on: November 05, 2018, 04:10:48 AM »
At min 50F (10C) citrus continues to grow, perhaps with exception of limes. I have like this and they started to bloom and heavily set fruit.
I use a high potassium fertilizer, KNO3 at 1000ppm weekly plus a foliar spare with ME and monthly a drench with FE. Water until 15% of water leakes.

Vlad

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Re: Winter Feeding of citrus
« Reply #4 on: November 05, 2018, 09:36:32 AM »
What is ME? Is FE the same as Fe, which is iron?

Millet

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Re: Winter Feeding of citrus
« Reply #5 on: November 05, 2018, 10:13:18 AM »
During most of the winter my greenhouse reaches 70 -80-F during the day, and I have my thermostat set for 55-F during the night.  I fertilize year around.
« Last Edit: November 06, 2018, 02:50:43 PM by Millet »

lebmung

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Re: Winter Feeding of citrus
« Reply #6 on: November 05, 2018, 10:39:48 AM »
What is ME? Is FE the same as Fe, which is iron?

Micro elements or trace elements are iron (Fe), manganese (Mn), zinc (Zn), boron (B), copper (Cu), molybdenum (Mo) and silicon (Si).

Empoweredandfree

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Re: Winter Feeding of citrus
« Reply #7 on: November 05, 2018, 11:59:39 PM »
I have a fertilizer called Apples and Oranges. It has all those micros but unfortunately the chelator is EDTA which is suspected of being a perisistent environmental pollutant. Whats another good micro-rich fertilizer without EDTA?

Laaz

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Re: Winter Feeding of citrus
« Reply #8 on: November 06, 2018, 11:53:43 AM »
I wouldn't feed at all in the winter. Let the plant rest & go dormant.

Vlad

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Re: Winter Feeding of citrus
« Reply #9 on: November 06, 2018, 02:58:14 PM »
Laaz, are you saying that fertilizing prevents them from going dormant?
I fertilize only the ones showing new growth.

lebmung

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Re: Winter Feeding of citrus
« Reply #10 on: November 06, 2018, 04:05:51 PM »
More heat means more light requirement. I found that citrus plants grow very well with 50 F at nigh and 68 F during the day. They flower and put nice foliage, compared with summer heat and high light intensity.

Millet

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Re: Winter Feeding of citrus
« Reply #11 on: November 06, 2018, 09:51:54 PM »
Citrus do not go dormant, as does many types of trees.  Its growth does indeed slow down during the winter months in colder areas, unless additional  light and heat are provided.

Laaz

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Re: Winter Feeding of citrus
« Reply #12 on: November 07, 2018, 07:23:48 AM »
We don't fertilize in-ground citrus here after Aug 1st so we don't get late flushes during the winter that will get killed or damaged.

Citrus may not go true dormant, but as a rule I don't feed any of my citrus after Aug 1st. Once the first freeze is predicted I move my container citrus into the garage & leave it there until March 1st. Left in the dark cool garage, it remain as it was put in, No new growth, no blooms & no leaf drop.

Normal years we don't get our first frost until mid / late December & usually only get 7-10 nights below freezing every year.

« Last Edit: November 17, 2018, 03:11:21 PM by Laaz »

Empoweredandfree

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Re: Winter Feeding of citrus
« Reply #13 on: November 10, 2018, 01:23:41 PM »
Laaz for potted plants though I would imagine applying micro nutrients through out the year would be essential for health and proper fruit production

brian

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Re: Winter Feeding of citrus
« Reply #14 on: November 11, 2018, 07:50:35 PM »
Laaz do you water the container trees you overwinter in Your garage?  Or do you let them dry out?

Millet

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Re: Winter Feeding of citrus
« Reply #15 on: November 11, 2018, 09:29:30 PM »
Brian, I doubt that the high humidity in your greenhouse has anything to do with your tree problem.   Humidity in my greenhouse, especially during the winter months sometimes causes "rain" to fall from the glazing.  On warmish days I turn on the exhaust fans to reduce the humidity.  However, over the 30 years I've had the greenhouse, I have never had a problem.  In Florida during the summer many days the humidity is 100 percent.  On Okinawa, when I was in the Navy, the humidity was near 100 percent the entire summer, no problem with the citrus.

lebmung

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Re: Winter Feeding of citrus
« Reply #16 on: November 12, 2018, 07:02:28 AM »
Laaz for potted plants though I would imagine applying micro nutrients through out the year would be essential for health and proper fruit production

Micro nutrients in high amounts can lead to toxicity. For instance iron becomes available to citrus when ph is under 6, and with high accumulation in soil can kill the plant.
My greenhouse has also high humidity and as a rule when humidity is high I water less, the plants can take water from the air and water droplets. Of course it depends also on temperature.

Sylvain

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Re: Winter Feeding of citrus
« Reply #17 on: November 12, 2018, 08:11:35 AM »
> iron becomes available to citrus when ph is under 6
Which form of Fe?

Radoslav

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Re: Winter Feeding of citrus
« Reply #18 on: November 12, 2018, 09:29:04 AM »
We don't fertilize in-ground citrus here after Aug 1st so we don't get late flushes during the winter than will get killed or damage.

Citrus may not go true dormant, but as a rule I don't feed any of my citrus after Aug 1st. Once the first freeze is predicted I move my container citrus into the garage & leave it there until March 1st. Left in the dark cool garage, it remain as it was put in, No new growth, no blooms & no leaf drop.

Normal years we don't get our first frost until mid / late December & usually only get 7-10 nights below freezing every year.

Here jn zone 6, the winter day is short and the only way, how not to kill citrus because of big disbalance of light/heat  is to keep temperature from 0 to 10 Celsius, no water, no fertilizer.

jako9403

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Re: Winter Feeding of citrus
« Reply #19 on: November 12, 2018, 10:07:18 AM »
In winter i usually use mulch or organic fertilizer.
I like fruit... I love miracle frut!

Millet

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Re: Winter Feeding of citrus
« Reply #20 on: November 12, 2018, 10:15:33 AM »
Lebmung, your correct that at a pH of 6 Iron is at it maximum availability.  However, iron still has some availability up to a pH of 8.

brian

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Re: Winter Feeding of citrus
« Reply #21 on: November 12, 2018, 11:42:11 AM »
Brian, I doubt that the high humidity in your greenhouse has anything to do with your tree problem.   Humidity in my greenhouse, especially during the winter months sometimes causes "rain" to fall from the glazing.  On warmish days I turn on the exhaust fans to reduce the humidity.  However, over the 30 years I've had the greenhouse, I have never had a problem.  In Florida during the summer many days the humidity is 100 percent.  On Okinawa, when I was in the Navy, the humidity was near 100 percent the entire summer, no problem with the citrus.

Did you mean to respond to me other thread regarding the gummy areas near twig dieback?  If so thank you for the information, I have always worried about humidity and it is good to know it can be tolerable.

lebmung

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Re: Winter Feeding of citrus
« Reply #22 on: November 12, 2018, 07:10:46 PM »
> iron becomes available to citrus when ph is under 6
Which form of Fe?

I am talking in particular about Ferric EDTA the most used in fertilizers but also about all the iron in general.
Sure there are other forms of Fe which are available to plants up to ph 9. I just say that applying too much iron when you see the sign of yellowing will build up in soil. The main problem is the PH, not that iron that is not present in soil. It's just not available. So most advanced gardeners apply iron to corect the problem. After a while once you correct the ph soil problem the iron becomes  available to the citrus plant in a high quantity which can eventually kill it.
Foliar spray of iron is not effective especially during the hot summer and under high light intensity can burn the plant.
Now if some of you went to the tropics, you can see that the land is red, sandy and lightweigh.. The red color comes from iron. Deficiency in iron over there is hardly seen.
In cold climates the citrus plants have a big problem with alkaline and chlorine water.

Sylvain

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Re: Winter Feeding of citrus
« Reply #23 on: November 13, 2018, 07:59:31 AM »
OK.
Just an observation, It is pH, not PH nor ph.

lebmung

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Re: Winter Feeding of citrus
« Reply #24 on: November 13, 2018, 08:45:59 AM »
OK.
Just an observation, It is pH, not PH nor ph.

nice one ;D

Laaz

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Re: Winter Feeding of citrus
« Reply #25 on: November 17, 2018, 03:16:06 PM »
I water the trees very well just prior to putting them in the garage. They don't get any water while in the garage & stay moist until I take them back out.

Empoweredandfree

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Re: Winter Feeding of citrus
« Reply #26 on: November 17, 2018, 04:34:39 PM »
I avoid anything with EDTA now. I decided just to foliar feed for the winter. I also top dress with a little Dr Earth organic.

Millet

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Re: Winter Feeding of citrus
« Reply #27 on: November 17, 2018, 05:16:06 PM »
Not only Dr. Earth, but all organic fertilizers are of not much use when applied to container culture.  This is because organic fertilizers must rely on microorganisms to first break down organic fertilizers, before they become available for the tree's absorption.  Container culture provides none, to very little microorganisms to accomplish this task. Therefore, organic fertilizers are a very poor choice for container grown trees. EDTA, especially in the form of the EDTA-iron chelate, is readily decomposed on exposure to sunlight and yields biodegradable products. Both biodegradation and non biological degradation ensure that EDTA doesn't ppersist
in the environment.     
« Last Edit: November 17, 2018, 08:31:08 PM by Millet »

lebmung

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Re: Winter Feeding of citrus
« Reply #28 on: November 17, 2018, 06:28:54 PM »
I agree with Millet. Organic fertilizers are good during the hot season, when you can add microorganisms from compost tea, vermicompost or supplements. Liquid humic acid and humus works well. But here there is another catch, these can also contain bad microorganisms in a low amount not harmful to plants. Still when the plant is stressed or soil is overwatered and cold these will take over. So instance Phytophthora.
If one applies in the winter, the fertilizer won't decompose so fast with the help of beneficial microorganisms. In fact anaerobic bacteria, mold and algae will take over which could in turn lead to root rot, and the soil becomes mushy. for those who don't believe apply organic fertilizer pellets on top of the soil, and put it in greenhouse at 10C or 50F and 90%RH, a white crust of mold will start to grow on top.

snek

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Re: Winter Feeding of citrus
« Reply #29 on: November 18, 2018, 08:33:32 AM »
"Therefore, organic fertilizers are a very poor choice for container grown trees."

Really?
I grow citrus only in containers and I use the most organic fertilizers.
More precisely (because I'm often asked): In the spring I use Osmocote 6M or 8M (about 1/6 according to the instructions) and the rest is only organic. Pelletized manure (cattle, sheep, horse, hen - I alternate it). Once or twice a year to add toppings liquid humus. That is all.
The most important thing is keeping the optimum humidity mode in the container !

Millet

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Re: Winter Feeding of citrus
« Reply #30 on: November 18, 2018, 03:42:50 PM »
Well snek, your are adding microorganisms a plenty via the cattle, sheep, horse and hen mature, plus the liquid humus.  It is the microorganisms in these products what would make an organic fertilizer available.   Also, you are using the conventional fertilizer Osmocote. This is what Lebmung's and my  posts explained above.
« Last Edit: November 18, 2018, 04:38:59 PM by Millet »

Empoweredandfree

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Re: Winter Feeding of citrus
« Reply #31 on: November 29, 2018, 02:32:26 PM »
Not only Dr. Earth, but all organic fertilizers are of not much use when applied to container culture.  This is because organic fertilizers must rely on microorganisms to first break down organic fertilizers, before they become available for the tree's absorption.  Container culture provides none, to very little microorganisms to accomplish this task. Therefore, organic fertilizers are a very poor choice for container grown trees. EDTA, especially in the form of the EDTA-iron chelate, is readily decomposed on exposure to sunlight and yields biodegradable products. Both biodegradation and non biological degradation ensure that EDTA doesn't ppersist
in the environment.   

 In the summertime it appears organics work just fine compared with their synthetic counterparts so I'm assuming there is some microorganism activity?

 Thats good to hear about EDTA as everything I've read say its not easy to degrade and toxic to microorganisms! I'd love to read something countering this if you could provide me some reading material..?

 

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