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Author Topic: Iron nails in the tree trunk or in the soil  (Read 539 times)

SeaWalnut

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Iron nails in the tree trunk or in the soil
« on: June 26, 2019, 07:40:49 PM »
Ive read on this forum that somme citrus growers put iron nails into the trunk of their trees or in the ground .
Just bought 2 kilos of small nails for a soil experiment ( not for citrus) but i want to hear your opinions about this practice.
« Last Edit: June 27, 2019, 03:52:08 AM by SeaWalnut »

brian

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Re: Iron nails in the tree trunk or in the soil
« Reply #1 on: June 26, 2019, 08:10:03 PM »
Ive never heard of using iron or steel directly like this, always some kind of chelated iron powder as drench or foliar spray

Millet

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Re: Iron nails in the tree trunk or in the soil
« Reply #2 on: June 26, 2019, 08:45:35 PM »
First of all, if your tree is not showing an iron deficiency, you should not do any treatment.   If you are concerned that the tree has an iron deficiency, use iron chelate or iron sulfate. 

SeaWalnut

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Re: Iron nails in the tree trunk or in the soil
« Reply #3 on: June 26, 2019, 09:13:32 PM »
Im not using the iron nails to fed iron for the trees.Il use iron nails in the soil to lower the phosphates and to get a verry low phosphorus soil ,because im growing somme plants that dislike and die from normal phosphorus levels,Proteaceae plants.
Citrus seem that they also dont need much phosphorus since they like acidic soils where phosphorus becomes non available.
And the member wich puts nails into the tree trunk might be right in case somme of that nail thats in the tree gets chelated by the tree sap and then metabolised.
« Last Edit: June 26, 2019, 09:19:55 PM by SeaWalnut »

SeaWalnut

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Re: Iron nails in the tree trunk or in the soil
« Reply #4 on: June 26, 2019, 09:19:09 PM »
Low ph = non available phosphorus and i will use the nails wich will rust and that rust will trap the phosphorus so that i can have a low phosphate soil without having a low ph.
« Last Edit: June 26, 2019, 09:23:45 PM by SeaWalnut »

brian

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Re: Iron nails in the tree trunk or in the soil
« Reply #5 on: June 26, 2019, 11:27:44 PM »
Between the tree nails, the dog poop bonemeal fert, and the geodesic greenhouse, Iím worried you are overcomplicating things.

SeaWalnut

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Re: Iron nails in the tree trunk or in the soil
« Reply #6 on: June 27, 2019, 02:03:52 AM »
Between the tree nails, the dog poop bonemeal fert, and the geodesic greenhouse, Iím worried you are overcomplicating things.
At first i lower the phosphates with iron nails for my trees and in case i fail then i will add the dog poo manure to restore the phospates  ;D.
Jokes asside,the phosphorus cycle fascinates me to the point that i got banned from a site after a discussion with somme chemists about phosphorus.
Even the proteaceae plants that i have ,i got them because of their strange adaptation to live in verry poore in phosphorus soils where not even fungi can grow.And understanding phosphorus cycle in nature its actually my profession because i am an eviromentalist.
« Last Edit: June 27, 2019, 02:15:26 AM by SeaWalnut »

pvaldes

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Re: Iron nails in the tree trunk or in the soil
« Reply #7 on: June 27, 2019, 04:31:14 AM »
In my opinion is just a fairy tale. Anything that hurts the tree significantly will trigger flower production instead growing wood, but there is a price also. The price is measured in years of life and health of the tree.

Cons: Damaged bark, open wounds welcoming entry of fungus, and nails that can hurt you. There is a risk to catch a brush cutter or scratch your feeth in a nail.

Benefits: My father did the same a lot of years ago in an lazy seedling orange tree. Nothing changed. He has to wait still the same 10 years for their first orange than with a standard tree. Eventually the tree started to produce and currently it gives fairly big harvests each year. Sometimes after a big season is chlorotic and need chelates like any orange tree... And shows two ugly useless nails at the basis. Another orange tree without nails that I planted close behaves exactly the same.

In my experience the benefits are unclear and probably zero and the risks are clear. You can achieve the same with pruning

............................................................................................

Second question. You must assure that everybody working in your place has been vaccinated against tetanus. Be careful also with your dog, pets love to dig and vet bills can be expensive.

I thing that there is a better way. Steel balls would be much better than nails for your experiment IMHO, You can find plenty of it in any garage near to you or in a car scrapping. They are totally safe for paws and hands and (after cleaned of its oil) will rust and blend with the soil like a pebble, so are much more pleasant to see also. Let the nails for furniture only
« Last Edit: June 27, 2019, 05:06:28 AM by pvaldes »

SeaWalnut

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Re: Iron nails in the tree trunk or in the soil
« Reply #8 on: June 27, 2019, 11:42:12 AM »
In my opinion is just a fairy tale. Anything that hurts the tree significantly will trigger flower production instead growing wood, but there is a price also. The price is measured in years of life and health of the tree.

Cons: Damaged bark, open wounds welcoming entry of fungus, and nails that can hurt you. There is a risk to catch a brush cutter or scratch your feeth in a nail.

Benefits: My father did the same a lot of years ago in an lazy seedling orange tree. Nothing changed. He has to wait still the same 10 years for their first orange than with a standard tree. Eventually the tree started to produce and currently it gives fairly big harvests each year. Sometimes after a big season is chlorotic and need chelates like any orange tree... And shows two ugly useless nails at the basis. Another orange tree without nails that I planted close behaves exactly the same.

In my experience the benefits are unclear and probably zero and the risks are clear. You can achieve the same with pruning

............................................................................................

Second question. You must assure that everybody working in your place has been vaccinated against tetanus. Be careful also with your dog, pets love to dig and vet bills can be expensive.

I thing that there is a better way. Steel balls would be much better than nails for your experiment IMHO, You can find plenty of it in any garage near to you or in a car scrapping. They are totally safe for paws and hands and (after cleaned of its oil) will rust and blend with the soil like a pebble, so are much more pleasant to see also. Let the nails for furniture only
Interesting story about your father citrus.
As for the second part,il be using nails because the steel balls and scraps  contain less iron than the nails.Especially bearing balls are made of cast iron with lots of carbon in them and also they have less surface area than thin nails.
Im not concerned about safety because i will use thin nails that will rust fast .A better idea would be to use iron oxides directly but ive calculated and oxides costs 4 times more than the nails for the same resulted oxide from the nails.
2 kilos of iron nails will become just @3,5 kilos of oxide wich is verry little considering there are Ultisoils that can have 800 grams of oxide per kilo of soil.
I will measure the phosphate first and then i will calculate how manny nails do i need to reduce it ,then double or triple the nails quantity .

Millet

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Re: Iron nails in the tree trunk or in the soil
« Reply #9 on: June 27, 2019, 01:18:51 PM »
Sea Walnut I think the whole idea is just plain silly.  However, it is your tree and you can do whatever you wish.

SeaWalnut

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Re: Iron nails in the tree trunk or in the soil
« Reply #10 on: June 27, 2019, 04:58:15 PM »
Sea Walnut I think the whole idea is just plain silly.  However, it is your tree and you can do whatever you wish.
Dont worry,i will not stick nails into trees,i was just asking about it here because i think the citrus growers more than otther trees growers have.experience with this.
As for the nails in the soil to make phosphorus non available ,its not silly its scientifically proven and i believe this is the key to success with proteaceae plants wich are not beginner plants( altough im a beginner) ,will die if you fertilise them with cow manure where the phosphates in the manure kill them.

Laaz

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Re: Iron nails in the tree trunk or in the soil
« Reply #11 on: June 27, 2019, 06:23:10 PM »
 :o :o :o

Standardbloke

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Re: Iron nails in the tree trunk or in the soil
« Reply #12 on: June 27, 2019, 11:37:03 PM »
My grandafther used to hammer a few iron star pickets deep around where the mature the root zone would eventually be at the time of planting, making sure they were buried at least 1/2 a foot underground. Seemed to work.

 

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