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Author Topic: ID ?  (Read 297 times)

giorgosgr

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ID ?
« on: August 29, 2019, 01:07:35 AM »



Hello, one friend gifted me this plant last year! the label writes asimina triloba sunflower (with a picture of a papaya). I dont know much of asimina trilobas (pawpaw) but i have two other plants that i have and they look very different from that. This one has smaller leafes that are velvety like in texture. If anyone knows what this is i would be gratefull

SeaWalnut

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Re: ID ?
« Reply #1 on: August 29, 2019, 05:12:32 AM »
Take pictures with the bark .Asimina leaves usually point downwards when mature but there are a few exceptions.
Its definatevely not sunflower if its an asimina triloba.

Mango Stein

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Re: ID ?
« Reply #2 on: August 29, 2019, 07:30:18 AM »
One of the most famous cultivars of Asimina triloba is called Sunflower. I can't remember the story of why it was named this way.

Maybe you have an Asimina hybrid? There are quite a few species in the genus.
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giorgosgr

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Re: ID ?
« Reply #3 on: August 29, 2019, 08:12:23 AM »
here are some pictures of the plant with bark

giorgosgr

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Re: ID ?
« Reply #4 on: August 29, 2019, 08:35:30 AM »
for some reason i cant post photos... when i am able i will post picture with the bark. Yes i am thinking i have maybe a hybrid and this is why i am asking

Triphal

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Re: ID ?
« Reply #5 on: August 29, 2019, 09:13:26 AM »
Yes. It is Asimina triloba. Hope your water table is high because the long tap roots can easily reach the water source. Or may need watering at times till the plant root system strengthened. Needs shading from direct sun for the first 4 to 5 years. May take 6 to 8 years to flower and fruit.

giorgosgr

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Re: ID ?
« Reply #6 on: August 29, 2019, 09:25:57 AM »
Yes. It is Asimina triloba. Hope your water table is high because the long tap roots can easily reach the water source. Or may need watering at times till the plant root system strengthened. Needs shading from direct sun for the first 4 to 5 years. May take 6 to 8 years to flower and fruit.
Dont worry it has plenty of water it was planted last year and this year it grew more and 2 feet. My only consern is it will not have enough chill hours to produce fruit!!!
Its great that you believe its Asimina triloba

SeaWalnut

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Re: ID ?
« Reply #7 on: August 29, 2019, 10:09:14 AM »
Did it loose its leaves in winter?
I looked at the picture after i zoomed and it might be asimina triloba and sunflower.The graft looks like on my sunflower and probably its from the same nursery in Italy.It looks unusual probably because of the climate or shade.

giorgosgr

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Re: ID ?
« Reply #8 on: August 29, 2019, 11:32:05 AM »











 here are some more images. Yes thankfully it did and did come back very strong

giorgosgr

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Re: ID ?
« Reply #9 on: August 29, 2019, 11:33:05 AM »
in the image with the two leafes the top is from my asimina triloba "mango" and the bottom from this one

usirius

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Re: ID ?
« Reply #10 on: September 02, 2019, 04:35:47 PM »
For me this plant Looks like Diospyrus lotus or maybe Diospyros virginiana - and not like an Asiminia triloba.

Here is a sample Picture from Diospyros lotus:

https://wildobstschnecke.de/de/Diospyros-lotus---Lotuspflaume.html
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giorgosgr

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Re: ID ?
« Reply #11 on: September 03, 2019, 06:23:33 AM »
For me this plant Looks like Diospyrus lotus or maybe Diospyros virginiana - and not like an Asiminia triloba.

Here is a sample Picture from Diospyros lotus:

https://wildobstschnecke.de/de/Diospyros-lotus---Lotuspflaume.html
I have some Diospyros virginiana near that plant and yes the leafes look similar but in Autumn they are quite different and also new growth isnt the same.

pvaldes

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Re: ID ?
« Reply #12 on: September 03, 2019, 10:31:18 AM »
I would say Annonacea but not necessarily Asimina (could be cherimola also) but must admit that Diospyros is a good candidate also.

Leaves are a little short, but nothing prevents it being Asimina IMO

Triphal

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Re: ID ?
« Reply #13 on: September 03, 2019, 12:05:11 PM »
Hi. I will redact my previous opinion which was mainly submitted because of the similarities in many root generated plants under our pawpaws and the also the label on your plant!
Didn't notice your explanation of the 'velvety' like texture of the leaves which I should say is usually found in Diospyros / persimmon plants and not in pawpaw plants.
It is at times hard for an amateur like me to opine on young seedlings or under bush root generated plants and I feel sorry for this. In my limited personal experience I have seen pawpaw plants with similar characteristics with varying shape and size of leaves but not with 'velvety' texture. At the same time Diospyos virginiana's 1 or 2 year old under bush plants (from roots) do not have that big a spread of the branches and also for that long a young branch without having any side branches or twigs.
But also young new branches of persimmon tend to be green or greenish which I see in one of your later published pictures. Curiously puzzled. PM sent

Triphal

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Re: ID ?
« Reply #14 on: September 03, 2019, 05:06:01 PM »
Interesting personal findings just now comparing 7 fruiting pawpaw and a dozen under the tree root plants (rootlings!) and 2 Asian persimmons and one American persimmon with 2 'rootlings'  observations are as follows.
A. The Asimina triloba leaves are way too large. B. The top leaf picture of the 2 leaves picture sent is most likely that of Acimina triloba. The bottom leaf could belong to both!  C. The peticle of the leaf is shorter in Acimina triloba than in Diaspyros.  D The axillary bud appears to be folded in Acimina but round or rounded in Diaspyros. E. LEAF BASE OF ACIMINA is grooved at the axillary bud.  F. There is linear pigmentation on the axillary side of the leaf base and this continues into the peticle. This is absent in Diaspyros. G.The Asimina trilobe leaf when rubbed and crushed between the thumb and index finger gives a scent of ? turpentine or kerosene.
In conclusion this amateur thinks your specimen is more likely a 'Diaspyros' than an 'Acimina'.
Since I am unable to (how to) send / publish some pictures or write some sketches on the net I apologize. Good luck.

SeaWalnut

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Re: ID ?
« Reply #15 on: September 03, 2019, 05:10:14 PM »
Its asimina and probably sunflower.Ive looked at the pictures better and it has the brown furry buds.

This is my asimina from a sunflower seed( seedling not grafted).The caged one its a prima.


And this is my sunflower thats grafted.When it starts to grow leaves,they start yelow.


And this is one american persimmon seedling ( D. Virginiana).Leaves start with somme red coloration wich doesnt happen to pawpaws.
« Last Edit: September 03, 2019, 05:42:29 PM by SeaWalnut »

giorgosgr

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Re: ID ?
« Reply #16 on: September 05, 2019, 12:39:58 AM »
I would say Annonacea but not necessarily Asimina (could be cherimola also) but must admit that Diospyros is a good candidate also.

Leaves are a little short, but nothing prevents it being Asimina IMO
I think its not cherimoya at least after it survived the winter like my other temperate trees. If it was anything subtropical in the place it is planted and with no protection it would be 100% dead

giorgosgr

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Re: ID ?
« Reply #17 on: September 08, 2019, 07:57:01 AM »







As you can see top two pics are my diospyros and bottom 2 my unknown tree  grown near that tree. They are completely different in every aspect. So its not that

giorgosgr

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Re: ID ?
« Reply #18 on: September 08, 2019, 08:04:13 AM »
Its asimina and probably sunflower.Ive looked at the pictures better and it has the brown furry buds.

This is my asimina from a sunflower seed( seedling not grafted).The caged one its a prima.


And this is my sunflower thats grafted.When it starts to grow leaves,they start yelow.


And this is one american persimmon seedling ( D. Virginiana).Leaves start with somme red coloration wich doesnt happen to pawpaws.



as you can see on my diospyros seedling the new growth is green

 

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