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Author Topic: How to increase yield on Lemon Zest Mango?  (Read 2482 times)

simon_grow

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How to increase yield on Lemon Zest Mango?
« on: September 06, 2019, 08:04:49 PM »


Lemon Zest is one of my all time favorite Mango varieties but my young trees set very few fruit. This picture above is a Lemon Zest tree grown in Palm Springs California by Gary and as you can see, his tree consistently sets good amounts of fruit, he probably had 60+ fruit this year.

I would like to gather information from members that grow Lemon Zest in hopes that we can come up with a strategy to improve yields for this excellent tasting variety.

I know that in hot and dry Palm Springs, Powdery Mildew and other fungal diseases are not an issue and this is likely why Gary gets such good yields from his tree.

Over the years, I have harvested a few fruit here and there from my various LZ trees but Iíve never harvested more than 3 fruit per tree( excluding nubbins) from any one tree in a given year. I do not spray my trees with Fungicide unless they have an obvious fungal infection but I will probably start a fungicide spray regimen in hopes of increasing yields.

I know that in some locations in Southern California, fungal diseases are not as much of an issue and in those counties, LZ probably has a decent to good yield.

I would like to hear if anyone has successfully increased yields for their LZ trees wether you are in Florida, SoCal or some other location. Iím especially interested to hear from individuals that initially had low or no yield and then saw a significant increase in yield after they started a Fungicide regimen or alternative method to increase yield.

I have heard from two growers that say their trees started setting and holding significantly more fruit after their trees reached a large size.

My tree set a good amount of fruit this year and last year but most the fruit dropped at around 2 inches in length which coincided with an increase in temperatures.

As soon as the fruit dropped from my trees, my tree exploded with vegetative growth. Iím wondering if I can decrease fruit drop by slightly backing off on watering. I already back off on Nitrogen pre bloom.

Any observations or comments are greatly appreciated.

Simon

simon_grow

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Re: How to increase yield on Lemon Zest Mango?
« Reply #1 on: September 06, 2019, 08:26:37 PM »
I have several different LZ trees on various rootstocks and my only LZ tree that is still holding fruit is this Double Stone grafted LZ tree that I just dug up from Leo Manuelís house. I gifted him this tree several years ago but it kept getting fungal diseases and never set fruit at his place. I dug it out of the ground early this year and stuck it into a big pot and after it established, it threw a single late bloom which set 5 fruit. One fruit just fell off as I took this picture. This tree is about two feet tall and 3 feet wide at its widest side.




In the last three years, my LZ grafted onto LaVern Manilla is the most consistent in production but it still only produces about three fruit max. It is in mostly shade which definitely isnít helping with the yield.

My LZ tree on Turpentine rootstock is my largest tree and itís bloomed heavily the last two years and initially set a bunch of fruit the last two years but most eventually drop. Last year I had one or two full sized excellent tasting fruit but this year, it dropped all its fruit. Last Winter, this tree suffered from lots of dieback in Winter and it looked like a skeleton but once it warmed up, it exploded with growth.

This picture I just took shows how bushy it is. It is approximately 7 feet tall and 8 feet wide and is very dense with foliage.


Simon

johnb51

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Re: How to increase yield on Lemon Zest Mango?
« Reply #2 on: September 06, 2019, 09:43:37 PM »
Do all mango varieties do well in Palm Springs/Coachella Valley?
John

simon_grow

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Re: How to increase yield on Lemon Zest Mango?
« Reply #3 on: September 06, 2019, 10:13:54 PM »
I only know one grower in Palm Springs and he harvested about two hundred Mangos from his various trees if I remember correctly. In the extreme heat, some leaves and fruit can burn but otherwise his mango trees are thriving and producing very well.

I would presume that Arizona members will also get high yields from LZ.

Simon

wslau

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Re: How to increase yield on Lemon Zest Mango?
« Reply #4 on: September 06, 2019, 10:53:18 PM »
Simon,
I only got 2 fruit from LZ on Manila rootstock that is 4 years old.  This is the first year it ever fruited.  I spray with 2 types of fungicides.  Most leaf/flower damage is encountered in Feb Thru June. I never get PM (powdery mildew) after June...so a combo of heat and humidity (Aug) seem to be necessary for good leaf growth and survival from PM, at least for our socalírs.  If we canít get LZ to work in socal, I may try to switch to Orange Sherbert.



« Last Edit: September 06, 2019, 10:57:34 PM by wslau »
Warren

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Re: How to increase yield on Lemon Zest Mango?
« Reply #5 on: September 07, 2019, 12:16:16 AM »
Frank has said in the past that if it rains during one of the several LZ blooms, to remove the panicles for a rebloom. Hopefully the rain misses one of the reblooms, if not try for another rebloom.

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Re: How to increase yield on Lemon Zest Mango?
« Reply #6 on: September 07, 2019, 05:49:08 PM »
Hey Simon,

One thing to throw out there is how are you pruning post harvest season? I have heard that if you cut over 1ft off of a fruiting branch it will set that branch back by two years until it fruits again, tip pruning is great for inducing branching and management but excessively pruning a mango can also cause low crop along with rainy season fungal spread.

-Joep450

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Re: How to increase yield on Lemon Zest Mango?
« Reply #7 on: September 07, 2019, 06:31:45 PM »
Doc Campbell said his LZ took more than 10 years to really get going.

simon_grow

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Re: How to increase yield on Lemon Zest Mango?
« Reply #8 on: September 07, 2019, 07:01:32 PM »
Simon,
I only got 2 fruit from LZ on Manila rootstock that is 4 years old.  This is the first year it ever fruited.  I spray with 2 types of fungicides.  Most leaf/flower damage is encountered in Feb Thru June. I never get PM (powdery mildew) after June...so a combo of heat and humidity (Aug) seem to be necessary for good leaf growth and survival from PM, at least for our socalírs.  If we canít get LZ to work in socal, I may try to switch to Orange Sherbert.




Great info Warren! The thing that confuses me is that my LZ trees have great fruit set but once the fruit get to about 2 inches in size, they tend to drop most their fruit. Then comes a massive growth flush. If Powdery Mildew were the main issue, I would expect it to heavily affect the blooms, which they do, but my trees always have a second or third bloom that have significantly less PM and I get decent to great fruit set from the second or third bloom.

Now that my larger tree is fully established, Iím hoping that it will set good fruit next year. I donít want to use any Plant Growth Regulators. I give my larger trees very little Nitrogen and this time of year, I already stop giving Nitrogen only to my larger trees in order to decrease leaf Nitrogen levels.

My Double Stone Grafted Lemon Zest fruits are about 2 inches in length and there is currently a small growth flush coming out so I expect it to drop a couple more fruit but at this time of year, I suspect this little tree will hold at least one fruit since it is already past the heavy fruit drop period that begins when it starts getting really hot in SoCal.

Simon

simon_grow

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Re: How to increase yield on Lemon Zest Mango?
« Reply #9 on: September 07, 2019, 07:04:50 PM »
Frank has said in the past that if it rains during one of the several LZ blooms, to remove the panicles for a rebloom. Hopefully the rain misses one of the reblooms, if not try for another rebloom.

Yes, my trees always rebloom if the first blooms get infected. Sometimes I prune off the old panicles because it gets rid of a lot of disease causing spores but even if I donít remove the panicles, they will fall off and new blooms will emerge on the terminal but there will be a lot of spores left behind.

Simon

simon_grow

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Re: How to increase yield on Lemon Zest Mango?
« Reply #10 on: September 07, 2019, 07:12:44 PM »
Hey Simon,

One thing to throw out there is how are you pruning post harvest season? I have heard that if you cut over 1ft off of a fruiting branch it will set that branch back by two years until it fruits again, tip pruning is great for inducing branching and management but excessively pruning a mango can also cause low crop along with rainy season fungal spread.

-Joep450

Hey Joe, here in SoCal, even late pruning or pruning more than a foot will still give us blooms.

A big issue we have here in SoCal is that young trees bloom incessantly in Winter. We want our young trees to grow vegetatively and increase in size before blooming and setting fruit.

I have experimented for many years on techniques to inhibit blooms including late pruning, increased Nitrogen levels, even into Winter, increased watering, even into Winter and nothing has worded except moving the plants indoors and increasing soil and ambient air temperatures above 62-63F.

Simon

simon_grow

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Re: How to increase yield on Lemon Zest Mango?
« Reply #11 on: September 07, 2019, 07:19:22 PM »
Doc Campbell said his LZ took more than 10 years to really get going.

Future, Iíd gladly wait ten years if LZ will set more fruit. I have to look at my tags but I believe my LZ has been in ground for about 4-5 years already. I consider my tree large and established enough to start holding fruit so Iím hoping i will get lucky next year.

Probably the number one thing we can do is to begin an integrated pest management system that includes the scheduled spraying with various fungicides that have different mechanisms of action.

Alternating with Copper, Sulfur, Garden Phos or even baking soda solution will probably work but Iím wondering if my tree was just too young. Iím still trying to figure out why my tree can set fruit but they always drop around 1-2 inches in size. If itís just a matter of maturity, Iím ok with that and will gladly wait another five years.

Simon

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Re: How to increase yield on Lemon Zest Mango?
« Reply #12 on: September 07, 2019, 08:24:50 PM »
I only know one grower in Palm Springs and he harvested about two hundred Mangos from his various trees if I remember correctly. In the extreme heat, some leaves and fruit can burn but otherwise his mango trees are thriving and producing very well.

I would presume that Arizona members will also get high yields from LZ.

Simon

There is one LZ tree that I know of second-hand that does very well in Phoenix. Very productive and clean fruit (I got to taste an LZ from the tree, even though I have not seen the tree). Perfect LZ flavor.

My LZ tree has produced a couple of fruit for me, but that is because of the size. It has been growing steadily since I planted it as a 3 gallon a few years ago. Now it is up to 8+ ft tall x 6 ft wide. Assuming our winter this year was not as bad as last year I would expect a decent crop. Tree grows like a champ. Loves the heat. Most mangos do, but LZ seems to do especially well in the desert.
- Mark

simon_grow

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Re: How to increase yield on Lemon Zest Mango?
« Reply #13 on: September 08, 2019, 02:04:04 AM »
I only know one grower in Palm Springs and he harvested about two hundred Mangos from his various trees if I remember correctly. In the extreme heat, some leaves and fruit can burn but otherwise his mango trees are thriving and producing very well.

I would presume that Arizona members will also get high yields from LZ.

Simon

There is one LZ tree that I know of second-hand that does very well in Phoenix. Very productive and clean fruit (I got to taste an LZ from the tree, even though I have not seen the tree). Perfect LZ flavor.

My LZ tree has produced a couple of fruit for me, but that is because of the size. It has been growing steadily since I planted it as a 3 gallon a few years ago. Now it is up to 8+ ft tall x 6 ft wide. Assuming our winter this year was not as bad as last year I would expect a decent crop. Tree grows like a champ. Loves the heat. Most mangos do, but LZ seems to do especially well in the desert.

Starch, thanks for the info! It does seem that Mango trees thrive in the heat. From a biological standpoint, we know that Powdery Mildew prefers a specific temperature and humidity and desert like temps of Palm Springs, Coachella Valley and Arizona are too harsh for PM to proliferate. The lower humidity in these locations will also inhibit other fungal organisms like Anthracnose.

Simon

zands

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Re: How to increase yield on Lemon Zest Mango?
« Reply #14 on: September 08, 2019, 05:29:23 AM »
Simon.... Reading in between the lines that Zill puts out. They will no longer graft Lemon Zest due to so called "issues". My take is LZ will do just fine in lower humidity southern California and Arizona you have proof already fr Starch. You just have to iron out the kinks. Right rootstock etc. Maybe some  minimal sprays. How about a dose of potassium?
« Last Edit: September 08, 2019, 10:39:44 AM by zands »

johnb51

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Re: How to increase yield on Lemon Zest Mango?
« Reply #15 on: September 08, 2019, 09:34:49 AM »
Simon, can you have a friend in the desert (Gary?) plant an LZ tree for you?  When the fruit's in season, you can make a couple of trips to harvest the fruit.  Maybe a dumb solution, but it would work!  I'm thinking it might be a losing battle to get a variety to produce where it doesn't want to produce.
« Last Edit: September 08, 2019, 04:30:45 PM by johnb51 »
John

simon_grow

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Re: How to increase yield on Lemon Zest Mango?
« Reply #16 on: September 08, 2019, 08:29:15 PM »
Simon.... Reading in between the lines that Zill puts out. They will no longer graft Lemon Zest due to so called "issues". My take is LZ will do just fine in lower humidity southern California and Arizona you have proof already fr Starch. You just have to iron out the kinks. Right rootstock etc. Maybe some  minimal sprays. How about a dose of potassium?

Iíve tried a multitude of Foliar sprays including seaweed and Citrus Nutritional spray. My particular location in San Diego is more coastal inland and the humidity is relatively high compared to more inland locations. I get heavy fog in the mornings which causes a lot of fungal issues for me.

My area is an excellent growing environment for Powdery Mildew. I do feed my trees with a good amount of Potassium and micro and trace elements. I also increased silicon levels with Potassium Silicate.

Simon

simon_grow

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Re: How to increase yield on Lemon Zest Mango?
« Reply #17 on: September 08, 2019, 10:55:50 PM »
Simon, can you have a friend in the desert (Gary?) plant an LZ tree for you?  When the fruit's in season, you can make a couple of trips to harvest the fruit.  Maybe a dumb solution, but it would work!  I'm thinking it might be a losing battle to get a variety to produce where it doesn't want to produce.

John, I donít want to burden him with work. Growing in the desert is a lot of work because temps can reach 117 or maybe even higher. In extreme heat, he has to put up shade cloth.

LZ is just so incredibly delicious that Iím willing to experiment some more and wait for the tree to mature even more to see if I get better fruit set.

I already have Sweet Tart and other varieties that are more disease resistant and productive. I also have a PPK tree and several Orange Sherbet seedlings growing. So far, the Orange Sherbet seedlings blooms seem more resistant to PM. Itís just a small graft but at least it set a fruit. I plucked it off so I donít know if it would have held to full maturity but Iíll find out in the coming years.

Simon

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Re: How to increase yield on Lemon Zest Mango?
« Reply #18 on: September 09, 2019, 08:57:32 AM »
Simon.... Reading in between the lines that Zill puts out. They will no longer graft Lemon Zest due to so called "issues". My take is LZ will do just fine in lower humidity southern California and Arizona you have proof already fr Starch. You just have to iron out the kinks. Right rootstock etc. Maybe some  minimal sprays. How about a dose of potassium?

Iíve tried a multitude of Foliar sprays including seaweed and Citrus Nutritional spray. My particular location in San Diego is more coastal inland and the humidity is relatively high compared to more inland locations. I get heavy fog in the mornings which causes a lot of fungal issues for me.

My area is an excellent growing environment for Powdery Mildew. I do feed my trees with a good amount of Potassium and micro and trace elements. I also increased silicon levels with Potassium Silicate.

Simon

I made too many assumptions Simon. San Diego has annual precipitation of 10.4". Looks like this precipitation comes at exactly the wrong time for you in the form of morning fog. I never would have guessed you could fungal issues in a location with 10" annual precipitation. Maybe try iron? Do you think ferrous sulfate thrown on top of mulch will chelate into the wood chips and become an organic-bound iron?

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Re: How to increase yield on Lemon Zest Mango?
« Reply #19 on: September 09, 2019, 11:23:24 AM »
Thank you Simon for this very informative post. I live in phoenix in a farming community. I have seven seedlings in the ground doing well. Five are on Flood irrigation.
Lemon Zest will definitely be one of the varieties i plan to graft on one or two of the trees when they get to size probably in 3 years. I'm patient. In the desert we get none of those fungus issues.
Congrats to Gary his tree looks phenomenal!!

Thanks again for the valuable info.
Mike

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Re: How to increase yield on Lemon Zest Mango?
« Reply #20 on: September 09, 2019, 11:52:32 AM »
Simon
Gary climate is perfect for LZ, Alfonso and other varieties that suffer from powdery mildew in our areas. Iíll give him a ring to see if we can get our old friend in the tasting next month.

simon_grow

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Re: How to increase yield on Lemon Zest Mango?
« Reply #21 on: September 09, 2019, 12:35:13 PM »
Simon.... Reading in between the lines that Zill puts out. They will no longer graft Lemon Zest due to so called "issues". My take is LZ will do just fine in lower humidity southern California and Arizona you have proof already fr Starch. You just have to iron out the kinks. Right rootstock etc. Maybe some  minimal sprays. How about a dose of potassium?

Iíve tried a multitude of Foliar sprays including seaweed and Citrus Nutritional spray. My particular location in San Diego is more coastal inland and the humidity is relatively high compared to more inland locations. I get heavy fog in the mornings which causes a lot of fungal issues for me.

My area is an excellent growing environment for Powdery Mildew. I do feed my trees with a good amount of Potassium and micro and trace elements. I also increased silicon levels with Potassium Silicate.

Simon

I made too many assumptions Simon. San Diego has annual precipitation of 10.4". Looks like this precipitation comes at exactly the wrong time for you in the form of morning fog. I never would have guessed you could fungal issues in a location with 10" annual precipitation. Maybe try iron? Do you think ferrous sulfate thrown on top of mulch will chelate into the wood chips and become an organic-bound iron?

Yeah, the rain comes at the wrong time of year and heavy fog in the mornings means my plants are covered in dew and my roof sometimes drips with collected moisture. I donít have this issue with the fog in Summer, it happens more in Winter and Spring.

I do give my trees Iron. Initially when I first planted my trees, my soil had a pH of around 8 so I used Iron chelate EDDHA but now my soil in the better parts of my yard has a pH of around 6-7 so I just use Iron EDTA. I use Sulfur to bring the pH of my soil down.

I have some compost and mulch over the root zone of my trees. I donít add compost into my planting holes, instead, I top dress with it so that the nutrients can leach down.

Realizing that fungus is one of the most likely candidates for poor fruit set, I am considering removing the mulch around my trees. The mulch is extremely beneficial for my trees so Iím hesitant to remove it but it is an option Iím considering. I will probably begin a fungal spray regimen before removing my mulch.

Simon

simon_grow

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Re: How to increase yield on Lemon Zest Mango?
« Reply #22 on: September 09, 2019, 12:41:08 PM »
Thank you Simon for this very informative post. I live in phoenix in a farming community. I have seven seedlings in the ground doing well. Five are on Flood irrigation.
Lemon Zest will definitely be one of the varieties i plan to graft on one or two of the trees when they get to size probably in 3 years. I'm patient. In the desert we get none of those fungus issues.
Congrats to Gary his tree looks phenomenal!!

Thanks again for the valuable info.
Mike

Mike, I would expect you to have huge Lemon Zest seedlings that are fruitful in the coming years. With your heat and low humidity, there shouldnít be any issues with fruit set.

Simon

simon_grow

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Re: How to increase yield on Lemon Zest Mango?
« Reply #23 on: September 09, 2019, 12:43:15 PM »
Simon
Gary climate is perfect for LZ, Alfonso and other varieties that suffer from powdery mildew in our areas. Iíll give him a ring to see if we can get our old friend in the tasting next month.

Great, itís been a while since Gary came to one of the mango tastings. It would be wonderful to see the old group back together!

Simon

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Re: How to increase yield on Lemon Zest Mango?
« Reply #24 on: September 09, 2019, 01:32:09 PM »
in So Cal, PM seems to be the big issue. I sprayed and still it didnt help. blooms turn black and if you have bead size fruitlets, they end up falling. If that is not enough, then Santa Ana takes care of drops OR mangoes split. Our winter/Spring is weird with wild temp swings, fog, extreme cold and warm days.  Frank has a big tree, now sure how it performed this year. He always start of with over 400 fruits, end up under a dozzen
« Last Edit: September 09, 2019, 01:43:35 PM by behlgarden »

 

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