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Author Topic: Tango mandarin stunted after re-pot  (Read 760 times)

jtnguyen333

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Tango mandarin stunted after re-pot
« on: December 07, 2019, 11:37:20 AM »
I bought a Tango mandarin from four winds grower in middle of October.  The plant potting mix was a mixture of fir bark and peat moss.  So I decided to bare root the tree and repot it in a more gritty mix and still well drained.  I re-potted it on 10/14/2019.  I also gave it a scoop of osmocote plus.  I leave it in the shade for two weeks.  After two weeks, I brought it out to full sun.  Since then, the plant has been stunted.  The new growth/leaves are yellow.  The old ones are turning yellow also.  Do you think this is a seasonal issue or lack of nutrients?

Thanks




Millet

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Re: Tango mandarin stunted after re-pot
« Reply #1 on: December 07, 2019, 02:46:13 PM »
The discoloration of your tree's leaves are not due to seasonal changes.  It certainly looks like deficiencies of iron and nitrogen.  The deficiency leaf symptom for iron is:  NEW leaves with green veins on otherwise a yellow leaf.  This deficiency can be caused either by high pH  or the shortage of minerals.  The leaf symptoms for a nitrogen deficiency is: Totally yellow leaves with no variation of color, or yellow/orange veins with some green out on the leaf sides.  Nitrogen is highly soluble, and thus is quickly leached from the medium with watering. For a container grown tree, growing in a rapidly draining medium, the tree should be fertilized at the very least once a month.  Once ever couple weeks would be much better.  Locate a water soluble fertilizer with higher levels of nitrogen and potassium and a lower level of phosphorous. Be sure the fertilizer also contains trace minerals.  It is difficult to see your tree's medium, as it is covered with dead laves.  What is the makeup of the medium mixture that the tree is presently growing in?
« Last Edit: December 07, 2019, 06:19:22 PM by Millet »

jtnguyen333

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Re: Tango mandarin stunted after re-pot
« Reply #2 on: December 07, 2019, 04:34:51 PM »
The medium is a mixture of DG, peat moss, pumice, and charcoal (Very similar to the top pot mix by Laguna Hills nursery).  As for water soluble fertlizer, should I still apply it even though the osmocote plus is in there?  I do not want to risk fertilizer burn.  Thank you.


The discoloration of your tree's leaves are not due to seasonal changes.  It certainly looks like deficiencies of iron and nitrogen.  The deficiency leaf symptom for iron is:  NEW leaves with green veins on otherwise a yellow leaf.  This deficiency can be caused either by high pH  or the shortage of minerals.  The symptom leaf pattern for a nitrogen deficiency is: Totally yellow leaves with no variation of color, or yellow/orange veins with some green out on the leaf sides.  Nitrogen is highly soluble, and thus is quickly leached from the medium. For a container grown tree, growing in a rapidly draining medium, the tree should be fertilized at the very least once a month.  Once ever couple weed would be much better.  Locate a water soluble fertilizer with higher levels of nitrogen and potassium and a lower level of phosphorous. Be sure the fertilizer also contains trace minerals.  It is difficult to see your tree's medium, as it is covered with dead laves.  What is the makeup of the medium mixture that the tree is presently growing in?

Millet

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Re: Tango mandarin stunted after re-pot
« Reply #3 on: December 07, 2019, 06:25:28 PM »
Using a water soluble fertilizer and Osmocote will not cause a problem.  Using both types of fertilizers is actually a good nutrition program, as it reduces the highs and lows of available nutrition to your tree.  As it now stands your tree is nutrient deficient.  The best to you and your tree.

jtnguyen333

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Re: Tango mandarin stunted after re-pot
« Reply #4 on: December 07, 2019, 07:30:35 PM »
Millet,

Is this a suitable one?  This is gro-power citrus & avocado.

Using a water soluble fertilizer and Osmocote will not cause a problem.  Using both types of fertilizers is actually a good nutrition program, as it reduces the highs and lows of available nutrition to your tree.  As it now stands your tree is nutrient deficient.  The best to you and your tree.


lebmung

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Re: Tango mandarin stunted after re-pot
« Reply #5 on: December 08, 2019, 10:52:12 AM »
I would say the root is not yet establish because of repot and colder season. The plant has those deficiencies because of poor absorption of minerals.
Foliage spray and a plastic cover to keep humidity of the leaves, but not of the soil.

Millet

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Re: Tango mandarin stunted after re-pot
« Reply #6 on: December 08, 2019, 01:40:11 PM »
What Lebmung wrote, cold can be a possibility in certain sections of the country, but not in an area such as San Diego. As to the fertilizer, I personally would not use it.  Citrus are heavy feeders, more so than many other plants.  I use a fertilizer with a NPK percentage of 25,5,15.  Meaning 25%N, 5% P, and 15% K.  Note: this is a 5-1-3 nutrient ratio fertilizer.  According to the text book Citrus, and University research,  this is the ratio that citrus absorb nutrients.  Lastly, besides the low level of the elements NPK, many of the nutrients in your fertilizer example are oxides, instead of being sulfates. 
« Last Edit: December 08, 2019, 01:42:25 PM by Millet »

jtnguyen333

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Re: Tango mandarin stunted after re-pot
« Reply #7 on: December 08, 2019, 06:03:31 PM »
Millet,

I'm looking at Peter's 25-5-15.  On the label, it only gives the direction for foliar/liquid feeding.  Can this be use as a granular feeding?  For foliar feeding of citrus & avocado, which small volume measuring would you use?  10% or 15% or 20%?





Millet

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Re: Tango mandarin stunted after re-pot
« Reply #8 on: December 09, 2019, 10:08:48 AM »
In my opinion Peters 25-5-15 is the very best fertilizer for citrus .  The bag does give a rate for use when used to apply to containers as well as in ground.  You will find the amount for Small Volume Measuring on the bags lower left hand corner.   The rate for your container is 1 teaspoon of Peters per gallon of water.  This will give your tree 225 PPM N..

brian

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Re: Tango mandarin stunted after re-pot
« Reply #9 on: December 09, 2019, 06:23:53 PM »
JT if you cannot find Jacks/Peters 25-5-15 let me know and I will mail you some to try out.  I have a big 25lb bag that I've barely used in years because I have been using Osmocote slow-release pellets as my primary fertilizer, and only tiny amounts of the granular when foliar feeding.

jtnguyen333

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Re: Tango mandarin stunted after re-pot
« Reply #10 on: December 09, 2019, 08:20:04 PM »
Millet..Can Peters 25-5-15 be used as a regular granular fertilizer?  From searching the forum, most people use it as foliar feed or as liquid soil drench. 

Brian,  thank you for your offer.  I was planning to get it off Amazon but I'll be glad to take your offer.  I will pm you my address.


brian

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Re: Tango mandarin stunted after re-pot
« Reply #11 on: December 09, 2019, 09:09:41 PM »
Ill mail you some tomorrow.  I dont think it is intended to be used dry, but rather mixed with water as soil drench or at a much lower concentrate as foliar spray

When I bought it years ago only 25lb bags were available, not sure of that is still the case.

Millet

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Re: Tango mandarin stunted after re-pot
« Reply #12 on: December 09, 2019, 09:53:56 PM »
Peters is used dissolved in water and applied to the root zone. 

jtnguyen333

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Re: Tango mandarin stunted after re-pot
« Reply #13 on: December 09, 2019, 10:43:21 PM »
What Lebmung wrote, cold can be a possibility in certain sections of the country, but not in an area such as San Diego. As to the fertilizer, I personally would not use it.  Citrus are heavy feeders, more so than many other plants.  I use a fertilizer with a NPK percentage of 25,5,15.  Meaning 25%N, 5% P, and 15% K.  Note: this is a 5-1-3 nutrient ratio fertilizer.  According to the text book Citrus, and University research,  this is the ratio that citrus absorb nutrients.  Lastly, besides the low level of the elements NPK, many of the nutrients in your fertilizer example are oxides, instead of being sulfates.

Millet, why is sulfate prefer over oxides? 

jtnguyen333

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Re: Tango mandarin stunted after re-pot
« Reply #14 on: December 17, 2019, 05:01:30 PM »
So I received a sample of HPF 25-5-15 from Brian couple days ago.  Thanks Brian.  Is it too late to feed the tree right now (I have a gold nugget that is in the ground also) in San Diego Zone 10a?  The temperature has been in the low 40s at night and mid 60s during the day.  Or should I wait till February/March?


Millet

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Re: Tango mandarin stunted after re-pot
« Reply #15 on: December 17, 2019, 05:52:00 PM »
You can fertilize your container trees, which I assume are now located in your home.  I would not fertilize the outside in ground tree at this time of the year.

jtnguyen333

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Re: Tango mandarin stunted after re-pot
« Reply #16 on: December 17, 2019, 08:21:12 PM »
Millet..I have a couple in ground and 3 in containers but they are outside the house not inside.  It almost never get below freezing cold in the my area.  Is there a reason not to feed right now?
You can fertilize your container trees, which I assume are now located in your home.  I would not fertilize the outside in ground tree at this time of the year.

Bomand

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Re: Tango mandarin stunted after re-pot
« Reply #17 on: December 17, 2019, 08:47:05 PM »
Fertilizing now can cause new growth and waking of any dormancy  the trees hold. Then a cold snap comes along and your trees will get damaged. All my outside do not get fertilize untill March 1 and I do not fertilize after August for these reasons.

Millet

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Re: Tango mandarin stunted after re-pot
« Reply #18 on: December 17, 2019, 09:22:53 PM »
Applying fertilizers has the potential to produce new flushes of tender growth.  New grow is by its very nature highly susceptible to damage from cold weather.  Old growth that has already hardened off can withstand seasonal cold, unless drastic cold weather should strike.  This is especially true when a very cold spell occurs following a warm spell. It is IMPORTANT to understand that warm winter temperatures, not irrigation or fertilization, play the MAJOR  role in stimulating untimely winter flushes of large, mature trees. However, when unseasonably warm temperatures occur, young trees may flush more easily than larger, mature trees, especially trees planted the previous fall.  If such young trees flush during winter months, fertilization may stimulate additional, tender growth, making trees even more susceptible to damage.  Consider the degree of flush, tree size, time of year and geographic location when making this decision.  Ultimately the decision is up to the grower.
« Last Edit: December 17, 2019, 10:48:34 PM by Millet »

spaugh

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Re: Tango mandarin stunted after re-pot
« Reply #19 on: December 18, 2019, 02:56:25 AM »
Ive never seen cold damage on a citrus tree here.  My mature citrus flush during winter.  This is the time to encourage them and use nitrogen since theres less insect pressure.
Brad Spaugh

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Re: Tango mandarin stunted after re-pot
« Reply #20 on: December 18, 2019, 04:04:09 AM »
I see you are in CA. Your climate is different from the other zones. Certainly your time to flush and fertilize would be diffrent also. It would be hard to get any cold damage lots of placez in CA. Micro climes exist that schedules are altered also.

spaugh

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Re: Tango mandarin stunted after re-pot
« Reply #21 on: December 18, 2019, 12:07:30 PM »
The OP has his location listed and posted he is in zone 10 san diego. 

James, a little fertilizer wont hurt.  A little patience will go a long way though.  The mail order trees are on "semi dwarf" rootstock.  They dont seem to grow very fast.  Just give it some time and when it warms up, use ashade cloth on it until it gets established.  Our sun seems to really stunt small citrus (and other trees) here.
Brad Spaugh

jtnguyen333

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Re: Tango mandarin stunted after re-pot
« Reply #22 on: December 18, 2019, 04:33:24 PM »
thanks Brad..off topic any update on the bacon avocado seed?


The OP has his location listed and posted he is in zone 10 san diego. 

James, a little fertilizer wont hurt.  A little patience will go a long way though.  The mail order trees are on "semi dwarf" rootstock.  They dont seem to grow very fast.  Just give it some time and when it warms up, use ashade cloth on it until it gets established.  Our sun seems to really stunt small citrus (and other trees) here.

spaugh

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Re: Tango mandarin stunted after re-pot
« Reply #23 on: December 18, 2019, 06:00:26 PM »
I have some seeds. 

One more thing I want to add here.  Water soluable like jacks is going to leach right out as soon as it rains here.  Its better to use organic non water soluable fertilizer or at least something like the grow power that doesnt just get wasted.  It may not be as strong but it stays around longer and can actually get used by the plant.  When its hot out and you have to water, then the soluable stuff is fine.  These guys telling you to use it have roofs over their plants inside a GH and have no cold weather and rain to deal with.  You probably dont need to water your potted plants at all if it keeps raining occasionally here.  Just sprinkle a little gro power and scratch it in and let the rain take care of watering until we get out of the wet season.
Brad Spaugh

Seanny

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Re: Tango mandarin stunted after re-pot
« Reply #24 on: December 19, 2019, 02:40:50 AM »
You have 2 issues with your pot mix.

There is no Calcium added.
There is no Ca in your fertilizer.
Maybe add some gypsum?

Charcoal will lock up your fertilizer.
You need to add fast release fertilizer to saturate the Charcoal.

Good Luck!

 

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